Should illegal aliens all be made citizens?

[GMichael]

I don't think that is much protection for an employer. I don't know how it works in your neck of the woods, but failure to maintain workers comp insurance under a no-fault regime opens you up to direct negligence suits. If these guys get hurt on the job through employer negligence and workers comp doesn't apply, then great, we'll sue the employer directly. Chances are if your the kind of employer that skirts the law regarding insurance requirements and employing illegals, chances are I'll be able to develop some negligence theories under almost any fact pattern. Collectibility might be an issue as always with uninsured, but hey with bankruptcy "deforms" of 2005 means I can keep chasing the employer. Plus its foolish, at least here, to rely on the "independant contractor" argument. Here it takes alot more than a 1099 to establish someone as an IC.

Yeah, and I don't know about some of these guys coming from other countries. They sneek in with people already living here. Some are armed. Most are uneducated and coming for work. They bring disease. They just set up right in the middle of your nieghborhood and it goes to crap. They come across water or sneak in through canada. They refuse to learn the native language. They claim a God given right to be here.
Oh, wait, geez, I'm sorry. I was thinking of the Colonists. Silly me. Too bad that John Smith or Hudson Bay Company didn't go back to where they came from.

Sorry, but I don't think times have changed that much from 400 years ago. We are an unusual country with an unusual history as to how we acquired our populace. Just because some people declare we are full doesn't mean we should close the door. If we did that, the door would have closed a long time ago and I know I wouldn' t be here because people have been declaring America "full" for centuries.

I don't want to lock all the doors. I just want them to ring the doorbell before they walk in my house uninvited, open the fridge and start drinking my beer. Wait till I offer.

[SlumpBuster]

I don't want to lock all the doors. I just want them to ring the doorbell before they walk in my house uninvited, open the fridge and start drinking my beer. Wait till I offer.

I see your frustration, especially as a guy who followed the rules only to see the prospect of the next guy just skating through.

But, they are invited, maybe not expressly. But every person that employs illegals is implicitly inviting them with the prospect of work. Our economic reliance on them is an invite. I don't see them as coming into my house and drinking my beer. Picking fruit for $150/week is more like coming into my backyard at night and surviving on my garbage scraps; I'm not going to see it, and I'm not going to miss what you take. Who am I to begrudge a person the legal status to do it?

[GMichael]

I see your frustration, especially as a guy who followed the rules only to see the prospect of the next guy just skating through.

But, they are invited, maybe not expressly. But every person that employs illegals is implicitly inviting them with the prospect of work. Our economic reliance on them is an invite. I don't see them as coming into my house and drinking my beer. Picking fruit for $150/week is more like coming into my backyard at night and surviving on my garbage scraps; I'm not going to see it, and I'm not going to miss what you take. Who am I to begrudge a person the legal status to do it?

The people who employ the illegal's are the biggest criminals in this circle IMO.
I have nothing against anyone coming here to better themselves, whether it be by picking apples, chopping meat or being a CEO. But I have a friend who owns a large apple farm here in NY. He has legal immigrants working on his farm every summer/fall. They still work for lower wages than someone who grew up here would. But they take the time to do it right. I even see a lot of the same faces every year.

Being here illegally should not be an acceptable reason to skip over the process. I would be willing to say, OK, you got over on us and we used you. Let's call it even and start over. But start from the start. Do not go to the front of the line. My wife still has to wait three more years before she can even apply for citizenship. She's been here 4 years legally. Where's her free pass?

One of the lines on the citizenship test is, Who is entitled to the constitutional rights in the USA? The answer is, everyone, citizens and aliens whether here legally or not are protected by our laws. Maybe that's just a BS line on the test, but everyone is supposed to be entitled to their rights here. And if (or more likely, when) illegals are being treated unfairly, I'll be on their side every bit of the way. They shouldn't have to deal with people talking down to them (although people do that to me too) or substandard wages or no benefits etc. Just please, fill out the forms, get in line, and don't use the excuse of being here for years as a reason to jump to the head of the line.