JFK Assassination

[Bernd]

That of course is one point of view. Just a bit out of date in my mind, as Washington is long gone. But I know what you mean.When the wall came down there was lots of cheering but when the bill came in that changed to all sorts of unpleasentness. Is just the price you have to pay for sharing this world.
On a very small level I could be, if I wanted to be self contained, don't think I am ready for the Isolation as yet.

Well top of the morning to you

Bernd

[markw]

I will write this very slow as I don't think you read very fast. When did I deny that the US helped West-Germany?

Yet, you imply in more than one post that the US had no hand in the wall coming down. All the walking you guys did had nothing to do with it. Wanna know the real reasons? Here's a hint... take a course in world economics.

That is exactly what a decent victorious country should do and help to create a stable Europe.

..and yet you eurotrash keep on bashing those who pulled your fat out of the fire.

I am not an anti Semite neither is anyone I know.How can I be blamed for what a minority in my country did 60 years ago?

Well, you blame Amercia for all the world's ills. Why shouldn't we blame you?

Actually, if you guys didn't try to exterminate the Jews, there would never have been a need to create a separate Jewish state. So, I guess you guys ARE responsible for a lot of the current mess.

I think we all have done some despicable acts towards our fellow man-The US is not exempt from this.

Well, we never started two world wars or set out to annihilate an entire race. But, on the whole we've done more good for the world than anyone else ...and less harm. Something you tend to overlook in your bashing.

What did the US do for East-Germany?

And, what did West Germany do for East Germany, but, you expected us to walk in with guns blazing? Isn't that what you are railing against us for? Again, a course or two in world economics might prove enlightening. .. .but, then again, maybe not.

You want me to believe that it took the mighty US 28 years to bring the wall down. LOL.

Your ignorance of the way the world works is astounding. Here's the real deal, heinz. We beat the communists. Not you. We, the US. You guys were just along for the ride. When they lost the war, they lost their hold on the wall, Then all you pansies could tear it down, jump up and down like the monkeys in 2001 and start trying to rebuild your country.

As for Europe "dealing" with Iraq-what was to deal with. No WMD (maybe they are hidden on the moon),no evidence of AL-Queda just-surprise surprise OIL.

Actually, I thought I said Iran. Weren't you guys selling hi-tech stuff to them? Well, it may come back in missiles. You're a lot closer than we are.

If regime change was or is so desireable why not announce that before you invade and why leave Zimbabwe,North Korea,China,Cuba etc. alone.Do you agree with their way of Government or could it be that they have no OIL.

/ Well, funny you should mention that. It seems the UN is begging for us to go in there to save African asses. Actually, they would accept any help. Any Germans volunteering? Bueller... anyone?

As for you calling me Eurotrash you have your opinion of me, I will live with it, and I think very highly of you too.

AS the wise philosopher once said, "kiss my monkey.

America is a beautiful country, but it is spoilt by people like you and your attitude.[

How" would you know? What did you ever do for ANY country. I was in the service and earned my fight to trounce on pompus, ungrateful, ignorant, eurotrash punks like you who don't know or care who really saved their asses. ...and is still doing it.

Does the Acronym "NATO" mean anything to you?

And since this is an Audioforum I leave you with a little recommendation to listen to "Lou Reed's-New York". Here is a fellow american talking about things I wouldn't dream to bring to a discussion table. Maybe you'll listen to him.

Ah yes, another insulated "Artiste" who took all he could from this country and never sacrificed a thing, except to pay as little tax as possible. Too bad he, like most artists, live in an insulated world.

[noddin0ff]

A lot of good stuff, and then...

Ah yes, another insulated "Artiste" who took all he could from this country and never sacrificed a thing, except to pay as little tax as possible. Too bad he, like most artists, live in an insulated world.

Hey! I like Lou Reed and particularly 'New York'. Nothing wrong with an artist taking a jab at hypocrisy. The purpose of a free and volunteer militia is to provide the citizenship the freedom to live in an insulated world. That’s why the US is a great nation.

[GMichael]

Walks back in, sees dishes flying around the room crashing everywhere, "I uh.. nevermind." Ducks and rolls out the door.

[markw]

Hey! I like Lou Reed and particularly 'New York'. Nothing wrong with an artist taking a jab at hypocrisy. The purpose of a free and volunteer militia is to provide the citizenship the freedom to live in an insulated world. That’s why the US is a great nation.

I don't have a problem with Lou Reed either but artists, on the whole, are the biggest hypocrites on the planet*. Remember, this is a guy whose first songs sang the praises of heroin and hookers. While this is fine entertainment, I find his views somewhat incompatible with my views on society.

*Well, I'll make an exception for Ted Nugent.

[noddin0ff]

I don't have a problem with Lou Reed either but artists, on the whole, are the biggest hypocrites on the planet*. Remember, this is a guy whose first songs sang the praises of heroin and hookers. While this is fine entertainment, I find his views somewhat incompatible with my views on society.

*Well, I'll make an exception for Ted Nugent.

Yah, but I draw a big distintion between domestic hypocrites and them there foreign ones. And, I gotta admire the moral principles of a rocker who made a bid to by Muzak so he could destroy it! Heroin aside, I don't think Reed really glamorized drugs quite the same way that Nugent glamorized using women.

But back on topic...

John Hinkley Jr, single handedly just about killed Reagan and no one accused him of being part of a commie plot. He got off way more than 3 shots, and got a lot closer. If he knew how to aim... He was just a movie buff (Taxi Driver). I don't see why we need to invoke the CIA, Cuba, and Aliens for JFK's assasination. As to bin Laden, Eric Rudolph (domestic terrorist) evaded law enforcement for 5 years, he didn't have millions of dollars, wasn't in a foreign mountainous land full of gun toting natives who don't speak English (ok, I might have to retract the gun toting and non-english speaking statement)... and good Lord, he was confined to a small stretch of woods in N. Carolina. Do you really need a conspiracy to explain why Bin Laden might still be at large.

"Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite."
--John Kenneth Galbraith

[Geoffcin]

Yet, you imply in more than one post that the US had no hand in the wall coming down. All the walking you guys did had nothing to do with it. Wanna know the real reasons? Here's a hint... take a course in world economics.


..and yet you eurotrash keep on bashing those who pulled your fat out of the fire.

Your making valid points, not need to call anyone names.

[JSE]

Walks back in room...............

Nugent Freaking RULES!!!!!!!!!


Leaves room.......

JSE

[trollgirl]

Hi Laz,

Good of you to bring it back on track. But this is how conversations develop. I find it amazing that the good citizens of the US just swallow the official explanations of the JFK killing.There should have been an outcry. The house select committe report is so full of holes and inconcistencies that it reads like fiction. They talk about JFK's brain being fixed in Formaldehyde. It is well documented that there was hardly any brain matter left in the Presidents head.Just take a look at the Zapruda film and see they spray of Brain matter. So if they talk about a fixed brain-whose are they talking about?
That alone is doubt enough to ask more questions.

Peace

Bernd

There are MANY odd things about the JFK hit. Here's one: have you EVER seen a photo of policeman Tippit?? Probably not, fact is,. he looked a lot like the Prez. When his body arrived at the same hospital, there seem to have been some mix-ups which produced the inexplicable autopsy reports. He may even be buried in JFK's grave.

Yes stupid Americans, too many of them, still trust what they are told by the government. Radicals have been telling us for 40 years or so to WAKE UP, but we still sleep. Now, having been conditioned to believe what we are told, we swallow the lies about 09/11/2001 with not a doubt in our minds. Most of us can no longer see what we are looking at. Case in point: the WTC collapses. I have seen enough controlled demolitions - live and on video - to know what to look for. Those towers were taken out by planted explosives. If you watch the collapse on slo-mo, you can easily see the cutting charges going off.

Now I'm the one going off topic...[blush].

Laz

[noddin0ff]

And you know what they put in our drinking water!? Fluoride! And, do you realize that in addition to fluoridating water, why, there are studies underway to fluoridate salt, flour, fruit juices, soup, sugar, milk... ice cream. Ice cream, ...children's ice cream. A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice.

And don't get me started on mind control...

[Bernd]

There are MANY odd things about the JFK hit. Here's one: have you EVER seen a photo of policeman Tippit?? Probably not, fact is,. he looked a lot like the Prez. When his body arrived at the same hospital, there seem to have been some mix-ups which produced the inexplicable autopsy reports. He may even be buried in JFK's grave.

Yes stupid Americans, too many of them, still trust what they are told by the government. Radicals have been telling us for 40 years or so to WAKE UP, but we still sleep. Now, having been conditioned to believe what we are told, we swallow the lies about 09/11/2001 with not a doubt in our minds. Most of us can no longer see what we are looking at. Case in point: the WTC collapses. I have seen enough controlled demolitions - live and on video - to know what to look for. Those towers were taken out by planted explosives. If you watch the collapse on slo-mo, you can easily see the cutting charges going off.

Now I'm the one going off topic...[blush].

Laz

Yes I have seen Officer Tippits picture. I also think that Tom Tilson has a valid point with the record of the number plate from the car that sped away and nobody was interested in it.
I didn't want to mention 9/11 but yes I have seen the Twin towers collapse and building 5 also. I also heard the public anouncement that the air was clean to breathe. All the sniffer dogs used are dead.
As for going off topic. What about the Space Shuttle that blew up. A trial run for taking Nuclear waste into space. If that one had "the" cargo on board-well you know.
It is very worrying.

Peace

Bernd

[Bernd]

Yet, you imply in more than one post that the US had no hand in the wall coming down. All the walking you guys did had nothing to do with it. Wanna know the real reasons? Here's a hint... take a course in world economics.


..and yet you eurotrash keep on bashing those who pulled your fat out of the fire.



Well, you blame Amercia for all the world's ills. Why shouldn't we blame you?

Actually, if you guys didn't try to exterminate the Jews, there would never have been a need to create a separate Jewish state. So, I guess you guys ARE responsible for a lot of the current mess.


Well, we never started two world wars or set out to annihilate an entire race. But, on the whole we've done more good for the world than anyone else ...and less harm. Something you tend to overlook in your bashing.



And, what did West Germany do for East Germany, but, you expected us to walk in with guns blazing? Isn't that what you are railing against us for? Again, a course or two in world economics might prove enlightening. .. .but, then again, maybe not.



Your ignorance of the way the world works is astounding. Here's the real deal, heinz. We beat the communists. Not you. We, the US. You guys were just along for the ride. When they lost the war, they lost their hold on the wall, Then all you pansies could tear it down, jump up and down like the monkeys in 2001 and start trying to rebuild your country.



Actually, I thought I said Iran. Weren't you guys selling hi-tech stuff to them? Well, it may come back in missiles. You're a lot closer than we are.



/ Well, funny you should mention that. It seems the UN is begging for us to go in there to save African asses. Actually, they would accept any help. Any Germans volunteering? Bueller... anyone?


AS the wise philosopher once said, "kiss my monkey.


How" would you know? What did you ever do for ANY country. I was in the service and earned my fight to trounce on pompus, ungrateful, ignorant, eurotrash punks like you who don't know or care who really saved their asses. ...and is still doing it.

Does the Acronym "NATO" mean anything to you?


Ah yes, another insulated "Artiste" who took all he could from this country and never sacrificed a thing, except to pay as little tax as possible. Too bad he, like most artists, live in an insulated world.

Look, your John Wayne attitude solves nothing, but that's the american way,I guess.
Native American genocide rings a bell?
You want me to believe that Ronald Reagan (LOL) stopped the USSR. Man oh man you are so ignorant. How about giving some kudos to Gorbatchev. He knew the Communist model is not workable not through some gun waving wild west nonsense.
As for east germany the east german government surpressed its people yet all top brass lived in the American sector in West-Berlin lead through at Check Point Charlie on your watch. Well done.All well documented and public information.
And one more, you stood by and watched the wall been put up.That was really helpful. And this happened in August 1961, but then you knew that,didn't you. As for Heinz that isn't my name. Is that the best you can do?
And as for being in the service-I am not impressed by goons in Uniform.How come the military is always equated with good.Far from it. True, I have first hand accounts of heroic acts being done by people in uniform, but those guys would have performed those acts anyway-Uniform or no Uniform- it's in you or it's not. But there are many more awful,cruel and sadistic acts performed in the name of doing good. Put an uneducated bully(and they are plentiful) in a uniform and watch what happens. Anybody who want's to join an outfit where you could get shot at or even worse-get killed, has to have some sort of defect in it's make up.

I think it is you who needs to take a course in recent world history. Your comments are a typical example of somebody who has been brainwashed.I pitty you.During the recent Hurricane disaster, two german Hospital Planes, where in the air within hours and on their way to help the american people, Both were turned back and the reason-"Thanks, but we have it all under controll." Well, we saw how it was all under controll and the world was left in no doubt how much value the US Government places on the life of it's citizens.
As for doing good for the world-which country has ever used Nuclear weapons? Any ideas?
Ask the people of Japan how much good the US has done. People there suffering to this day from the after effects.But then you knew that too.

The US has a duty to give back to the world and here is why. The US are the biggest poluter of the planet and the largest user of resources per head.

I used to think you are just annoyingly arrogant but it seems you're just thick.

Peace

Bernd

[bobsticks]

Bernd,
Over the last couple of months i've read many of your posts and I believe you to be a man of peace and conviction. I can imagine how upsetting it is to have the characteristics of long dead countrymen imparted unto you. That, Bernd, is a two-way street. When you talk about Americans or The American Way please remember that there are 300 million non-homogeneous citizens in this country. We are not all lemmings diving into a sea of propaganda and moreover most of us have never been in a position to oppress anybody
I'm sorry about your friend. While there is a compelling argument to be made about his decision-making there are undoubtedly other factors at play, most notably Federal Hate Crimes Legislation and Mandatory Minimum Sentencing. Once enacted, these effectively tied the hands of judges in many, many cases--non-violent possession of a certain quantity of drugs in some states can get you life with no parole while the average rapist gets 5-7 years...and how can it be argued that all premeditated murders don't involve hate?
It's important to note, however, that Death Sentence Guidelines are decided upon by state legislatures and that the Executive Branch has little say with the exception of case-by-case amnesty over anything. Often the relationship between Federal and State goverments is quite adversarial.
It does beg the question, what type of society allows for this? I think to understand the frustrations of most Americans requires an immersion into day-to-day life here...just as it would be a prerequisite for expert commentary on your culture. Note that there are over 270 MILLION HANDGUNS in our country ( gun control?--nice thought but a day late and several dollars and lives short ). It is also telling that for several weeks an album entitled "Get Rich or Die Tryin'" topped the charts here. While we protect the Rights of Free Speech and Life,Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness there seems to be an unwritten Right to be Petulant that too many engage with frightening gusto.
JSE's reaction is a prime example of Moderate angst in a sytem that has forgotten its core. As teen pregnancy/illegitemacy, illiteracy, and crime spiral upwards everyone claims victimization. This is a country where over fifty percent of the children's main educational and parental influence is derived from a pop culture that is apathetic at best.
To put the gun problem in historical perpective, the next time you read an article about pandemic gun violence in this country try inserting the words "The Inquisition" in place "gun violence" and I suspect that the numbers bare that out. It really is that bad. It is important to be aware that of the 22,000+ gun deaths every year in this country a miniscule percent are ever even considered for the Death Penalty. Virtually all involve multiple or egregious crimes against humanity and I suspect your friend was caught in the bureaucratic quag of 1)conspiratorial lies, and 2) Hate Crime Legislation.
When you look at laying blame for the country's woes you have to look past the face man, this one and his predecesors. Our two party system has become so polarized as to constitute a text book example of the Unstoppable Force meeting the Immovable Object. The Democrats have become, right or wrong ,synonymous with tax and spend while pandering to the "disenfranchised". Their sibling organization, the ACLU, at one time pioneered the equality of ALL people, while now spending more time trying to get government funding for a guy to offend a huge percentage of the population by photographing a crucifix in urine. The Republicans, of course, have become the jackal-like lackeys of the military/industrial complex. Again right or wrong. The only universal is that centrists on both sides of the aisle see the representation of their true constituents endangered by pressures from the radical extremes.
What is one to do then? Well, many of us act locally. We lead youth groups, we join neighborhood watch groups and we VOTE (although often for the lesser of two evils).We try and care about our fellow human beings in a quantitative way. And we engage in hopefully meaningful conversation. I support Trollgirl's right to denounce her government 100% but would respectfully remind her that in alot of countries she would probably not be with us any longer for having been a woman and done so.
Wow. This turned into a real monster over a morning cup of coffee. Sorry about the rant and recitation...but not really. We're not all John Wayne types, Bernd, or jackasses or imperialists or infedels or whatever.
Thanks for sharing your love of music with me.
Mark

[bobsticks]

Does JOEBIALEK get extra-credit in GMichael's troll class? Look what this thing started!

[Bernd]

Bernd,
Over the last couple of months i've read many of your posts and I believe you to be a man of peace and conviction. I can imagine how upsetting it is to have the characteristics of long dead countrymen imparted unto you. That, Bernd, is a two-way street. When you talk about Americans or The American Way please remember that there are 300 million non-homogeneous citizens in this country. We are not all lemmings diving into a sea of propaganda and moreover most of us have never been in a position to oppress anybody
I'm sorry about your friend. While there is a compelling argument to be made about his decision-making there are undoubtedly other factors at play, most notably Federal Hate Crimes Legislation and Mandatory Minimum Sentencing. Once enacted, these effectively tied the hands of judges in many, many cases--non-violent possession of a certain quantity of drugs in some states can get you life with no parole while the average rapist gets 5-7 years...and how can it be argued that all premeditated murders don't involve hate?
It's important to note, however, that Death Sentence Guidelines are decided upon by state legislatures and that the Executive Branch has little say with the exception of case-by-case amnesty over anything. Often the relationship between Federal and State goverments is quite adversarial.
It does beg the question, what type of society allows for this? I think to understand the frustrations of most Americans requires an immersion into day-to-day life here...just as it would be a prerequisite for expert commentary on your culture. Note that there are over 270 MILLION HANDGUNS in our country ( gun control?--nice thought but a day late and several dollars and lives short ). It is also telling that for several weeks an album entitled "Get Rich or Die Tryin'" topped the charts here. While we protect the Rights of Free Speech and Life,Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness there seems to be an unwritten Right to be Petulant that too many engage with frightening gusto.
JSE's reaction is a prime example of Moderate angst in a sytem that has forgotten its core. As teen pregnancy/illegitemacy, illiteracy, and crime spiral upwards everyone claims victimization. This is a country where over fifty percent of the children's main educational and parental influence is derived from a pop culture that is apathetic at best.
To put the gun problem in historical perpective, the next time you read an article about pandemic gun violence in this country try inserting the words "The Inquisition" in place "gun violence" and I suspect that the numbers bare that out. It really is that bad. It is important to be aware that of the 22,000+ gun deaths every year in this country a miniscule percent are ever even considered for the Death Penalty. Virtually all involve multiple or egregious crimes against humanity and I suspect your friend was caught in the bureaucratic quag of 1)conspiratorial lies, and 2) Hate Crime Legislation.
When you look at laying blame for the country's woes you have to look past the face man, this one and his predecesors. Our two party system has become so polarized as to constitute a text book example of the Unstoppable Force meeting the Immovable Object. The Democrats have become, right or wrong ,synonymous with tax and spend while pandering to the "disenfranchised". Their sibling organization, the ACLU, at one time pioneered the equality of ALL people, while now spending more time trying to get government funding for a guy to offend a huge percentage of the population by photographing a crucifix in urine. The Republicans, of course, have become the jackal-like lackeys of the military/industrial complex. Again right or wrong. The only universal is that centrists on both sides of the aisle see the representation of their true constituents endangered by pressures from the radical extremes.
What is one to do then? Well, many of us act locally. We lead youth groups, we join neighborhood watch groups and we VOTE (although often for the lesser of two evils).We try and care about our fellow human beings in a quantitative way. And we engage in hopefully meaningful conversation. I support Trollgirl's right to denounce her government 100% but would respectfully remind her that in alot of countries she would probably not be with us any longer for having been a woman and done so.
Wow. This turned into a real monster over a morning cup of coffee. Sorry about the rant and recitation...but not really. We're not all John Wayne types, Bernd, or jackasses or imperialists or infedels or whatever.
Thanks for sharing your love of music with me.
Mark

Hi Mark,

Thank you for that. I am well aware that the majority of american people are decent and peaceloving. I have visited many times and the last in 2004 to attend the Vote for Change tour in Philadelphia.
I just get upset when the propaganda is so far removed from the truth and people who bought into it shout abusive language.
I have many american friends especially Paul Moor (who I mentioned before) who lives now in Berlin and is to my mind one of the greatest men alive.
In 1983 I travelled for 10 months through your beautiful country and managed to see all the states apart from Alaska, something I will complete one day.
I am humbled that you have taken the time to put your thoughts onto the page. It has touched me. Thank you.

The power of music gives you wings

Bernd

[Bernd]

Does JOEBIALEK get extra-credit in GMichael's troll class? Look what this thing started!

I think he should go top of the class.

Bernd

[markw]

Look, your John Wayne attitude solves nothing, but that's the american way,I guess.
Native American genocide rings a bell?

And, where did those original Americans come from? Hint.. they are not indigenous to this country.

You want me to believe that Ronald Reagan (LOL) stopped the USSR. Man oh man you are so ignorant. How about giving some kudos to Gorbatchev. He knew the Communist model is not workable not through some gun waving wild west nonsense.[

No. All the presidents since WWII contributed to that. Gorbachov was only the first Russian to admit that their economy tanked. You still don't see why, do you? Pity...

As for east germany the east german government surpressed its people yet all top brass lived in the American sector in West-Berlin lead through at Check Point Charlie on your watch. Well done.All well documented and public information.

And? Your point is? As long as the as the correct papers we couldn't stop them. Remember, we're the good guys.

And one more, you stood by and watched the wall been put up.That was really helpful. And this happened in August 1961, but then you knew that,didn't you.

That was an greement made between Russia and the US after WWII. They controlled that sector. Again, you want John Wayne to come in and free the East Germans? Why couldn't you? You have al the answers and seem to blame us for the consequences your country suffered after losing the two world wars it started in less than 40 years.

As for Heinz that isn't my name. Is that the best you can do?

As per Goeff's requsst, I'll withdraw that. The Eurotrash is still in the air though.

And as for being in the service-I am not impressed by goons in Uniform.How come the military is always equated with good.Far from it. True, I have first hand accounts of heroic acts being done by people in uniform, but those guys would have performed those acts anyway-Uniform or no Uniform- it's in you or it's not. But there are many more awful,cruel and sadistic acts performed in the name of doing good. Put an uneducated bully(and they are plentiful) in a uniform and watch what happens. Anybody who want's to join an outfit where you could get shot at or even worse-get killed, has to have some sort of defect in it's make up.

Ah, I see... Veddy intelesting...It's perfectly all right for you to expect, no, demand, that Americans come over and risk their lives to make it all good for you, but all you want to do is sit back and criticize. Yep, the eurotrash comment stands.

I think it is you who needs to take a course in recent world history. Your comments are a typical example of somebody who has been brainwashed.I pitty you.

No. Where do you think the world would be without us. Hint.. think East Germany.

During the recent Hurricane disaster, two german Hospital Planes,where in the air within hours and on their way to help the american people,

Yeah, we rahank you for your meager contribution. The logistics involved in loading ans sending two airplanes is compare to dealing with 30,000 square miles of flooded land.

Get yer priorities straight Both were turned back and the reason-"Thanks, but we have it all under controll."

Get your realities straight. Those two token airplanes weren't a drop in the bucket for all the problems involved in trucking all the goods to where they could do the most good. Remember, we airdropped food to your grandparents because we couldn't land anywhere near where we could do any good.

Well, we saw how it was all under controll and the world was left in no doubt how much value the US Government places on the life of it's citizens.

And, in case you don't know it, there were local and state politicians marking their own turf in the way. Had the Feds overruled them, the problems would have been minimized but it's too late for that. ..but laws preclude that ...for now.

As for doing good for the world-which country has ever used Nuclear weapons? Any ideas? Ask the people of Japan how much good the US has done. People there suffering to this day from the after effects.But then you knew that too.

Ohhh.. I was wondering when you would bring that up. And, how many countries besides Japan pulled off a sneak attack of that magnatude on a military base during peace time. Also, those two bombs saved more lives on both sides that he inevitable invasion of Japan would have cost. Period.

... and don't kid yourself, kid. You guys were working on nuclear weapons, too. The heavy water experiments uncovered after the war proved that. It's only our superior science and industry (and a bunch of really smart Jews) that allowed us to attain that goal before you. In spite of all your peaceful posturing, it almost sounds like you're sorry you didn't.

The US has a duty to give back to the world and here is why. The US are the biggest poluter of the planet and the largest user of resources per head.

And, we're also the biggest prodiucer in the world and export more in foreign aid, both goods and money, than anyone else. ..and when shiit hits the fan, who does the world come crying to to save them? Hint... it ain't germany.

I used to think you are just annoyingly arrogant but it seems you're just thick.

And, I always thought you were simply ignorant and a bit proud but now I'm leaning towards totally anti-American and simply jealous of our countries accomplishments,

[JSE]

As for doing good for the world-which country has ever used Nuclear weapons? Any ideas?
Ask the people of Japan how much good the US has done. People there suffering to this day from the after effects.But then you knew that too.

Um, Pot........ meet Kettle. I think you two will get along fine.

JSE

[Bernd]

And, where did those original Americans come from? Hint.. they are not indigenous to this country.


No. All the presidents since WWII contributed to that. Gorbachov was only the first Russian to admit that their economy tanked. You still don't see why, do you? Pity...


And? Your point is? As long as the as the correct papers we couldn't stop them. Remember, we're the good guys.



That was an greement made between Russia and the US after WWII. They controlled that sector. Again, you want John Wayne to come in and free the East Germans? Why couldn't you? You have al the answers and seem to blame us for the consequences your country suffered after losing the two world wars it started in less than 40 years.


As per Goeff's requsst, I'll withdraw that. The Eurotrash is still in the air though.



Ah, I see... Veddy intelesting...It's perfectly all right for you to expect, no, demand, that Americans come over and risk their lives to make it all good for you, but all you want to do is sit back and criticize. Yep, the eurotrash comment stands.


No. Where do you think the world would be without us. Hint.. think East Germany.

Yeah, we rahank you for your meager contribution. The logistics involved in loading ans sending two airplanes is compare to dealing with 30,000 square miles of flooded land.

Get your realities straight. Those two token airplanes weren't a drop in the bucket for all the problems involved in trucking all the goods to where they could do the most good. Remember, we airdropped food to your grandparents because we couldn't land anywhere near where we could do any good.

And, in case you don't know it, there were local and state politicians marking their own turf in the way. Had the Feds overruled them, the problems would have been minimized but it's too late for that. ..but laws preclude that ...for now.

Ohhh.. I was wondering when you would bring that up. And, how many countries besides Japan pulled off a sneak attack of that magnatude on a military base during peace time. Also, those two bombs saved more lives on both sides that he inevitable invasion of Japan would have cost. Period.

... and don't kid yourself, kid. You guys were working on nuclear weapons, too. The heavy water experiments uncovered after the war proved that. It's only our superior science and industry (and a bunch of really smart Jews) that allowed us to attain that goal before you. In spite of all your peaceful posturing, it almost sounds like you're sorry you didn't.


And, we're also the biggest prodiucer in the world and export more in foreign aid, both goods and money, than anyone else. ..and when shiit hits the fan, who does the world come crying to to save them? Hint... it ain't germany.


And, I always thought you were simply ignorant and a bit proud but now I'm leaning towards totally anti-American and simply jealous of our countries accomplishments,

I shall only respond to your first and last line as the rest is too far gone into Jingoism territory.

The original americans are mostly people from europe who couldn't hack it over here or who messed up badly or just plain stupid.
That's how you got Carl Panzram.
Just to make it very clear I am not anti american, and certainly not jealous of Big Macs and Super Size, just anti lies and pro human rights.

Have a nice day

Bernd

[markw]

I shall only respond to your first and last line as the rest is too far gone into Jingoism territory.

and a fitting response to your posts.

The original americans are mostly people from europe who couldn't hack it over here or who messed up badly or just plain stupid.

Now you're simply grasping at straws. Actually, a lot came here for religious and political freedom. They must have had something in them since, within a few generations, they were the basis of the biggest nation in the world who did more for human rights than any other nation in the history of the world.

I do note that during the revolution, the German mercaneries were paid by England, though.

That's how you got Carl Panzram.

Actually, he was BORN here of parents who, by the way, had recently immigrated from Germany. So, you're saying that they knew they were going to spawn a serial killer and chose to come here to do it?
.

Just to make it very clear I am not anti american, and certainly not jealous of Big Macs and Super Size, just anti lies and pro human rights.

You are so willing to search out and believe the worst lies and ignore the good truths that I find your purported altruism to be transparent. No, you've got that same "master race" attitude that seem to be endemic your people.

[Bernd]

and a fitting response to your posts.

Now you're simply grasping at straws. Actually, a lot came here for religious and political freedom. They must have had something in them since, within a few generations, they were the basis of the biggest nation in the world who did more for human rights than any other nation in the history of the world.

I do note that during the revolution, the German mercaneries were paid by England, though.


Actually, he was BORN here of parents who, by the way, had recently immigrated from Germany. So, you're saying that they knew they were going to spawn a serial killer and chose to come here to do it?
.
You are so willing to search out and believe the worst lies and ignore the good truths that I find your purported altruism to be transparent. No, you've got that same "master race" attitude that seem to be endemic your people.

Anyway nice to have an exchange of views. You will never convince me that the US are the greatest nation on this planet that only ever do good and everybody envies as I have no intention to tediously point out the failures.
Just one thing that I forgot in my hasty last response. The two bombs on Japan. How do you know how many lives were saved by dropping Nuclear Bombs on ordinary people. That is a big statement and shows either a great deal of arrogance or stupidity. Or the use of a secret time machine.I would love to know.
No master race gene in me I am affraid, I think it has emigrated, too.Guess where to? That's why I work for myself. Only answerable to myself.

Take it easy-you win

Bernd

[markw]

Anyway nice to have an exchange of views. You will never convince me that the US are the greatest nation on this planet that only ever do good and everybody envies as I have no intention to tediously point out the failures.
Just one thing that I forgot in my hasty last response. The two bombs on Japan. How do you know how many lives were saved by dropping Nuclear Bombs on ordinary people. That is a big statement and shows either a great deal of arrogance or stupidity. Or the use of a secret time machine.I would love to know.
No master race gene in me I am affraid, I think it has emigrated, too.Guess where to? That's why I work for myself. Only answerable to myself.

Take it easy-you win

Bernd

But, you are so enthustiac about whatever wrong you precieve that you believe that it outweighs all the good we've done and will continue to do.

As for the bombs on Japan, get over it. You think the inevitable full scale invasion of the main island would have saved lives? Wrong! Better minds than yours weighed the costs and benefits. It's done and it WAS the right thing to do at that time. You have absolutely NO idea what you're talking about.

Learn some history along with economics. Perhaps then you'll come off actually knowing something rather than blindly reacting to your emotions.

Perhaps the master race has emigrated. ..to England.

[Resident Loser]

...perhaps you didn't get the chance to read this...

http://forums.audioreview.com/off-topic-non-audio/so-flo-you-learn-your-mistakes-eh-13677-3.html#post104940

From Sept. '05, it is obviously a response to Florian, when he did one of his idiotic, Euro-centric, finger-pointing tirades...give it a little time for the system to get to post #62 in the thread...

More than enough blame to go around I think...

And the two A-bombs...How many more people would have died (on both sides) in an all-out, b@!!$-to-the-wall invasion of the Japanese homeland? In addition it was obviously of great propaganda value, as it most likely kept Stalin and the USSR in check...a divided Germany would have been small potatoes...

As a history buff (in fact as someone who wanted to be, but never became, a history teacher), I have found that there is more than meets the eye when it comes to nearly any event...just don't take things at face value...

jimHJJ(...look beyond the obvious...)

[Bernd]

But, you are so enthustiac about whatever wrong you precieve that you believe that it outweighs all the good we've done and will continue to do.

As for the bombs on Japan, get over it. Better minds than yours weighed the costs and benefits. It's done and it WAS the right thing to do at that time. You have absolutely NO idea what you're talking about.

Learn some history along with economics. Perhaps then you'll come off actually knowing something rather than blindly reacting to your emotions.

Once again Mark just your opinion and no direct answer to my question. Anyway I enjoyed this little tet-a tet and you are wrong. Nothing is more counter productive to me then having to point out faults (I judge Dogs-and one judges Virtues not faults,same as I try to do with everything else). Many great things come from your great nation, but not all and not all are good. You came over as blowing the trumpet of the all knowing all conquering Yank.Which, if that is you, then good luck to you and we have nothing in common. If not then I am sure we could have a great night over some cool Beer (make it Czech i.e. neutral) one day.
Till then you enjoy being an american I enjoy being european and am thankful for having had this opportunity to exchange views.
Let there be music.

Bernd

[E-Stat]

The original americans are mostly people from europe who couldn't hack it over here or who messed up badly or just plain stupid.

Original Americans from Europe? Take out your globe and compare the width of the Bering Strait to The Atlantic Ocean.

rw