Blu Tide Continues to Turn: Porn Studios Ready to Abandon HD-DVD?

[Ajani]

........I would hardly call 600,000 standalones, and 8 million PS3 world wide dismal sales.......

I have one large problem with these figures that Blu-Ray uses to claim large sales... and that is the inclusion of the PS3... sure it can play Blu-Ray discs, but are most consumers really buying it as Blu-Ray player, a videogame sytem or both?

Would it make sense for Mark Levinson to claim to be the leader in high end audio sales, by including the sales of all Lexus with Mark Levinson stereos? I doubt that most consumers buying a Lexus are buying it for the stereo...

Should DVD-A or SACD claim brilliant sales figures based on the number of DVD/Universal Players that now play their respective formats? How many of us consumers have a DVD player that plays one/both of those formats but have never bought a DVD-A/SACD disc?

I regard the PS3 sales figures as a very poor reflection of Blu-Ray's popularity... I think the standalone players are the more telling tale and 600,000 units really isn't all that impressive.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I have one large problem with these figures that Blu-Ray uses to claim large sales... and that is the inclusion of the PS3... sure it can play Blu-Ray discs, but are most consumers really buying it as Blu-Ray player, a videogame sytem or both?

I bought my purely as a bluray player. With no good games out, most of the folks that have bought them were probably for bluray playback. And lets look at the data. Before the PS3 was released, HD DVD was outselling bluray 2-1. One month after the PS3's release bluray was outselling HD DVD 2-1. The PS3 most undoubtedly had a major impact on that. In Europe, the best selling bluray player is the PS3. Disc sales there are 4-1 in blurays favor. In Japan, the PS3 makes up 90% of bluray players sold. Disc sales there are 95-5 in favor of bluray. I am quoting from NDP latest figures. One of the reasons Warner went for bluray was the impact of the PS3. A survey was conduct on bluray.com and a dozen other gaming sites. Over 85% of PS3 owners had purchased at least one bluray disc. So clearly while not all PS3 owners are buying disc, enough are to drive sales.

Would it make sense for Mark Levinson to claim to be the leader in high end audio sales, by including the sales of all Lexus with Mark Levinson stereos? I doubt that most consumers buying a Lexus are buying it for the stereo...

Well ,this is not really a good example. High end has never been associated with cars. A bluray drive has always been associated with a PS3. You have to make the distinction of which high end your are speaking of, but that is how the market is broken down. High end home audio, High end audio for auto. Both are quite different, and deserve the distinction.

Should DVD-A or SACD claim brilliant sales figures based on the number of DVD/Universal Players that now play their respective formats? How many of us consumers have a DVD player that plays one/both of those formats but have never bought a DVD-A/SACD disc?

If these brillant claims of player sales didn't impact disc sales, then making the claim is pointless isn't it? You have 600,000 bluray standalones sold, and 800,000 HD DVD players sold. It is pretty difficult for the lower number to outsell the higher number consistantly 2-1 week after week.

I regard the PS3 sales figures as a very poor reflection of Blu-Ray's popularity... I think the standalone players are the more telling tale and 600,000 units really isn't all that impressive.

I think this is an antiquated way of thinking. Considering that the PS3 is a full profile player, capable of decoding all audio codecs, can be updated wirelessly, has SACD playback and was the cheapest bluray player at that, it was a value that bluray videophiles cannot pass up. Its SACD playback is better than 90% of the SACD players out there, and was engineered by the same guys that developed the SACD format. The PS3 happens to be the most stable bluray player as well. I have never had a single disc frozen in my player. When BD+ was implement, the PS3 handled it better than almost all of the bluray players out there. When it comes to sound and picture quality, the PS3 is always in the top tier of the bluray line of players.
No, the fact that it was such a value is a excellent reflection on the PS3 AND bluray popularity. However, the newer standalones coming out are starting to offer the same level of flexibility as the PS3(though they do not offer SACD playback), and that will definately steal some of the thunder from the PS3. There is a reason that Sound and Vision made the PS3 the product of the year last year.

[Ajani]

I bought my purely as a bluray player. With no good games out, most of the folks that have bought them were probably for bluray playback. And lets look at the data. Before the PS3 was released, HD DVD was outselling bluray 2-1. One month after the PS3's release bluray was outselling HD DVD 2-1. The PS3 most undoubtedly had a major impact on that. In Europe, the best selling bluray player is the PS3. Disc sales there are 4-1 in blurays favor. In Japan, the PS3 makes up 90% of bluray players sold. Disc sales there are 95-5 in favor of bluray. I am quoting from NDP latest figures. One of the reasons Warner went for bluray was the impact of the PS3. A survey was conduct on bluray.com and a dozen other gaming sites. Over 85% of PS3 owners had purchased at least one bluray disc. So clearly while not all PS3 owners are buying disc, enough are to drive sales.




Well ,this is not really a good example. High end has never been associated with cars. A bluray drive has always been associated with a PS3. You have to make the distinction of which high end your are speaking of, but that is how the market is broken down. High end home audio, High end audio for auto. Both are quite different, and deserve the distinction.



If these brillant claims of player sales didn't impact disc sales, then making the claim is pointless isn't it? You have 600,000 bluray standalones sold, and 800,000 HD DVD players sold. It is pretty difficult for the lower number to outsell the higher number consistantly 2-1 week after week.



I think this is an antiquated way of thinking. Considering that the PS3 is a full profile player, capable of decoding all audio codecs, can be updated wirelessly, has SACD playback and was the cheapest bluray player at that, it was a value that bluray videophiles cannot pass up. Its SACD playback is better than 90% of the SACD players out there, and was engineered by the same guys that developed the SACD format. The PS3 happens to be the most stable bluray player as well. I have never had a single disc frozen in my player. When BD+ was implement, the PS3 handled it better than almost all of the bluray players out there. When it comes to sound and picture quality, the PS3 is always in the top tier of the bluray line of players.
No, the fact that it was such a value is a excellent reflection on the PS3 AND bluray popularity. However, the newer standalones coming out are starting to offer the same level of flexibility as the PS3(though they do not offer SACD playback), and that will definately steal some of the thunder from the PS3. There is a reason that Sound and Vision made the PS3 the product of the year last year.

All good points, but what we seem to have here, is the difference between a conservative and an aggressive estimate... Not including any PS3 sales is conservative, while including all 8 million is very aggressive...

So let's see if I can come up with a more realistic estimate:

Since Blu-Ray discs routinely outsell HD ones 2 to 1 each week.... then that indicates that the PS3 is having some (but not nearly as large an impact as one would expect if 8Million PS3 owners are buying the PS3 to play Blu Ray discs)...

HD Sales = 800,000 Players
Blu-Ray Sales = 600,000 Players + 8,000,000 PS3

So basically a ratio of 1 HD player to just over every 10 Blu-Ray players...

That should transate into disc sales around 10:1 in favour of Blu-Ray, not 2:1....

Which implies that PS3 is effectively contributing about 1M Blu Ray players (HD Players (0.8M)x 2 = 1.6M.... 1.6M - 0.6 (Blu Ray) = 1M PS3 effective contribution)....

Let me know what you think...

[hermanv]

I still remember the scam where Sony hired "critics" to send press releases to national newspapers declaring a Sony movies (Columbia) to be great and with record attendance.

I frankly don't believe a word they say. Not that all other corporations don't routinely stretch the truth. The bigger they are, the greater the chance they can lie with impunity.

It would be very rare for me to base a purchase decision based on press published by the same corporation that makes the product.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I still remember the scam where Sony hired "critics" to send press releases to national newspapers declaring a Sony movies (Columbia) to be great and with record attendance.

I frankly don't believe a word they say. Not that all other corporations don't routinely stretch the truth. The bigger they are, the greater the chance they can lie with impunity.

It would be very rare for me to base a purchase decision based on press published by the same corporation that makes the product.

You would have a point if Sony compiled the figures. They did not, NDP did.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

All good points, but what we seem to have here, is the difference between a conservative and an aggressive estimate... Not including any PS3 sales is conservative, while including all 8 million is very aggressive...

So let's see if I can come up with a more realistic estimate:

Since Blu-Ray discs routinely outsell HD ones 2 to 1 each week.... then that indicates that the PS3 is having some (but not nearly as large an impact as one would expect if 8Million PS3 owners are buying the PS3 to play Blu Ray discs)...

HD Sales = 800,000 Players
Blu-Ray Sales = 600,000 Players + 8,000,000 PS3

So basically a ratio of 1 HD player to just over every 10 Blu-Ray players...

That should transate into disc sales around 10:1 in favour of Blu-Ray, not 2:1....

Which implies that PS3 is effectively contributing about 1M Blu Ray players (HD Players (0.8M)x 2 = 1.6M.... 1.6M - 0.6 (Blu Ray) = 1M PS3 effective contribution)....

Let me know what you think...

I used world wide sales of 8 million players with US sales of disc. Try this.

3.7 million players sold IN AMERICA(including the PS3), and 8 million disc sold IN AMERICA. This ought to give a more accurate picture.