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  1. #51
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    Do you honestly think that Jon Curl thinks his mods to your amps are equivalent to his JC-1 design? C'mon! I'm convinced he could find multiple ways to improve upon any Onkyo implementation in terms of component quality and power supply effectiveness. What he cannot fix is the inherent topology. As good as the JC-1s are (I've heard them at length, have you?), far better exists (at least for musical content). They do quite well, however, at their price point given the Chinese assembly.

    rw
    When you read a statement, try reading that statement exactly for what it states. In the future, avoid putting things in that statement that the statement didn't exactly state.

    Thanks!
    Sir Terrence

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  2. #52
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    I would sincerely hope these "THX approved" speakers also break with the bass management convention because I seriously doubt the 2.5" *mains* have any clue whatsoever as to what 80 hz means!

    High End THX

    rw
    The 80hz standard does not apply to PC speakers, it only applies to it home THX speakers. Their PC certification has a much higher crossover point to ensure that the speakers can playback X level at the ears from X position away.

    There are different standards for certifying different kinds of components.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
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    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
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    9 Onkyo M-508 power amp
    6 custom CAL amps for subs
    3 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid monitors
    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
    2 custom 15" sealed FFEC servo subs
    4 custom 15" H-PAS FFEC servo subs
    THX Style Baffle wall

  3. #53
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    The 80hz standard does not apply to PC speakers, it only applies to it home THX speakers. Their PC certification has a much higher crossover point to ensure that the speakers can playback X level at the ears from X position away.

    There are different standards for certifying different kinds of components.
    Why does a PC speaker need to be certified?

  4. #54
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    When you read a statement, try reading that statement exactly for what it states. In the future, avoid putting things in that statement that the statement didn't exactly state.
    Ok. Do you really think that modified mid-fi is equivalent to purpose built gear designed to a far higher level? Apparently, you are not aware of what Mr. Curl can do with a clean sheet of paper.

    rw

  5. #55
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    There are different standards for certifying different kinds of components.
    More fodder for your comment that THX certification is a joke. It is a standard that has nothing remotely to do with performance.

    rw

  6. #56
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    I think I will get me a beer and pop me some popcorn too. But I can see you guys points on both sides. If people have the ability to modify mid fi gear and get high end performance out of it and be satisfied then great. But for a good audio designer to design something form scratch to be no holds barred performance would be at a different level too. But other than that I will drink my beverage and let you gentlemen argue this one out.

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  7. #57
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajani
    Why does a PC speaker need to be certified?
    It doesn't, that is why it is a joke to do so.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
    200" SI Black Diamond II screen
    Oppo BDP-103D
    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
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    9 Onkyo M-508 power amp
    6 custom CAL amps for subs
    3 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid monitors
    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
    2 custom 15" sealed FFEC servo subs
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  8. #58
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    Ok. Do you really think that modified mid-fi is equivalent to purpose built gear designed to a far higher level? Apparently, you are not aware of what Mr. Curl can do with a clean sheet of paper.

    rw
    The word assumption does begin with the word a$$. I am very aware of what Mr. Curl can do, that is why I asked him to do the modification. Do you have any more ASSumptions to add to this thread?

    Amps are things you have to actually listen to before comment. Horse before buggy. Making comments about something you never heard is silly and illogical. Cart before horse. Taking more from a statement than was actually said, cart with no wheels and no horse.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
    200" SI Black Diamond II screen
    Oppo BDP-103D
    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-510 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-508 power amp
    6 custom CAL amps for subs
    3 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid monitors
    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
    2 custom 15" sealed FFEC servo subs
    4 custom 15" H-PAS FFEC servo subs
    THX Style Baffle wall

  9. #59
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    I am very aware of what Mr. Curl can do, that is why I asked him to do the modification.
    Most folks would simply have said, "yes, I've heard the JC-1 amplifiers in my system". Is that a true statement - yes? no? Do you remember?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    Making comments about something you never heard is silly and illogical.
    I'll ask the question again so perhaps you might respond. Do you really think that Jon Curl thinks his mods to Onkyo amps sound as good as his JC-1 design? He posts over at AA, so perhaps I'll ask him directly.

    rw

  10. #60
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    Most folks would simply have said, "yes, I've heard the JC-1 amplifiers in my system". Is that a true statement - yes? no? Do you remember?
    You don't know most folks, and most folks do not have answers that conform to what you believe they should be. I do not think that was the point of my comments in the first place. Interpret only what is written, it is safe that way.


    I'll ask the question again so perhaps you might respond. Do you really think that Jon Curl thinks his mods to Onkyo amps sound as good as his JC-1 design? He posts over at AA, so perhaps I'll ask him directly.

    rw
    I do not know what John Curl thinks, I am not John Curl am I? If you have to ask him directly, do so. I am the wrong person to poise that question to.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
    200" SI Black Diamond II screen
    Oppo BDP-103D
    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-510 power amp
    9 Onkyo M-508 power amp
    6 custom CAL amps for subs
    3 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid monitors
    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
    2 custom 15" sealed FFEC servo subs
    4 custom 15" H-PAS FFEC servo subs
    THX Style Baffle wall

  11. #61
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    You don't know most folks, and most folks do not have answers that conform to what you believe they should be.
    Sorry that my trick question "have you ever heard JC-1s in your system" baffled you.

    rw

  12. #62
    Rob_a rob_a's Avatar
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    re:

    I know an insider at the Harmon corp., and from what I have heard, their behind the bubble when it comes to new technology. By the time they develop new products, their already outdated, so in order to keep up they are using what’s on the market already. I was also told that their audiophile products were “crap!” and they were probably going to lose their base costumers. just some things I heard.
    Last edited by rob_a; 01-20-2010 at 12:24 PM.
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  13. #63
    nightflier
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    Fascinating read. Ahem, forgive me for asking the obvious, but has Lexicon responded?

  14. #64
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightflier
    Fascinating read. Ahem, forgive me for asking the obvious, but has Lexicon responded?
    Yes... they stick by their claims that they have made improvements over the Oppo, but haven't stated what those improvements are.... (I believe that response is on the Audioholics' website)...

  15. #65
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    I wonder how many people have laughed and then said, "You don't really believe that your $500 player can actually be as good as my $3000 player do you?"
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  16. #66
    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajani
    Yes... they stick by their claims that they have made improvements over the Oppo, but haven't stated what those improvements are.... (I believe that response is on the Audioholics' website)...
    One would think, that if the article published wasn't true, Harmon would sue for slander, etc. The fact that they haven't, speaks volumes. They're probably hoping it will blow over, which it will, eventually. Kinda reminds me of baseball's steroids controversey, everyone knows the players involved are lying, and it becomes kind of a joke after a while. Better to fess up, and move along.

  17. #67
    Music Junkie E-Stat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    I wonder how many people have laughed and then said, "You don't really believe that your $500 player can actually be as good as my $3000 player do you?"
    I find it amazing that apparently they only did badge engineering. I'm aware of a number of players that used the transport from a cheaper donor, but incorporated their own discrete output stage (which is where the basic Oppo needs help). For those who output the digital stream to an external processor, even that would be superfluous.

    rw

  18. #68
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by E-Stat
    I find it amazing that apparently they only did badge engineering. I'm aware of a number of players that used the transport from a cheaper donor, but incorporated their own discrete output stage (which is where the basic Oppo needs help). For those who output the digital stream to an external processor, even that would be superfluous.

    rw
    I work in the laptop and printer parts business. We often see parts and even large assemblies from one manufacture being used in another's unit, but I don't ever remember anyone completely "re-badging" another's printer in whole.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  19. #69
    Forum Regular audio amateur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    I work in the laptop and printer parts business. We often see parts and even large assemblies from one manufacture being used in another's unit, but I don't ever remember anyone completely "re-badging" another's printer in whole.
    Does that mean if I need a part for my 5 year old Dell you can be my hookup?

  20. #70
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by audio amateur
    Does that mean if I need a part for my 5 year old Dell you can be my hookup?
    I can find Dell parts, but we don't get any discounts on them. We'd end up marking the price up. You're better off going on Google yourself. Ebay is another good source. If you need Toshiba laptop or projector parts I can hook you up for sure.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  21. #71
    Forum Regular audio amateur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    I can find Dell parts, but we don't get any discounts on them. We'd end up marking the price up. You're better off going on Google yourself. Ebay is another good source. If you need Toshiba laptop or projector parts I can hook you up for sure.
    Is that toshiba projectors or any projector? Tanx

  22. #72
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by audio amateur
    Is that toshiba projectors or any projector? Tanx
    Tosh mostly. I think we can get Epson parts too.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  23. #73
    Forum Regular audio amateur's Avatar
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    I'm looking at a full hd Optoma for 500 bucks Any idea how expensive their bulbs are?

  24. #74
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by audio amateur
    I'm looking at a full hd Optoma for 500 bucks Any idea how expensive their bulbs are?
    I would try this company first. http://www.dlplampsource.com/e-store...=1016181377040

    Once you have the part number needed, you can check Google & Ebay for the best pricing.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  25. #75
    nightflier
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    Isn't it a matter of degrees?

    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    I work in the laptop and printer parts business. We often see parts and even large assemblies from one manufacture being used in another's unit, but I don't ever remember anyone completely "re-badging" another's printer in whole.
    I believe that Canon still designs, manufactures, and assembles all of HP's printers, and the badge on the front is just that, a badge. The big difference, is that the price difference between Canon and HP printers isn't $2K.

    I'm really surprised that Lexicon is sticking to their guns, not just because of the negative popular press, but also considering the negative response it will be getting from the audio community. As has been pointed out, it calls all hi-fi into question and could affect sales across this industry, especially in this economy. I sure hope Michael Fremer doesn't come out in defense of Lexicon....

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