Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
They are two different things, in the first instance our brains are too slow to discern
the seperate frames and they run together and make motion.
If our brains were too "fast" then we'd be sitting there waiting for all of teh frames to get there and they would be as what they are seperate frames.
I knew you were dumb, just not short yellow schoolbus dumb
I didn't say our brain was too fast stupid, I said the PROCESS was too fast for our eye/brain mechansim. And you say I am dumb, you can't even read foo.

I can.
And you say MY standards are low
Yes I did, and I am right.

I think your brains are "cobbled" together
You do not know how to think, and that is why you make these kinds of stupid statements.


No, it was what was left over after I spent my money on something more important, the people in my life. I have my priorities, something you dont have to worry about since most probably wont get near you
Your idiotness, you do not know how people interact with me, you don't know me from Adam's house cat. I think its rather ironic that a admitted dumpster diver says he has priorities. What, finding the cheapest trash he can find? Well, I hope you found yourself.


EVERYTHING is a compromise to meet a price point.
And performace relative to price is important , if you know anything you'd know THAT
Your thinking is too mass market. In the high end, products are designed for performance first, and the price is purely secondary. In the mass market its the opposite. A price point is established, and the product is created to meet that price point. Once again you are missing the detail of the discussion.

No, its a result of using a CRT for something for which it was never intended, CRT was
always meant to be a direct view device, they just dont produce enough light to work as a projection device without serious long term problems.
This is a laughable statement if I ever saw one. Can you explain what serious long term problems will exist? You have never owned a front projection system, so how do you know what issue could pop up? I have owned a Sony G-90 for the last five years, I have not had a single problem from it. Other folks have had their front projection systems for close to ten years and have had no problems. You are stinking up the room with your bull$hit.

they were a work around because there was nothing besides a film projector to meet the home viewing need.
Now their compromises arent nessesary, and when wall size OLED is in production
it will be the dominant form factor
Rediculous. Flat panels are the compromise. They sacrifice performance levels already acheived by high end CRT's(and lower end models as well) for the convience of hanging it on a wall. Flat panels do not do black, the do not reproduce the color gamut at SMPTE spec's, the cannot reproduce the grey scale accurately, they have poor response times and motion blur. What you consider is the compromise does do black, can reproduce the color gamut at SMPTE spec's, can do the grey scale accurately, does not suffer from motion blur, and has a instantaneous response. And please do not talk to me about something that has not even acheived a 20" screen size yet.



Stacked projectors have been a way for HT types to double the light output of their setup forever, go to the magazine sites and check out the archives.
It becaome more common when HD arrived, since the light output of a HD CRT is much less
Once again you are lying. I am an installer and have been so for more than 15 years. I can count on one hand the amount of installs I have done that required stacked projectors. You talk like this is the norm, and it isn't. Lie number two, HD CRT have less light than analog CRT's, more bull$hit. The Sony G-90 was built in 1997 In 1997 HDTV was almost non existant, but the G-90, the Barco 1209, and the electrohome 9500 ultra could reproduce 1080p back then. The could put out 1300 lumens in 1997 and they can put out 1300 lumens in 2008. So they could do better than HDTV back then, and 1300 lumens back then, so just when did the light output drop? Where are my boots, dude you are loaded full of cow plop.


Thats three cheap projection TV sets, two an HD(samsung and pioneer 47in models) and uncounted experience from various friends, systems at work, etc.
Unless you're over fifty you arent even CLOSE to my "experience" with CRT tech,
starting in the early seventies
Your "experience" has not translated to "knowledge", so it is essentially worthless.

Any dlp front projection set will beat the pants off of CRT in brightness, resolution, and most importantly, price.
Lie number three. I know of no DLP that can do 2500x2000(essentially 2000p)lines of information. Zero. Price is only a issue for those who count pennies. I treasure performance first, price second. DLP's suffer the same problems as all fixed panel devices do, cannot do black, cannot do greyscale, cannot reproduce the HD color gamut accurately. You get what you pay for. Brightness does not matter when you cannot do so many other things correctly.

THE FORM FACTOR that will (and is ) most practical and affordable for most is a DLP,
LCOS (or one of its derivatives) and LCD front projection, while bringing up the rear in q is still quite good.
This is the thinking of the a "good enough" person, not a "give me the best" person. DLP, LCD, and plasma are all a step backwards from my current "dinosaur" CRT RPTV. Not one of these technologies can do what my current RPTV does. I don't do good enough.

NOBODY wants a monstrosity sitting in their HT or living room and are willing to put up with the shortcomings in order to acheive miniscule improvements.
Well there must be alot of nobodies out there, because Curt Palmer who sells refurbished RPTV and front projection systems is doing booming business right now, in spite of the fact that they do not make them anymore. When you compare the performance of the typical high end projector, the flat panel is the one with the shortcomings. And you would have to own one to say its improvements are miniscule. Of course because you have always purchased cheap crap, I am sure a compromised flat panel like the vizio is an improvement for you.

If a 5,000 DLP projector will acheive 99% of what a 20,000 CRT can do you'd have to be an idiot to buy the CRT.
AND WHEN SOMETHINGS OBSOLETE it means that better is out there, you can keep using the old stuff, sure, but sooner or later it will be GONE
There is a flaw in this logic, even the best plasma, DLP or LCD cannot even come close to the performance of the Sony G-90. All you have to do is look at test spec's and one can clearly see this. You are just one bucket of lies old dude. You are just like Nightliar, will lie just for the sake of doing so. CRT's are not obsolete, they are just too big and require alot of maintainence. The only benefit a flat panel offers you over a CRT is it takes up less space. Otherwise it is a compromise when compared to a quality CRT based projector.

GLAD YOU CONCEDE MY POINT
Sorry but motion blur is visible. The effects of a slow response time are visible. The inability to do below black is visible. The inability to reproduce an accurate HD color gamut is visible. So the only point that I will concede is that you are not very bright to be so old.


your brains are flawed.
of course our broadcast tech is "flawed" , its built by human beings, however it does quite good most of the time.
So how does a flat panel correct this? It doesn't, and because of its drawbacks, it makes a compromised system even worse.

Our system used to be built around CRT tech, it was intended that that was what we'd use to translate electronic signals into light.
But that isnt the case anymore.
Interlaced broadcasting was an ingenious solution to not having enough space to put an entire signal through at once, but it was a compromise.
Since we still have a interlaced based broadcasting system, how did the change to a digital system improved the system?. A digitally based interlaced system is no better than a analog based interlaced system. It is a more complex system because digitally based signal do not travel as far as analog based transmission systems, so more repeaters are required which makes the entire system more complex.


Today we still use it for the same reason but in a different way, instead of putting together
two fields to make one interlaced frame we are putting together two frames to make one
progressive frame
That would explain 720p, but how about 1080i? In OTA broadcasting 720p is the minority, and 1080i is the majority.

More philosophy from the three stooges school of thought.
The first two years of school in electronics was frustrating, we learned about oscilators,
components like capacitors, various solid state and even tube devices.
We never touched a TV.
If that is the case, then how can you use the words of your electronics teacher if you never touched the subject? It is pretty obvious they didn't teach you about TV

Then the first week of the third year a schematic of a tv set was laid out, we were surprized to see that we understood it perfectly.
Our teacher said we had to learn the underlying , more simple concepts in order to put them together.
This is the way I still learn things, break them down to component parts
It is the only way to learn anything.
Unfortunately when you break them down, some of the little pieces are getting lost, so your ability to create a whole picture, a coherent stream of logic is completely compromised. So this explain why you skip the detail and the big picture. There is none.

An atom bomb is simply playing pool at the subatomic level,
making it happen is whats complicated
This is pretty deep for a person that is as deep as a pool of spit on a sidewalk. Do you borrow this from sombody?


What I hate to see is your childish nonsense on this page because I simply can't resist the urge to put a simpering moron with delusions of grandeur in his place.
You must be saying this in a mirror.

I know my limitations and place in the universe, just wish you'd quit trying to stand on your hind legs and exceed yours
We all know your limitations. Unfortunately we have to read about them everyday on this board. Wishing is for kids, are you starting your second childhood pixelneck?




Which proves my point, eventually there will be nothing to "refurbish", this is because the form factor is DEAD.
While they do not make CRT based television anymore, there are plenty of parts to continue refurbishing high end projection systems for years to come. Didn't you say that plasma is dead? Well, it doesn't look dead to me as long as they continue to make them. As long as I can purchase a refurbished or upgraded quality CRT projector, then it ain't dead yet.

In the future they will view this as we view a horse and buggy, while they watch their
oled screens painted on a wall using nanotech to arrange the elements
They said we would have flying cars by now, but we don't. So I'll just wait until we can view this horse and buggy arguement when the reality sets in. You'll be dead by then though.



None of this is relevant to 99% of the population, and even people in the field would have trouble discerning the difference between a five grand DLP and a fifty grand CRT
set.
There is no proof of this statement at all. I do not like so called facts that are pulled out of thin air with no proof.

Well, there is one difference, they still make and sell front projector dlp in industrial quanity
something that will never happen again with CRT, no new CRT factories will be built.
The chinese makes alot of things in quantity, that does not make them better. Most things made in quantity usually lack quality anyway.

CRT is quite gooid, it should be with armies of engineers working on it for a century,
but with all of that effort it should be better
Truth is that CRT was a nessesary evil, we used it because there was no choice.
Now theres a choice.
Flat panels are also a necessary evil. They were invented for the sake of the WAF, and not because they are a inherently better technology. I find it rather ironic that a projector that is 11 years old can outperform a "new" technology. Things that are digital are not always better than things that are analog. A just becuase something can be hung on a wall, does not make it better than something that takes up alot of space.

People who saw the first cars procclaimed them a "fad" because a good horse
could outrun them. THAT DIDNT LAST LONG.
I wasn't around when car first got here, so I do not know what folks proclaimed. You were probably around though.

My standard are "lower" than yours?Not really, I JUST LIVE IN THE REAL WORLD,
and like most cant afford thousands for a miniscule increase in performance that my fifty year old eyes probably cant detect anyway, when a 20 year old would have a problem doing so.
Your standards are lower than mine. I treasure performance over price. You treasure price over performance. A vizio flat panel would NEVER grace my hometheater because it cannot exceed the performance of my current dinosaur CRT RPTV. My eyes have absolutely no problem seeing a significant performance increase over a flat panel. You would have a problem because you cannot recognized quality of you saw it. Its all about price to you. Neither of my twenty year old sons have any problem seeing the improvement of my CRT based RPTV over the LCD panels in their rooms. That is why they are sitting in front of my set more than they sit in front of theirs.

And this is considering that CRT is better, which it isnt actually.
Face it talky, NOBODY is working on this tech anymore, its in the attic of the human race in practicallity if not quite reality just yet.
GET OVER IT.
Well Curt Palmer is still working on them, he is somebody. I know at least 10 other folks that work on them as well. Curt Palmer is always working on improvments to high end projectors, even if Sony or Ampro aren't. Nothing is not in the attic until there is not one left in use. There are millions still in use.

I really like the name Sir Talky. Its funny, much like pixelidiot, pixelpuss, pixeless, and my personal favorite because it so aptly describes you...burntoutpixel.

Looking forward to the next round old fart.