Speakers for Classical Music for Rotel RB 1070 (budget: upto 2k$)

[RGA]

Dear TAH -

You once told me - "get overyourself" - after a night's sleep I think you were correct - I need to "get over myself" so I will not ask for any of those things like ISP addresses, links to ebay acocounts to be sure the ebay seller was you, or where you auditioned the AN E, or that when you say there are no dealers in the UK but there are, because in the end "point in fact" you are entitled to you opinion. My Arrogance and Ego on this matter has gotten the better of me, I must admit.

I presume that my opinion is the "right" opinion. And of course it is "right" for me and I simply must allow that it may not be "right" for you. Indeed, looking back at the exchange on AA - with your passionate stance for a "brilliant" sound you held for Elac I now must admit that you and I simply do not hear the same things when we are listening to audio equipment. I heard Elac in South Korea (Yongsan statiion in a mega high end complex second or third floor) over a year after that exchange. Sometimes timing is everything. So it is clear to me that because you liked that speaker so much and my audition was pretty much the ploar opposite that well we hear things completely differently - and it is entirely plausible in fact likely that if the Elac sound is one you held with such high esteem that the AN K would not. I doubt the two would really hold a water with the same individuals.

Geofcin has not responded but I see it now - it really makes no difference whether I believe you or not or in fact that you've heard it or not, or in fact that you heard it and didn't like it.

Theaudiohobby - I'll take you at your word on this matter and operate on good faith with an apology for implying that you did not really audition the Audio Note products you have claimed to audition.

Blackraven
You have posted a link of a guy who bought the AN K - Nelson is a very nice young man and I spent several hours listening to his AN K in his room and in fact can't say I disagreed with what I heard. In his room with his gear the speaker was eaisly the brightest of the lot leaning edgy - still open fast and tight but not particularly dynamic and not bass strong - I would use the word ultra-lean - though there was no irritating ringing or anything - it just didn't have any drive or in room pressure that I got in my room. In my room I had followed what the manufacturer told me to do - thus, I had them in corners in a small with no other speakers in the room, anbgled in so the tweeters fired a meter in front of my head with my head below the tweeters on sand/leadshot filled stands coupled with blu-tac. I was fascinated in fact to hear the AN K in a very large open room with vauleted ceiling placed 5 feet into the room directly beside Gershman Acoustics speakers on stands higher than recommended with 200 watt high damping factor Solid State power amps (oddyssy). I was actually a little impressed at how good they performed considering that this is just about as bad a set-up as one would put the AN K in.

What is interesting is that if the theaudiohobby had heard them, I suspect he would be shocked and dispayed because in his audions he found the exact polar opposite of how he described the the AN K/B which paraphrasing was rolled off in the treble but not bright.

I have tried the AN K/Spe with Bryston, Arcam, Sugden, Audio Note, Audio Refinment, Linn, ASL, Marantz(a receiver), Oddyssy, Sonic Impact, Sim Audio, and Rotel. Have I achieved the result that Nelson got - and have I achieved the one theaudiohobby got? Well I did get the lean sound in other combinations and rooms - I have not got the result the audiohobby got - but then I have not heard the AN K/B. And to be fair having heard the AN E/D and the AN E/Spe with the differences in wiring and cabinet materials - I can certainly gleam a degree of insight into TAH's audition of the K/B and K/Spe The copper wired mdf/chipboard models versus the ply/silver wired variants does show a darker presentation with the former.

Theaudiohobby and fellow forumers
So again I opologise for not "getting over myself" and not accepting the views that run or ran counter to my own. I pride myself in being an incredibly open minded person in the sense that I am liberal to quite a large degree on what people choose to do in their own life. Although I do have a Richard Dawkins athiest zealot streak in me when it comes to religion.

Again I opologise for my comments and inuendos to TAH and for allowing my personal preference for something to be held as gosepl and to assume, quite arrogantly, that everyone must share the same preference as me or it is they that must have been dropped on their head at a yound age. Indeed reading myself here I come across as those guys who come to my door with the pamphlets telling me to believe or go to hell for all eternity (indeed amusingly enough is reminiscent of the "are you on the road to audio hell?" argument) - the exact people I hide behind my couch from when they come knocking so they'll go away.

[theaudiohobby]

You once told me - "get overyourself" - after a night's sleep I think you were correct - I need to "get over myself" so I will not ask for any of those things like ISP addresses, links to ebay acocounts to be sure the ebay seller was you,

There is nothing stopping you from asking, why stop now? By the way, you have chosen a lousy time to get over yourself, to do so after pointedly and repeatedly accusing me of lying smacks of very lousy timing.

or where you auditioned the AN E, or that when you say there are no dealers in the UK but there are, because in the end "point in fact" you are entitled to you opinion

Nice sleight of hand, when did I ever say I had auditioned the AN E, care to point to any post anywhere where I made that claim. Secondly, I never said Audio Note had no dealers in the UK, I said "I do not know any dealers that carry the AN E in the UK" big difference which happens to be the reason I have not listened to the AN E as my closest Audio Note dealer (Noteworthy Audio) did not carry it.

[Florian]

Oh boy Oh boy Oh boy..... i didnt even read the responses. But man that thread kept on flying....weeeeeee!

Cool stuff... puts some interest back into this forum.... not much tough

[RGA]

There is nothing stopping you from asking, why stop now? By the way, you have chosen a lousy time to get over yourself, to do so after pointedly and repeatedly accusing me of lying smacks of very lousy timing.

Nice sleight of hand, when did I ever say I had auditioned the AN E, care to point to any post anywhere where I made that claim. Secondly, I never said Audio Note had no dealers in the UK, I said "I do not know any dealers that carry the AN E in the UK" big difference which happens to be the reason I have not listened to the AN E as my closest Audio Note dealer (Noteworthy Audio) did not carry it.

Again I am sorry - you mentioned that the AN E was overpriced and thus because you are pretty diligent about not opining on things you have not heard naturally I assumed you auiditioned it. You mentioned you heard a speaker at a friends and I thought you were talking about the AN E since the AN E was what was being discussed previously and mostly in the thread. Please if you can help me out in the future if people are discussing the AN E it would help that if you make comments on the sound that you make it clearer that it was not the E you hear but you are commenting on the AN K or J and "inferring" from that experience what the E sounds like - certainly you may feel that the AN E is overpriced without auditioning but givent he thread it certainly makes it appear that you auditioned it. Lots of people love the E and don't love the J incidentally and that is why looking back it was not clear to me.

However, I will endevour not to skim read in the future but I am on holiday and trying to spend as little time on this as possible and should have read more carefully and or checked for clarification. If I had simply asked "have you heard the AN E" I would have prevented the whole thing. Again my error.

[GMichael]

I so miss the good ol' days.

[audio amateur]

opining

Is that actually a word?

[Ajani]

Is that actually a word?

Yep.. it is...

[theaudiohobby]

You mentioned you heard a speaker at a friends and I thought you were talking about the AN E since the AN E was what was being discussed previously and mostly in the thread. Please if you can help me out in the future if people are discussing the AN E it would help that if you make comments on the sound that you make it clearer that it was not the E you hear but you are commenting on the AN K or J and "inferring" from that experience what the E sounds like - certainly you may feel that the AN E is overpriced without auditioning but givent he thread it certainly makes it appear that you auditioned it.

Do we now have listen to a speaker to make a judgement that it's overpriced? Hello, I just said that my local dealer does not carry the speaker, could it be that he feels that the AN E is not competitive (in the UK) in its price bracket? Furthermore we are on thread when the original poster asked speakers up to 2k. Or do I have to personally listen to every speaker model before recommending it be added to a short list?

[Ajani]

Do we now have listen to a speaker to make a judgement that it's overpriced? Hello, I just said that my local dealer does not carry the speaker, could it be that he feels that the AN E is not competitive (in the UK) in its price bracket? Furthermore we are on thread when the original poster asked speakers up to 2k. Or do I even have personally listen to a speaker to recommend that another add it their short list?

I know this question wasn't directed at me... but to be honest, If I was going to claim that a speaker is overpriced, I think I really should have at least auditioned it 1st or have detailed knowledge of the cost to produce it (including R&D etc)... Otherwise, what am I basing my opinion on? I don't see the reason to bash something I've never heard...

[theaudiohobby]

I know this question wasn't directed at me... but to be honest, If I was going to claim that a speaker is overpriced, I think I really should have at least auditioned it 1st or have detailed knowledge of the cost to produce it (including R&D etc)... Otherwise, what am I basing my opinion on? I don't see the reason to bash something I've never heard...

Did you read my previous comments? Do you suppose I have not done any research? Did you miss the fact I said visited an Audio Note dealer and auditioned the model that the dealer deemed competitive? Do you suppose the current Audio note dealer does not carry E line because they are screaming bargains?

To answer your concern, I have a lot to base my opinion, I wasn't belly gazing when I said it's overpriced and evidently the UK market concurs as the nearest (and the only one I know of) place to audition it is Audio Note's factory in brighton!

fyi....here is a link to the dealer to give you some perspective as your defence of RGA is becoming ridiculous.

[Ajani]

your defence of RGA is becoming ridiculous.

OK... clearly you two have a serious beef and I'll keep out since I don't side with either of you...


Now where did GM put my popcorn?

[GMichael]

OK... clearly you two have a serious beef and I'll keep out since I don't side with either of you...


Now where did GM put my popcorn?

A little anger management could be in order. At least it's entertaining though.

The popcorn is all gone. How about some beer and nuts?

[theaudiohobby]

OK... clearly you two have a serious beef and I'll keep out since I don't side with either of you...

Your contribution to the spat has been less than helpful, a few posts ago you made a bad situation worse by implying that RGA actions might be justified and here you are doing the exact same thing. RGA defamed me on a public board which puts him in a very spotty position. RGA never did provide the url to the previous audio note thread he liberally excerpted, why not ask him why?

Like you said, its time for you to grab the popcorn.

[GMichael]

Your contribution to the spat has been less than helpful, a few posts ago you made a bad situation worse by implying that RGA actions might be justified and here you are doing the exact same thing. RGA defamed me on a public board which puts him in a very spotty position. RGA never did provide the url to the previous audio note thread he liberally excerpted, why not ask him why?

Like you said, its time for you to grab the popcorn.

Just one word. Decaf.

[theaudiohobby]

Just one word. Decaf.

Already done that....did not make the defamation less easy to accept.

[Ajani]

A little anger management could be in order. At least it's entertaining though.

Yep... funny how at 1st RGA sounded like he needed the anger management classes... and now that RGA has gotten all apologetic and chilled, TAH is getting in a rage...

The popcorn is all gone. How about some beer and nuts?

Beer yes... but you can keep your nuts.... I have my own...

[GMichael]

Yep... funny how at 1st RGA sounded like he needed the anger management classes... and now that RGA has gotten all apologetic and chilled, TAH is getting in a rage...



Beer yes... but you can keep your nuts.... I have my own...

Mine are salted.

[theaudiohobby]

Yep... funny how at 1st RGA sounded like he needed the anger management classes... and now that RGA has gotten all apologetic and chilled,.

Needless to say your comments were the most unfortunate as you suggest that my comments should not be taken on face value. And you did the same thing twice in the same thread! very good going!

[RGA]

Do we now have listen to a speaker to make a judgement that it's overpriced? Hello, I just said that my local dealer does not carry the speaker, could it be that he feels that the AN E is not competitive (in the UK) in its price bracket? Furthermore we are on thread when the original poster asked speakers up to 2k. Or do I have to personally listen to every speaker model before recommending it be added to a short list?

After living in China and currently vacationing in Thailand I now find "everything overpriced." I did say "certainly you may feel that the AN E is overpriced without auditioning" and you're well within your rights to feel that way. Perhaps your dealer feels the same way or he may have other reasons for not stocking one. Since I have never been there or met the people running the store you'd me more up on them than I. I would no assume they're overpriced because the dealer doesn't have one in stock - my dealer has one in stock - the demonstration model and it takes 6 months to a year to get one if you like it. That includes he dealers - they can't get any either. Maybe Noteworthy is on a wait list - maybe they sold their demonsration model - maybe they don't like Audio Note at all anymore and are just clearing stock.

You don't like the sound - you think they're ovepriced and you feel you have evidence to support both. Fine. I get it. AN bad - Peter is a shuckster - RGA is a mean bad man for liking something you don't like. Good - I am sorry I opologized. Here is my pound of flesh

[theaudiohobby]

You don't like the sound - you think they're overpriced and you feel you have evidence to support both. Fine. I get it. AN bad - Peter is a shuckster - RGA is a mean bad man for liking something you don't like.

So much for an apology!

Here is my pound of flesh

it's foul! keep it! I look forward to the day when you can find it in yourself to write an unambiguous apology.

[Luvin Da Blues]

........ RGA defamed me on a public board which puts him in a very spotty position.......

Help me out here TAH. I'm not a legal type dude but don't we all post anonymously here so, how can this be defamation?

[mlsstl]

It is amazing how many times people can walk right by repeated opportunities to conclude an argument. (The word "conclude" was carefully chosen; it doesn't mean "win" or "resolve".)

Perhaps audiophiles are human after all.... ;-)

[RGA]

Dear theaudiohobby

I have difficulty giving you a solid apology because you so often give the impression you have listened to things and then apparently not heard them. You have said to me that you have never heard the AN E in this thread but on a prior thread here on CAM you said the following:

"In comparison AN-E and the Quad are dynamically constipated.and no one will seriously consider either as credible classical music studio monitor."

"Personally, comparing the Westminster to the Audio Note E is a bit of a joke , they are in a different league entirely."

"The fact of the matter is that nobody in their right mind will monitor a large orchestra recording on either an Audio Note E or a Quad 2905 because of their dynamic and bass limitations."

"Well not in my book…it lean midbass and upper bass is not to my taste. It’s limited LF capability would certainly take a toll on dynamics."

All from just one thread Advice about speakers

Now if you put yourself in my shoes for a moment then you would see why I had assumed you auditioned the AN E. This is an awful lot of commentary on the way you perceive a speaker to sound without actually hearing them. And if you have not auditioned the AN E then judging from that thread is not clear which , if any of the three of those speakers you have heard. The E is roughly three times the box volume of the J - it's fine if you are inferring what the E sounds like based upon your audition of the J, but I think it is fair to actually mention at some point that that's what you are doing or state that "while I have not auditioned the E - according to the measurements provided by XYZ magazine the bass is too limited or the Dynamics is measurably proven not to be a good dynamic loudspeaker and the in room bass response can't cover acoustic instruments such as the piano." Again I have no problem with anyone commenting on speakers they have not directly heard so long as, in fairness to everyone reading, that you don't imply or infer that you have heard something. If this was an oversight on your part - that's also ok - it happens people are in a rush read something or write something to make a point or let the argument supercede what they otherwise would have written with a cooler head.

But since neither of these notes was stated by you when someone talks about the sound of the midbass I assume they've actually heard it. I don't believe you can really fault me for making that assumption.

I have no problem with apologizing for erroneously making the assumption you heard something you didn't or vice versa, but I can't see how you could blame me for concluding with your above statements that you auditioned the AN E. But hey, now I know and I offer the apology and I hope you can at least see why I jumped to the conclusion and why I asked you to try to make it more clear in the future so that it will prevent people like myself from jumping to that conclusion.

[theaudiohobby]

I have difficulty giving you a solid apology because....

That's say its all... it would seem Ajani has given you some steam to start erecting new strawmen. In the same thread you said

"The Red Trace in your graph of Harbeth shows similar measured response in certain areas indicating room induced issues - that said it is a fair assessment in commentary by John Atkinson -

In the end I can't argue with the measurements since they are what they are. I hear it like Art hears it and numerous others hear it ."

But I guess that the passage of time continues to cloud your recollection of previous events, or is it just case of another day, another strawman. While at it, I might as well repeat my comments from the previous thread, the Audio Note E is dynamically challenged in the bass, I do not have drive to a Ford Escort to know that it not as fast as a B&W M3.

[GMichael]