plasma is DEAD...part deux

[Woochifer]

You probably are, you are probably still in JR high

Wrong again. But, I'd add that your limited grasp of logic and piss poor grammar is a lot more reminiscent of grade school than anything that I post!

It is dead
dead dead dead dead .
Kinda like you above the neck.

Right, since you interpret a tech segment that grew by more than 30% last year as dead, I'll take your assessment of my cognitive acument as your bass-ackward acknowledgment that you've lost yet another argument.

Keep right on repeating your plasma is dead mantra. It just makes you look more and more like a plasma shill as plasma sales grow, and your street lunatic rantings steer one person after another on this board towards plasma.

Why would I keep any of my old TV sets around?

And why would I use one as a "mirrow"?

My Vizio is mounted in the back room, my folks have my old 37" in their living room.
LOOK at the pot calling the kettle black, never seen pics of your goldstar special.

The link to my home theater pics have been in my signature for longer than you've been on this board. The only reason you haven't seen it is because you're either too lazy or haven't been taking your Ritalin. When I get around to updating it with my current TV, the new pics will be there. Pics of myself, my wife, and my daughter have also been posted on this site. Unlike you, I have nothing to hide because I'm not a troll.

Funny that you'd bring up pot, cuz short-term memory loss and short attention span seem to be an issue with you ...

And the "WALMART DRUGS are for diabetes assclown.

And the symptoms that infect your posts have nothing to with insulin levels!

The only "blur" around here is your personality.
I HAVE NEVER SEEN ANY SO CALLED "MOTION BLUR".
OR BURN IN EITHER.
I am two for two, you are one for two

And you claim that others are factually challenged and make nothing but personal attacks?

It doesnt exist AT ALL, it is totally MADE UP.

The motion resolution measurements are there for anyone who wants to see them. The only thing made up is your repeated denials.

A TEST PATTERN is the only reconized way to measure resolution,

And a test pattern is exactly what's used to measure motion resolution. Try reading the info on my links sometime, rather than just staring at the pictures.

And 60hz is also the standard, as TV is 60 fps.

Yep, that's why all plasma TVs use 60 Hz as the native screen refresh rate. Low motion resolution is not an issue with plasma TVs, so they don't need to go with 120 Hz or 240 Hz. The Pioneer plasmas have a native 72 Hz mode to handle 1080/24p signals.

A 120HZ SET DOUBLES that frame rate, a 24p blue player puts out 72(24fps times 3)
in order to eliminate 3:2 pulldown.

That's not all it does. Most 120 Hz sets use interpolated images to fill in the gaps between frames. That's why some reviewers think that 120 Hz motion interpolation makes the picture quality look worse -- every other image is something fabricated by the video processor. Now, with LCD manufacturers going to 240 Hz and 480 Hz screen refresh rates, upwards of 75% to 87.5% of the frames are no longer native to the source.

If a set advertises anything higher its just a con, it wont give you any resolution increase,

Yet, 120 Hz LCDs routinely outperform 60 Hz LCDs on motion resolution tests.

its impossible to get any res increase in a video pic without an expensive scaler.
You do get an increase in PQ by deinterlacing a pic(480i to 480p, or 1080i to 1080p) but that is just because you are doing away with interlacing.

Deinterlacing alone does not explain away the wretched motion resolution performance with 60 Hz LCD TVs, but I see that you'll keep trying to bending the facts to suit your agenda.

I have read claims from some plasma makers that their sets are "480" hz
HAD ME LAUGHING ROLLING ON THE FLOOR.
Even IF a set has this rediculously high refresh rate it would be of no practical value.

And if you actually read what the number is, you'd see that it's not the refresh rate for the screen itself, just the video subfield processor. Nothing more than a marketing number for the J6Ps that buy their TVs based on spec numbers. Of course, the only number that matters to you is the price tag.

And as for "moving images" my set will have moving images long after your POS

Right, this coming from someone who reflexively kicks his TVs to the curb before the warranty even runs out. Spare me your hypocrisy until you actually keep a TV for a year or two.

Like I said, I'll take my chances with a company that has the highest reliability in the industry and proven track record for customer service and warranty support, over some marketer with an inconsistent reliability record and post-warranty support that was nonexistent until very recently.

[RoadRunner6]

Here we go again, a page after page rematch of the Pix and Boom-Boom Wooch duking it out all over again!

Very prophetic if I do say so myself!

RR6

[Rich-n-Texas]

You are Nostradomos(sp?) reincarnated RR6.

[GMichael]

I picked that up off the web, and then politely declined the invitation from your old lady.

If my old lady gave you an invitation, you should have accepted. It would have been your only chance in life to be with a hot babe. Well, at least one that didn't charge you.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Great comeback G.

[RoadRunner6]

If my old lady gave you an invitation, you should have accepted. It would have been your only chance in life to be with a hot babe. Well, at least one that didn't charge you.

Oh, that was beautiful!

[Rich-n-Texas]

We should frame it, ya know?

[GMichael]

Oh come on guys. Let's not make him feel any worse than he already does. He deserves our pitty.

[pixelthis]

Oh come on guys. Let's not make him feel any worse than he already does. He deserves our pitty.

FUNNY, YOUR OLD LADY SAID THE SAME ABOUT YOU.

[pixelthis]

You are Nostradomos(sp?) reincarnated RR6.

more like NOSTRA-DUMBASS, really.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Oh nooooooooo!!! An afternoon appearance by the pill pusher!

[GMichael]

FUNNY, YOUR OLD LADY SAID THE SAME ABOUT YOU.

She does worry about me so.

[pixelthis]

[QUOTE]

Wrong again. But, I'd add that your limited grasp of logic and piss poor grammar is a lot more reminiscent of grade school than anything that I post!

At least I have some grasp of logic

Right, since you interpret a tech segment that grew by more than 30% last year as dead, I'll take your assessment of my cognitive acument as your bass-ackward acknowledgment that you've lost yet another argument.

And LCD still outsells it by a wide margin.
Not to mention that a lot of those "sales" were to business and included a lot of "spiffs"
(kickbacks)

Keep right on repeating your plasma is dead mantra. It just makes you look more and more like a plasma shill as plasma sales grow, and your street lunatic rantings steer one person after another on this board towards plasma.

Plasma is DEAD because of many technical reasons, not to mention economic ones.
First it was the gas escaping from the tube envelope , but they supposedly "fixed"
that, and then it was screen burn in, and then they supposedly "fixed" that
Wit such an amalgamation of patches and work arounds, like cycling the picture on and off, effectively cutting the brightness in half.
THIS next disaster will drive away even more customers, as will the next one.
ITS BASICALLY A RUBE GOLDBERG CONTRAPTION,
destined for a spot next to the eight track tape player in the attic.

And why would I use one as a "mirrow"?

A typo, know what that is?
And I dount you would use one as a mirror, might break it even worse than it will be already

The link to my home theater pics have been in my signature for longer than you've been on this board. The only reason you haven't seen it is because you're either too lazy or haven't been taking your Ritalin. When I get around to updating it with my current TV, the new pics will be there. Pics of myself, my wife, and my daughter have also been posted on this site. Unlike you, I have nothing to hide because I'm not a troll.

I have seen you setup, and you have plenty to hide, even if you dont realize it

Funny that you'd bring up pot, cuz short-term memory loss and short attention span seem to be an issue with you ...

You are the one out of touch with reality

And the symptoms that infect your posts have nothing to with insulin levels!

And the lies, propaganda and outright mistruths have nothing to do with your low I.Q levels.
Beleiving a propaganda website fronted by the MAJOR plasma make, however, is

And you claim that others are factually challenged and make nothing but personal attacks?

What have you been doing during this entire post except lying and making personal
"attacks"?

The motion resolution measurements are there for anyone who wants to see them. The only thing made up is your repeated denials.

I deny that there is such a thing as "motion resolution" and anybody with ANY electronics training whatsoever will deny the same thing.
These "measurements" appeared on a propaganda website hosted by a CE whore
who spent 30 years as a PR hack working for the people trying to push plasma tv
down the throats of an unsuspecting public in order to pay for a stupid investment in a new plasma plant.
They mean absolutely NOTHING

And a test pattern is exactly what's used to measure motion resolution. Try reading the info on my links sometime, rather than just staring at the pictures.

a test pattern is a still image dillweed, how do you measure something moving with
a still image.
There has been several tries at coming up with a valid and consistent way of measuring
resolution during motion, but no sucess so far.
You can get in the ballpark but nothing precise.
The rest is, as SAMUEL CLEMMENS said, "lies, damn lies, and statistics".
Which you ought to know about, handling all three for our benevolent govt.

Yep, that's why all plasma TVs use 60 Hz as the native screen refresh rate. Low motion resolution is not an issue with plasma TVs, so they don't need to go with 120 Hz or 240 Hz. The Pioneer plasmas have a native 72 Hz mode to handle 1080/24p signals.

Its not an "issue" with LCD sets EITHER.
KEEP MAKING STUFF UP, IN the end reality biting you in the ass will still
hurt like a b***tch

That's not all it does. Most 120 Hz sets use interpolated images to fill in the gaps between frames. That's why some reviewers think that 120 Hz motion interpolation makes the picture quality look worse -- every other image is something fabricated by the video processor. Now, with LCD manufacturers going to 240 Hz and 480 Hz screen refresh rates, upwards of 75% to 87.5% of the frames are no longer native to the source.

Those "interpolated" images are not made out of whole cloth, they are derived from actual frames.
This is not a problem, expensive scalers were doing this well a decade agao, and now new tech makes the price cheaper

Yet, 120 Hz LCDs routinely outperform 60 Hz LCDs on motion resolution tests.

Are those the same made up POS "tests" you are talking about above?
120hz SETS ARE GOING TO LOOK BETTER, there is more info on teh screen at any given time.
AND FOR THE LAST TIME, the "motion res" is going to be the SAME as the still res,
a progressive DOES NOT lose res during movement, I DONT CARE what YOU SAY,
I will listen to engineers, not a govt hack, thank you

Deinterlacing alone does not explain away the wretched motion resolution performance with 60 Hz LCD TVs, but I see that you'll keep trying to bending the facts to suit your agenda.

YOU are the one with an "agenda" not me, and deinterlacing has NOTHING to do with "motion res" since that DOESNT EXIST.
I guess you think that repeating a lie often enough will make people beleive it.
Now where have I heard THAT before?

And if you actually read what the number is, you'd see that it's not the refresh rate for the screen itself, just the video subfield processor. Nothing more than a marketing number for the J6Ps that buy their TVs based on spec numbers. Of course, the only number that matters to you is the price tag.

price does matter to any intelligent consumer, and the rest is gibberish, as what the subfield (and other procs) output is what appears on THE SCREEN

Right, this coming from someone who reflexively kicks his TVs to the curb before the warranty even runs out. Spare me your hypocrisy until you actually keep a TV for a year or two.

I do trade TV sets quite often, but my last one I had three years, and I TEND TO know those who get my older equipment(it sells easy, they know what I buy)

So its important to have a set that will last, it might be one I keep awhile, and longetivity
also plays to quality, but of course you dont know that(or much of anything)

Like I said, I'll take my chances with a company that has the highest reliability in the industry and proven track record for customer service and warranty support, over some marketer with an inconsistent reliability record and post-warranty support that was nonexistent until very recently.

Panasonic has high reliability, which is why I have bought several of their products,
but they are not miracle workers, not even they can turn a turd into a mercedes.

as you will find out


Hopefully the hard way

[Woochifer]

At least I have some grasp of logic

Tenuous at best, as evidenced by your posts.

And LCD still outsells it by a wide margin.

Yeah, because the vast majority of LCD shipments are in the 32" and under class, and include OEM shipments for computer monitors -- all markets that plasma doesn't compete in.

Not to mention that a lot of those "sales" were to business and included a lot of "spiffs"
(kickbacks)

What do you call all those flat panel computer monitors sitting in offices?

And where's your proof of "spiffs"? Or is this just more imaginary conspiracy nonsense?

Plasma is DEAD because of many technical reasons, not to mention economic ones.First it was the gas escaping from the tube envelope , but they supposedly "fixed"
that, and then it was screen burn in, and then they supposedly "fixed" that
Wit such an amalgamation of patches and work arounds, like cycling the picture on and off, effectively cutting the brightness in half.

Lemme get this straight. A technology is dead when companies keep improving its reliability and performance, and when sales keep growing by more than double digits ever year. And you claim to have "some" grasp of logic?

I have seen you setup, and you have plenty to hide, even if you dont realize it

Yeah, that still explains why you've never posted any pics of your setup or yourself. Wassamadda, you scared of what we will say when the curtain behind your charade gets lifted?

You are the one out of touch with reality

Only the reality that you manufacture inside your head.

And the lies, propaganda and outright mistruths have nothing to do with your low I.Q levels.
Beleiving a propaganda website fronted by the MAJOR plasma make, however, is

Low IQ? I'm not the one that prefers to manufacture fake conspiracy theories when the facts aren't on my side. Or do you actually believe in your own BS? Doesn't sound very bright to me!

What have you been doing during this entire post except lying and making personal
"attacks"?

Uh, let's see ... correcting your many factual errors and basically exposing your posts for the troll fodder that it is?

I deny that there is such a thing as "motion resolution" and anybody with ANY electronics training whatsoever will deny the same thing.

Right, so all of the LCD and plasma TV manufacturers who are touting the improved motion resolution of their latest TVs don't have "any" electronics training?

These "measurements" appeared on a propaganda website hosted by a CE whore
who spent 30 years as a PR hack working for the people trying to push plasma tv
down the throats of an unsuspecting public in order to pay for a stupid investment in a new plasma plant.
They mean absolutely NOTHING

Blah blah blah. So that explains why CNET, Home Theater, HDTV Test, and other review sites use the same motion resolution test. Face it, this is now a standard benchmark test that's very commonly used. And gosh, some LCD TVs have actually begun to perform well on that test.

And like I keep asking you. If Gary Merson is such as plasma hack, then why does he maintain a list of recommended LCD TVs? Basically, you bought a cheap LCD TV and will manufacture whatever lies you can come up with to smear anybody who points out the drawbacks of making the choice that you did. No need to take it personally when the facts don't coincide with your fanboy rants.

a test pattern is a still image dillweed, how do you measure something moving with
a still image.

With a monoscope test pattern.

There has been several tries at coming up with a valid and consistent way of measuring
resolution during motion, but no sucess so far.

Name some of these "several tries." Otherwise, we'll just chuck this into the pile with the rest of your unsubstantiated BS.

The rest is, as SAMUEL CLEMMENS said, "lies, damn lies, and statistics".

And then there's reality and pixie's warped interpretation of it.

Its not an "issue" with LCD sets EITHER.
KEEP MAKING STUFF UP, IN the end reality biting you in the ass will still
hurt like a b***tch

How would you know? Because you're the one getting bitten by reality most of the time?

Those "interpolated" images are not made out of whole cloth, they are derived from actual frames.

And interpolated images are not the same as actual frames. With these new 240 Hz LCDs, now 75% of what the viewer sees is an interpolated image.

This is not a problem, expensive scalers were doing this well a decade agao, and now new tech makes the price cheaper

Cheaper, but not better. So, if LCD tech did not have motion resolution problems, then why would LCD TV manufacturers even bother with 120 Hz screen refresh? And why would they advertise that 120 Hz improves motion if no motion is lost with 60 Hz LCD TVs as you claim? All plasmas are natively 60 Hz because they don't need motion interpolation to smooth out the motion.

Are those the same made up POS "tests" you are talking about above?
120hz SETS ARE GOING TO LOOK BETTER, there is more info on teh screen at any given time.

So that explains why the 60 Hz Pioneer plasmas are currently the most highest rated HDTV on the market?

AND FOR THE LAST TIME, the "motion res" is going to be the SAME as the still res,

How many times are you going to say "FOR THE LAST TIME"?

YOU are the one with an "agenda" not me, and deinterlacing has NOTHING to do with "motion res" since that DOESNT EXIST.

Actually, YOUR agenda is quite clearly all about promoting plasma. Your rantings about plasma and LCD are so over-the-top insane and repetitive that no one can take it seriously!

I guess you think that repeating a lie often enough will make people beleive it.
Now where have I heard THAT before?

Nah, you're the one that actually believes this, given that how much you practice on this board.

price does matter to any intelligent consumer,

And nothing else matters to the pixie consumer.

I do trade TV sets quite often, but my last one I had three years, and I TEND TO know those who get my older equipment(it sells easy, they know what I buy)

And that just makes your rantings about durability and reliability all the more hypocritical, since you don't even bother to keep your TVs long enough to find out how blind your fanboy devotion really is.

So its important to have a set that will last, it might be one I keep awhile, and longetivity
also plays to quality, but of course you dont know that(or much of anything)

Right, so that explains why you bought a TV from a company with an inconsistent track record for reliability, and was imposing extraneous $500+ charges for boxing and shipping on warranty service when you first bought from them.

Panasonic has high reliability, which is why I have bought several of their products,
but they are not miracle workers, not even they can turn a turd into a mercedes.

Yeah, they're not miracle workers. They just make TVs with the lowest failure rate in the industry, and back it up a solid track record for customer service and spare parts availability.

as you will find out


Hopefully the hard way

Why? Because your misery loves company? No thanks.

I'm not the one that bought a disposable TV. Maybe you will find out "the hard way" when your TV needs a part that nobody can locate, or your beloved fanboy company wants to charge you shipping for warranty service. But, I certainly wouldn't wish that on anyone, even a lying troll like you.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Oh come on guys. Let's not make him feel any worse than he already does. He deserves our pitty.

You give him pity, but I would rather give him rat poison.

[GMichael]

You give him pity, but I would rather give him rat poison.

And then you'd miss him. Just like you miss Lex and P.S.

Don't try to deny it. I know that you live to enlighten the non-enlighten-able.
Who would be left for you to play with?

[pixelthis]

You give him pity, but I would rather give him rat poison.

I would think you would be philosopically opposed to a poison aimed at your own kind

[pixelthis]

And then you'd miss him. Just like you miss Lex and P.S.

Don't try to deny it. I know that you live to enlighten the non-enlighten-able.
Who would be left for you to play with?

GEE, is your nose far enough up there to see his tonsils yet.
You DO realize that if it werent for Google TALKY WOULDNT "KNOW"
ANYTHING?