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  1. #1
    Ajani
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    I want CES 2011 NOW!!!! New Product Rumours

    I feel like a kid in a candy store, both of my favourite speaker brands are supposed to debut new lines (in my ideal price range) in January:

    The Revel Performa Series 3

    &

    The Monitor Audio GX Series



    Also, both lines should look gorgeous as they both borrow aesthetics from the flagship Ultima 2 and Platinum lines respectively...

    I wonder what other jewels await me in January...

    http://avcat.jp/avnews/2010/magx.htm
    Last edited by Ajani; 11-17-2010 at 04:46 AM.

  2. #2
    Charm Thai™
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    If that had black trim rings and black woofers it'd be a sharp looking speaker. Silver looks too gaudy on the gloss black for me.

  3. #3
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheHills44060
    If that had black trim rings and black woofers it'd be a sharp looking speaker. Silver looks too gaudy on the gloss black for me.
    I'm sure it will be available in other colours that wont conflict with the silver...

  4. #4
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    A MA dealer told me the RX-6 was quite a bit better than the RS-6. I am also interested in hearing the GX. I hope the economy is good enough for the store to bring something in from the GX.

  5. #5
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    A MA dealer told me the RX-6 was quite a bit better than the RS-6. I am also interested in hearing the GX. I hope the economy is good enough for the store to bring something in from the GX.
    The RX-6 is highly regarded for bringing much of the quality materials and sound from the Gold Series down to a much more affordable price range... I expect the new GX line to do the same by bringing Platinum quality down to the Gold Range...

    There are real advantages to having flagship ranges to trickle down technology from...

  6. #6
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajani
    The RX-6 is highly regarded for bringing much of the quality materials and sound from the Gold Series down to a much more affordable price range... I expect the new GX line to do the same by bringing Platinum quality down to the Gold Range...

    There are real advantages to having flagship ranges to trickle down technology from...


    I own a pair of MA RS 6's and I am not sure how I feel about metal cones. Something is not quite right. The Mo Fi OML 1's which use a silk tweeter and a coated pulp woofer sound much better in the range they cover. The RS 6's are in the closet collecting dust.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
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    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  7. #7
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael
    I own a pair of MA RS 6's and I am not sure how I feel about metal cones. Something is not quite right. The Mo Fi OML 1's which use a silk tweeter and a coated pulp woofer sound much better in the range they cover. The RS 6's are in the closet collecting dust.
    Probably just a system synergy issue... Metal tends to lean towards the bright side and Krell is not known for being rolled off and soft sounding...

    You might want to put the RS6's on A'gon...

  8. #8
    Suspended atomicAdam's Avatar
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    Ajani -

    I should be headed to CES 2011 - I'll make sure to check these out for you and give you a report.

    I'll hopefully also get more time with those LCD2 cans.

  9. #9
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicAdam
    Ajani -

    I should be headed to CES 2011 - I'll make sure to check these out for you and give you a report.

    I'll hopefully also get more time with those LCD2 cans.
    Excellent! I look forward to your impressions on all 3...

  10. #10
    Charm Thai™
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael
    I own a pair of MA RS 6's and I am not sure how I feel about metal cones. Something is not quite right.
    I agree JM. Most of the time subwoofers are the only speakers I can tolerate metal cones in.

  11. #11
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    I'll have to try to get a chance to hear both of those. Looks interesting.
    Tim Evans
    East Street Audio
    Onix, Melody, & ACA

  12. #12
    Suspended atomicAdam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael
    I own a pair of MA RS 6's and I am not sure how I feel about metal cones. Something is not quite right. The Mo Fi OML 1's which use a silk tweeter and a coated pulp woofer sound much better in the range they cover. The RS 6's are in the closet collecting dust.
    AH HA! Now you know why I moved on a bit...

  13. #13
    RGA
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    John and Adam

    The thing with the driver materials is the companies out to make a buck need to differentiate themselves from the pack. The driver itself may in fact be technically superb but it doesn't mean that the sound will be anything other than fatiguing over long listening sessions. Kevlar was written about and people found them to be highly problematic beaming whatever. but they don't sound good in music listening applications IMO. Driver integration is not just a crossover but a sonic character that the driver itself puts out. Because a given woofer may put out 200hz so will four others but they don't all sound alike doing it and that is one reason to consider materials. At some point the tweeter hands over to a woofer and if the materials are dissimilar then a good ear or even average ears will at some point hear that handoff. On a showroom floor a speaker like the Monitor Audio designs with dissimilar drivers can generate a wow factor but sooner or later that dissimilarity will creep in IME. Which might be why the founder of Monitor Audio doesn't own them himself!!!

    Someone read a graph and it looked good so build them and have lots of advertising on the cool new tweeters. Metal, titanium, tube tapering, ribbon, circular ribbon, stretched ribbon, stretched metal, Platinum, Diamond - and it's oh so "cool" - it's a shame they almost always get outclassed entirely by speakers using boring old silk domes and paper. A good plasma in Acapellas or Manger flat cones, field Coils have sounded good but the costs. I have never been convinced by a speaker using a ribbon tweeter. Actually I've never been convinced by a ribbon doing anything. I've liked two recently - Sonist and Audio Zen but even here I kind of feel it could be better with a regular boring old silk dome. The added zing sssss (detail) would be removed and it would like integrated better with the woofers. Although I liked them at the show quite a lot. (but then a show is a 15-45minute listen and then on to the next).

  14. #14
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    John and Adam

    The thing with the driver materials is the companies out to make a buck need to differentiate themselves from the pack. The driver itself may in fact be technically superb but it doesn't mean that the sound will be anything other than fatiguing over long listening sessions. Kevlar was written about and people found them to be highly problematic beaming whatever. but they don't sound good in music listening applications IMO. Driver integration is not just a crossover but a sonic character that the driver itself puts out. Because a given woofer may put out 200hz so will four others but they don't all sound alike doing it and that is one reason to consider materials. At some point the tweeter hands over to a woofer and if the materials are dissimilar then a good ear or even average ears will at some point hear that handoff. On a showroom floor a speaker like the Monitor Audio designs with dissimilar drivers can generate a wow factor but sooner or later that dissimilarity will creep in IME. Which might be why the founder of Monitor Audio doesn't own them himself!!!

    Someone read a graph and it looked good so build them and have lots of advertising on the cool new tweeters. Metal, titanium, tube tapering, ribbon, circular ribbon, stretched ribbon, stretched metal, Platinum, Diamond - and it's oh so "cool" - it's a shame they almost always get outclassed entirely by speakers using boring old silk domes and paper. A good plasma in Acapellas or Manger flat cones, field Coils have sounded good but the costs. I have never been convinced by a speaker using a ribbon tweeter. Actually I've never been convinced by a ribbon doing anything. I've liked two recently - Sonist and Audio Zen but even here I kind of feel it could be better with a regular boring old silk dome. The added zing sssss (detail) would be removed and it would like integrated better with the woofers. Although I liked them at the show quite a lot. (but then a show is a 15-45minute listen and then on to the next).
    I agree with your general view that dissimilar driver materials are not likely to integrate well... That has been my experience with combinations such as aluminum tweeters and kevlar midranges... I think it is often just a case of looking at specs and tossing in exotic materials...

    I think, however, that your decision to apply that theory to Monitor Audio is way off base.. Monitor Audio uses the sames C-CAM (Metal drivers) from woofer to tweeter... The only distinction in the tweeters was adding a thin layer of Gold over the already metal driver... In the Platinum line they use the C-CAM material to create a ribbon tweeter... So it is not a case of using completely different driver materials that don't integrate...

    One of the reasons I like Revel and also Monitor Audio is because of using similar materials for all drivers... I believe that we too often blame crossover design for the inherent incompatibility of different driver materials...

  15. #15
    Ajani
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    Adam & JM,

    If I'm not mistaken you both purchased the RS6's based on the excellent reviews not because you had done extensive listening sessions with them in a store...

    While I also purchase products without a first audition, I think we need to remember that doing so means there is an even stronger chance that you won't really like the product when you take it home....

    Also, consider whether you were using gear that complemented the speakers or did you just combine them with gear you already owned at the time? Combining speakers you haven't auditioned with whatever gear you have on hand could easily account for your bad experiences...

    Despite all of those issues, you might really just not like metal drivers or Monitor Audio speakers... They are not for everyone (no matter what a review might claim)... Then again no speaker is for everyone...

  16. #16
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajani
    Adam & JM,

    If I'm not mistaken you both purchased the RS6's based on the excellent reviews not because you had done extensive listening sessions with them in a store...

    Despite all of those issues, you might really just not like metal drivers or Monitor Audio speakers... They are not for everyone (no matter what a review might claim)... Then again no speaker is for everyone...


    I bought mine from the local audio dealer about 1 mile from home. This time I had been to several audio stores and listening to speakers. I thought the MA's were the best of what I heard at the time. I was pleased with them long after a 30 day trial would have lasted. Then I began to be bothered by the sound. Believe me the Krell drives them quite nicely. A friend was visiting one time and I put in some Black Eyed Peas and let the music flow. I continued to turn up the volume and he was impressed that everything just got louder and not distorted. Initially the sound was impressive and they did get an impressive review. There was just something that after a few months began to become irritating.

    Then I brought out the OML 1's and oh the music was back. The audio store where I bought the MA's is just a shell of its former self. MA is all he stocks but can order other brands. He deals a lot in used and does new home theater installs. Sadly there was not much chance of trading them in on something else. The MA's helped me realize how good the Mo Fi's are. Oh and the Krell drives them nicely. I should add that the best speaker was the one I bought sound unheard.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
    Int. Amp Krell S-300i
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    Monitor Audio RS6
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    AQ SPKR and AQ XLR and IC

  17. #17
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael
    I bought mine from the local audio dealer about 1 mile from home. This time I had been to several audio stores and listening to speakers. I thought the MA's were the best of what I heard at the time. I was pleased with them long after a 30 day trial would have lasted. Then I began to be bothered by the sound. Believe me the Krell drives them quite nicely. A friend was visiting one time and I put in some Black Eyed Peas and let the music flow. I continued to turn up the volume and he was impressed that everything just got louder and not distorted. Initially the sound was impressive and they did get an impressive review. There was just something that after a few months began to become irritating.

    Then I brought out the OML 1's and oh the music was back. The audio store where I bought the MA's is just a shell of its former self. MA is all he stocks but can order other brands. He deals a lot in used and does new home theater installs. Sadly there was not much chance of trading them in on something else. The MA's helped me realize how good the Mo Fi's are. Oh and the Krell drives them nicely. I should add that the best speaker was the one I bought sound unheard.
    My bad... It was the Krell you ordered unheard online? (I must have mixed that up with the MAs)...

    I haven't tried Krell, but the descriptions I've read of their sound just doesn't seem like a good match to Monitor Audio... I could imagine it sounding impressive for awhile and then annoying in the long run... IMO, MA's should be paired with warmer sounding gear... MA speakers are deliberately engineered to be "bright" and "bass heavy" - just check out the frequency response charts from Stereophile & HiFi World... So an amp that won't slightly roll off the extremes / emphasize the mid-range is likely to be a poor match to the MA's...
    Last edited by Ajani; 11-21-2010 at 09:06 PM.

  18. #18
    Suspended atomicAdam's Avatar
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    My complaint isn't the quality of sound of the RS6 speakers - it is more the lack of detail and the in ability to form a cohesive image - where all the frequencies sounds integrated and coming from a central point. I could always here the bass being low to the ground. I think for the price, they are fantastic speakers. But I heard better, and moved on.

    I would love to give them another go with some of the speaker cables and gear I have my hands on now. I can tell you for sure the slightly bloated mid ranges would be reduced (I hope) and the detail would increase (i hope). But frankly, there are just speakers out there that are more detailed and better at putting together the sound. Obviously, even MA has better speakers than the RS6... Saying I moved on isn't a knock on the speakers, it is just a fact.

  19. #19
    Super Moderator Site Moderator JohnMichael's Avatar
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    I did not have any problem with bloated bass because the Krell keeps a tight grip on the woofers. I agree they could not deliver a cohesive image. Comparing the RS6's to the OML1's which both retailed for about $1,000 proves what I have always thought about speakers. It is easier and cheaper to make a well damped cabinet for a bookshelf speaker than it is a floor standing speaker. I do not remember which audio writer would say under $5,000 buy bookshelf over $5,000 floorstanders. The OML1's using a smaller well damped cabinet and two drivers can image much better than the RS6's using three drivers and a more resonant cabinet. I am sure the PMC's are doing a better job with imaging.

    My thoughts are about dynamic drivers in boxes.
    Last edited by JohnMichael; 11-22-2010 at 04:24 AM.
    JohnMichael
    Vinyl Rega Planar 2, Incognito rewire, Deepgroove subplatter, ceramic bearing, Michell Technoweight, Rega 24V motor, TTPSU, FunkFirm Achroplat platter, Michael Lim top and bottom braces, 2 Rega feet and one RDC cones. Grado Sonata, Moon 110 LP phono.
    Digital
    Sony SCD-XA5400ES SACD/cd SID mat, Marantz SA 8001
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  20. #20
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by atomicAdam
    My complaint isn't the quality of sound of the RS6 speakers - it is more the lack of detail and the in ability to form a cohesive image - where all the frequencies sounds integrated and coming from a central point. I could always here the bass being low to the ground. I think for the price, they are fantastic speakers. But I heard better, and moved on.

    I would love to give them another go with some of the speaker cables and gear I have my hands on now. I can tell you for sure the slightly bloated mid ranges would be reduced (I hope) and the detail would increase (i hope). But frankly, there are just speakers out there that are more detailed and better at putting together the sound. Obviously, even MA has better speakers than the RS6... Saying I moved on isn't a knock on the speakers, it is just a fact.
    Your earlier post was in between JM's questioning whether he likes metal drivers and RGA's seeming contempt for Monitor Audio... So it seemed more like you were chiming in on the Monitor's Audios not being good...

    As for moving on: That should be expected... The RS6 were very good $1K Towers, but $1K is not the end all of HiFi speakers... The reason I never bought a pair of RS6 is because I heard the GS20... Having heard the GS20, I was never willing to accept the lower sound quality of the RS6... Considering the GS20 were triple the price of the RS6, then it better have sounded superior...

  21. #21
    Ajani
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnMichael
    I did not have any problem with bloated bass because the Krell keeps a tight grip on the woofers. I agree they could not deliver a cohesive image. Comparing the RS6's to the OML1's which both retailed for about $1,000 proves what I have always thought about speakers. It is easier and cheaper to make a well damped cabinet for a bookshelf speaker than it is a floor standing speaker. I do not remember which audio writer would say under $5,000 buy bookshelf over $5,000 floorstanders. The OML1's using a smaller well damped cabinet and two drivers can image much better than the RS6's using three drivers and a more resonant cabinet. I am sure the PMC's are doing a better job with imaging.

    My thoughts are about dynamic drivers in boxes.
    I've heard a few reviewers and mags make similar statements about bookshelfs versus floorstanders... usually the figure was closer to $2K than $5k though... But logically, a $2K small, 2 way monitor should be comprised of far higher quality materials than a $2K, large, 3 way floorstander (assuming the brands spend similar ratios on materials versus design, advertising, profit margins, etc)...

    Generally one would expect a small monitor to have a more refined sound than a tower of the same price... The tower should have greater bass extension, scale and dynamic range. So it should be a matter of user preference...

  22. #22
    Ajani
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    To get the thread back on track:

    I keep wondering if we'll see a new digital amp from NAD....

    The NAD M2 has been raved about by Stereophile, The Absolute Sound and HiFi News as being the second coming of integrated amplifiers, so clearly it is only a matter of time before the tech trickles down to cheaper models... So perhaps CES 2011 will be the time for a cheaper digital integrated...

  23. #23
    Charm Thai™
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    I want to hear the M2 so badly. I only know what I have read but is it me or does it seem grossly overpriced for what it is?

  24. #24
    Ajani
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    Another pic of the GX300:



    More pics here:

    http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/v...374&start=1560

  25. #25
    Ajani
    Guest
    GX50:


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