Bestbuy offering TV ISF calibration.

[Smokey]

ISF stand for Imaging Scienec Foundation whcih set the standard for TV calibration precedure. It will calibrate TV color to 6500k temperature which is the industry and studio stanadard for TV color temperature.

Cost is $299 which include:

Calibrate your TV to ISF standards by ISF-Certified Elite Service Specialists (Geek Squad)
Adjust the surround sound levels of the A/V receiver to ensure all the effect speakers are working optimally
Review and check the speaker system; verify that all speakers are properly positioned and working
Ensure that all wires and cables are neatly dressed, using wire ties as needed

I must admit that calibrating TV to ISF standard can make night and day difference in TV picture quality, but $299 sound kind of steep to me. I wonder how much they charge for TV calibration alone

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1190677437119

[Rich-n-Texas]

Festus,

The best resource for ISF calibration services is at the AVS forums:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forum...ysprune=&f=139

I'd trust this forum before any BB store... Or CC... or more to the point, B&M stores all around the world, ya know?

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

ISF stand for Imaging Scienec Foundation whcih set the standard for TV calibration precedure. It will calibrate TV color to 6500k temperature which is the industry and studio stanadard for TV color temperature.

Cost is $299 which include:

Calibrate your TV to ISF standards by ISF-Certified Elite Service Specialists (Geek Squad)
Adjust the surround sound levels of the A/V receiver to ensure all the effect speakers are working optimally
Review and check the speaker system; verify that all speakers are properly positioned and working
Ensure that all wires and cables are neatly dressed, using wire ties as needed

I must admit that calibrating TV to ISF standard can make night and day difference in TV picture quality, but $299 sound kind of steep to me. I wonder how much they charge for TV calibration alone

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1190677437119

Smokester, they use disc's for calibration, not things like a sencore color generator, analyzer, or snell and wilcox hot plates(exceptionally high quality color and pattern generator and extremely accurate analyer) to calibrate. What they do, you could do for a smaller investment

[Smokey]

Festus,

The best resource for ISF calibration services is at the AVS forums:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forum...ysprune=&f=139

I think most of independent calibrator charge about $400 and one have wait for them to come to your area, or buy them transportation ticked if they have to go out of their way to be in your area. I agree though that they probably do a better job.

Smokester, they use disc's for calibration, not things like a sencore color generator, analyzer, or snell and wilcox hot plates(exceptionally high quality color and pattern generator and extremely accurate analyer) to calibrate.

Do they access the TV's service menu at all?? I imagine with ISF certification, they are obligated to calibrate TV to 6500k standard no matter how elementary equipment they use.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I think most of independent calibrator charge about $400 and one have wait for them to come to your area, or buy them transportation ticked if they have to go out of their way to be in your area. I agree though that they probably do a better job.

Actually the price is a little closer to $500, but I have found the pricing in my area all over the map.

Do they access the TV's service menu at all?? I imagine with ISF certification, they are obligated to calibrate TV to 6500k standard no matter how elementary equipment they use.

The certification you get from ISF is a little less rigorous than certfification from CEDIA or THX. ISF covers the VERY basic, especially at this price. This I know for a fact because I have been CEDIA certified, and am still THX certified. Their ability to accurately calibrate is equivalent to the quality of the equipment they use to generate and analyze signals. At the price they are charging it is not likely(IMO) that they are going to have the equipment to do so, or that the person doing the calibration will have the know how to do it over a broad based amount of sets on the market and in the field.

[Smokey]

At the price they are charging it is not likely(IMO) that they are going to have the equipment to do so, or that the person doing the calibration will have the know how to do it over a broad based amount of sets on the market and in the field.

Hopefully they won’t send a kid to do a man’s job.

On BB web site, it said that it takes approximately two hours to do calibration which also include speaker/HT set up and tidy up everything. I imagine with that time frame, they won’t have time to set up sophisticated calibration and color measuring equipment, and do a run through TV’s menu.

[pixelthis]

Smokester, they use disc's for calibration, not things like a sencore color generator, analyzer, or snell and wilcox hot plates(exceptionally high quality color and pattern generator and extremely accurate analyer) to calibrate. What they do, you could do for a smaller investment

my thoughts exactly.
Welcome back sir talky, finally get your meds stabilized?

[bfalls]

I'm willing to bet for a price of $299, they are only calibrating the DVD input and the sound system. I'm also willing to bet it doesn't include any adjustments within the service menu. This would be necessary if you want the customer's default settings to be the calibrated settings. The $500 price sound more like the cost of a full calibration, which usually runs approx. $165/input. To me BB calibration is better than nothing at all, but shouldn't be labeled an ISF calibration.
I've been through ISF calibration classes and own a Sencore P403 video signal generator. I've performed many calibrations and feel it's necessary to use the service menu. If the default setting are not the calibrated settings, the customer, their children, or friends can change the settings and unless they're recorded, will require reclaibration.
I'm not sure how they would be able to adjust to D6500 without a sensor to determine the correct proportions of RGB.
Probably for the general public, their calibration is of value as long as they include the satellite/cable input. What usually happens is people get so used to the "Torch Mode" set by the manufacturer, correct calibration tends to look dull, so they end up changing the setting anyway.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Just the thought of having a car that says "Geek Squad" on it parked in front of my house would be embarrasing.

[GMichael]

Just the thought of having a car that says "Geek Squad" on it parked in front of my house would be embarrasing.

Will Chuck himself be coming out to set up my system?

[Rich-n-Texas]

You take Chuck, I'll take the hot blondie!

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I'm willing to bet for a price of $299, they are only calibrating the DVD input and the sound system. I'm also willing to bet it doesn't include any adjustments within the service menu. This would be necessary if you want the customer's default settings to be the calibrated settings. The $500 price sound more like the cost of a full calibration, which usually runs approx. $165/input. To me BB calibration is better than nothing at all, but shouldn't be labeled an ISF calibration.
I've been through ISF calibration classes and own a Sencore P403 video signal generator. I've performed many calibrations and feel it's necessary to use the service menu. If the default setting are not the calibrated settings, the customer, their children, or friends can change the settings and unless they're recorded, will require reclaibration.
I'm not sure how they would be able to adjust to D6500 without a sensor to determine the correct proportions of RGB.
Probably for the general public, their calibration is of value as long as they include the satellite/cable input. What usually happens is people get so used to the "Torch Mode" set by the manufacturer, correct calibration tends to look dull, so they end up changing the setting anyway.

I think BB is counting on a couple of things. The folks who truely know about calibration will not call them, so ignorance is bliss for those who do. They know you are not going to pay a "REAL" technician to come out and check their results, and they know you DON'T have the equipment to check after they leave or you wouldn't have called them in the first place. They are going to calibrate one input, with a calibration disc that covers both audio and video. That is what you are getting for that price.

[Smokey]

I've been through ISF calibration classes and own a Sencore P403 video signal generator. I've performed many calibrations and feel it's necessary to use the service menu.

They don't have no choice but to enter the service menu If they want to change TV's color temperature or correct gray scaling. If they only use the disc and TV's onscreen menu, (as you said) then it shoudn't be called an ISF calibration.

[pixelthis]

They don't have no choice but to enter the service menu If they want to change TV's color temperature or correct gray scaling. If they only use the disc and TV's onscreen menu, (as you said) then it shoudn't be called an ISF calibration.

Agreed, but how long has it been since you've bought a TV?
My set has seperate (red, green, blue) color temp settings and a master setting.
As for the poster who mentioned "torch" mode, my sets default for bright and contrast is set at 50 as a default.
Of course for geometry and a few other setings you'd need the service
menu.
MY brothers plasma has a similar temp setup , BTW.

[pixelthis]

Just the thought of having a car that says "Geek Squad" on it parked in front of my house would be embarrasing.

This from a guy who owns a 9 year old firebird.

[Rich-n-Texas]

This from a guy who owns a 9 year old firebird.

It still hauls azz.

Smokey, bottom line... DON'T call the friggin' Geek Squad to cal your TV. OKAY? I don't agree that it takes extreme measures to get a cal technician out to your house. The AVS thread I pointed you to lists techs from many regions and I'm sure you can find one locally. And remember, without exception... you get what you pay for.

[Smokey]

Agreed, but how long has it been since you've bought a TV? My set has seperate (red, green, blue) color temp settings and a master setting.

I have noticed that few new LCD TV such as yours (I think Samasung also) do include color temperature adjustments in their user menu. Are they any use to achieve 6500 k color temperature??

As I recall, one really need six set of settings (Cutoff and Drive for each three primary colors) to achieve color gray scale in both low and high light output.

Smokey, bottom line... DON'T call the friggin' Geek Squad to cal your TV. OKAY? I don't agree that it takes extreme measures to get a cal technician out to your house.

Thanks Rich.

I like to calibrate my TV using TV's service manual. It is not really hard to do if one know what to look for, and have alot of patient

[BradH]

ISF stand for Imaging Scienec Foundation whcih set the standard for TV calibration precedure. It will calibrate TV color to 6500k temperature which is the industry and studio stanadard for TV color temperature.

Actually, the standard is D65, not 6500K. What's the difference? You could measure 6500K at each 10% step and it still wouldn't look right. Here's why: there are many combinations of color levels that would arrive at 6500K but only one proportion is the right one and it needs to be at every level. If you look closely you'll see D65 and 6500K are two separate points on the curve in the CIE chart. (Also, the D65 target is 6504K but what's a few Kelvin among friends?) This is why there's no such thing as "D6500" and other such terms.

What they do, you could do for a smaller investment.

Absolutely. For about $140 you could get an EyeOne sensor, download HCFR Colorimetre for free and read these instructions:

http://www.curtpalme.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10457

Keeping in mind that Geek Squad is only using a Spider to do the same thing. This is all assuming your service menu gives you full access like the Color Management Systems in the Samsung and others. There's a list of models at AVS.

Hope this helps.

[mbbuchanan]

If you spend 3K on a new LCD or plasma set then I guess $299.99 isn't a bad deal when you consider how much people will spend for Monster Cable HDMI and and other accessories that will probably yield less impact on performance than this calibration.

[hermanv]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built. Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

I bought an LED DLP (again I'm probably one of the last hold outs). Better blacks, better color accuracy and reviewers gave the set an OK for factory grey scale calibration. Suddenly reds are very deep in color and exhibit a great variety of shades of red I've never seen on plasma or LCD. The LED DLP is also cheap. It just isn't slim enough to hang on a wall (but neither is any home theater equipment, so who cares?)

[Rich-n-Texas]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built. Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

I bought an LED DLP (again I'm probably one of the last hold outs). Better blacks, better color accuracy and reviewers gave the set an OK for factory grey scale calibration. Suddenly reds are very deep in color and exhibit a great variety of shades of red I've never seen on plasma or LCD. The LED DLP is also cheap. It just isn't slim enough to hang on a wall (but neither is any home theater equipment, so who cares?)

Now I remember why I like this guy.

[pixelthis]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built. Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

I bought an LED DLP (again I'm probably one of the last hold outs). Better blacks, better color accuracy and reviewers gave the set an OK for factory grey scale calibration. Suddenly reds are very deep in color and exhibit a great variety of shades of red I've never seen on plasma or LCD. The LED DLP is also cheap. It just isn't slim enough to hang on a wall (but neither is any home theater equipment, so who cares?)

led DLP was my first choice also, having no wife to object.
But two things scuttled it, cost, and reports of trouble from some of the first models.
Maybe when they get the tech worked out(and I hit the lottery) it might be reconsidered.
One of the greatest pics I have ever seen was on a 70" Mitshu at Circuit City, a still of a rose, absolutely amazing.
But I have no backup , my set has to work, and work every time.
LED solves a lot of the problems I had with DLP, BUT the tech has to work itself out first, and since every-friggin- body in the world wants a FLAT screen, RPTV might become extinct before that happens.

[hermanv]

led DLP was my first choice also, having no wife to object.
But two things scuttled it, cost, and reports of trouble from some of the first models.
...edit..

I can't speak to ultimate reliability, the set below is a refurbished Samsung (which I think is French for "we fixed the major bug"). Show me how to beat $849 for 56" 1080p HDTV. Or you can have 61" for about $150 more.

http://www.secondact.com/product/HLT...art-HLT5687SRB

[BradH]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Monitors and projectors need to be calibrated a lot more often than a good o-scope. I've installed more $30K NEC projectors and $25K Sony's than I can count or remember. None of them, or any other projector or monitor I've seen, was pre-calibrated for grey scale (or anything else) although there may be some manufacturers who do it. If they did they would be charging you for something that needed to be done again a few months later. Obviously projectors and tube monitors will normally drift more than a flat panel but the flat panels need to be tweaked occasionally also.

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built.

Any set needs to be calibrated to hit it's potential mark. Given that, I think it's better to have a monitor that has full access to gamma and grey scale tracking than otherwise. I would be shocked to see a properly calibrated monitor that wasn't more accurate than any consumer model that came straight out of the box.

Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

This really sucks too. The manufacturers are pulling the same stunt they did in the NTSC era although it's not nearly as bad. Yeah, first they picked an aspect ratio that nobody ever used, then they cheese out on the color decoders. But it's early days still. I'm curious to see Dolby's new process where the LCD's are lit with individul LED's fed by the B&W signal. It was shown earlier this year at a trade show and apparently the contrast ratio and black level are stunning.

[hermanv]

Monitors and projectors need to be calibrated a lot more often than a good o-scope. I've installed more $30K NEC projectors and $25K Sony's than I can count or remember. None of them, or any other projector or monitor I've seen, was pre-calibrated for grey scale (or anything else) although there may be some manufacturers who do it. If they did they would be charging you for something that needed to be done again a few months later. Obviously projectors and tube monitors will normally drift more than a flat panel but the flat panels need to be tweaked occasionally also.

I can see why a CRT projector might need frequent calibration, but a DLP projector should stay close to correct for a long time.

Grey scale calibration can be easily automated. The factory could do it at probably 1-2 seconds per set.

I seem to see newer sets as more stable than older designs, by using highly integrated and mostly digital processing the need for frequent calibration can probably be designed out. I also remember an old Sony studio monitor that had photo cells looking at the back face of the CRT. I think auto calibration can be done, it just requires a change in mind set on the part of the designers/manufacturers.

Don't I remember early color TVs with skin color problems (green or orange hues) then auto flesh tones were added, problem solved. Newer sets don't even seem to need the auto correction, stability has improved remarkably. Just apply the same thinking to grey scale.