Bestbuy offering TV ISF calibration.

[Rich-n-Texas]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built. Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

I bought an LED DLP (again I'm probably one of the last hold outs). Better blacks, better color accuracy and reviewers gave the set an OK for factory grey scale calibration. Suddenly reds are very deep in color and exhibit a great variety of shades of red I've never seen on plasma or LCD. The LED DLP is also cheap. It just isn't slim enough to hang on a wall (but neither is any home theater equipment, so who cares?)

Now I remember why I like this guy.

[pixelthis]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built. Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

I bought an LED DLP (again I'm probably one of the last hold outs). Better blacks, better color accuracy and reviewers gave the set an OK for factory grey scale calibration. Suddenly reds are very deep in color and exhibit a great variety of shades of red I've never seen on plasma or LCD. The LED DLP is also cheap. It just isn't slim enough to hang on a wall (but neither is any home theater equipment, so who cares?)

led DLP was my first choice also, having no wife to object.
But two things scuttled it, cost, and reports of trouble from some of the first models.
Maybe when they get the tech worked out(and I hit the lottery) it might be reconsidered.
One of the greatest pics I have ever seen was on a 70" Mitshu at Circuit City, a still of a rose, absolutely amazing.
But I have no backup , my set has to work, and work every time.
LED solves a lot of the problems I had with DLP, BUT the tech has to work itself out first, and since every-friggin- body in the world wants a FLAT screen, RPTV might become extinct before that happens.

[hermanv]

led DLP was my first choice also, having no wife to object.
But two things scuttled it, cost, and reports of trouble from some of the first models.
...edit..

I can't speak to ultimate reliability, the set below is a refurbished Samsung (which I think is French for "we fixed the major bug"). Show me how to beat $849 for 56" 1080p HDTV. Or you can have 61" for about $150 more.

http://www.secondact.com/product/HLT...art-HLT5687SRB

[BradH]

I'm probably one of the last holdouts. I find the idea that a brand new state of the art TV needs calibration before use offensive. I've bought exotic test equipment including $35,000 oscilloscopes that came "gasp" calibrated from the factory (the cheap ones come that way too).

Monitors and projectors need to be calibrated a lot more often than a good o-scope. I've installed more $30K NEC projectors and $25K Sony's than I can count or remember. None of them, or any other projector or monitor I've seen, was pre-calibrated for grey scale (or anything else) although there may be some manufacturers who do it. If they did they would be charging you for something that needed to be done again a few months later. Obviously projectors and tube monitors will normally drift more than a flat panel but the flat panels need to be tweaked occasionally also.

Setting gray scale is nice, but more and more sets now get decent gray scale accuracy ratings from reviewers. I recommend you buy a set that's close as built.

Any set needs to be calibrated to hit it's potential mark. Given that, I think it's better to have a monitor that has full access to gamma and grey scale tracking than otherwise. I would be shocked to see a properly calibrated monitor that wasn't more accurate than any consumer model that came straight out of the box.

Besides both plasma and LCD suffer a color accuracy that can't be calibrated out (native colors do not align with HDTV color triangle). I find this more noticeable than a mediocre grey scale.

This really sucks too. The manufacturers are pulling the same stunt they did in the NTSC era although it's not nearly as bad. Yeah, first they picked an aspect ratio that nobody ever used, then they cheese out on the color decoders. But it's early days still. I'm curious to see Dolby's new process where the LCD's are lit with individul LED's fed by the B&W signal. It was shown earlier this year at a trade show and apparently the contrast ratio and black level are stunning.

[hermanv]

Monitors and projectors need to be calibrated a lot more often than a good o-scope. I've installed more $30K NEC projectors and $25K Sony's than I can count or remember. None of them, or any other projector or monitor I've seen, was pre-calibrated for grey scale (or anything else) although there may be some manufacturers who do it. If they did they would be charging you for something that needed to be done again a few months later. Obviously projectors and tube monitors will normally drift more than a flat panel but the flat panels need to be tweaked occasionally also.

I can see why a CRT projector might need frequent calibration, but a DLP projector should stay close to correct for a long time.

Grey scale calibration can be easily automated. The factory could do it at probably 1-2 seconds per set.

I seem to see newer sets as more stable than older designs, by using highly integrated and mostly digital processing the need for frequent calibration can probably be designed out. I also remember an old Sony studio monitor that had photo cells looking at the back face of the CRT. I think auto calibration can be done, it just requires a change in mind set on the part of the designers/manufacturers.

Don't I remember early color TVs with skin color problems (green or orange hues) then auto flesh tones were added, problem solved. Newer sets don't even seem to need the auto correction, stability has improved remarkably. Just apply the same thinking to grey scale.

[BradH]

I also remember an old Sony studio monitor that had photo cells looking at the back face of the CRT.

You mean like an internal light meter? Haven't heard that one but with studio tube monitors there's no telling. They were always the best for NTSC. For auto-calibration it seems you would always need a light meter on the face of the tube or screen. Automatically analyzing the various curves in a feedback loop could work I suppose but doing it in a factory would still be time consuming, a lot more time than they want to spend on an assembly line. Also, the faster the process went the less accurate it would be. I'm not sure how an internal light meter could work because it needs to be at the center of the display.

Don't I remember early color TVs with skin color problems (green or orange hues) then auto flesh tones were added, problem solved. Newer sets don't even seem to need the auto correction, stability has improved remarkably. Just apply the same thinking to grey scale.

That wasn't really an auto-correction, it was a permanent manufactured over-compensation. They were pushing the color temperature higher and higher because it looked brighter to consumers. That screwed up the grey scale and black & white movies looked like varying shades of blue. That's why a room looked blue when someone was watching television in the dark. You really notice when you pass by a house at night. This resulted in the green or orange skin tones you mentioned. Rather than correct the color temperature and lose the "whiter than white" mentality of bleach and dye companies, the manufactures "compensated" by designing color decorders shifted into the red so the skin tone problem would be less noticeable. This never stopped either, resulting in the infamous "Sony Red" problem. Lousy grey scale and incorrect color decoders are why NTSC has the reputation for Never Twice The Same Color compared to PAL and SEACAM. The reality is NTSC was arguably a better format than the other two but the manufacurers of consumer sets never followed the standard until the 90's with a couple of high-end models. The only other option was getting your hands on a pro monitor and those weren't cheap and certainly didn't qualify as "big screen". That's amazing when you think about it. The vast majority of viewers have never seen accurate NTSC.

You mentioned you thought color accuracy of the decoder was more noticeable than bad grey scale. Not to my eyes but fair enough. The thing is, you can't get accurate color under any circumstances if the grey scale is off. Also, one thing that's not commonly understood is accurate grey scale actually increases the number of colors the monitor is able to display. So I'm really big on monitors that allow you to adjust gamma and grey scale, it's like a godsend.

[hermanv]

Yes, if manufacturers would publish the set-up access codes and you could rent a photometer, you could do it yourself. It's not really difficult for anyone even moderately good in electronics mostly the process is a bit tedious. (Perfect for those of us who agonize over tiny details).

I did do my old CRT rear projection by eye with the video essentials test disk. Far from perfect, but better than the factory (Toshiba in this case) left the set. I haven't done my new LED DLP set, it looks pretty good from the factory. It's possible that LEDs have a more predictable light output level with fewer unit to unit variations.

It certainly is easy to fall into the trap of always finding the lowest cost item, only rarely does this also represent best value. I never did buy a Ford Pinto.

[pixelthis]

Yes, if manufacturers would publish the set-up access codes and you could rent a photometer, you could do it yourself. It's not really difficult for anyone even moderately good in electronics mostly the process is a bit tedious. (Perfect for those of us who agonize over tiny details).

I did do my old CRT rear projection by eye with the video essentials test disk. Far from perfect, but better than the factory (Toshiba in this case) left the set. I haven't done my new LED DLP set, it looks pretty good from the factory. It's possible that LEDs have a more predictable light output level with fewer unit to unit variations.

It certainly is easy to fall into the trap of always finding the lowest cost item, only rarely does this also represent best value. I never did buy a Ford Pinto.

Of course the worst thing is buying a pinto for mercedes prices.
BTW , are the LED DLP sets any "brighter"?
I had heard so.

[StevenSurprenant]

ISF stand for Imaging Scienec Foundation whcih set the standard for TV calibration precedure. It will calibrate TV color to 6500k temperature which is the industry and studio stanadard for TV color temperature.

Cost is $299 which include:

Calibrate your TV to ISF standards by ISF-Certified Elite Service Specialists (Geek Squad)
Adjust the surround sound levels of the A/V receiver to ensure all the effect speakers are working optimally
Review and check the speaker system; verify that all speakers are properly positioned and working
Ensure that all wires and cables are neatly dressed, using wire ties as needed

I must admit that calibrating TV to ISF standard can make night and day difference in TV picture quality, but $299 sound kind of steep to me. I wonder how much they charge for TV calibration alone

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....=1190677437119

The Best Buy near me have two Panasonic Plasmas sets set side by side. One was calibrated and one wasn't. I went to see the improvement and was surprised, but not how you might imagine.

The colors of both sets were very close. However, I could see a little more detail on the one to the left. It looked like the contrast was set differently. It also looked washed out. The blacks were not as black as the one on the right. The one on the right looked more 3D. All in all, a much better picture. The surprise came when the sales rep told me that the one on the left was the calibrated one.

He insisted that in a dark room, the calibrated one would look better. I found that hard to believe since the blacks on the calibrated set was more gray than black. He could be right, I don't know for sure, but from what I saw, I would buy the one on the right.

One thing these calibrators try to do is to reduce power consumption and that is where the problem is, I think? I know that on my LCD, when I lower the brightness of the back light to it's lowest setting, the picture gets washed out too. I usually set the power to the middle and the picture looks great.

I've heard other people complain about their ISF adjusted sets and readjusted them back after the service guy leaves. I have also heard people say it's the greatest thing since apple pie.

Does anyone know why there is such a great disparity between opinions?

[pixelthis]

The Best Buy near me have two Panasonic Plasmas sets set side by side. One was calibrated and one wasn't. I went to see the improvement and was surprised, but not how you might imagine.

The colors of both sets were very close. However, I could see a little more detail on the one to the left. It looked like the contrast was set differently. It also looked washed out. The blacks were not as black as the one on the right. The one on the right looked more 3D. All in all, a much better picture. The surprise came when the sales rep told me that the one on the left was the calibrated one.

He insisted that in a dark room, the calibrated one would look better. I found that hard to believe since the blacks on the calibrated set was more gray than black. He could be right, I don't know for sure, but from what I saw, I would buy the one on the right.

One thing these calibrators try to do is to reduce power consumption and that is where the problem is, I think? I know that on my LCD, when I lower the brightness of the back light to it's lowest setting, the picture gets washed out too. I usually set the power to the middle and the picture looks great.

I've heard other people complain about their ISF adjusted sets and readjusted them back after the service guy leaves. I have also heard people say it's the greatest thing since apple pie.

Does anyone know why there is such a great disparity between opinions?

What you call "washed out" is probably more realistic.
I got some flack when, looking at a screen capture someone posted
of his new plasma, I said that the pic seemed a bit oversaturated.
He got irate , but most sets in the world have too much color.
I have the red on my current set at 40.
AND if you set looks "washed out" when the backlight is turned down,
you need to turn down the contrast, try halfway, maybe the brightness
a bit too.
one of the things I like about my new Vizio is that its the first set I have
ever bought with the contrast set at the proper level.
Means they are paying attention, I have gotten XBR SONY sets
with the contrast set to "torch" mode.
IN SPITE of what sir talky says, I do know something about
this stuff, and true a pic set by "eyeball" can never be as accurate
as a calibrated one, but with a lot of experience it can come closer than the sellers of calibration want you to think.
ALSO you might not like a properly calibrated set, some do prefer a little color boost, and the set a bit too bright for decent black level.
Nothing wrong with this, some like to mangle their music with SET tubes,
and amps that look like something out of a 1940 Sears catalog.
It just isnt very "accurate" is all.
Probably why some prefer the pic of a plasma set, being created by a
volatile gas its not going to be as "sharp" as an LCD.
Fuzziness to them translates to "filmlike".

[Duds]

More sewage from the spewage master.

go check out the testing sound and vision did between lcd and plasma....see who won

What you call "washed out" is probably more realistic.
I got some flack when, looking at a screen capture someone posted
of his new plasma, I said that the pic seemed a bit oversaturated.
He got irate , but most sets in the world have too much color.
I have the red on my current set at 40.
AND if you set looks "washed out" when the backlight is turned down,
you need to turn down the contrast, try halfway, maybe the brightness
a bit too.
one of the things I like about my new Vizio is that its the first set I have
ever bought with the contrast set at the proper level.
Means they are paying attention, I have gotten XBR SONY sets
with the contrast set to "torch" mode.
IN SPITE of what sir talky says, I do know something about
this stuff, and true a pic set by "eyeball" can never be as accurate
as a calibrated one, but with a lot of experience it can come closer than the sellers of calibration want you to think.
ALSO you might not like a properly calibrated set, some do prefer a little color boost, and the set a bit too bright for decent black level.
Nothing wrong with this, some like to mangle their music with SET tubes,
and amps that look like something out of a 1940 Sears catalog.
It just isnt very "accurate" is all.
Probably why some prefer the pic of a plasma set, being created by a
volatile gas its not going to be as "sharp" as an LCD.
Fuzziness to them translates to "filmlike".

[lucasskywalker1]

More sewage from the spewage master.

go check out the testing sound and vision did between lcd and plasma....see who won

Hey DUDS all well and good with sound and vision though I hope that is not your only source you rely on. 2 and a half yrs. ago my theater expirience began with the ordering of the 55" Hitachi of which I cancelled 2 days later(CC salesman a little misleading) I then went to BB and purchased an open boxed Pioneer 61" that 3 weeks later when the calibration man showed up we then determined I had a bad Panel(it was returned to BB). Upon the advice of the calibration expert who preferred the 52" Sony 1080p LCD, 52" Sharp Aquos 1080p LCD, and the 50" Pioneer Elite 1080p Plasma, we purchased a 65" Sharp Aquos 1080p from Crutchfields(nobody in NE had the set at the time) we owned it for 3 weeks and then purchased a Sony Bluray the TV did not acknowledge the Bluray. Sharp's explanation was that the TV went into production prior to Sony releasing the licensing to other Manufacturers. Prior to the freight company coming back to PU the Sharp I purchased what is now my flagship PRO-1540HD 60" Plasma both TV's were in my home for the final game of the Patriots. They were less than 14 feet from each other and all but 1 of 15 people preferred the Pioneer over the Sharp. One additional note on the sharp because 120Hz. wasn't available yet When Tom Brady threw the ball WE witnessed multiple images of his arm in motion, WE did not expirience that with the Pioneer, however I do currently own (besides the 60" elite) a 42" Pioneer, 2-32" Phillips and in my kitchen is a 26" Sharp it was the biggest screen size that would fit under my cabinet and we do like it. So the morale of this story is next yr. Panasonic Plasma could be KING of the Hill, technology is forever more evolving. Have a great Day my friend.

[Duds]

Nope, not my only source. I let my eyes decide as well

Hey DUDS all well and good with sound and vision though I hope that is not your only source you rely on. 2 and a half yrs. ago my theater expirience began with the ordering of the 55" Hitachi of which I cancelled 2 days later(CC salesman a little misleading) I then went to BB and purchased an open boxed Pioneer 61" that 3 weeks later when the calibration man showed up we then determined I had a bad Panel(it was returned to BB). Upon the advice of the calibration expert who preferred the 52" Sony 1080p LCD, 52" Sharp Aquos 1080p LCD, and the 50" Pioneer Elite 1080p Plasma, we purchased a 65" Sharp Aquos 1080p from Crutchfields(nobody in NE had the set at the time) we owned it for 3 weeks and then purchased a Sony Bluray the TV did not acknowledge the Bluray. Sharp's explanation was that the TV went into production prior to Sony releasing the licensing to other Manufacturers. Prior to the freight company coming back to PU the Sharp I purchased what is now my flagship PRO-1540HD 60" Plasma both TV's were in my home for the final game of the Patriots. They were less than 14 feet from each other and all but 1 of 15 people preferred the Pioneer over the Sharp. One additional note on the sharp because 120Hz. wasn't available yet When Tom Brady threw the ball WE witnessed multiple images of his arm in motion, WE did not expirience that with the Pioneer, however I do currently own (besides the 60" elite) a 42" Pioneer, 2-32" Phillips and in my kitchen is a 26" Sharp it was the biggest screen size that would fit under my cabinet and we do like it. So the morale of this story is next yr. Panasonic Plasma could be KING of the Hill, technology is forever more evolving. Have a great Day my friend.

[pixelthis]

Hey DUDS all well and good with sound and vision though I hope that is not your only source you rely on. 2 and a half yrs. ago my theater expirience began with the ordering of the 55" Hitachi of which I cancelled 2 days later(CC salesman a little misleading) I then went to BB and purchased an open boxed Pioneer 61" that 3 weeks later when the calibration man showed up we then determined I had a bad Panel(it was returned to BB). Upon the advice of the calibration expert who preferred the 52" Sony 1080p LCD, 52" Sharp Aquos 1080p LCD, and the 50" Pioneer Elite 1080p Plasma, we purchased a 65" Sharp Aquos 1080p from Crutchfields(nobody in NE had the set at the time) we owned it for 3 weeks and then purchased a Sony Bluray the TV did not acknowledge the Bluray. Sharp's explanation was that the TV went into production prior to Sony releasing the licensing to other Manufacturers. Prior to the freight company coming back to PU the Sharp I purchased what is now my flagship PRO-1540HD 60" Plasma both TV's were in my home for the final game of the Patriots. They were less than 14 feet from each other and all but 1 of 15 people preferred the Pioneer over the Sharp. One additional note on the sharp because 120Hz. wasn't available yet When Tom Brady threw the ball WE witnessed multiple images of his arm in motion, WE did not expirience that with the Pioneer, however I do currently own (besides the 60" elite) a 42" Pioneer, 2-32" Phillips and in my kitchen is a 26" Sharp it was the biggest screen size that would fit under my cabinet and we do like it. So the morale of this story is next yr. Panasonic Plasma could be KING of the Hill, technology is forever more evolving. Have a great Day my friend.

okay, there is a new invention out, its called the PERIOD.THERES ONE FOR EXAMPLE
ON THE END OF THIS STATEMENT....
PLASMA IS....
DEAD.

(btw)

[Woochifer]

The Best Buy near me have two Panasonic Plasmas sets set side by side. One was calibrated and one wasn't. I went to see the improvement and was surprised, but not how you might imagine.

The colors of both sets were very close. However, I could see a little more detail on the one to the left. It looked like the contrast was set differently. It also looked washed out. The blacks were not as black as the one on the right. The one on the right looked more 3D. All in all, a much better picture. The surprise came when the sales rep told me that the one on the left was the calibrated one.

He insisted that in a dark room, the calibrated one would look better. I found that hard to believe since the blacks on the calibrated set was more gray than black. He could be right, I don't know for sure, but from what I saw, I would buy the one on the right.

One thing these calibrators try to do is to reduce power consumption and that is where the problem is, I think? I know that on my LCD, when I lower the brightness of the back light to it's lowest setting, the picture gets washed out too. I usually set the power to the middle and the picture looks great.

I've heard other people complain about their ISF adjusted sets and readjusted them back after the service guy leaves. I have also heard people say it's the greatest thing since apple pie.

Does anyone know why there is such a great disparity between opinions?

If these sets were displayed on the brightly lit main floor, then anything using a higher brightness and picture level setting will look better. That's why TV manufacturers set the levels so high by default, so that they will stand out in that kind of uninviting environment. The sales rep was correct in indicating that in a darker room, the calibrated set would look better. You probably don't watch your TV at home in a room lit up with warehouse lights, so why evaluate a TV under those conditions?

ISF or not, judging by your post, I get the impression that you've never done any sort of calibration on your TV. I suggest you pick up a copy of Digital Video Essentials or Avia, and do your own initial calibration on the TV. This probably won't give you the exact reference levels, but it will get you very close. The calibrated levels are your baseline -- this is how your TV is supposed to look using the same reference levels that the studios mastering your DVDs and Blu-ray discs use.

Once you have your baseline, then you can tweak the levels to fit your preferences and specific room conditions (i.e., a calibrated setting does not assume that you have a bright room). Whether or not you go the ISF route, you really need to do some sort of reference calibration because the default settings on most TVs are way off. An initial calibration will get an end user as close to optimal picture quality as they can get by themselves, while the ISF calibration will handle any further refinements that are only possible by accessing the service menus and using more fine tuned equipment.

The first time I used a calibration disc, I was shocked at how much better the picture looked -- the default/torch settings on the TV way overshot the brightness and sharpness, and the colors and tint were also wrong. Once calibrated, I made some minor adjustments to suit my preferences, and pretty much left the settings alone (with occasional checkups to make sure that they did not deviate as the TV got older). Once you get used to a calibrated picture, you can't go back. The default settings that most TV manufacturers use will make the picture look fake, washed out, and overly bright by comparison. As much as I like my new Panny, the default settings and the "Standard" mode looked awful.

[pixelthis]

My new Vizio was the first set I HAVE BOUGHT IN 20 YEARS
that didnt have the contrast set to "torch" mode.
it was also the best looking pic outta the box.
JUst NEEDED TO ADUST the green temp a bit and that was it, and turn down the backlight, of course.

[StevenSurprenant]

Duds...

I really wasn't comparing LCD with Plasma. However, I did read the Sound and Vision article you suggested. I agree that the best Plasma is better than the best LCD that I've seen to date. Myself, I own an LCD for several reasons, lower power usage and lower heat output. If it wasn't for those two issues, I would own a Plasma, or at least a top of the line Plasma.

Woochifer...

Actually, I have two different calibration disks and have run both of them. They come with the color lens. What you might find interesting is that when they display the different color bars and I used the color lens to make two colors disappear, I could only do that with one of the colors. I assume that my sets needs calibration through the service menu, which I cannot do.

When I first got the set, I was using the Dynamic mode and then went to the Standard mode and finally settled on the Movie mode which has the best picture overall. So, I had the same results as you.

My TV also has 5 setting for power usage (back light), off, low med, high, and auto. I usually use low or medium. Off is too bright, low and med is good, High power saving cause the picture to looked washed out like the ISF adjusted Pannie I saw in the store. Auto looks about like the off setting.

I do realize that the LCD sets in the stores are set to Dynamic with the highest brightness setting. They certainly look good in the stores, but at home this setting is awful.

Back on track...

I wasn't comparing my TV with the Pannies in the store. I was more concerned with the ISF calibration differences of those two TV's.

I was considering ISF calibration for my TV, but I am gun shy about doing it since I've read posts by people who were less than happy with the results. As I said earlier, other posters were extremely pleased with the results, especially those with the old CRT rear projection TV's.

As for which type of TV is better, it all depends. Side by side with top of the line TV's I would say the best Plasma's are on top by a small margin. With dark pictures, the Plasma is hands down better. With bright pictures, I like the LCD. Everything in between is a toss up. There is no clear winner.

I think that the signal quality is of greater importance than the difference between TV's.

Disclaimer...

These opinions may change drastically at a moments notice.

[BradH]

I was considering ISF calibration for my TV, but I am gun shy about doing it since I've read posts by people who were less than happy with the results.

Most people like high contrast and bright screens in their homes. They've been doing it that way forever. It's flashy, it's an eye grabber, they paid for the set and naturally want to get their enjoyment out of it. But technically this is the video equivalent of a smiley face on equalizer. People who get used to listening in those conditions usually have a negative reaction with their first exposure to a well curved frequency response whether it was achieved with room treatment or electronically or whatever. They're not sure what the big deal is. It's usually recommended to view a calibrated monitor for at least a week before coming to a judgement. Once you get used to seeing detail in the blacks you miss it when it's disappeared into the black hole of a high contrast picture that seemed impressive before. But I'm not sure what you mean by "washed out" on the set you saw. There's always the possibility the salesman didn't know what he was talking about. (Shocking, I know.) There's also the possibility that an employee tweaked it to their heart's content after it was on the floor. Or it may in fact have been properly calibrated. Hopefully you saw it in one of their so called "dark rooms", what I call the Commission Cave. That's not optimum conditions but it's better than viewing it under the flourescents. There's an entire SMPTE white paper on viewing conditions and you can bet you won't see those conditions at Best Buy and probably not in the homes of customers who are dissatisfied with the results of calibration. If you have it done then give it a week under good viewing conditons because Wooch is right, once you get used to knowing what it looks like, nothing else will do. It's not like audio where you sometimes wonder what speakers were used during mixing and mastering. With video program mastering, there's an enormous amount of effort made to adhere to THE standard so that, with some effort, viewers can see what was intended.

[lucasskywalker1]

Look at my previous reply regarding calibration. The one important piece of information that I have as yet to see qouted on any of the forum website I belong to is the reccomendation that not only after your first 100-200 hrs. break-in time should you get a calibration but also on the 1 yr. anniversary after that cal you can determine how frequently you should have the service done(based on degradation) which depend mostly on 2 factors: Quality of Product and viewing hours per year. Take a Panny for instance under the same typical viewing circumstances will have less percentage of degradation than say a Magnavox or Olevia so the requirement could be much more frequent. After 1 yr. if you only expirience a 3 percent degradation on the panny if your viewing habits don't change dramatically you could in theory wait 5 yrs. for your next. I have a friend who owns an Olevia and after 1 yr. he's expirienced an 7% loss he should consider a cal every other yr. Remember the printout is of paramount importance so if a Calibrator can't provide that for you, you might want to look elsewhere.

[pajr2179]

I personally do not see the value of isf calibration unless you have a dedicated theater, The lighting environment is always different when I watch TV. Someone coming to my home and doing an isf calibration in an environment that I will never be using my system (except watching movies) seems pretty pointless. And, isn't possible that after all the calibration is done you won't like the picture anyway?