Help with new cd player?

[noddin0ff]

Excuse me I condensed this. You're missing the whole point. I don't have a problem with that. I have a problem with the dude's self righteous all knowing mocking tone addressing me not with actual criticism of me. There's a difference in the two.

Sure, we'd all like to be treated nice, but with statements like

I shouldn't even bother to address you as you are so low on the food chain you're not worthy of even contempt...This is my last comment addressing you as I'm not into swatting mosquetos... but Leaf you're a waste of spurm.

your deep concerns about self-righteousness and mockery sound mighty hollow. Proper spelling would help in your case too; nothing takes the sting out of an insult like sloppy spelling. Try S-P-E-R-M and M-O-S-Q-U-I-T-O-S and at least your put downs will sound informed. If you want to make a point, set an example.

As I said, if your saying the DAC has nothing to do with optical connection sound fine, but something is giving the HK DVD player great optical sound.

I'll try again where others have failed. Hershon, nothing is giving your HK better sound in this case. There is no 'digital sound'. The purpose of a DAC is to turn a digital signal into analog sound. You are listening to the analog sound produced DENON DAC. If you hooked any other CD player to your DENON with an optical cable it will deliver the same digital signal as your HK. The DENON DAC will do the same thing and you will get the same sound. Someone may come in and argue 'jitter' but that is not the issue here. You may be hearing a better sound, but it is not because your HK has 'great optical sound'

[anamorphic96]

Hey Hershon you never anwered my question about digital and analogue connections. Can you in your own words explain the difference ? Dont get technical just describe the function of each.

[anamorphic96]

Another thing is get a blind fold and have someone like Paul install his DVD player the same way on your Denon. Then listen to the two withoout knowing which is in use. I bet you cant hear the difference.

[LEAFS264]

Why dont you just correct him. One thing i've learned on the A/V forums is some that know this stuff really thinks there sh$t dont stink. Correct somebody and they will learn. I dont know anyone thats born knowing. These forums are here to teach and learn.

Shokhead, I agree with you 100 percent. I really do feel this form is here for us all to learn,but when people are giving advice and FAKING there way through with no knowledge to back it up.......that person should keep to learning and stay far away from the teaching. This is not the first time he has given bad advice, where do you draw the line and say somthing. For me it was this thread.

Jay

[shokhead]

Well i send him sites with info to read on some of the stuff he talks about. Thats should help. What really bothers me is when somebody corrects somebodys spelling. Mine sucks but i dont need anyone to tell me. I'm 52,not 2.

[LEAFS264]

Ya, somtimes i'm typing way to fast and not watching what i'm doing,than it all turns to crap. I don't think Hershon is a bad guy..just not well informed. And as far as the little hissy-fit with the insults go, that just goes to the age level that we're all dealing with.


Jay

[N. Abstentia]

[QUOTE=hershon]All I was trying to say is that my Harmon Kardon DVD player when combined with my Denon receiver gives me better sound then any other CD/DVD/Universal player I've ever tried and for the present I'm attributing that by process of elimination to the DAC albeit to get this great sound I am listening by an optical connection. [QUOTE]

The problem is, you keep saying this HK player sounds so great, but then you (in not so many words) say it sounds like crap in the next breath because you have to hook it up digitally to make it sound good. This BYPASSES evertything in the player that makes it different from any other player. So the HK is NOT a good sounding player according to you.

With the hookup method you are using there will be no difference in the sound of your HK or a $39 grocery store player or a $900 overpriced player.

[shokhead]

Cool. Then lets try helping him and then along the way i'll lean stuff to because god knows i'm way light on how this stuff works. I've been out of the A/V loop for 5-6 years and was into and still am cycling but at xmas,i upgraded everytrhing but speakers. WAF put a stop to further upgrades. LOL

[noddin0ff]

Well i send him sites with info to read on some of the stuff he talks about. Thats should help. What really bothers me is when somebody corrects somebodys spelling. Mine sucks but i dont need anyone to tell me. I'm 52,not 2.

What really bothers me is when somebody lacks consideration. My spelling sucks but I take the extra 3 seconds to spell check, as a small token gesture of consideration for others. Like wearing a shirt in a restaurant. Lack of capitals, apostrophes, and spelling are minor nuisances, but they do influence whether or not you are taken seriously. Take time to write and people will take time to help. Deride others and...

Consideration aside, if you're *trying* to insult someone..."spurm"? That's just funny. Why get all worked up if you're not even going to try. It's anticlimactic, the insult just hangs there, impotent...

If I were the moderator I'd delete hershon's posts (#10 and #19) for being rude. But, odds are, this one will be deleted. So read fast.

[LEAFS264]

This thread belongs to madmax1, not Hershon. So lets not use up anymore of this thread on Hershons equipment problems....because this whole form is full of Hershon and his damn Equipment.
lol.

[anamorphic96]

I think madmax gave up along time ago.

[paul_pci]

All I was trying to say is that my Harmon Kardon DVD player when combined with my Denon receiver gives me better sound then any other CD/DVD/Universal player I've ever tried and for the present I'm attributing that by process of elimination to the DAC albeit to get this great sound I am listening by an optical connection. If factors are at work such as osmosis why the HK gets this great sound and its not from the DAC fine, but obviously something is making the sound great. No one on this board or at any store has yet to identify what specific part of a CD/DVD/Universal player equipment will make the sound better than the next player other than a DAC. As I said, if your saying the DAC has nothing to do with optical connection sound fine, but something is giving the HK DVD player great optical sound.

Yes, and it's the Denon receiver, which is why all of us prodded you to dump the JVC like a stinking corpse.

[LEAFS264]

Yah, 2 posts out of 36. I would say he gave up.

[hershon]

In regards to spelling of certain words say "basztard" for instance, try spelling it accurately and this websites software will automatically X out the words so there's a little method in my madness. As to the other mispellings like misquetto or whatever, I profess to total laziness.
I'm assuming "spurmm" would either be censored if spelled right or get me in trouble with the
people running the board. I actually have a BA in English if that makes you feel better!

[shokhead]

LOL I'm tell'n ya,everybodys sh$t stinks.

[hershon]

You're basically saying, correct me if I'm wrong, that I can connect any DVD player whatsoever to my Denon 3801 Receiver, at the same DVD and/or receiver settings and get the same identical CD sound? I absolutely unequivocally disagree and am taking issue with you presuming to tell other people what they're hearing or not hearing when you're not there and the actual person is. In front of someone on this board, I connected the Harmon Kardon DVD player digitally to my JVC receiver and he heard the same difference in sound I did from my DVD built in JVC player. If DVD players all sound the same when connected digitally, then you wouldn't have significant price differences & some company would have an advertising campaign that our cheap so and so DVD player sounds the same as a $300 DVD player when played digitally because NoddinOff says so.

[N. Abstentia]

You're basically saying, correct me if I'm wrong, that I can connect any DVD player whatsoever to my Denon 3801 Receiver, at the same DVD and/or receiver settings and get the same identical CD sound?

BY GEORGE I THINK HE'S FINALLY GOT IT!

A digital signal is just simply a raw bitstream. It's 0's and 1's. It's either off or on, there is no middle ground. All players sound identical when sending a digital signal.

[shokhead]

So the next question is what makes players better or worst? Laser? Curcuits? Boards? Quality of all the stuff inside?

[N. Abstentia]

Power supplies, spindle motors, transports, better analog output stages, isolated chassis, signal chain layout, low noise component layout..etc..is what makes more expensive players better in most cases.

Is it worth it? That's up to the user.

[noddin0ff]

You're basically saying... that I can connect any DVD player whatsoever to my Denon 3801 Receiver, at the same DVD and/or receiver settings and get the same identical CD sound? I absolutely unequivocally disagree and am taking issue with you presuming to tell other people what they're hearing or not hearing when you're not there and the actual person is...

Hershon, spelling aside and rudeness aside, I'm trying to help you understand what you're hearing. I said

You may be hearing a better sound, but it is not because your HK has 'great optical sound'

So I didn't presume to tell you what you were or were not hearing. I am trying to help you figure out what to attribute it to. To the best of my knowledge, nowhere in this thread have you compared two players connected *digitally* to your Denon. You don't have to, but if you did, my bet is that they will sound identical regardless of quality. I'm not the only person on this thread to make this comment. You attributed the better HK sound to the HK DAC, but you were bypassing this DAC. You may 'absolutely unequivocally disagree' but until you make the correct comparison this disagreement is just speculation. Connect them via analog connections and there likely could be a difference. If you do the digital only comparison and still hear a difference, that's fine by me, enjoy it. Deep inside, I'll believe you only think you hear a difference, but if you’re happy, what does it matter? But you should understand what you are comparing so that when you find the sound you're looking for you know what is making it happen. Others more knowledgeable than I have given you similar advise. Please read all of anamorphic's posts.

[hershon]

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong about the DAC nor need or desire to reiterate about the optical connection, but No One Here, I Repeat No One, will give a straight answer, on what specifically by Specifical part, can make one DVD player sound better than another DVD player when connected Optically to the same receiver at the same settings. Some people are insisting, which is cool, that there is no difference in sound under this connection as all its reading is "X's and O's" but I maintain some DVD players are making the "X's and O's" better than others. Again, if such a fact is true, then why hasn't someone come up with the cheapest $5/Pick a Price DVD player & actually advertised that the sound is as good as a $500 player through a digital connection?

[JeffKnob]

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong about the DAC nor need or desire to reiterate about the optical connection, but No One Here, I Repeat No One, will give a straight answer, on what specifically by Specifical part, can make one DVD player sound better than another DVD player when connected Optically to the same receiver at the same settings. Some people are insisting, which is cool, that there is no difference in sound under this connection as all its reading is "X's and O's" but I maintain some DVD players are making the "X's and O's" better than others. Again, if such a fact is true, then why hasn't someone come up with the cheapest $5/Pick a Price DVD player & actually advertised that the sound is as good as a $500 player through a digital connection?

A digital connection sends only 1's and 0's. This is a binary signal. There are only two options 1's and 0's. A 1 is a 1 and a 0 is a 0. There is no such thing as a great 1 or a great 0 or a crappy 1 or a crappy 0. Certain combinations of these 1's and 0's are translated by a DAC (Digital to analog converter) into the wonderful sounds that we listen to. A DAC will read the digital signal the same as any other but the quality of the conversion to analog is where the difference is.

If you are using the analog connections from any source to a receiver the conversion from digital to analog has already taken place by the sources DAC. If you are using a digital connection the conversion hasn't taken place until the signal gets to the DAC in your receiver. Many people prefer using a digital connection because a digital signal travels better with little to no degredation in signal quality.

Most people will choose to purchase a more expensive DVD player to obtain a better picture and not for the sound because most people who are actually concerned about he sound will know to use a digital connection.

[LEAFS264]

Most people will choose to purchase a more expensive DVD player to obtain a better picture and not for the sound because most people who are actually concerned about he sound will know to use a digital connection.

Amen, to that.
Do you understand now Hershon!!
People with $2000-6000 cd players don't use digital connections.
People with $500-3000 dvd players look for a better picture. Because the sound from a DIGITAL connection is the same!!!!!!!!!

Jay

[paul_pci]

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong about the DAC nor need or desire to reiterate about the optical connection, but No One Here, I Repeat No One, will give a straight answer, on what specifically by Specifical part, can make one DVD player sound better than another DVD player when connected Optically to the same receiver at the same settings. Some people are insisting, which is cool, that there is no difference in sound under this connection as all its reading is "X's and O's" but I maintain some DVD players are making the "X's and O's" better than others. Again, if such a fact is true, then why hasn't someone come up with the cheapest $5/Pick a Price DVD player & actually advertised that the sound is as good as a $500 player through a digital connection?

Hershon, look at N. Absentia's post #45 of this thread. It is the list that you claim no one has given as to what physical differences are to be found across different DVD players at different price points.

[shokhead]

Amen, to that.
Do you understand now Hershon!!
People with $2000-6000 cd players don't use digital connections.
People with $500-3000 dvd players look for a better picture. Because the sound from a DIGITAL connection is the same!!!!!!!!!

Jay

Well no. I got my under $500 DVD player for the audio. Also thats abit of a blanket statement that you assume.