Quote Originally Posted by RGA View Post
No you are 100% wrong there buddy.

Sit in my chair in my house and I will play the AN J with my 10 watt amp at full output and you are saying this will not damage your ears. Why are you talking about bass - read what I said - I didn't mention bass at 92db I mentioned the speaker (all frequencies) and that was the sensitivity rating not the in room sound. I'll be happy to crank it - The speaker easily puts out 105db into the room. Play 100hz - 3khz at 105db for 10 straight hours and tell me it's not bad for your ears.
Once again, you are using as a example something that NEVER happens in real life. Nobody listen's to anything at a constant level. The levels of any source change dynamically from moment to moment.

Secondly, you are talking about midbass to the critical band, and when I speak about loud bass's effect on their ears, I am talking about BASS frequencies, not midbass and up. You know, 20-80hz.

Thirdly just saying a speaker puts out 105db means absolutely nothing if you do not cover the bandwidth that volume covers. I would imagine your AN J cannot play 105db at anything below 40 or 50hz. Below that both your speakers and your amp would run out of gas.

The measurement I provided was where the magazine measures them. Audio Note claims the speaker puts out 108db before it starts to compress. Ie 108db before audible distortion.
108db from 100-20khz, 50-20khz, 20-20khz...what?

Assuming that is a reasonable figure (my Wharfedales put out 119db in a not that much bigger cabinet or woofer) then if Audio Note's 108db is main band then 6db down then the speaker is capable of is 102db at 18hz in corners. Which is suddenly a lot more respectable I would say. If they are using the 108db before compression distortion in the bass then the main band will comfortably play to 114db (at 0.2% distortion in the bass is a lot better than 5%)
Sorry, but I don't believe this AT ALL. Please provide the measurements that support this.

The problem is you don't seem to understand any concept related to speaker sensitivity/efficiency.

It is not JUST about the amplifier and I'm sorry if you don't understand what speaker sensitivity is all about.
I understand it alright, but I also know that a speaker does not remain the same sensitivity at all frequencies.

To get two times the "perceived" volume level (to subjectively be deemed "twice as loud" you need a gain of 10decibels. It doesn't matter how you do it either through watts from the amplifier or sensitivity of the speaker.

If speaker A is 90db sensitive and 20hz - 20khz and speaker B is 80db at 20hz -20khz all else being equal speaker A is TWICE as loud as speaker B on the same 1 watt of power - twice as loud at 20hz and twice as loud at 1khz.

To do it via an amplifier if you have a 100watt amplifier you need 200 watts for a 3db gain (which is barely audible). A 400 watt amp is a 6db gain. An 800 watt amp gives you a 9db gain. A 1600 watt amp gives you a 12db gain over a 100watt amplifier. Irrespective of frequency.

If I run a 100db sensitive speaker with a 100 watt amp and Fred buys an 80db speaker and has a 1600 watt amplifier - my stereo, including all bass frequencies, will play a LOT louder than his by 8db. And that's assuming his speaker has a sticker on the back that says "Power handling 1600 watts" If the power handling is the usual 250 watts then my system will utterly destroy Fred's.
Once again you are wasting three hundred million words to outline something you cannot substantiate with facts. Another point you seemed to be missing is no amp/speaker combination has sensitivities that remain constant over their entire bandwidth, unless it states it does.

I love the folks in the my bass is better than your bass threads. May as well be talking to car audio people. I didn't buy Audio Note because of the bass - there are plenty of speakers with more bass - umm I didn't even buy the biggest bass model they make which should point out that bass is not my only consideration. I am not using it for home theater and I don't listen to organ music.
Then your example still fails, because there are people out there that use their system to listen to organ music, and for hometheater. Your little small bubble does not apply to the masses, and that is something you need to get straight in your head

That said the AN J/Spe in blind level matched sessions in Hi-Fi Choice clobbered all other standmounts that magazine has tested (including PMC, Genewlec, ATC, and all the mainstream brands.) Clobbered them so much they pulled the speaker out of the test and put them in the test for full range floorstanding speakers instead. Incidentally they have no corners so that was without corner gain.
That was with their reviewers ears, their room, and their front end. Results would be different in a different room, with a different set of ears, and different front end.

Then the AN J won the blind test and noted as having "prodigious bass" against the floorstanders. No it can't compete with really big speakers or big subwoofers. There are limits. But sound quality is the goal not just thump thump bass for Terminators exploding from laser fire. If I wanted that I would have bought ATC and Bryston. Listening to music on it I'd want to stick a fork in my eye.
I actually would prefer you chop your hands off, so we don't have to read anymore of your unsubstantiated nonsense over and over again. Have you even heard the Bryston 28B? Probably not. Have you ever heard the ATC SCM-300A? Probably not, so you claims on both brands are only based on single models, and not the whole line of speakers or amps. Limited exposure=limited actual experience.


A really cheap speaker that will do very good output at 30hz with 97db sensitivity in the bass is the CV 215 SoundStage! Equipment Review - Cerwin-Vega CLS-215 Loudpeakers (12/2007)
I have heard that speakers little brother and was impressed for the money.