Islam: Our Partners in Peace...

[bobsticks]

The judge is wrong, the cops are wrong, most of y'all are wrong and Feanor, my friend, you are engaging in an illogical argument.

[Feanor]

The judge is wrong, the cops are wrong, most of y'all are wrong and Feanor, my friend, you are engaging in an illogical argument.

Balderdash !!

[markw]

Well the Christian Right isn't killing anybody (yet), but then not all Islamic fundamentalists go so far as to kill people.

Frankly I think the Christian Right might just be a bigger threat to American than Islamists ever could be. Consider reading this book ...

Chris Hedges: American Fascists: The Christian Right and the War on America

If you truly believe that, then canada is a more backwards and gullible country than I originally thought.

So, we forgo out constitutional rights because the LEOs are too afraid of the thugs to do their job?

Here's some reality to counter your bullshiite

[Feanor]

If you truly believe that, then canada is a more backwards and gullible country than I originally thought.

So, we forgo out constitutional rights because the LEOs are too afraid of the thugs to do their job?

Here's some reality to counter your bullshiite

Thank you for your comment, Mark.

I really don't know why you are picking on me because I'm Canadian. Is it just because your disagree with me? Or because you disagree with Chris Hedges, (author of American Fascists), who's American?

The linked article seems to imply that the arrestees were arrested because they were preaching contrary to Sharia law, and seems dismissive of the actual charge, "breaching the peace". Is it so inconceivable to you that they might have been making public nuisances of themselves?

Let me say that I am against any adoption of Sharia law in Canada (or the US); I will oppose various aspects of Sharia law, for example its treatment of women as inferiors. ... But wait: this is something that various Christian Right churches do too. Same for positions against homosexuals -- hmmm, maybe the Christian Right and Sharia advocates can come to a congenial understanding.

I do believe that Islamism -- a political as much as a religious momement -- is a dangerous force in the world, but I do not believe it ever will be a significant force internally within the USA. OTOH, The Christian Right is a power, and yes, I do believe that the Christian Right is a greater threat to American democarcy than Muslims.

You might take some comfort in that I don't consider the Christian Right to typify American Christians in general. For that matter I don't consider the Christian Right to be Christians, (not in any way the Jesus would recognize), rather they are modern-day Pharisees of the same character that Jesus contemned

[ForeverAutumn]

Mark has a serious hate-on for Canada. I don't know what we ever did to him, but I'm as happy that he's American as he is.

[markw]

It's not a hatred so much as an amused befuddlement in that you look at America as the greatest threat to the world even though you owe your safe, unfettered existence to us. Even your culture mimics us as to be indistinguishable fro ours.

And, I also find it funny (not) that you try to throw your digs at Christianity at every opportunity.

As for that book, I find it also curious that you proudly throw that book out as an example of Christians being more of a threat than Islam. ...and now it seems that you're trying to backpedal. Good for you!

Now, would either of you two legal geniuses be able to tell me exactly what "breaching the peace" is, and how it differs from exercising their constitutionally guaranteed right of assembly and free speech.

Go ahead. Do a little research before coming to the defense of the police. ,,,and then get back to me.

But, I guess this this the only real outlet y'all have to rag on the US. After all virtually everyone else in the "great north" knows what side their bread is buttered on. I guess it makes y'all feel canada is important, eh?

[ForeverAutumn]

You have a very strange view of Canadians.

Thank you for not invading us.

[Mr Peabody]

It's one thing to say you don't believe, and disagree with Christianity but then it's another for that same person to try to tell the world what a Christian is. Feanor it would be a full time job to correct your inaccuracies regarding the Bible. I say Bible opposed to using "christianity" due to the word becoming so misused and represented by many of the groups you hold up as examples. Both them and you are misguided to say the least.

[Mr Peabody]

You have a very strange view of Canadians.

Thank you for not invading us.

Got oil? We may re-evaluate that decision

[ForeverAutumn]

Got oil? We may re-evaluate that decision

Our best kept secret... Shhhhhh. Don't tell anyone, okay?

[Feanor]

It's not a hatred so much as an amused befuddlement in that you look at America as the greatest threat to the world even though you owe your safe, unfettered existence to us. Even your culture mimics us as to be indistinguishable fro ours.

And, I also find it funny (not) that you try to throw your digs at Christianity at every opportunity.
...

But, I guess this this the only real outlet y'all have to rag on the US. After all virtually everyone else in the "great north" knows what side their bread is buttered on. I guess it makes y'all feel canada is important, eh?

You are a person of little understanding, Mark.

I admire the American nation and wish the best for its people (as I've said quite often). Accordingly I the time to understand the treats & vulnerabilities that the US faces in the hope they will be addressed. It's perplexing to me that you make the spurious and pathetic accusation that I'm anti-American.

I believe that institutional religion is a major exacerbant of the problems of the world today and the direct cause of some of them, (as it has ever been). That is true for Christianity, Islam, and other religions quite equally. The Christian Right, (as opposed to Christians in general), happens to be one instance of that poses an particular threat to America.

[Feanor]

Our best kept secret... Shhhhhh. Don't tell anyone, okay?

Yeah, we got plenty of oil. Hey, the Alberta oil sands contain more oil than Saudi Arabia. So bring on the invasion. I'm sure the occupation will "win our hearts and minds".

Wait ... no need: Harper is already a sycophant of the US.

[Feanor]

It's one thing to say you don't believe, and disagree with Christianity but then it's another for that same person to try to tell the world what a Christian is. Feanor it would be a full time job to correct your inaccuracies regarding the Bible. I say Bible opposed to using "christianity" due to the word becoming so misused and represented by many of the groups you hold up as examples. Both them and you are misguided to say the least.

Do you have a particular "inaccuracy" of mine that you care to point out?

[Mr Peabody]

I am not going through the entire thread to debate you point by point, I don't have the time. In addition, by not having any faith you are not on the same playing field.

As a recent example, no where does the Bible teach women are second class citizens. With that being said, the Bible does state, if I may paraphrase, "Christ is the head of the church, man is the head of his household". Men are to love, respect and honor their wives but God put into place an order of authority. One has to take the Bible in it's entirety or not at all. People like to believe God is love and He is but they refuse to accept that He also warns of a not so pleasant eternity for the disobedient.

[bobsticks]

One has to take the Bible in it's entirety or not at all...

No one doesn't and I would point out that the most fervent of the Far Right idealogues in this country never do. I could write something pithy to illustrate the point or one could just take a stroll down Leviticus Lane turn left at Numbers Boulevard and hit that nice little cafe at the end of Rue de Paul's Epistles for a steaming hot cup of hypocrisy.

All that said, it's still unconscionably wrong to censor the dingbat.

[Feanor]

I am not going through the entire thread to debate you point by point, I don't have the time. In addition, by not having any faith you are not on the same playing field.

As a recent example, no where does the Bible teach women are second class citizens. With that being said, the Bible does state, if I may paraphrase, "Christ is the head of the church, man is the head of his household". Men are to love, respect and honor their wives but God put into place an order of authority. One has to take the Bible in it's entirety or not at all. People like to believe God is love and He is but they refuse to accept that He also warns of a not so pleasant eternity for the disobedient.

Your paraphrase illustrates my point. One may argue for a benign interpretation, but the same words have been used a various times in history, including the present day by some, to vigorously subordinate women.

"Taking the Bible as a whole" is a matter of smoothing over the Book's many contradictions -- when people have done that they are come to a wide range of conclusions on almost every issue. For my part, I contrast the jealous, vengeful, and genocidal god of the Old Testament with the (relaitvely) compassionate god of the New Testament. (Some heretical theologians have actually declared that they are different gods.) Personally I consider the Old and New Testaments not reconcilable. Muslims, of course, consider both of those complilations to be full of errors and distortions.

[markw]

You have a very strange view of Canadians.

Thank you for not invading us.

Actually, I like most canadians I've met. My only issue seems to be with a few here that exhibit that little man/big ego "moral superiority" attitude in massive doses about which I read.

[Feanor]

Actually, I like most canadians I've met. My only issue seems to be with a few here that exhibit that little man/big ego "moral superiority" attitude in massive doses about which I read.

I think you're confused about who has the "superiority" attitude.

[Hyfi]

I am not going through the entire thread to debate you point by point, I don't have the time. In addition, by not having any faith you are not on the same playing field.

As a recent example, no where does the Bible teach women are second class citizens. With that being said, the Bible does state, if I may paraphrase, "Christ is the head of the church, man is the head of his household". Men are to love, respect and honor their wives but God put into place an order of authority. One has to take the Bible in it's entirety or not at all. People like to believe God is love and He is but they refuse to accept that He also warns of a not so pleasant eternity for the disobedient.

I don't want to start a huge religious debate here and I would not consider myself to be an Atheist, but the book is just a book. It has already been proven that it was manipulated into its current form by rearranging, editing, and burning anything that may sway the story attempting to be told.

Most of the book is written in code because each different sect tried to hide what it was doing. Scrolls found at the Dead Sea location contain books of the bible written well before the book was put together, but had been changed later when the book was assembled.

All 4 gospels totally contradict each other but are supposed to be true and when marked in red, the actual words of Jesus. The 4 books were written so long after the fact that nobody would have remembered conversations word for word to be able to quote them.

The book as a whole is all written in correspondences and were never intended to be taken in the literal sense, until Organized Religion, Christianity, decided that they could control the masses with fear. You can go to 10 churches on Sunday and get a totally different view of the same passage due to mis-interpretations.

One cannot preach about the All Loving, All Forgiving God and then turn around and tell you to be fearful. It is not logical. It is one or the other or a farce. We are all the same, made up of the same stuff and in the scheme of all things bigger, we are all one.

Many here are probably not too familiar with Emanual Swedenborg, or the New Church. (Pretty sure Mr. P and I have exchanged some thoughts on his book Heaven and Hell which is a good suggested read in one of the newer translated forms) The link below is to some of Swedenborgs writings which is his enlightened interpretation of the opening books of the bible. He goes basically phrase by phrase and explains the intent of the passage, the correspondences and meaning, and then points out all the related passages in the rest of the book so when you read them, you can refer back and understand what it was intended to mean. I reccomend these readings for anyone who thinks they know the book or want to understand it better.

http://www.magister.msk.ru/library/b...g/swedenb1.htm

If any here ever saw the Robin Williams movie "What Dreams May Come", the whole premise of Hell was taken straight out of Swedenborg's Heaven and Hell. If you read thru the link above, it is a lot to go thru and it took me a good bit of time, you will recognize elements of the movie such as the scene when they were in the boat going thru what is called 'Faces of the Water" Also if you read Heaven and Hell, you would recognize why the movie had Levels of Hell as well as noticing that Like Minded people go with the same when in heaven or hell which is actually the lowest (farthest place from God).

[markw]

I think you're confused about who has the "superiority" attitude.

I think you've not been paying attention.

[ForeverAutumn]

If you truly believe that, then canada is a more backwards and gullible country than I originally thought.

Actually, I like most canadians I've met. My only issue seems to be with a few here that exhibit that little man/big ego "moral superiority" attitude in massive doses about which I read.

Your words, here and in the past, tell a different story. But assuming that what you say is true...your problem is with only one or two people...then let me just say that when you put down a whole country based on the opinion of one or two people it makes you look bigoted and ignorant. I'm not saying that you are either of these things. I'm just saying how you appear in case you'd like to work on some self-improvement.

[GMichael]

(Mike opens the door slowly and slips onto the couch unnoticed)
Hey LJ, got anymore popcorn?

[markw]

Your words, here and in the past, tell a different story. But assuming that what you say is true...your problem is with only one or two people...then let me just say that when you put down a whole country based on the opinion of one or two people it makes you look bigoted and ignorant. I'm not saying that you are either of these things. I'm just saying how you appear in case you'd like to work on some self-improvement.

Are you saying that wnat I see here is atypical of the average canadian? For a suposedly small minority, you make a very vocal showing on this forum. How can I deny that when forming an opinion? Perhaps you should do more to show your country in a better light. After all you don't see Americans posting out of the clear blue on what they percieve to be problems with canada, do you?

[JohnMichael]

It's one thing to say you don't believe, and disagree with Christianity but then it's another for that same person to try to tell the world what a Christian is. Feanor it would be a full time job to correct your inaccuracies regarding the Bible. I say Bible opposed to using "christianity" due to the word becoming so misused and represented by many of the groups you hold up as examples. Both them and you are misguided to say the least.

I am amazed by those who profess to be Christians who do not emulate Jesus. My definition is someone who is loving, forgiving and a person of peace. The bible was written by many people over many hundreds of years. Of course the translation errors from languages to languages. Then different faiths selected the books they wanted. I could not be a bible literalist with all the errors. Then of course on top of that we have ministers who preach to support their biases using chosen parts of the bible.

[ForeverAutumn]

Are you saying that wnat I see here is atypical of the average canadian? For a suposedly small minority, you make a very vocal showing on this forum. How can I deny that when forming an opinion? Perhaps you should do more to show your country in a better light. After all you don't see Americans posting out of the clear blue on what they percieve to be problems with canada, do you?

I could say the same about you as an American. But I don't judge all Americans based on the opinions of just one or two.

I actually came back here to delete my comment. Not because I don't believe in what I was saying, but because I didn't like the way that I was behaving and portraying myself. I don't see the point in continuing this conversation, so I'm not going to.