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  1. #1
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    I made the Bose blunder!

    Some of you may know that I am into pool. Over the weekend I was working as a referee for a pool tournament in CT. It's was at a very nice place. Everything looked upscale and clean. Much nicer and larger larger than our older tournament sites. But there was an issue with the sound. The walls were bare as bare could be. No acoustic tiles or even a picture or two to break up the sound. Fill this room with close to a thousand drinking pool players and the noise level was torture. The music system consisted of 6 small Bose speakers and a base module. The 6 speakers were mounted at the top of the south and north walls. They were angled down, pointed from there to the opposite walls near where the floor would meet them. The base module was mounted on a wall near the door. Every time there was an announcement, the music would cut off, and the anouncement would come through the same speakers. Everyone would turn to me to ask, "what did they say?" I would not know since I couldn't hear either. I took a break Sunday afternoon. (long days: from 8AM till 3 AM the next mornings) While standing outside to get out of the "sound hell" someone asked me what I thought of the new site. I told him that I liked it very much but that it had some sound issues. He agreed. I went on to say that they could fix it with a few acoustic tiles. He didn't seem to know what I meant but nodded. Then I said that they needed to get rid of those tiny Bose cubes and put in real speakers. A look of total shock came over his face. He said, "But Bose makes the best audio that money can buy." I started to laugh. About a dozen people turn to me. Their faces are bright red. The intense look on their faces was hard to describe. If looks could kill, I would have burst into flames at that moment. One yells, "BOSE IS THE BEST!!!" Another says, "yeah, if you're so smart, who do YOU think makes the best speakers?" I said, "Um... well... I don't really know who is the absolute 'best' but there are many who are better." More people start turning my way. The crowd starts to move in closer. I'm starting to fear for my life, but I push on. Someone yells, "WHAT KIND OF SPEAKERS DO YOU HAVE?" I'ya.. I have Infiniti speakers." So, you think INFINITY makes the best?" Um, no... but they are better than Bose. They aren't really anywhere near the best. Some would say that ML's are the best. Others would say Magnepans, or Apogees, or Totems or Ushers are the best. Some of these could cost up to $20k or more. But I've seen some that go for as much as 1/4 of a mil. I don't know if they are the BEST. What I do know, is that Bose is not.
    It may have been a good thing that the tournament director stepped outside for a second to ask me some rule questions. It just may have saved my life. I got dirty looks from people the rest of the day.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  2. #2
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    I miss my pool table.

    This website and Bose have quite a history don't they? Someone in the Speakers section was questioning why a Bose topic got locked which seems to have brought RL back to life. Gotta love his attitude!

    Personally I have no experience whatsoever with Bose, but I do sooo hate those wave radio commercials. Just who are they trying to kid... oh... wait... that's right! The general public.

  3. #3
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    I saw that thread. It even brought Flo out of retirement. I miss him.

    I don't have anything against Bose really. They have a brilliant business plan. Their equipment isn't really all that bad, just not the best as they have Joe Average thinking. And the tiny speakers this place had, have no chance to fill that large of a room. Was like trying to have a concert in Central Park with my system. It ain gonna cut it.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  4. #4
    Da Dragonball Kid L.J.'s Avatar
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    I have a friend who thinks this way. I went to his house after he got his 3K bose DVD/CD/AVR all in one system and I didn't have the heart to say anything. He's happy with it though and was preaching on and on about it but he has the slightest clue. While he was talking, I would glance at my wife everynow and then and give her a little wink (she's been hanging around me long enough to know better.........I know, I'm such a jerk).

    So he does a demo for us. He has this hooked to 2K Pioneer plasma. Sounded OK but the bass was freakin weak. I have no true experience with Bose but not worth the 3K he spent if you ask me. The picture looked like crap as well. It looked so bad that I questioned how he had his system hooked up. Believe it or not, he had his 3K Bose thingie hooked up to his 2K plasma with a freakin' yellow composite video cable

    Can you believe it. I told him go pick up some component cables and he could increase his picture quality dramaticly and he brushed me off. Perhaps he saw me winking at wifee. I haven't asked if he ever picked up the component cables, but I will next time I'm at his place.

  5. #5
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by L.J.
    I have a friend who thinks this way. I went to his house after he got his 3K bose DVD/CD/AVR all in one system and I didn't have the heart to say anything. He's happy with it though and was preaching on and on about it but he has the slightest clue. While he was talking, I would glance at my wife everynow and then and give her a little wink (she's been hanging around me long enough to know better.........I know, I'm such a jerk).

    So he does a demo for us. He has this hooked to 2K Pioneer plasma. Sounded OK but the bass was freakin weak. I have no true experience with Bose but not worth the 3K he spent if you ask me. The picture looked like crap as well. It looked so bad that I questioned how he had his system hooked up. Believe it or not, he had his 3K Bose thingie hooked up to his 2K plasma with a freakin' yellow composite video cable

    Can you believe it. I told him go pick up some component cables and he could increase his picture quality dramaticly and he brushed me off. Perhaps he saw me winking at wifee. I haven't asked if he ever picked up the component cables, but I will next time I'm at his place.
    That's funny.
    Be very careful when you ask him. These Bose guys seem to get very upset if you question them. A couple of guys were turning colors. They went from pink to red to a purple color.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  6. #6
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Those same people think Sony is one of the elite brands in home electronics, too.

    I just avoid those conversations if at all possible - the only time you can talk about Bose to people is before they've made a purchase - save them.

    Otherwise you're insulting what they've just dropped a lot of money on in blind faith that Bose is the best money can buy. It's a question of image, lifestyle, stature, etc...you can't win that one.

    I'd love for Harman or someone to just go all out on the marketing, smear campaign and all, and put an end to it. Imagine the Coke vs Pepsi taste challenge commercials with speakers...10 outta 10, prefer the sound of Infinity or JBL to Bose..

    Until then....

  7. #7
    Color me gone... Resident Loser's Avatar
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    Well...

    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    That's funny.
    Be very careful when you ask him. These Bose guys seem to get very upset if you question them. A couple of guys were turning colors. They went from pink to red to a purple color.
    ...that's simply a part of the "more expensive has to be better" mindset...An attitude which would seem not to be limited to Bavarian nimrods...

    Anyone who would use Bose cubes/bass modules as a Muzak/page system should have their tiny little brains examined...They are what they are: high-in-WAF and easily installed in a home setting, quite suitable for reproducing laser-totin' mechanical lizards...a P.A. they ain't...

    jimHJJ(...BTW, my limited participation is a result of this place bein' sooo efffin slow and otherwise tedious...)
    Hello, I'm a misanthrope...don't ask me why, just take a good look around.

    "Men would rather believe than know" -Sociobiology: The New Synthesis by Edward O. Wilson

    "The great masses of the people...will more easily fall victims to a great lie than to a small one" -Adolph Hitler

    "We are never deceived, we deceive ourselves" -Goethe

    If you repeat a lie often enough, some will believe it to be the truth...

  8. #8
    Loving This kexodusc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident Loser

    jimHJJ(...BTW, my limited participation is a result of this place bein' sooo efffin slow and otherwise tedious...)
    Hmmm, is everyone having problems here but me or something? Same as always from my perspective - more regular members on vacation this time of year...

  9. #9
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    In the morning (6:30 - 11:00 am CDT) the site moves along pretty well for me. Afternoon and evening is a different story. Pages load slow, "server is busy...", that type of thing. Although I've yet to see an instance where the Quick Reply box didn't appear. That one seems strange to me. Yes there are a lot of people complaining these days from where I'm sitting...

  10. #10
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kexodusc
    Those same people think Sony is one of the elite brands in home electronics, too.

    I just avoid those conversations if at all possible - the only time you can talk about Bose to people is before they've made a purchase - save them.

    Otherwise you're insulting what they've just dropped a lot of money on in blind faith that Bose is the best money can buy. It's a question of image, lifestyle, stature, etc...you can't win that one.

    I'd love for Harman or someone to just go all out on the marketing, smear campaign and all, and put an end to it. Imagine the Coke vs Pepsi taste challenge commercials with speakers...10 outta 10, prefer the sound of Infinity or JBL to Bose..

    Until then....
    Many people I talk to, do believe that Sony is the end all in electronics. Poor lost souls.

    I didn't mean to insult them. Who knew that so many of them had fallen prey to Bose.

    A good side by side would be nice. Where can we set this up?
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  11. #11
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    maybe you should invite them guys over to your place mike, and then post a pic of the looks on their faces

    it's normal for bose owners to react aggressive, after all, how would you react if you spent alot of money on something and it turns out to be complate crap

    keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

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    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  12. #12
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident Loser
    ...that's simply a part of the "more expensive has to be better" mindset...An attitude which would seem not to be limited to Bavarian nimrods...

    Anyone who would use Bose cubes/bass modules as a Muzak/page system should have their tiny little brains examined...They are what they are: high-in-WAF and easily installed in a home setting, quite suitable for reproducing laser-totin' mechanical lizards...a P.A. they ain't...

    jimHJJ(...BTW, my limited participation is a result of this place bein' sooo efffin slow and otherwise tedious...)
    Many of the people at this tournament were from Rockland County. Been there? It's the land of BMW's and Mercedes. More money than brains. And a very deep embedded, "we're better than you are" way about them.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  13. #13
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by basite
    maybe you should invite them guys over to your place mike, and then post a pic of the looks on their faces

    it's normal for bose owners to react aggressive, after all, how would you react if you spent alot of money on something and it turns out to be complate crap

    keep them spinning,
    Bert.
    My guess is that they would tell me that my system sounds OK, but not as good as a real system like their Bose. Some people do not want to know the truth. Denial (De' Nile) is not just a river in Egypt you know.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  14. #14
    Forum Regular FLZapped's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Resident Loser
    ...that's simply a part of the "more expensive has to be better" mindset...An attitude which would seem not to be limited to Bavarian nimrods...

    Anyone who would use Bose cubes/bass modules as a Muzak/page system should have their tiny little brains examined...They are what they are: high-in-WAF and easily installed in a home setting, quite suitable for reproducing laser-totin' mechanical lizards...a P.A. they ain't...

    jimHJJ(...BTW, my limited participation is a result of this place bein' sooo efffin slow and otherwise tedious...)

    Yeah, same attitude as one finds with cables. -Bruce

  15. #15
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Ok, and, but,

    If you were to poll 100 people on the street and have them name speaker manufactuers, specifically for home theater I think the general answer would probably be Bose, JBL, Sony, Yamaha, Klipsch, Polk, and a few others perhaps. We all see those silly commercials for Bose on TV where they hype them to death...."amazing", "wow", "quality"...yep it's the 3-2-1 system from Bose. Yippee!

    Quite frankly the general public enjoy Bose for a few reasons: 1. easy to install. 2. small, compact, very discrete. 3. All-in-one system.

    So people honestly believe that they are able to get small, compact, easy to install, all in one systems that sound great....who wouldn't want it? I mean, if they could make a speaker the size of a 3X3 cube that sounded like Apogee Grands, Dali Megalines, or Wilson audio I think we'd all jump at the offer. The problem is that people are not educated on that limit of quality and to some...the quality delivered by Bose is sufficient. Let's face it, if you haven't heard anything BETTER than Bose, than why would you think otherwise? Ignorance is no excuse though and that's why people like us need to be the ones educated our friends, family, pool players, whoever on that type of quality.

  16. #16
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    So people honestly believe that they are able to get small, compact, easy to install, all in one systems that sound great....who wouldn't want it? I mean, if they could make a speaker the size of a 3X3 cube that sounded like Apogee Grands, Dali Megalines, or Wilson audio I think we'd all jump at the offer. The problem is that people are not educated on that limit of quality and to some...the quality delivered by Bose is sufficient. Let's face it, if you haven't heard anything BETTER than Bose, than why would you think otherwise? Ignorance is no excuse though and that's why people like us need to be the ones educated our friends, family, pool players, whoever on that type of quality.
    I agree with P-Sky and would extend the thought. I don't think it's merely that people aren't educated as to quality musical reproduction but in fact are ignorant as to quality instrumentation as well.How many kids out there never or rarely hear live music? How many people never hear music that is non-electronic based? If your point of reference is the car stereo or the speaks on your television anything is an improvement, especially if you don't know how an instrument is really supposed to sound in the first place.

  17. #17
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    people like us need to be the ones educated our friends, family, pool players, whoever on that type of quality.
    No thanks. Had my fill of angry mobs.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  18. #18
    Forum Regular nobody's Avatar
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    I think even if people know there is better sound quality to be had, many would still go with Bose for the ease of setup, ease of use and compact size. For most people, they want "good enough" sound and focus more on usability. They may choose better sound if it was available in a similarly simple, full-system solution; but it really isn't that I've seen. Personally, I've always thought the high end should stop complaining about how poor Bose is for the money and come up with their own solution for an easy-to-use, discreet, compact system for under 3K. If Bose is so bad and it is so easy to better them, it should be no problem, right?

  19. #19
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nobody
    I think even if people know there is better sound quality to be had, many would still go with Bose for the ease of setup, ease of use and compact size. For most people, they want "good enough" sound and focus more on usability. They may choose better sound if it was available in a similarly simple, full-system solution; but it really isn't that I've seen. Personally, I've always thought the high end should stop complaining about how poor Bose is for the money and come up with their own solution for an easy-to-use, discreet, compact system for under 3K. If Bose is so bad and it is so easy to better them, it should be no problem, right?
    The people I saw felt that Bose was the absolute best money could buy, barring none.
    I picked up a Yamaha HTIB for our bedroom. The list price was $750. (paid nothing) I'll stack it up against any Bose cube system ever made.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  20. #20
    Forum Regular nobody's Avatar
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    I agree tons of stuff sounds better, I just don't know that any of the other options are easier for some people. And, yeah, when people think Bose is absolutely the best sound, it is just ignorance 'cause they do basically sound like crap. But, that happens with most specialty type products; most people simply don't care enough to look into it.

    I'm just saying sound aside, there are a lot of things people really value that the Bose systems address that other systems don't even attempt to address. For example, the Yamaha is likely bulkier and has more individual settings to mess with. Most of the problems are very easy for anyone around here who likes gear, but lots of people do not like gear at all and do not want to mess with it. They want a little box they can slip whatever kinda disc in they have, press a button and listen/watch/whatever. And, the less visible the better for the speakers. I don't see other companies addressing those kinds of issues as much as Bose.

    I'm not saying I personally like the Bose systems, I just think they provide many things for people that other companies do not even attempt to provide and I think it's a shame that we don't see companies trying to make higher quality systems that serve those needs.

  21. #21
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    No thanks. Had my fill of angry mobs.
    I am sure that it gets frustrating when talking to people who are close-minded about sound quality and such, but even planting a seed in their mind that maybe they ARE wrong could perhaps change their perspective down the line. You never know.

  22. #22
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nobody
    I agree tons of stuff sounds better, I just don't know that any of the other options are easier for some people. And, yeah, when people think Bose is absolutely the best sound, it is just ignorance 'cause they do basically sound like crap. But, that happens with most specialty type products; most people simply don't care enough to look into it.

    I'm just saying sound aside, there are a lot of things people really value that the Bose systems address that other systems don't even attempt to address. For example, the Yamaha is likely bulkier and has more individual settings to mess with. Most of the problems are very easy for anyone around here who likes gear, but lots of people do not like gear at all and do not want to mess with it. They want a little box they can slip whatever kinda disc in they have, press a button and listen/watch/whatever. And, the less visible the better for the speakers. I don't see other companies addressing those kinds of issues as much as Bose.

    I'm not saying I personally like the Bose systems, I just think they provide many things for people that other companies do not even attempt to provide and I think it's a shame that we don't see companies trying to make higher quality systems that serve those needs.
    Does seem like the market is wide open for competition. Maybe no one feels that they can take on the Bose mystique.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  23. #23
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    I am sure that it gets frustrating when talking to people who are close-minded about sound quality and such, but even planting a seed in their mind that maybe they ARE wrong could perhaps change their perspective down the line. You never know.
    Just as long as they don't change my perspective to, looking up from the ground.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  24. #24
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Just let people buy what they like. There are those who who pick on people with a huge budget, there are those who pick on people with a small budget. For some people 3k just don't matter, i have a friend in the U.S. who does not have to worry about buying a 60k amplifier, he does not even need to check his account for it.

    I for one, am not rich, just hard working and lucky. But i just spent 320,-EUR on a CD Player for a friend with a beginner set. (Magnepan 0.5QR-SE, Onkyo Integra 6850 and a DIY amp). He listens to my system quite often, and even tough the price is aprox. 311 times higher he still LOVES it and there is no problem like Resident Looser has with me, where he asumes that i believe in "more expensive is better". This is complete none sense, but people like you, RL generally bash people who have a much higher limit on their audio hobby and disagree with your obsession over mid-fi electronics (based on my view).

    I asume this was directed straight at me, and if you where a true man, you would pick this fight with me openly, and not hide in some ancient post.

    ...that's simply a part of the "more expensive has to be better" mindset...An attitude which would seem not to be limited to Bavarian nimrods...
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  25. #25
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    I saw that thread. It even brought Flo out of retirement. I miss him.
    Thanks GM,

    but i am not really back. I skimp these forums, from time to time and if i find something interesting (very rarely), i make a comment. Seeing how "HighEnd-Bashing" is still the norm here, i don't feel like coming back more often.

    Cheers

    Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

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