5 speakers, $2500US: Paradigm vs B&W vs Totem???

[jjjanzen]

RGA:

Do you know where I can find a comparative frequency response chart for the Totem's (Sttaf preferably)?

[RGA]

They don't measure Totems there. Personally I would not go by the measurements to judge the sound -- I'm not a fan of the 100V3 in the least but the measurements they do (which is hardly comprehensive) look ok. This was just to illustrate that the two speakers measure similar and certainly one isn't "better" than the other -- personally I find most speakers with this cabinet design material design sound very much alike...which is why the cheaper speakers are a worth auditioning. Totem is more expensive can;t play as loud sound smaller cost more but look better. The Arro for instance is ok but I'd rather the Athena Floorstander for 1/3 the price as a big chunk of the Arro midband compressed and sounds quite a lot like a boom and sizzle speaker to ME.

To other people it might sound great. But I always get the sense when people talk about the Model one it is always compliments like " great bass for a small speaker" which is true it does have great bass for a small speaker but that does not mean it has "great bass" in an overall way. The Model One in Canada was selling for $1800.00 a few years ago and I compared the B&W CDM2SE which was about $1150.00Cad and the B&W was better to me. The Model one needs a small room had a small sound compressed badly at medium high levels -- and were not especially great at low volumes because oftheir poor sensitivity and efficiency...when it all ligned up it sounded good but i found it an incredibly limiting loudspeaker and when you factor in the $1800.00 price tag it was puzzling to me.

It's just personal taste I stress but every time I listen to a Totem I come away saying "is that it?" And then I look at the price and I guess I don't get the appeal other than the visual - they are some of the most beautiul speakers going for the money.

I would just ask a bunch of dealers to let you take several speakers home and try them all out.

[kexodusc]

personally I find most speakers with this cabinet design material design sound very much alike...

You continue to amaze me...Your comments make it clear to me you place far too much emphasis on what designers "say" they do and how a speaker actually sounds. Cabinet shape, driver material contributing to similar sound? God, why not throw in voice coil gauge, pole-vents, dust caps, magnet material...Guess that makes sense...Audio Note clearly sounds like the less expensive Cerwin Vega's of similar shape with paper cone woofers...please...

Totem is more expensive can't play as loud sound smaller cost more but look better. The Arro for instance is ok but I'd rather the Athena Floorstander for 1/3 the price as a big chunk of the Arro midband compressed and sounds quite a lot like a boom and sizzle speaker to ME.

Boom and sizzle? From a Totem? Brother, THAT'S a first...I usually hear they are the chaotic opposite...midrange warm and detail with rolled off highs and insufficient bass/boom....they generally have gradual roll-offs in the bass and are anything but boomy. Totem is known for presenting HUGE sounds...not the "small speaker" sound you mention. Might not be your thing, but that's like saying Toyota is known for their poor quality...just the opposite...

and were not especially great at low volumes because of their poor sensitivity and efficiency...

Statements like these make me question if you have ever really taken the time to listen to these speakers or if you are just trolling. By ruling out all speakers you don't promote with these made up deficiencies, you indirectly steer people towards the brands that make your list. Efficiency and Sensitiviy do NOT affect the sound quality of the speaker in the way you are implying. There is nothing lost or added as far as musical information goes as a result of sensitivity.
Totems are a pretty fair bargain at their price points. Perhaps a bit of niche product as they aren't the most ideal speakers in 600 sq foot rooms. For most mid-size or smaller rooms their design presents far more flexibility and better integration with the rooms to achieve superior sound.

[Geoffcin]

Statements like these make me question if you have ever really taken the time to listen to these speakers or if you are just trolling. By ruling out all speakers you don't promote with these made up deficiencies, you indirectly steer people towards the brands that make your list. Efficiency and Sensitiviy do NOT affect the sound quality of the speaker in the way you are implying. There is nothing lost or added as far as musical information goes as a result of sensitivity.
Totems are a pretty fair bargain at their price points. Perhaps a bit of niche product as they aren't the most ideal speakers in 600 sq foot rooms. For most mid-size or smaller rooms their design presents far more flexibility and better integration with the rooms to achieve superior sound.

Perhaps he's heard them with horribly underpowered amps. Vince Bruzzese actually apologized when he played the Hawks, as he said "The Hawks like a bigger amp" I think he was running 150 watts into the Rainmakers and it sounded great. The Mani-2 was using a 400wpc amp(4ohm), and it was dynamic heaven!

Compressed?! HA-HA-HA!!!

[RGA]

The arro sounds like a boom and sizzle speaker to me - not the Rainmaker and not the Model one nor the Mani. The Arro. And it isn't a boom really more of just a speaker that is trying to wow me with the bass for it's size and a speaker that seems very difficient in the mid(vocal band sounding nasal). it sounds small and side by side with some Energy's it was embarrassing...the Arro is overpriced and sounds highly fatiguing sorry but that's tha way it sounds - I have listened to totems for years -- with Roksan Bryston and parasound most recently all of which have more than enough power to drive any Totem.

In a small room the the Model one will be nice -- just not to me for th money. Even Geoffcin has subonciously proven my point "WTF" value for the size that they are." Yes they are impressive for the size they are -- but take the size oOUT OF THE EQUATION and they are a ho hum overpriced speaker. Everyone I know is very impressed with the size and the sound from the small box -- but after that they just do not sound BIG and if they did you would have bought them right? After all they ALSO look phenomenal -- but you know exactly what I'm talking about -- they are expensive for the sound on tap -- their midrange is not great -- they SOUND like a speaker trying to impress and somewhere along the way they have the pyrotechnics and gee wiz factor but lost the pot musically.

No one has to agree with me and I'm not telling anyone they should be hearing it the way I'm hearing it -- but i've felt a bit like this toward Totem 5 years before I ever heard of Audio Note since back in the CDM SE series of B&W's. The Model one made me say wow that;s really cool for a small speaker -- but after that wow it's not musical it sounds boxy and it needs bags of power to not play loud and not work in a medium sized room very well -- sorry but that just isn't worth nearly $2k. I briefly auditioned the Rainmaker a second time and it's overpriced to me. I try for the most part to recommend what I would buy at the price point or my close runner ups -- Since Totem to me runs double what I think they're sonics run I can't recommend them. I heard $2500.00 Dreamcatchers in a surround sound rig...again $2500.00 for the sound that was on offer is simply ludicrous to me.

Of course I steer people to speakers I like when I can -- I also try and steer people to what I think is the best on their list or what I think is the best bang for buck -- I also try and find something cheaper and what i think is better when I can because unluike you I don't try and get people to spend double the money for no better a speaker but covered in a nice "LOOKING" box. Totem is grossly overpriced all across the line IMO. None of them sound BAD -- but they are certainly nothing special at the prices.

[kexodusc]

Well RGA, I guess if you say it has to be true...Totem's continued success is more evil corporate marketing and stupid buyers being conned into pretty over-priced speakers that sound worse than $200 Best Buy models.
Thanks for saving us from making a big mistake.

[RGA]

Well A&B sound is like Best Buy just so you know as maybe you have not been out west. No - you overract and get defensive -- where didI say they sound worse than $200.00 best buy speakers? I think it is YOU who are very much insulting Energy loudspeakers for being able to offer superior value for FAIR prices -- ditto for their sister Athena line.

[psonic]

Yes, you can get maximum speaker for the $2500 with Dynaudio. Listen to the Audience 52 and 62 and see what you think. The 62 has a bit more bass and will work in a mid sized room without a sub, you also don't need stands and you have nice built floorstanders (no resonance in these). Then get the A42 as surround and look into the center channel or possibly "phantom mode" without a center channel (my preference). If you skip the center you may even go up to the 72 which has a ton of bass. Listen to all your list of speakers, then go listen to these...

http://www.dynaudio.com/