I know you wont like this thread so dont reply

[Florian]

Thanks for sharing your opinions. I think that i am a straight forward person and speak my mind freely. You are all agreeing partly with the one problem i adressed here many times. The "audioreview standard package" is Paradigm, B&W, Axiom etc... and as soon as one person goes against the mass recomendation they get called an arrogant jerk.

I would much rather get an opinion from a person who has a strong believe then a typical standard reply which is often made by those members who enjoy a celebrity style online life.

-Flo

[GMichael]

Thanks for sharing your opinions. I think that i am a straight forward person and speak my mind freely. You are all agreeing partly with the one problem i adressed here many times. The "audioreview standard package" is Paradigm, B&W, Axiom etc... and as soon as one person goes against the mass recomendation they get called an arrogant jerk.

I would much rather get an opinion from a person who has a strong believe then a typical standard reply which is often made by those members who enjoy a celebrity style online life.

-Flo

So how did I do? I've never listened to any Paradigm, B&W, or Axioms. But I would like to. And the B&W DVD they sent me was way cool. It even sounded great on my lil' Infinity's.

I have one strong belief. That is that no hobby is worth loosing sleep over. That I'd rather joke around and be called a fool than to get upset about everything and feel like a fool for not enjoying myself.

I know that we have different priorities as far as sound equipment. But we have fun anyhow. Hope we can keep swapping jokes.

[Florian]

I know that we have different priorities as far as sound equipment. But we have fun anyhow. Hope we can keep swapping jokes.

Priorities and personal taste are all fine, and will not keep us from joking around ;-) As long as the facts remain facts and the faults are not drawn into pretty little pictures which serves as a baby cradle for those with no own way.

-Flo

[GMichael]

Priorities and personal taste are all fine, and will not keep us from joking around ;-) As long as the facts remain facts and the faults are not drawn into pretty little pictures which serves as a baby cradle for those with no own way.

-Flo

Not sure I follow this. But I'll try not to draw anymore pictures.

[shokhead]

Thanks for sharing your opinions. I think that i am a straight forward person and speak my mind freely. You are all agreeing partly with the one problem i adressed here many times. The "audioreview standard package" is Paradigm, B&W, Axiom etc... and as soon as one person goes against the mass recomendation they get called an arrogant jerk.

I would much rather get an opinion from a person who has a strong believe then a typical standard reply which is often made by those members who enjoy a celebrity style online life.

-Flo

Are not those brands the ones 98% of us can afford? Are not those brands easier to find then more costly brands? I would'nt go into a forum with anything most dont have. Kinda like being an outcast.

[Bernd]

Are not those brands the ones 98% of us can afford? Are not those brands easier to find then more costly brands? I would'nt go into a forum with anything most dont have. Kinda like being an outcast.

And I thought the point of this Forum is to share experiences, have fun, give advice and help other members and learn about other members systems. Am I wrong?
Who wants to be part of the masses (98%) voluntarely anyway? How boring, pointless and mind numbing would this be if we only talk about the most popular best buy brands. Wide varied opinions is what makes this interesting. And it's almost certain that there are those who live an on-line celebrity lifestyle when in reality.................,well you know.

Peace

Bernd

[daviethek]

I have 3 hobbies. Fly-fishing, Oil painting and listening to great music. I am looking at retirement in about 5 years. Combined with all the pains and joys of family life, I know that I will have no problem finding things to do in retirement. Having these kind of interests is not only worthwhile, it is critical to properly transition yourself from the cube farm to the trout stream.

The best feeling I have about the music/stereo hobby is that when I have friends over, they can see and hear my passion for sound reproduction. I'm not so sure they are complimentary when they leave, but when they are here, my gear blows them away.

When I read some of the posts here, I can sense the passion. Some are so passionate about the gear that one wonders if they can still feel the music. Some are critical of what others can or cannot hear. When I read these things I think about being catholic or American citizenship. If you ask 20 people about the basic requirements for each you may get an unbelievable range of answers. even among the catholics.

[Bernd]

I have 3 hobbies. Fly-fishing, Oil painting and listening to great music. I am looking at retirement in about 5 years. Combined with all the pains and joys of family life, I know that I will have no problem finding things to do in retirement. Having these kind of interests is not only worthwhile, it is critical to properly transition yourself from the cube farm to the trout stream.

The best feeling I have about the music/stereo hobby is that when I have friends over, they can see and hear my passion for sound reproduction. I'm not so sure they are complimentary when they leave, but when they are here, my gear blows them away.

When I read some of the posts here, I can sense the passion. Some are so passionate about the gear that one wonders if they can still feel the music. Some are critical of what others can or cannot hear. When I read these things I think about being catholic or American citizenship. If you ask 20 people about the basic requirements for each you may get an unbelievable range of answers. even among the catholics.

A man with taste and depth. Very well said, Sir. Retirement. You have roughly 5 years on me. I, too will have no problem keeping busy.

Peace

Bernd

[Florian]

Is it fair and honest to only recommend the mass market equipment? Is it not fair to spread the word about Quality instead of Quantity and fair Price?

Are panel speakers or horns only for snobs because they are not sold from online retailes or best buy for rock bottom prices with which no company can pay a fair sallery to their employees or buy quality parts from?

I believe that every new members deserves better then the "audioreview standard package", this is a free for all site and the providers should not limit their new members to 4 choices. But in a way they do, the big names on here have a "standard package" that they recommend and any or all other opinions are put to an end by the use of "snob" "arrogant" etc. As usual the masses feel validated by it and join in without having any actual experience or idea what the fundamental discussion is about.

I find this sad, and would hope that ALL members, but esp. the new ones look at more hidden brands that cannot afford to buy advertising on a big site or magazine. In todays world people need to live and this "cheaper is better" or "cheap is just as good" attitude wont help the small buisiness etc. and will not help to give you a better sound!


-Flo

[kexodusc]

Is it fair and honest to only recommend the mass market equipment? Is it not fair to spread the word about Quality instead of Quantity and fair Price?

I think you're missing the point behind a lot of recommendations made at this website.
There's nothing wrong with recommending mass market equipment. If someone asks a question about what $200 a/v receiver they should buy with Prol-logic II processing, you're pretty much limited to mass market. You seem incapable of grasping this concept.

Quality doesn't mean expensive. It means doing the job it was designed to do well. $200 Sony receivers do the job, but fail enough to not be considered great quality. $200 Denon's tend to last a bit longer with fewer faults. To some, they even sound better than Sonys. Therefore higher quality. Understand?
Recommending a $2100 Arcam receiver or $5000 worth of separates as a response to such a question would just be a stupid waste of time. There's a time and a place to make such recommendations, some people are smart enough to know when.

Are panel speakers or horns only for snobs because they are not sold from online retailes or best buy for rock bottom prices with which no company can pay a fair sallery to their employees or buy quality parts from?

Huh? Fair salary? Most of these Best Buy brands actually employ very few people and pay them well enough. They make their money by small profit margins and large volume, not a ridiculously unfair mark-up. But what does that have to do with recommending products?

I believe that every new members deserves better then the "audioreview standard package", this is a free for all site and the providers should not limit their new members to 4 choices. But in a way they do, the big names on here have a "standard package" that they recommend and any or all other opinions are put to an end by the use of "snob" "arrogant" etc. As usual the masses feel validated by it and join in without having any actual experience or idea what the fundamental discussion is about.

Here you go again. The evil "Big Names" are conspiring to promote the junky mass market brands like Paradigm, B&W, and Axiom. Nonsense. Is this any different that the "standard package" responses you give on panel speakers? You're not really that unique in that regard.

You sound like broken record repeating the same crap about big names on this site who only recommend B&W, Paradigm, and Axiom. I dare you prove any so-called "big name" has only recommended those three brands, or that they've only ever recommended ANY BestBuy/mass market brand. You won't be able to and you know it.

Nobody wishes to censor your recommendations. They just wish you had a bit more tact and relevance when making them. A lot of the so called "big names" here have recommended panel speakers, horns, small speaker companies, and other non-mainstream solutions. Comments like the ones you're making in this thread are out of touch with reality, and discredit the value of any advice you would give. You have a lot of audio knowledge you could share constructively, but instead you chose to employ a "mine is better than yours" attitude and approach. It appears you're trying to present yourself as some kind of audio martyr, when at the most, you're just another voice among many.

I find this sad, and would hope that ALL members, but esp. the new ones look at more hidden brands that cannot afford to buy advertising on a big site or magazine. In todays world people need to live and this "cheaper is better" or "cheap is just as good" attitude wont help the small buisiness etc. and will not help to give you a better sound!

That's BS and you know it. If I named a $5000 speaker, I'm sure you could name one for less than $5000 you thought sounded better. What's wrong with trying to get the best sound for the money? Do you make a habbit of buying the second best thing for the money? If you knew there was something better for cheaper, wouldn't you take advantage of that? Thought so.

If I have $2000 to spend on speakers there's no way in hell I want the 3rd best speaker priced at $2000. And if the best speaker cost $1000, why the hell would I spend $2000 on a speaker just line somebody's pockets?

Most of the recommendations here are presented as places to start listening, nothing more. I've only met a few people here that believe they've heard the best speaker possible and constantly push that to other people.

If you're going to make accusations about this site or its members, at least have the balls to list names and examples that aren't pure bull**** made up for no other reason than to make yourself feel like the poor persecuted victim. If you can't back up what you say, don't say it.

[shokhead]

And I thought the point of this Forum is to share experiences, have fun, give advice and help other members and learn about other members systems. Am I wrong?
Who wants to be part of the masses (98%) voluntarely anyway? How boring, pointless and mind numbing would this be if we only talk about the most popular best buy brands. Wide varied opinions is what makes this interesting. And it's almost certain that there are those who live an on-line celebrity lifestyle when in reality.................,well you know.

Peace

Bernd

Because part of the masses are the ones that can afford the most popular brands,whatever that means. Me, if i'm buying a 25K car,i dont read and study 50K cars. I'm not on a MB forum,i'm on a Altima forum.

[Bernd]

Because part of the masses are the ones that can afford the most popular brands,whatever that means. Me, if i'm buying a 25K car,i dont read and study 50K cars. I'm not on a MB forum,i'm on a Altima forum.

Sure, but take your budget (however large that is) and put some effort in the selection process. There are many small manufacturers worth checking out, but that takes effort. Also very often you don't find these products reviewed since they seldom place big ads.

And I guess I am different from you there. If I would be in the market for the said car I sure would like to know how that manufacturers 50K car performes and how it is different from what I am interested in. And is any technology from the top model filtering down? Anybody can produce a cost no object superb product. The hard part is to capture some of that performance with a given budget. And some do it better then others and some just cheat (review sample full of expensive components but the production model scaled down in quality - it happens) or don't care.
It is very easy to buy a magazine and pick the latest 5* winners and walk into an Audio chain store and buy the whole thing in one go.
I will stand by that, that one can do a lot better with those funds.The choice in the more reasonable priced band of the audio market is vast. So no need to follow the herd. Use your ears and put some effort into it and believe me you will be rewarded.

Example: My last Speaker purchase comes in three different price bands. I had it explained to me where the money goes and where the differences lay - and then I listened and came up with a decision that suited me and me alone. That is the way to buy. Of course it matters how serious you are about this pastime and how much importance is placed on sound quality and pride of ownership.
I welcome diversity and much rather read about some other members golden find, be that new,second hand or vintage, but please show some imagination.

Have a good weekend

Bernd

P.S. What is an MB or Altima Forum? Please tell.