Super Bowl Half Tme Music/Super Bowl Game

[jack70]

Funny that this post was about the music and the game... and 95% of the posts don't even mention the game AT ALL. And then some of you complain about THE MEDIA making a big deal about the halftime nonsense ... all the while you're doing the same thing. Some of you guys call yourselves football fans???

1/ The crapola...

I can understand some of the public backlash of the halftime crap (more dumbing down of the culture), but it's no less insidious (IMO) than most primetime fare like "Friends" (lame), or MTV (more lameness), and MOST of the crap (overt violence or sexuality, when used without any meaningful plot reasons, simply for shock value) on TV. I'm not saying you don't have the right to watch that sorta stuff... just that there's a TON of it out there already, and not that inspiring for younger viewers. I just think you got this backlash from many parents of kids that don't let em watch much TV, and are more perturbed at how violence & sex is forced down their young kids throats against the values they're trying to impart to their kids. BTW, where are the NOW libbers, who used to get upset at the culture implication that assult is OK if it's "cute"... fine message for the kids who don't know any better. And we wonder why grammer school kids use the F-word.

The whole sexualization of prepubescent kids in our culture today is a little disturbing... and sadly, I don't have much in the way of insight or answers for it. Having said that, most football commercials are overtly sexy (Coors beer twins, etc), and this type of lame/sexy popular music is the norm today. I also see heaps of irony in Tagliabue professing outrage at the halftime show. In a sport where steroids, strutting, borderline humiliation, drugs, sex, criminal activity (Panthers), are all such a huge part of the sport, it sounded a pretty funny.

But why anyone would watch the so-called "entertainment" is beyond me. I watched a little of ESPN's pregame discussions at 11AM, but I didn't turn the TV on till kickoff at 6:30. I've been watching local weekly breakdown shows of the Patriots games since September, and I was more interested in The GAME than anything else. I didn't watch ANY of the halftime nonsense live.

Musically, what I saw in the replays was really shallow. Old tunes, and I heard much was lip-synched... TOTALLY unacceptable IMO. Fakers. That's the best we can do America today? Our culture is seen throughout the world for the superbowl, and that's the best those stupid CBS/MTV suits can come up with? Anyone remember the great PBS Blues series last year? Why not do a show that unites some of those classic oldtimer musicians and the new Blues generation... could have been spectacular IMHO. It never ceases to amaze me how most corporate types in the media etc are so tone-deaf to what's original or good. Or how they target everything at the teen market demographic, even though it was a minor part of that audience. It's gotta be the Peter Principal at work.

2/ Now, about the game... enough on the stupid "entertainment"...

I've followed the Pats since the 70's. For those that haven't seen the Pats much, that's exactly the type of game they've played most every week this season. Early lead... looks like they're the better team, yet the other team makes a run at the end... and the Pats are forced to make a furious last minute charge to pull it out of the fire. It's the type of season few fans ever get to enjoy, and it's been a long time coming.... finally a season where most breaks goe your way, and when they don't you still get another chance to redeem yourself. It's also special because we lost so many starters to injury this year, more than any other NFL team, yet still persevered.

I thought the zebra's were pretty good... don't think it effected the outcome anyway. Same with the Panther's decision to go for 2 pts... I thought it was an OK decision... but ya gotta use an "outta the box"play, and make it. Considering the Pats missed 2 "gimme" field goals, gave up a FG on a stupid squib kick before halftime(!), lost Rodney Harrison to injury (broken arm) which resulted in an 85yd TD by Carolina, and blew an easy 3 or 7pts with the intercept in the endzone near the end... I was glad the Pats came out on top -- would'a been a long offseason had they lost knowing they blew all those points (23). Altogether, a great game, with a couple of superbowl records (37pts in the 4'th Q!)

Did anyone see the replay tape of the streaker? Was on our local Boston sports show. Funny as hell... a near-naked dancin' & prancin' fool making an ass of himself... finally someone ran out to get him before Matt Chatham of the Pats drilled him to the ground with a nice body blow...BAM. I think the players were hardly in the mood for such nonsense at that point. What's hard to understand is how he got access to the field... lots of reporters with official credentials were totally barred from the lower field. And why'd it take so long for anyone to react to it?

We SHOULD be stronger next year, with the draft picks and players coming back from injury. But football rarely goes according to hoyle... and that's partly why it's such a great game. Congrats Pats... congrats Panthers.

[dld]

Jack, I totally agree with your analysis of the game. Personally, I was pulling for Carolina (since Dallas beat them this year, we could have claimed title to being a team that beat the champs). However, the non partisan sports fan in me wanted New England to come out on top. Hell, like you said, they flat gave away 23 points. End of story. To have lost that game would have been an injustice to the total effort they put forth. I just wish their fans knew how to celebrate a nationaL championship like our Tiger fans down here in beautiful (well, sort of) Baton Rouge. I guess we're more of a group of friendly drunks

Towards the end oft the game, I was getting a feeling similar to the feeling I had when LSU was in the position of having totally dominated OU in the Sugar Bowl, but faced the real possibility of OU scoring a TD against a very tired Tiger defense in the waning minutes, forcing an OT, and who knows what after that? Why Stoops abandoned the running game to go to the pass, after he had run our defense into the ground is beyond me. I'll forever be thankful for his decision tho.

As far as the dumming down of our culture, I just won't accept that as the norm. Call me idealistic, but just because its there doesn't mean we have to accept it. I read today the Beyonce lip syched the National Anthem. WTF???

As for Friends, I've grown rather fond of it in reruns. Certainly better than the basic sitcom fare gracing our airwaves. (none of which I've watched more than an episode or two, I'd rather watch bombs explode on the History channel). I only catch it for one reason, it comes on before the daily Simpson's rerun, so I usually see the final 2-5 minutes of it every evening after dinner. Perhaps in small doses like that its not so offensive???

[jack70]

Yeah... it's true... often the best team doesn't get to win the title. It's why sports is so exciting. The all-time example of that is NC State winning the NC in hoops... they wouldn't have even made the cut for the final top-48 seeding if they hadn't won 3 in a row for the ACC title and the automatic berth... and they gave us the greatest, most exciting ride of any hoops champion ever.

This really WAS a Cinderella-season for the Pats... how often do teams win so many close games? Yeah, it would'a been very tough for the Pats to swallow a loss because of a few errors, after playing so well (better overall). But the same thing happened in their AFC-Champ win over the Colts... they dominated Manning and their running game, yet the Colts were still within striking distance till the very end. It's partly because every team that gets this far is really good... you rarely see a team get shut-out badly unless they ALL get up with their bio-rhythms out of sync (Colts over Denver).

People talk about the Dolphins 17 game streak, but the Pats played something like 11 games against teams with winning records.. a much harder road than Miami did. BTW, they also won all 4 pre-season games (usually a bad sign for the season).

Makes you wonder how serendipitous Drew Bledsoe's injury against the Jets was 3 years ago... who knows how different things would be if that never happened. I also want to say that most of the Pats are a bunch of great guys off the field... many like Richard Seymore are on weekly interview shows and are really terrific guys. Brady as well... all the accolades haven't swelled his head... he has his ego under control. It's really refreshing in today's world of celebrity-ego-idiots.

I just wish their fans knew how to celebrate a nationaL championship like our Tiger fans down here in beautiful (well, sort of) Baton Rouge. I guess we're more of a group of friendly drunks.

I think it would'a been a lot worse if it hadn't been below freezing here for the past month. God knows what will happen if the Sox ever win it all...LOL. I don't understand it myself... but that behavior sort of echoes what we were all reflecting on with the media becoming dumbed-down and overly-sexual over the past decades. Stuff that wouldn't have been accepted decades ago is now commonplace. Maybe it's just a cycle-ish thing for the culture... or maybe it'll get worse in the future.


As for sit-coms like Friends, It's partly because I've watched stuff like Gleason's Honeymooners and All in the Family, and find most of today's shows poorly written, if not total rehashes of plotlines which are already 10'th-generation copies. The only sitcom I've even watched in the last 20 years is Seinfeld, and only occasionally. At least they tried to be a little different there, and although they often struck out, they also often hit some home runs. I just found the characters in Friends to be hollow, with no positive redeeming values... something you got with Gleason, Andy Griffith, & even the much-maligned Beaver. I watch my share of junk-TV too, but my main "complaint" is that too many Kids watch it, and get the idea it must be good. Shakespeare is good... and there are lots of great old movies and TV shows... and I wonder if too much 2'nd-rate fare will kill/stunt kid's appreciation (and seeking out) of truly rich film & literature. But I'm getting into R. Pirsig philosophical territory here, so I'll leave it at that...LOL.

TV is essentially a "public" venue... one we all own, at least in principle, and it should be held to a different dynamic than something you have to seek out or pay for (extreme violence and extreme sexist fare). If all parents were GOOD parents: wise, and who talked about these things all the time, I wouldn't be so concerned... but too many parents aren't even up to the task of raising a pet, let alone a human being. The schools can't make up for such parents abrogations, although occasionally a special teacher or coach can save such kids.

...I'd rather watch bombs explode on the History channel

Did you catch any of their recent 4-part/4-hr shows on The Barbarians? (Viking's, Huns, Goths and Mongols)... pretty good historical re-enactments if you're into history at all. I also enjoy American Chopper on the Discovery Channel.... mixes art and mechanics (motorcycle design) in a pretty cool reality-type show (I've NEVER watched any of the "real" reality shows). The family dynamics there are typical of what I & my friends grew up with, and I think many guys can appreciate that interplay there. BTW, their Superbowl commercials were better than most of the others.

[nobody]

I always think the way we as a society in the US have no problem with violence, but are deathly afraid of sex is pretty funny. I remember when I worked in a video store. You'd get parents coming in with little kids and picking out the most brutally violent things they could find, action, sci-fi, and war movies the kids wanted to see, without a second thought. Then the dad would come up with one, get all serious and ask, "there isn't any nudity in this, is there?" Like, marinating your kids brain in mindless violence from age 3 up is OK, but god forbid he see a female breast. I was always fairly shocked to see how common such attitudes were.

Oh...and I still think Miss Jackson's hot.

[Dusty Chalk]

I always think the way we as a society in the US have no problem with violence, but are deathly afraid of sex is pretty funny. I remember when I worked in a video store. You'd get parents coming in with little kids and picking out the most brutally violent things they could find, action, sci-fi, and war movies the kids wanted to see, without a second thought. Then the dad would come up with one, get all serious and ask, "there isn't any nudity in this, is there?" Like, marinating your kids brain in mindless violence from age 3 up is OK, but god forbid he see a female breast. I was always fairly shocked to see how common such attitudes were.

Thank you. I was just trying to say this aim thing on another forum. Like they haven't seen a booby before. What do you think they grew up on, bottles? And like there's anything wrong with seeing a booby. I think parents just get embarassed and don't want to talk about it, that's why they don't want their kids to see it.

I mean, you know cigarettes leads to marijuana, and marijuana leads to harder drugs, right? What the L does seeing a breast lead up to? Having sex? Becoming a pervert? Remaining heterosexual? I can think of worse destinies in life...

[Jim Clark]

Thank you. I was just trying to say this thing on another forum. Like they haven't seen a booby before. What do you think they grew up on, bottles? And like there's anything wrong with seeing a booby. I think parents just get embarassed and don't want to talk about it, that's why they don't want their kids to see it.

I mean, you know cigarettes leads to marijuana, and marijuana leads to harder drugs, right? What the L does seeing a breast lead up to? Having sex? Becoming a pervert? Remaining heterosexual? I can think of worse destinies in life...

Some of you guys are defintely speaking like a bunch of folks without kids. No seeing a breast isn't as dreadful as some want to make it out to be, but...

A couple of things are important here, like rules for starters. There are rules (laws) governing broadcasts. I guess some people aren't required to follow the rules that are layed down? Is that the message we want our kids to learn? Celebrity gives you certain privledges but it shouldn't be extended to a license to break whatever rules and regulations govern our society.

Futhermore, you might think that sending a message that it's ok to rip off a womens shirt whenever the mood hits is all in fun or even ok, but many of us do not. That, and much worse happens everyday but I don't see how glorifying it in front of a national audience can be a good thing. People can say whatever they want about the incident but it boils down to a glorification of violence against women. THAT is what many people are upset about. Had she bared her own breast that would be one thing but that wasn't the situation at all. Yeah, I know she was in on it, but that doesn't really change anything relevant to my point.

Rev. jc

[MindGoneHaywire]

Not for nothing, Jim, but a lot of the arguments to the contrary of yr position make quite a lot of sense--i.e. this is silly, what's the big deal, etc. etc. And I have to agree with a lot of them. But when I heard about this--I wasn't watching at the time & unless one was totally concentrating on it it wouldn't seem as though you would've actually caught what happened--I did happen to think about my nephews. And by extension about kids in general.The issue is just a little more complicated than 'what's the big deal?' Maybe it's not a big deal for a kid to see some sweater meat, ha ha. I don't think it's going to corrupt any kids that wouldn't be corruptible in other ways by other forces. But I don't think it's right, either; it was just a little too much. My 7-year-old nephew shouldn't have to have this explained to him at his age. Will he live? Of course. But parents today didn't have grow up dealing with this sort of thing, for the most part, so there is a bit of a culture shock involved. It'd sure be nice if this wasn't an issue, but unfortunately it is. You're right, a lot of these correct & well-meaning opinions are coming from people who aren't parents, & I'm one of 'em. But I definitely see yr side here.

[jack70]

I always think the way we as a society in the US have no problem with violence, but are deathly afraid of sex is pretty funny.

I agree with most of your sentiments... the fact we tend have a "problem" with sex in this a country can indeed be tiring at times... but I think the thing many people are getting more & more upset (fed-up) with is larger than this one thing... it's a more general thinking that our culture is becoming coarser... that we're defining deviancy down.

I agree that violence can be harmful at certain ages too, although there's a big difference between watching violence and experiencing it... it's real violence where kids get their minds f__ked up. And the fact you saw some idiot parents UNconcerned about video violence for their kids doesn't mean MOST parents aren't concerned about such violence, which is worse in movies & games than 20-40 years ago. Many parents have gotten TVs out of their houses completely, and most ARE very concerned about what their kids see, especially pre-10 year olds. (that's my personal observation).

Many parents get justifiably upset when they lose the hearts & minds of their kids to outside forces. Some of it may be their own fault, but I can see their point too, especially when parents aren't even aware of lots of the stuff their kids can get caught up with when out of their direct care. Does an 8 year-old have the knowledge or will to make an informed decision when he's offered drugs, or cheap inhalants (far worse than drugs), or sexual activity? It's the same battle for kid's minds we're talking about here, and parents see the tide going in the wrong direction (cruder accepted public behavior), and it ticks 'em off.

...What the L does seeing a breast lead up to? Having sex? Becoming a pervert? Remaining heterosexual? I can think of worse destinies in life...

Here's the issue Dusty... it's not the issue of the nudity so much, but the assault-type behavior (ripping a chick's bra off) that reinforces the attitude that it's OK to do that to chicks. The fact that lots of young kids saw that, and kids tend to act out this sort of thing, means you're going to see cruder behavior among kids (who don't know better). And it's even confusing to kids whose parents are saying something else. Tell me, would it be OK if they showed hard-core sexual acts there? How about bestiality? Where do you draw the line? That's the issue here (the line)... and the fact that parents want to make that decision, not outside forces. Is it OK to make crack addicts appear as if they're cool to kids... or show people shooting pets as sick "fun", or other such fare that requires an adult's fully formed conscience to fully understand. It's a public show in primetime and that should require a different standard than other venues... that's all.

...anyway, it was frickin' great game!!!