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  1. #1
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    Question SACD and DVD-A dead, but K2HD is HERE!!!?!!?!?

    Is this old news? Well here goes,

    There is this new format called K2HD that was briefly talked about below the LP CC article, BrandonH had posted. http://stereomojo.com/index.htm

    According to Victor Japan site, it is capable to producing sound up to 100khz at 24/192 ib a regular CD player. Apprentely with this newest technology called K2HD, Vicotr was able to cramp in 24/192 worth of info/data into a regualr CD.

    There are K2HD already being sold in Japan. Here is the link:

    http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/k2hd/disco.html#top

    Could this be the next format that will exceed everything that is availble today? I wasnt able to get much more info from the site.

    I will call my fam in Japan tonight and see if I can get a couple of K2HD. Hope to report back soon.


    JRA

  2. #2
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    I guess the "HD" is new

    Quote Originally Posted by jrhymeammo
    Is this old news? Well here goes,

    There is this new format called K2HD that was briefly talked about below the LP CC article, BrandonH had posted. http://stereomojo.com/index.htm

    According to Victor Japan site, it is capable to producing sound up to 100khz at 24/192 ib a regular CD player. Apprentely with this newest technology called K2HD, Vicotr was able to cramp in 24/192 worth of info/data into a regualr CD.

    There are K2HD already being sold in Japan. Here is the link:

    http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/k2hd/disco.html#top

    Could this be the next format that will exceed everything that is availble today? I wasnt able to get much more info from the site.

    I will call my fam in Japan tonight and see if I can get a couple of K2HD. Hope to report back soon.


    JRA
    Thanks for this world-rocking new, JRA.

    "K2 Super Coding", which is related to "XRCD" (eXtended Resolution CD), has been around since 1995. It was from JVC too and persumably the "HD" version is mostly an evolutionary advancement.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extende...n_Compact_Disc

    I have a few jazz K2's, and to me they sound good but not better (or even as good), as the SACDs or HDCDs that I own. Do we need another hi-rez format? If people cared they'd buy SACD or DVD-A (which are also multi-channel): why should buy K2HD in preference? What is most absurd is that K2HD prices are likely to run higher than these proven hi-rez media. It looks like this is just another proprietary scheme to skim more money from suckers -- of course there's definitely nothing new about that.

    On the other hand, they might do OK in Japan. There's a place where the domestic market seems to suck up a bizzare range of pricey products that can't be sold elsewhere in the world.

  3. #3
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    Do we need another format? I say yes, as long as it's not gonna further decrease SACD availability... that is not going to happen as we all know, unless something happens. Would CD still be the "standard" tangible media format, 10 years from now? I imagine it's gonna be some sort of streaming media thru subscription over some tri-optically wireless entertainment system made by Bose.

    One of the thing that I'm confused about is that how can a CDP with less than 192/24 DAC gonna be able to benefit from this format? Whatever the case, I'm gonna find out for myself.

    JRA

  4. #4
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Yeah, me too

    Quote Originally Posted by jrhymeammo
    Do we need another format? I say yes, as long as it's not gonna further decrease SACD availability... that is not going to happen as we all know, unless something happens. Would CD still be the "standard" tangible media format, 10 years from now? I imagine it's gonna be some sort of streaming media thru subscription over some tri-optically wireless entertainment system made by Bose.

    One of the thing that I'm confused about is that how can a CDP with less than 192/24 DAC gonna be able to benefit from this format? Whatever the case, I'm gonna find out for myself.

    JRA
    That is, I'm confused about how you get 24/192 sound from 16/44.1. I think JVC might deliver a better way of producing standard CD, but I gather there are a good may techniques for do that. JVC has just hyped-up their method to "justify" higher prices. One clue is that no special equipment is need to play these CDs, unlike HDCD where you need a special decoder.

    Will K2HD reduce SACD sales? My guess is yes, to some extend. Format competition always reduces overall acceptance of all the competing formats. A huge impediment to SACD's success has been the vinyl LP which continues to be the quasi-irrational obsession of so many audiophiles -- but at least many of those 'philes began large LP collections.

    Would I buy K2HD? Certainly, if it was the music I wanted and priced no higher than SACD for the same content.

  5. #5
    PDN
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    Just my opinion but I wouldn't place faith in any new CD format considering the way these others have gone (HDCD, DVD-A, SACD), etc. I have two CD players that both can play HDCD format. Do you know how many HDCD's I have? Two. You can hardly find any out there both on-line and retail. What a joke. Standard CD format will be around for a long time to come. Look at LP's. Folks thought they were history and now look. There's a renewed interest in them with many brands of high end turntables being manufactured. Sorry to sound this way but this seems to be what's happening. What I would like to see is many more of the older albums on CD say from the 60's & 70's digitally remastered to 24bit technology adding more bass and greatly improving the sound quality from when they were originally recorded in the studio. Take many of the early Beatles CD's. Their sound is awful, tinny if you know what I mean. Well, that's my 2 cents anyway for what it's worth.

  6. #6
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    I agree, PDN

    Quote Originally Posted by PDN
    Just my opinion but I wouldn't place faith in any new CD format considering the way these others have gone (HDCD, DVD-A, SACD), etc. I have two CD players that both can play HDCD format. Do you know how many HDCD's I have? Two. ... What I would like to see is many more of the older albums on CD say from the 60's & 70's digitally remastered to 24bit technology adding more bass and greatly improving the sound quality from when they were originally recorded in the studio. Take many of the early Beatles CD's. Their sound is awful, tinny if you know what I mean. Well, that's my 2 cents anyway for what it's worth.
    What we most need are more really well-made CDs. In general, (subject to many individual exceptions), CDs made recently are far better than those made in the '80s. What you really need, though, to make good remasters are the original recording tapes, not just some 2nd or 3rd generation master).

    Again, in general, my SACDs and HDCDs, (I have only 5-6 of the latter myself), are much better than my typical CD, but the only obvious reason is more careful recording and production, not the medium itself. Multi-channel is another matter: well recorded MC played back on a well set up system can convey a realism that 2 ch simply cannot.

  7. #7
    Forum Regular Registered Member jim goulding's Avatar
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    I gotta a couple of K2's, too . .

    one I listen to quite a bit. It's a Riverside recording of The Cannonball Adderley Quintet "Live in San Francisco" at my old haunt The Jazz Workshop. It was released on vinyl over 30 yers ago. Podna's, this is a great recording!. Of jubiliant, toe tapping jazz to boot. One thing about Cannonball, he's fun. It's vivid, vibrant, and full sounding. Very natural. The other is a recording of a big band doing Monk tunes and while it's sonics are pristine with pinpoint imaging, it's a bit dry and the balance is a little off to my tastes. But it speaks well for the medium as does the former. If the people behind K2 are saying they can take the fidelity even further, I don't think I care. Not on these two releases anyway. They're that good!

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    If something like K2 delivered the goods it would have an edge over SACD just because you could play it with your existing CD player.

    HDCD is weird, it really didn't have any marketing, nor did I see any labels on the discs to tell consumers it was a HDCD. I used to have a CD player with a LED that lit up if a HDCD was played. Many times I had one and didn't even know it until I placed it in that player. What was even more strange, there were many Country titles in HDCD. I heard a couple of the Country albums with HDCD and they sounded artificial but I think that was more due to the Pop style production that was used. The Paula Cole album is HDCD and it sounds pretty good. Whatever they use the recording has to be done right on the master to begin with.

    I'm amazed at how well some live Jazz recordings sound. They must set up correctly to begin with and then leave it alone to preserve they special presence of a live recording. I've got some Crusaders discs that aren't so great on frequency balance, sounding a bit thin, but they have that live presence that just make them fun to listen to. That, and the fact the music jams.

    Anyone having XRCD, do they label these where you can tell what it is? I'd like to get my hands on one. I remember amusicdirect.com carried them.

  9. #9
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    In my case

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    If something like K2 delivered the goods it would have an edge over SACD just because you could play it with your existing CD player.

    HDCD is weird, it really didn't have any marketing, nor did I see any labels on the discs to tell consumers it was a HDCD. I used to have a CD player with a LED that lit up if a HDCD was played. Many times I had one and didn't even know it until I placed it in that player
    ....
    Anyone having XRCD, do they label these where you can tell what it is? I'd like to get my hands on one. I remember amusicdirect.com carried them.
    All my HDCDs are on the Reference Recordings label. The label is associated with Keith Johnson who was among the developers of HDCD. All the RR samples I have are outstanding -- then again, they are outstanding even without HDCD decoding at work.

    I have several jazz albums that say, for example, "20-bit K2 Super Coding" and "This album is remastered using 20-bit A/D converter with digital K2 interface." But I don't know whether this makes them XRCDs. They sound very good but nothing really beyond a well-made standard CD.

  10. #10
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    Aftrer 2nd read of the Victor website, I'm starting think this is a mastering technique instead of a new format. I wish there was someone on this site who can read Japanese better than I can.... I dont understand audio lingo in Japanese. If K2HD transfers at 24/192 at 100k, I'm not sure what's so different from DSD process, often found on the back of TELAC RBCD. Sonny's Colossal has been rereleased more than once, and they are offering the album on K2HD.
    If this proves to be much more superior than our recent remastered recording, then I say bring it on!!

    Problem is that I'm not a big fan of Mr. Rollins. i think I'll grab a copy of ELP and a copy of some newer recording.


    JRA

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    I have one Reference title and it is probably my best sounding album. It's a Classical comp, I think it's called Brass & Organ. There's a track on there that is simply amazing played through my Krell gear. There is a Kettle drum crescendo with the Krell's strength and transcient response is unbelieveable. The first time I heard it I was so startled I had to play that part over to see if I really just heard what I thought I did.

    I'll have to look at the back of some more of my discs to see if I notice any K2 mentioned.

  12. #12
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    I have one Reference title and it is probably my best sounding album. It's a Classical comp, I think it's called Brass & Organ. There's a track on there that is simply amazing played through my Krell gear. There is a Kettle drum crescendo with the Krell's strength and transcient response is unbelieveable. The first time I heard it I was so startled I had to play that part over to see if I really just heard what I thought I did.

    I'll have to look at the back of some more of my discs to see if I notice any K2 mentioned.
    You wouldn't happen to have the SACD of CAPTAIN FANTASTIC would you?

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    You wouldn't happen to have the SACD of CAPTAIN FANTASTIC would you?


    Yes.

    bill
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  14. #14
    Suspended PeruvianSkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by musicman1999
    Yes.

    bill
    The reason that I am asking is because I wanted to know how CURTAINS sounded with your Krells. It wasn't until I went with my current 2-channel setup (instead of playing it in 5.1) that I really noticed the 'THUD' of the drums on that song. Man does it ever pack a punch! Just a brilliant mix and one of my all time favorite albums and certainly a great demo SACD.

  15. #15
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    Krells, i wish. The veil of confusion has lifted and now i understand.

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  16. #16
    Forum Regular Registered Member jim goulding's Avatar
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    Live Jazz Recordings

    Mr. Peabody- I, too, think live jazz recordings are usually very good. I think you're right about setting up the mikes. Then, it usually goes to a two track machine with very little mixing. The result is in real time. I think that's the difference. I got one for you and I think bobsticks will agree, Art Blakey and The Jazz Messengers at Keystone Korner 3. The designation 3 is very important. This version of The Messengers features Wynton and Branford Marsalis and a hellova bop pianist, Donald Brown. Go right to side two, or if you're listening by CD, that would be tract #4. Blakey's drum hits are so clean and his cymbals shimmer. You can hear the inside of the piano's box. And yet things are miked with regard for your perspective as tho you were in the audience and with regard for the position of the players on stage. The last track is the best on the album, in my veteran opinion. Clean cookin with gas! Blakey positively shines on this and he is positioned behind the front line as it should be. You mentioned The Crusaders. Have you heard "Live at The Lighthouse '88"? Good recording.that's not thin, I think you might agree. My copies are on vinyl and regular CD, respectively.

  17. #17
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    I'll have to check those 2 titles out. Thanks

  18. #18
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim goulding
    Mr. Peabody- I, too, think live jazz recordings are usually very good. I think you're right about setting up the mikes. Then, it usually goes to a two track machine with very little mixing. The result is in real time. I think that's the difference. I got one for you and I think bobsticks will agree, Art Blakey and The Jazz Messengers at Keystone Korner 3. The designation 3 is very important. This version of The Messengers features Wynton and Branford Marsalis and a hellova bop pianist, Donald Brown. Go right to side two, or if you're listening by CD, that would be tract #4. Blakey's drum hits are so clean and his cymbals shimmer. You can hear the inside of the piano's box. And yet things are miked with regard for your perspective as tho you were in the audience and with regard for the position of the players on stage. The last track is the best on the album, in my veteran opinion. Clean cookin with gas! Blakey positively shines on this and he is positioned behind the front line as it should be. You mentioned The Crusaders. Have you heard "Live at The Lighthouse '88"? Good recording.that's not thin, I think you might agree. My copies are on vinyl and regular CD, respectively.

    Absolutely cosigns...

    Search out this recording Mr. P, you won't regret it. It has also been my experience that most of the Oscar Peterson and Lionel Hampton recordings on the Telarc label are pretty solid. Both Live at the Blue Note and Encore at the Blue Note just "take you there" and are excellent DSD recordings in standard redbook format.

  19. #19
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Sounds like yet another variation on a familiar theme, namely JVC's K2 mastering process. In the end, the native data resolution that comes out of the disc remains at 44.1/16. A CD is incapable of producing bits that it does not have. The HDCD format squeezes a little bit of extra bandwidth, but that differs from JVC's K2 process because HDCD's an actual encode-decode process that requires hardware at both ends to obtain slightly higher resolution (in fact, the HDCD encoding process actually raises the noise floor for normal CD playback).

    This is not a format so much as a mastering process with a bunch of fancy trademarks attached (no different than Sony's Super Bit Mapping CD, which refers to mastering done using analog masters transferred to DSD).

    The only difference between this version of K2 and previous incarnations (marketed as XRCD and XRCD2) seems to be that the mastering is now done from a 192/24 transfer rather than 96/24. In the end, everything still gets downsampled and dithered to 44.1/16. These K2HD mastered CDs might achieve higher sound quality, but then so might any number of other steps used by other companies. (For example, some mastering engineers believe that any kind of high resolution digital downsampling is better off using whole number multipled sampling rates such as 88.2 or 176.4 kHz, rather than the 96 or 192 kHz sampling rates)

    For all of the technobabble that accompanies these "new and improved" CDs, I don't think there's any substitute for a good recording and attention to detail during the mastering process. Then again, it's hard to justify charging upwards of $30 for a merely "remastered" CD, so might as well slap that XRCD2 or K2HD label onto a CD in better hopes that someone's more willing to pay that much for a 44.1/16 CD.

    If you read this JVC press release, it seems that they are marketing K2 towards compressed file mastering, and the references to 100 db dynamic range seems to refer to the resolution used during the mastering process, not necessarily the dynamic range that ends up on a CD (not that you'll find many master sources with that kind of dynamic range to begin with).

    http://www.japancorp.net/Article.Asp?Art_ID=14009

    That Stereomojo site's claim that this sounds better than SACD is highly dubious, because I would question what they are comparing.

    Are they comparing commercially available discs? Or the SACD and K2HD-mastered disc versus an actual master feed? If they are comparing commercially available discs, then any comments cannot be generalized to the format itself, since the preparation of the K2HD-mastered CD and the SACD were done by different engineers, using different settings, and perhaps even using different master sources.

    For example, I have Classic Records' 96/24 PCM disc of Gershwin's orchestral/piano pieces performed by Slatkin and the St. Louis Symphony (excellent recording and performance BTW), and IMO it sounds inferior to the Mobile Fidelity CD version of that same recording. Does that mean that a CD's 44.1/16 resolution is inherently superior to 96/24 resolution? Of course not. All it indicates is that Mobile Fidelity uses a superior playback rig and/or employs a superior mastering process and/or their engineer did a better job at tweaking with that particular transfer (and FYI, the SACD layer on that same disc is a step above the CD layer -- a more worthwhile comparison than whatever these Stereomojo guys tried since both were mastered by the same engineer, while using the same playback rig and the same master tape).

    Basically, Stereomojo is claiming that a specific CD can sound superior to a SACD. I wouldn't argue with that. But, they seem to be making the claim that this mastering process is capable of making the CD format superior to the SACD format, which is a laughable claim given that this K2HD process does absolutely nothing to change the CD's inherent characteristics. There's no encode-decode process that makes the CD itself any different from any other "remastered" CD. The K2HD discs might sound nice, but let's not go overboard with the hype.
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  20. #20
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Woochifer again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer
    Sounds like yet another variation on a familiar theme, namely JVC's K2 mastering process. In the end, the native data resolution that comes out of the disc remains at 44.1/16. A CD is incapable of producing bits that it does not have. The HDCD format squeezes a little bit of extra bandwidth, but that differs from JVC's K2 process because HDCD's an actual encode-decode process that requires hardware at both ends to obtain slightly higher resolution (in fact, the HDCD encoding process actually raises the noise floor for normal CD playback).

    This is not a format so much as a mastering process with a bunch of fancy trademarks attached (no different than Sony's Super Bit Mapping CD, which refers to mastering done using analog masters transferred to DSD).

    The only difference between this version of K2 and previous incarnations (marketed as XRCD and XRCD2) seems to be that the mastering is now done from a 192/24 transfer rather than 96/24. In the end, everything still gets downsampled and dithered to 44.1/16. These K2HD mastered CDs might achieve higher sound quality, but then so might any number of other steps used by other companies. (For example, some mastering engineers believe that any kind of high resolution digital downsampling is better off using whole number multipled sampling rates such as 88.2 or 176.4 kHz, rather than the 96 or 192 kHz sampling rates)

    For all of the technobabble that accompanies these "new and improved" CDs, I don't think there's any substitute for a good recording and attention to detail during the mastering process. Then again, it's hard to justify charging upwards of $30 for a merely "remastered" CD, so might as well slap that XRCD2 or K2HD label onto a CD in better hopes that someone's more willing to pay that much for a 44.1/16 CD.

    If you read this JVC press release, it seems that they are marketing K2 towards compressed file mastering, and the references to 100 db dynamic range seems to refer to the resolution used during the mastering process, not necessarily the dynamic range that ends up on a CD (not that you'll find many master sources with that kind of dynamic range to begin with).

    http://www.japancorp.net/Article.Asp?Art_ID=14009

    That Stereomojo site's claim that this sounds better than SACD is highly dubious, because I would question what they are comparing.

    Are they comparing commercially available discs? Or the SACD and K2HD-mastered disc versus an actual master feed? If they are comparing commercially available discs, then any comments cannot be generalized to the format itself, since the preparation of the K2HD-mastered CD and the SACD were done by different engineers, using different settings, and perhaps even using different master sources.

    For example, I have Classic Records' 96/24 PCM disc of Gershwin's orchestral/piano pieces performed by Slatkin and the St. Louis Symphony (excellent recording and performance BTW), and IMO it sounds inferior to the Mobile Fidelity CD version of that same recording. Does that mean that a CD's 44.1/16 resolution is inherently superior to 96/24 resolution? Of course not. All it indicates is that Mobile Fidelity uses a superior playback rig and/or employs a superior mastering process and/or their engineer did a better job at tweaking with that particular transfer (and FYI, the SACD layer on that same disc is a step above the CD layer -- a more worthwhile comparison than whatever these Stereomojo guys tried since both were mastered by the same engineer, while using the same playback rig and the same master tape).

    Basically, Stereomojo is claiming that a specific CD can sound superior to a SACD. I wouldn't argue with that. But, they seem to be making the claim that this mastering process is capable of making the CD format superior to the SACD format, which is a laughable claim given that this K2HD process does absolutely nothing to change the CD's inherent characteristics. There's no encode-decode process that makes the CD itself any different from any other "remastered" CD. The K2HD discs might sound nice, but let's not go overboard with the hype.

    Not sure if anyone could've said it any better. As I thought, this is just a mastering process for a plain RBCD. Then now I wonder why it was stated that no special equipment is needed to play these K2HD... Maybe just to clear any confusion for some potiential consumers like myself.

    I got some CDs that walk all over certain SACDs. Art Blakey "Caravan" is absolutely horrible on SACD. I image that it was just a terrible recording to begin with. I'm sure some magical processing can resolve some fidelity but not sure if it';s worth the effort.


    My Fam is out on a vacation so no recommendation for K2HD at this point. But what I can, most certainely,m recommend is:

    Stella by Starlight: The Great Jazz Trio, Hank Jones.
    they should have series of this stuff, and this SACD is just perfect. Anyone who can stand Jazz and owns a SACD player should at least own one album from the series.

    JRA

  21. #21
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrhymeammo
    Not sure if anyone could've said it any better. As I thought, this is just a mastering process for a plain RBCD. Then now I wonder why it was stated that no special equipment is needed to play these K2HD... Maybe just to clear any confusion for some potiential consumers like myself.

    I got some CDs that walk all over certain SACDs. Art Blakey "Caravan" is absolutely horrible on SACD. I image that it was just a terrible recording to begin with. I'm sure some magical processing can resolve some fidelity but not sure if it';s worth the effort.


    My Fam is out on a vacation so no recommendation for K2HD at this point. But what I can, most certainely,m recommend is:

    Stella by Starlight: The Great Jazz Trio, Hank Jones.
    they should have series of this stuff, and this SACD is just perfect. Anyone who can stand Jazz and owns a SACD player should at least own one album from the series.

    JRA

    I think a lot of it boils down to the philosophy of the record company and/or mastering engineer. On my Classic Records/Mobile Fidelity example, the difference between the CD/SACD and 96/24 PCM discs very clearly illustrated those respective companies' fundamental approach to their releases.

    Classic Records is all about preserving the "vintage" sound as closely as possible. Their mastering playback rig consists of restored vintage tape players and mixers, and they use a first generation vault copy of the original LP issue as a playback reference. The ultimate goal is to replicate the sound of that original LP issue as closely as possible, even with a high res digital transfer. Their production staff is top notch (as a vinyl cutter, Bernie Grundman is as good there is in the industry), and to that end they do a great job.

    Mobile Fidelity OTOH takes a lot more artistic license to tinker with the sound. Their playback rig is highly customized with a purported analog frequency range that exceeds what DVD-A and SACD are capable of. Their goal is to produce something that subjectively sounds better than the original LP or CD issue. To that end, I think they have generally succeeded, and explains why I would prefer Mobile Fidelity's CD version over Classic's higher resolution version of the same recording.

    Fantasy/Prestige Records (which I believe is the company that issued that Art Blakey SACD) is particular about preservation. (Their tape vault in Berkeley stores the masters for some of the most treasured recordings in jazz and rock history, and the fanatical attention to detail in how that vault operates seems to indicate that they take this task very seriously) The LP and CD comparisons that I've done seem to indicate that, like Classic Records, they have a particular analog reference that they aim for. BTW, Fantasy/Prestige also uses the K2 mastering system for some limited edition releases, and they price these titles very reasonably. Concurrently, they have also licensed many of those same titles for release as XRCDs, which are NOT reasonably priced, and lead me to wonder what differences might exist between Fantasy/Prestige's regular CDs and these megapriced XRCDs, considering that both of them use that K2 mastering setup.

    Like you mention, with that Art Blakey SACD, it might simply be that no good references exist, and Fantasy/Prestige to me doesn't seem like they're into "colorizing" their recordings. Then again, you do have a live human being working the boards during these transfers. The Rudy Van Gelder remasters have made all kinds of editorial changes to classic Blue Note titles, some of which have worked, other that have not.
    Last edited by Woochifer; 09-07-2007 at 03:14 PM.
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  22. #22
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
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    Cool

    I disagree with the premise that SACD and DVD-A are "dead".
    Life support maybe, but certainly not "dead".
    Both are relatively cheap to make, and if there is just a smattering of support I beleive they may surrive, even tho both are the biggest marketing missfires in history.
    But they may yet find their audience, people who want sound without the limitations
    of the red book, but not so blinded by nostalgia that they are hypnotized by their turntables.
    As for the CD its never lived up to its potential, properly mastered it can sound quite good.
    Anybody ever heard Sheffield labs?
    I have two of their discs, and they are superb, their main deal is recording live in the studio,
    but they pay special attention to mastering. Pat Coil's STEPS, AND "THE USUAL SUSPECTS" are both really quite good.
    And Jazz is mastered more carefully because record companies know that a lot of jazz
    fans are audiophiles, and wont put up with any less than their best effort
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  23. #23
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    SACD may still be in ICU but I think we can safely call DVD-A's time of death. I still see SACD new releases but I haven't seen anything from DVD-A in quite sometime. SACD is still a nitch, it will be interesting to see if HDMI connection will give it more life.

    I have one of the Pat Coil discs. I can't remember if the name is Brian's Song or if that's just one of the songs on it. I also have James Newton Howard & Friends which is a must for any music lover. I may have a couple more.

  24. #24
    nightflier
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    The sad state of SACD...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    SACD may still be in ICU but I think we can safely call DVD-A's time of death. I still see SACD new releases but I haven't seen anything from DVD-A in quite sometime. SACD is still a nitch, it will be interesting to see if HDMI connection will give it more life.
    Not if the new high def players (BR & HD-DVD) don't support the format. It also looks like a lot of vendors are dropping players with SACD compatibility for some reason.

    That said, SACD is definitely in ICU, although I doubt if this new format will sign it's DNR papers. It will probably live on for years in a vegetative state, perhaps as long as classical music survives....

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    You wouldn't happen to have the SACD of CAPTAIN FANTASTIC would you?
    They may revoke my audiophile membership but I do not have any SACD's, nor DVD-A. When SACD first came out I couldn't tell much difference and it seemed getting a player that did both CD and SACD very well would be unlikely, most did either or. If I knew anyone with a good SACD player I'd like to do another comparison but it would have had to be good to compete with my Krell 280cd and now my Audio Note DAC. The main reason is I wouldn't want to lay the kind of money I spent on a CD player for the hand full of titles I might like. If the record companies got behind it and put some regular music it might have been more appealing

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