Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. #1
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594

    well I'm getting some new rear speakers

    After much time spent trying to figure out what two channel preamp to go with in my system and almost causing myself a headache in the process I thought that while in that search I would go ahead and take care of another need for my system which is a upgraded pair or surround speakers and after some searching I found out that Dynaudio does not make a dipole/bipole surround and the closest thing to a surround speakers they made is the audience 40 which just has a screw hole mount which is not what I wanted and would not work nor look very good in my system. I seen that Emotiva had a sale on their ERD-1 surround speaker which has adaptability for dipole or bipole and has a mounting bracket that will work much better with my system plus they are running them on sale for $289 with free shipping so I figured I would give them a shot. I will let you know how they do once they come in and I hope they work well seeing that my current surround speakers the sound dynamics cinesats which I have been running for years and are wore out. I will keep you guys posted on how they do with my system.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  2. #2
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    4,380
    Harley,

    Shame you could not work a pair of Danes into your setup using stands. I use the 42s on 36" stands in the rear corners. It may actually be a waste of speaker since they are so good but I will always have them if needed for mains in a smaller system.

    I have been interested to hear what someone will say about the Emotiva speakers. Most electronic companies don't sell speakers or the other way around. Does anyone know exactly who makes them before Emo puts their logo on them?

    Keep us posted.

  3. #3
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO, USA
    Posts
    10,176
    Indeed, it would be interesting to hear what you think of the Emo speakers. Most of their gear I have heard is very "clinical" sounding, I don't know how else to say it, maybe "emotionless". There 12" sub seems to be very good though. So the speakers have potential.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Well I picked them up instead of looking for a set of Dynaudio bookshelves because the Emo's have wall brackets and have different phase settings to allow for different placement. Since the way my room is set up the rears are right behind the listener in the room so I was thinking installing them in reverse phase bipoler like the manual suggests will make them seem like they are farther away from the listener and thus give the effect that they are sitting farther behind me. If this does not work I will just run them fulling in phase and set my delay further. I hope that they will sound good. they have two soft dome tweeters and a good looking mid driver and I have heard that they are quite the speaker for the money and with their 30 day money back thing I figured what the heck I will give them a shot since I have been needing surround speakers for some time and the search for my new preamp is still ongoing and I am still doing research and am not ready to commit just yet. I will keep you posted on how they do since I will probably receive them early next week and have them hooked up to do some break in and what not to see how I like them.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  5. #5
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    tuscaloosa
    Posts
    5,528

    Cool

    [QUOTE=Hyfi]Harley,

    Shame you could not work a pair of Danes into your setup using stands. I use the 42s on 36" stands in the rear corners. It may actually be a waste of speaker since they are so good but I will always have them if needed for mains in a smaller system.

    I have been interested to hear what someone will say about the Emotiva speakers. Most electronic companies don't sell speakers or the other way around. Does anyone know exactly who makes them before Emo puts their logo on them?

    THE CHINESE
    LG 42", integra 6.9, B&W 602s2, CC6 center, dm305rears, b&w
    sub asw2500
    Panny DVDA player
    sharp Aquos BLU player
    pronto remote, technics antique direct drive TT
    Samsung SACD/DVDA player
    emotiva upa-2 two channel amp

  6. #6
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Well I got them and are listening to a movie with my system right now and are setting the levels correctly with the other speakers in my system. So far so good they are easy as hell to install and are built quite well for their price. I am not expecting them to totally keep up with my Dynaudio's because they are at a different level but I also know that Dynaudio does not make a speaker that have the options that the emotiva's do. i will let them have some time to break in and do some movie watching and continue to see if they continue to sound good or improve even. Will let you guys know.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  7. #7
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO, USA
    Posts
    10,176
    Sounds like they are already installed but it's a shame you didn't hook them up for some 2-channel listening before assigning them to rear duty. Some actual listening would give more of an idea of what they could do, imaging, frequency response etc.

  8. #8
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Really I did not even think about it because the way they are built I would not think that they would have worked for two channel or as mains very well so just installed them as they are. But I do have some blue ray live music performance material that is very good at testing a theaters abilities at music and channel seperation and what not and actually I was surprised at how smooth these speakers are so far and while being smooth they are actually detailed. I played a passage that had a piano and to violins and 2 chelo's where each channel had a string instrument and the piano took middle stage like you where in the middle of the stage listening to the performance which is not the way I typically like to listen to music but it did allow me to hear these speakers ability at detail and smoothness and their ability to mate well with my dynaudio's on this kind of content. I also played a couple of movies today while dialing everything in and was very impressed. I played some of avatar which is a real good movie for audio and video and also played a few other movies and found that the phase switched on the back of the speakers allowed me to reverse the phase of the tweeters which in turn made them seem like the speakers were further back behind my seats than they really are which is a good thing since my rears are only able to be mounted about 2 feet behind me on the back wall and this phase switching really does help with the depth of the rear channels in my system. So far I am liking them especially for what I paid for them with free shipping and 5 year warranty.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  9. #9
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO, USA
    Posts
    10,176
    Good deal. They do seem like they were a well thought out surround speaker.

  10. #10
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    to say a bit more the cabinets are very well put together and hefty maid. The midbass drivers are good though you can tell they aren't Dynaudio quality but are good none the less and the tweeters are much better than I expected for a speaker of this price whether its a bookshelf or a surround speaker. After all the bad stuff being said about their dac as far as usability not so much sound it is nice to know that I do like their speakers so far for the money and fit the bill for my surround use perfectly and I have heard good things about their amps even though I haven't heard one for myself. And like I said they mate well with my Dyns as far as tonal quality good enough that none of the speakers show themselves in the overall sound when playing movies everything just seems to be where it is supposed to be without any tonal sore thumbs. I will just see if they get even better after some break in time so I might be watching a few more movies in the near future but that is ok since there are a lot of movies that my girlfriend is wanting to see.
    Last edited by harley .guy07; 01-05-2011 at 07:33 AM.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  11. #11
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Will I will say this, The ERD 1's have really woke up with some time on them and are really sowing their stuff now with some of the BR movies I have been renting or have bought. At first they seemed a little soft in the highs and not very dynamic compared to my Dyn's but that was before first dialing in the levels and also giving them a good workout to break them in. I played Iron man 2 the other night and also wolfman and both have a descent soundtrack in parts and these speakers really impressed me considering first the detail that they presented and the fact that with both movies I had my system absolutely cranked and they handled it like it was another leisurely walk through a park and for the price of these speakers that impressed me. And I have heard people talk about their looks being bad or unattractive,actually I like their understated looks with the aluminum plates and black surfaces, they match the rest of my system quite well. I actually have Chicken Foot on blue ray and I listened to it the other night after a few beverages and I felt like a high school kid at a rock concert, Yeah I do like 2 channel better for music and it is my main passion but when you put a live concert on blue ray on dts master audio it is a hole lot of fun to listen to it through your theater system if all the speakers are of quality and you have the power to run them, Oh yeah and don't forget the sub, my JBL driver custom built sub really cranked out the concert bass on that one and my neighbors thanked me for it the next morning "thank god they are chicken foot fans".

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  12. #12
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Update on the Emo surrounds. I have been running them for long enough now to break them in these speakers are excellent rear channel surround speakers for the money. I have played many a blue ray through my system and even the most subtle of details seem to emanate from these speakers now that I have cranked several movies from them and the have excellent imaging qualities for rear surround speakers, when something is happening right behind you in the movie they will image it right in and do a very good job of doing so. They also handle dynamics with out any problems as long as you keep in mind that these speakers were meant to be crossed over at around 80 hertz. I have not tried running them on the full range setting because I know from the specs that they are not meant to be run on full range output due to there small size and what they were designed for. I am glad I chose these as my rear speakers because they work perfectly in my room and do an excellent job with my other speakers.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  13. #13
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    6,883
    Glad you're enjoying the new setup. I think the next steps in your setup involve positioning the surrounds. This is the ITU reference 5.1 alignment. In my experience, this provides the best surround imaging with most sources.



    Looking over your equipment, I wonder why you never considered matching the Danes all the way around. At the very least, you should consider a matching center speaker for your next upgrade. Timbre matching is actually the most crucial aspect of maximizing surround performance.
    Wooch's Home Theater 2.0 (Pics)
    Panasonic VIERA TH-C50FD18 50" 1080p
    Paradigm Reference Studio 40, CC, and 20 v.2
    Adire Audio Rava (EQ: Behringer Feedback Destroyer DSP1124)
    Yamaha RX-A1030
    Dual CS5000 (Ortofon OM30 Super)
    Sony UBP-X800
    Sony Playstation 3 (MediaLink OS X Server)
    Sony ES SCD-C2000ES
    JVC HR-S3912U
    Directv HR44 and WVB
    Logitech Harmony 700
    iPhone 5s/iPad 3
    Linksys WES610



    The Neverending DVD/BD Collection

    Subwoofer Setup and Parametric EQ Results *Dead Link*

  14. #14
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Surprisingly I am quite content with the way the Emo's and the Dyns sound together. Their sound characters are a lot alike so the timbre matching thing is very good at this point. I will agree with the center channel speaker comment though and though I think my Yamaha center does a very good job I will at some point probably upgrade to a Dyn center when I get around to it and the money gets in my hands.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  15. #15
    ride a jet ski Tarheel_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    661
    Quote Originally Posted by harley .guy07
    Surprisingly I am quite content with the way the Emo's and the Dyns sound together. Their sound characters are a lot alike so the timbre matching thing is very good at this point. I will agree with the center channel speaker comment though and though I think my Yamaha center does a very good job I will at some point probably upgrade to a Dyn center when I get around to it and the money gets in my hands.
    If you really want to see what your center channel brings to the party, disconnect that speaker and set the receiver to center = none. Slightly toe-in your Danes and see if a phantom center sounds better than the Yammie.

    I ran this type of setup for over a year and really didn't miss the center unless i moved from the sweet spot. I'd lean toward the other comment that your center should have been matched before replacing surrounds...but at least you have a reason for another upgrade.

  16. #16
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    I know what you are saying and I have done that before just during setup and I do agree that a dynaudio center would improve things but my surround speakers were quite old and were in need of replacement. Some day I will probably put a Dyn center in my system but the yamaha center channel speaker is not as bad as you guys think it is. My theater system sounds good now and there are other things in my system to do first, then I will start that process of replacing the Yamaha center. But yes I have ran the Dynaudio's without the center before and it does really well that way but you have to stay in the sweet spot for it to work like it should and sometimes when watching movies unlike when I am critically listening to music that is just not possible.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  17. #17
    Forum Regular
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Home Of The Fighting Gamecocks
    Posts
    1,702
    Since there is limited signal passed to the rear surrounds I'd spend my money elsewhere.

  18. #18
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Well the main reason that I bought the new rears is that they were on sale at a great price and my rears that I was running had a midbass driver that was starting to show signs of going bad when playing blue rays that have more intense rear channel information. You are right that the rears do not carry as much information as the other speakers but when playing blue rays with the better audio formats the rears are more predominant than when DVD was the main format and I can tell a huge difference since installing the new rears. The Center channel thing is something that I will address at some point but my 2 channel setup is my main concern as I have a new preamp on the way for 2 channel listening. That is my concern for my system is music but I could not resist the price of the surround speakers and new that they were going to improve the audio performance of the theater part of my system.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  19. #19
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    6,883
    Quote Originally Posted by Poultrygeist
    Since there is limited signal passed to the rear surrounds I'd spend my money elsewhere.
    That's not always the case. Newer movie soundtracks now mix very aggressively to the surround channels, and use the surrounds to anchor the side imaging and spatial cues. You can only do that by mixing the sound information to the surrounds at nearly equal levels to the front channels.

    I would actually place the surrounds higher in importance than the center speaker, since the L/R mains can create a phantom center effect with no issues with timbre matching. With the surrounds, that surround effect requires surround speakers, and optimizing the surround effect requires timbre matched speakers. For the same reason you wouldn't want to use a different L speaker and R speaker, I wouldn't recommend going with a lower class of speaker for the surrounds.
    Wooch's Home Theater 2.0 (Pics)
    Panasonic VIERA TH-C50FD18 50" 1080p
    Paradigm Reference Studio 40, CC, and 20 v.2
    Adire Audio Rava (EQ: Behringer Feedback Destroyer DSP1124)
    Yamaha RX-A1030
    Dual CS5000 (Ortofon OM30 Super)
    Sony UBP-X800
    Sony Playstation 3 (MediaLink OS X Server)
    Sony ES SCD-C2000ES
    JVC HR-S3912U
    Directv HR44 and WVB
    Logitech Harmony 700
    iPhone 5s/iPad 3
    Linksys WES610



    The Neverending DVD/BD Collection

    Subwoofer Setup and Parametric EQ Results *Dead Link*

  20. #20
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    "That's not always the case. Newer movie soundtracks now mix very aggressively to the surround channels, and use the surrounds to anchor the side imaging and spatial cues. You can only do that by mixing the sound information to the surrounds at nearly equal levels to the front channels."

    that is a very good point and that is exactly why I made the move I did and I am happy with the way it turned out.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  21. #21
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    "That's not always the case. Newer movie soundtracks now mix very aggressively to the surround channels, and use the surrounds to anchor the side imaging and spatial cues. You can only do that by mixing the sound information to the surrounds at nearly equal levels to the front channels."

    that is a very good point and that is exactly why I made the move I did and I am happy with the way it turned out.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  22. #22
    Forum Regular pixelthis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    tuscaloosa
    Posts
    5,528

    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by harley .guy07
    "That's not always the case. Newer movie soundtracks now mix very aggressively to the surround channels, and use the surrounds to anchor the side imaging and spatial cues. You can only do that by mixing the sound information to the surrounds at nearly equal levels to the front channels."

    that is a very good point and that is exactly why I made the move I did and I am happy with the way it turned out.
    The center is the most important speaker in a surround setup.
    Your left/right (stereo) speakers are only important for stereo listening, in a HT environment they are on equal footing with the other "surrounds".
    As much as 90% percent of the sound comes from the center. I CONSTANTLY
    hear that a "phantom" center is "just as good" as a "real" center, but this is like
    listening to a stereo without a left or right speaker.
    BUT cheapskates will always try it anyway. I NEVER WILL UNDERSTAND WHY
    the speaker that produces most of the sound is considered an option.
    NOT TO MENTION THAT WITH THE NEW "LOSSLESS" codecs and full range sound all around, decent surround speakers at all points are more important than ever.
    LG 42", integra 6.9, B&W 602s2, CC6 center, dm305rears, b&w
    sub asw2500
    Panny DVDA player
    sharp Aquos BLU player
    pronto remote, technics antique direct drive TT
    Samsung SACD/DVDA player
    emotiva upa-2 two channel amp

  23. #23
    Suspended
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO, USA
    Posts
    10,176
    Pix, correct me if I'm wrong but if you listen to stereo without left and right as you mentioned I believe you have silence.

  24. #24
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Springfield, Mo
    Posts
    1,594
    Quote Originally Posted by pixelthis
    The center is the most important speaker in a surround setup.
    Your left/right (stereo) speakers are only important for stereo listening, in a HT environment they are on equal footing with the other "surrounds".
    As much as 90% percent of the sound comes from the center. I CONSTANTLY
    hear that a "phantom" center is "just as good" as a "real" center, but this is like
    listening to a stereo without a left or right speaker.
    BUT cheapskates will always try it anyway. I NEVER WILL UNDERSTAND WHY
    the speaker that produces most of the sound is considered an option.
    NOT TO MENTION THAT WITH THE NEW "LOSSLESS" codecs and full range sound all around, decent surround speakers at all points are more important than ever.
    In my opinion with the higher def formats out there with blue ray running 24 bit 96 kilo through all channels and processing being as good as it is in todays world EVERY!!! speaker is important when it comes to home theater. The center is important to keep the vocals and on screen effects at the screens position, I get that and I also understand others saying that a phantom center can work if everything is symmetrical because if your system has good imaging which mine does the center speaker information will be put through the left and right speakers equally making them anchor the sound in the center image right where the CENTER speaker would be anyway. I understand both sides and the fact is when watching movies especially in a group with not everybody in your rooms sweet spot it is better to run a center channel so everyone can get center anchored sound. That is just how it is and it is really that simple. I chose new rear speakers because the rears I was running were wearing out and with blue ray the higher def more dynamic output in the surround channels were letting me know their age so I replaced them. Yeah my center speaker is not the same brand as my mains. Yeah it was a cheaper speaker to purchase than my mains but it does do a good enough job for me for right now and it is a better speaker than you guys give it credit for. My new surround speakers give me much more dynamics and rear stage and really add to the sound of the home theater side to my system. Thats it in a nutshell. I will get a new center WHEN I AM READY and to me my 2 channel side of my system is more important to me anyway and with a new preamp coming in that is what I am concerned with right now. When the day comes that I change my center The first thing I will do is hop on here and post that I have changed it so the minds can settle and things will go back to normal.

    Marantz SR5008(HT)
    Nu Force P8 Preamp (2 channel)
    Pass Labs X150.5(2 channel)
    Adcom 545 mk2 power amp(rear channel amp)
    Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S Mains Speakers
    Dayton 8" HO custom sealed subwoofer(2 channel)
    Yamaha NS-c444 center channel
    Emotiva ERD-1 surround speakers
    JBL e250p subwoofer highly modified
    Samsung 46" LED TV
    OPPO BDP-83 blue ray/multi format player
    ps-audio NuWave dac (2 channel)
    Dell I660 music server running fidelizer windows 8 audio optimizer
    PS Audio Quintet power center



  25. #25
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    6,883
    Quote Originally Posted by harley .guy07
    In my opinion with the higher def formats out there with blue ray running 24 bit 96 kilo through all channels and processing being as good as it is in todays world EVERY!!! speaker is important when it comes to home theater. The center is important to keep the vocals and on screen effects at the screens position, I get that and I also understand others saying that a phantom center can work if everything is symmetrical because if your system has good imaging which mine does the center speaker information will be put through the left and right speakers equally making them anchor the sound in the center image right where the CENTER speaker would be anyway. I understand both sides and the fact is when watching movies especially in a group with not everybody in your rooms sweet spot it is better to run a center channel so everyone can get center anchored sound. That is just how it is and it is really that simple. I chose new rear speakers because the rears I was running were wearing out and with blue ray the higher def more dynamic output in the surround channels were letting me know their age so I replaced them. Yeah my center speaker is not the same brand as my mains. Yeah it was a cheaper speaker to purchase than my mains but it does do a good enough job for me for right now and it is a better speaker than you guys give it credit for. My new surround speakers give me much more dynamics and rear stage and really add to the sound of the home theater side to my system. Thats it in a nutshell. I will get a new center WHEN I AM READY and to me my 2 channel side of my system is more important to me anyway and with a new preamp coming in that is what I am concerned with right now. When the day comes that I change my center The first thing I will do is hop on here and post that I have changed it so the minds can settle and things will go back to normal.
    Yep, you do get it. I would actually suggest that you experiment with turning the center speaker off. The results might surprise you. Before I bought the matching center speaker for my setup, I tried a mismatched speaker in the center and found that it didmore harm than good. So, I went for a year without a center speaker until I saved up enough. The L/R mains can make up for the lack of a center speaker, but they cannot make up for the lack of surround speakers. That's why I would prioritize the surrounds.

    Going without a center speaker will definitely affect the dialog intelligibility for anyone sitting off-axis. But, if you're sitting in the sweet spot, and you got the L/R mains properly positioned, the phantom center effect (which your receiver will create at the appropriate levels) will more than suffice. And if the timbre mismatch between the center speaker and the L/R mains is big enough, switching the center speaker off would actually improve the dialog intelligibility and overall performance.

    Keep in mind that with multichannel music and concert DVD/BDs in particular, the engineers are mixing a lot less information into the center channel, because overuse of the center channel can actually detract from the spatial placement and ambient cues.

    For now, I think you'll want to just optimize what you have. That means positioning, level matching, and experimenting with the settings (center channel off, DSP settings, etc.). Oh, and while you're looking for upgrade options, you might want to try EQing the subwoofer. A parametric EQ is by far the biggest bang for the buck improvement you can make on a HT system (do a search for Behringer Feedback Destroyer, a bargain at $100, and you'll see how many of us on this forum swear by it).
    Last edited by Woochifer; 02-04-2011 at 09:07 AM.
    Wooch's Home Theater 2.0 (Pics)
    Panasonic VIERA TH-C50FD18 50" 1080p
    Paradigm Reference Studio 40, CC, and 20 v.2
    Adire Audio Rava (EQ: Behringer Feedback Destroyer DSP1124)
    Yamaha RX-A1030
    Dual CS5000 (Ortofon OM30 Super)
    Sony UBP-X800
    Sony Playstation 3 (MediaLink OS X Server)
    Sony ES SCD-C2000ES
    JVC HR-S3912U
    Directv HR44 and WVB
    Logitech Harmony 700
    iPhone 5s/iPad 3
    Linksys WES610



    The Neverending DVD/BD Collection

    Subwoofer Setup and Parametric EQ Results *Dead Link*

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •