Help with helping a friend building a sound system

[pixelthis]

pixelthis : you best choose your words before blasting at someone's comments.

not "blasting" anything, just saying YOU were blasting music off of a server

Just where in my post did I say CD/SACD is always better than the flac (and other lossless) format ?

You were guilty of ommision, you left out Flac and ape, and mentioned stuff that
isnt as good as CD


[pixelthis]

That is so funny, where do you think many flac files come from ? Media, such as CD.

Thats where I ripped my Flac files from, which is why they are just as good

A computer will have NO Playback issues ? That's hilarious. The following can cause these playback issues when files are played on a PC instead of a dedicated CD
player :

1. The PC has too many applications opened simitanously
2. The PC is low or out of disc space
3. The PC is has been infected by certain forms of virii and spyware
4. The PC has windows installed at all hahaa.
5. The PC is unstable, has key system files removed or corrupted
6. The PC is below minimim spec
7. The PC Blue Screens of Death
8. The PC /server has been set up the wrong way
9. An incorrect version of software has been installed
10. The software has been installed the wrong way

I'm assuming you have not lost your memory when I said "can" cause these
playback issues.

THESE ARENT "PLAYBACK" ISSUES, they are stupidity.
I was afraid pauses would interfere with my music, played back in FLAC off of a USB drive,
and that did happen occasionally.
Now I just make sure everything is turned off, when I listen to my music I don't do anything else.
None of the other "issues" are a problem to someone with a brain

Put a proper dedicated CD player in front of you, plug it in, switch it on and put in a normal CD. Just how many on that list of 10 apply to such a CD player?
Let's see NONE !!.

[pixelthis]

Scratches, skipping, dirt, CD "rot", how many apply to a computer?

Again... that is an argument structure coming from purely one angle only, there is a
bigger picture than "convenience".

there is no bigger issue than "convienence".
This is the most overlooked and least understood issue in home audio.
Thats because most "audiophiles" refuse to admit it, but the phrase "out of sight, out of mind " applies to music.
Sit your music on a shelf , lined up in there little jewel boxes, you will forget aabout most of it.
Most play their newer stuff, the older stuff gets forgotten.
But if its on a menu on your computer its more likely to stay in your mind, you will see it as you search through it.
A friend never organizes his stuff, while setting up his HT in his new garden home, he
walked up to me with a package wrapped in celopane, it was a stack of CD's, mostly robert cray. He had been searching for them forever.
How you organize your libary is key to how much you enjoy it.
This is why I like changers, I like to sit and listen to music not exercise by constantly getting up and changing discs.
And a well built five disc changer can sound as good as a high buck single tray unit,
like the changer from Marantz, for instance.
And putting together a playlist on a computer means a lot of uninterrupted enjoyment

How do you think music companies make money ? They release CDs, DVDs, then rerelease more versions, heck even Elvis is releasing another greatest hits CD as I
write this post. Despite the folks who believe cd stores will close down because it
will be all taken over by flac servers, i-tune stores etc, fail to realise just how many
people DO NOT own a Pc, and many will never do so. On the contrary there are still
many vinyl users out there who are loyal to it.
Does one believe that Sony, BMG, and all of the other major music companies are
going to simply close shop because everything's going to go on Windows Servers ?
Right, who's going to pay for all the musicians to perform their music ? Yeah I'm sure
you will pay their music contracts.
I walk into Cd stores once a week and noticed that there's literally 1000's of people lining
up to buy a CD, DVD, or other form of music/game in some packaging. Hmmm no
doesn't look like CD is very dead to me. Didn't look more dead this year than last year.

You dont need a computer anymore.
In Japan the PC is becoming passe, the Japanese are using Ipods, PDA'S, cellfones,
and other type devices to surf the web, download files, and text and email.
They use USB drives to store things

iTunes and similar companies that store music for the consumer to pay per song(let's say for legitimate purposes), will only continue to do so as long as they make
increasing profits every year. For that to happen CD, DVD sales will have to keep
going down

.

keep going down, which means they are going down.
A CD was a pretty big deal when it came out, and it was a music playback system,
then the CD rom app began, 650 mb was hugh, held all of the software on my first computer.
Now, its a joke. 650 mb aint squat in a 30, 60, 80 gig Ipod world.
I have a 30 gig player that has my entire collection for play in the car, or on the go
Its the size of a pack of smokes

Should CD retail shops all over the world to close down the following must happen :

1. All music companies will have to cease contracts to produce music onto CD, and
stick the on "flac" servers instead.

2. All audio component companies must cease their R&D and stop making CD/SACD,
DVD-Audio, and Universal Disc players.

3. All music companies must no longer be able to justify their 1c per CD cost for their
1500% profits. Hmmm yeah this 1c really is far too expensive.

4. The markup for music on flac servers (or other lossless format servers), is more likely
to be lower than 1500% so many music artists in the world (as little as they get paid
already, may have to keep their day jobs flipping burgets).

5. 90% of the people who can afford to buy CDs, must stop buying CDs forever.
That is like asking 90% of the world to stop buying chocolate.

The only thing "required" is that people stop buying CD'S, which they are doing in wholesale numbers.
In the last few years we have had a half dozen record shops close down in town, and this is a college town.
And the others are on life support.
Open your eyes and take a look at the "real" world.
As for the "markup ON SERVERS , what do you think the "markup" on a CD is?
THEY COST 2.00 TO MAKE, thatss right, 2.00
thats for marketing, pressing, artists, the gas to send em out on the truck.
And the industry is having a hissy fit because walmart "only" wants to charge eight bucks,
a markup of 400%.
And dont forget that a lot of stuff is on that CD you bought that you dont want, you just wanted a few songs, so the actual price of those two songs or so is probably a lot larger
than downloading.
WHICH IS WHY DOWNLOADING IS TAKING OFF, AND cd SALES ARE TANKING

Maybe in your world everyone will own a PC, sit in front of monitor, and listen to flac files one day. Yeah I'm sure someone will give all third world people in the world a PC,
and monitor, or a flac file player, and over 90% of people can be persuaded that there is
no appeal of reading a CD booklet, taking a look at what the artist looks like, reading the
lyrics, when all that they will have from now on is their iPod-ish flac player.

And these third world types have CD players?

Arguments such as yours come from the same type of people from CD owners back in 1982 who said that LP's will be dead.

I was one of those people, and I was RIGHT.
The only records today are specialty issues and they cost a fortune, and the "analog"
sound from these "records " usually comes from digital masters

I do not disagree that Flac on servers etc won't do well in the music market, and improve on their popularity, but to take over and own CDs ? PLEASE !!!

More likely some form of WMA lossless, or Apple lossless
PEOPLE ARE LIKE DINOSAURS, THEY NEVER NOTICE THE ASTEROID HAS HIT.
For CD, its here, its just a matter of time.
And I HATE IT, I love CD

2004, worldwide sales of CD audio, CD-ROM, and CD-R reached about 30 billion discs. 2007, 200 billion CDs had been sold worldwide.

TELL THAT to former makers of CRT television sets, ask them if they thought in 2002
that a 32" crt TV be scarce as hens teeth in 2008.
In 2006 I PRICED A 32IN VIZIO FOR A GRAND AT sams club, sitting alonside it was a 32in sdtv from somy, and a 30" widescreen from phillips, and several others.
How many are there today, two years later?

I believe your "some would say" CD days are numbered, will need to remember to take their medication

.

We'll be in line behind record company owners

Sorry YOU LOSE Mr Flac.

You sound like the Germans at the end of WWII, you lose allies!
And then they blowed their brains out.
YOU LOSE, as does anubody who underestimates the change that can happen in a market overnight

[GMichael]

We may have strayed a little off topic. But then again, the OP doesn't seem to be around anymore.

[OzzieAudiophile]

[pixelthis]

not "blasting" anything, just saying YOU were blasting music off of a server

Blasting a technology/method is not quite the same as blasting someone personally.
Not a good point if you have to sidestep what you're trying to argue.

[pixelthis]

You were guilty of ommision, you left out Flac and ape, and mentioned stuff that
isnt as good as CD

My orginal point was not intended to list every format that has been out, and will be
out, it would of taken days to write.

Your normal normal method of operation is to look for absolutely anything that anyone
has missed in any post and have a go is it ? Rather than provide actual constructive
criticism ?

[pixelthis]

THESE ARENT "PLAYBACK" ISSUES, they are stupidity.

Of course the original points affect "Playback", stupid or not, people are still most
capable of doing the above, no matter how much their love to store their precious
flac (or any other music) files onto their PC.

So what ? Scratch on CD ? you can rule that as stupidity. Many CD players are
still capable of playing CDs that have scratches on them. As if the CD players will
cheese-grate CDs. It's not even surface scratches which cause CD players to skip,
more than the dirt/grime on the disc. However it doesn't occur to some people to
keep their discs clean. It even states in some CD player manuals to advise the
owner to keep their discs clean, with even instructions on how to wipe them.

Troubleshooting sections raise some checkpoints to handle stupidity issues.

I.e. No power on CD player.

1. Check that you have plugged in the player.
2. Check that you have pressed the power button on the front panel to the on position.

Anyone who's at least half knowledgable with Windows know that Microsoft's largest
group of software testers are "the end consumer". That's what patches and service
packs are for. The help file is althrough improving, but many errors give the
user the option to "send to Microsoft", which is as helpful as putting a bush fire out with
a can of petrol.

Just how is a Blue Screen of Death - Stupidity ? Just how in the world are you supposed
to avoid every possible type of Blue Screen of Death occurance ? Your point is based
that software and hardware on a PC will NEVER break down, or become damaged.

blackraven raised a good point - Hard drive failure, as much care you can take, when
those go, you risk losing much more, than some lousy scratches on 1 CD, where
only the songs on that CD are affected instead of the rest of your music collection.

Kodak have released archival CDs and DVDs that claim files copied on there will
last 300 years for CD, 100 for DVD. Certainly 99% longer than some other dodgy
brands. There are also many other formats and alturnatives to hard drive, many that
are more stable than hard drives.


[pixelthis]

I was afraid pauses would interfere with my music, played back in FLAC off of a USB drive,
and that did happen occasionally.

You will get plenty of causes for pauses of reading music off PCs and/or streaming
files off the net, or networked PC/Server. Pretty much some of those cause are
the ones I listed above.

Played FLAC off a USB drive, haha, USB. I'll leave that to you to figure it out for yourself
how to fix that. And NO not by necessarily changing to CD instead.

[pixelthis]

None of the other "issues" are a problem to someone with a brain

And taking at least reasonable care of your CDs, DVDs, anything on disc does NOT
apply to someone with a brain ?

There's many ways to mistreat, and not take care to store discs in their cases etc.
For many people who have a large CD collection, most would take at least some
reasonable care of their discs because they value the time/money they spent buying them
Should they encounter a disc which is unplayable on their player, that's 1 in 100, or 1000.
Even then, that doesn't mean that disc cannot play on another player.

There are even disc scratch repairers and cleaners.

Your argument is justifying that disc players should be robust enough to play a
disc regardless on how the discs themselves are mistreated by the user, that
the problem will always be the player, never the user.

That is the same as saying you should still be able to start your car and drive
down to the shop regardless on how poor condition you've kept the engine.

Whilst at the same time any flac setup will be more reliable and stable, and that
if it doesn't work, it's "stupidity".

No matter how good you claim your flac files are, or any other file you can rip off
a disc, no matter how technology progresses, there element of "stupidity" will always
be there. You can always count of computer illiterate people who make "stupidity"
mistakes than a CD player skip a section of 1 disc due to a bad scratches, and
dirt.

[pixelthis]

Scratches, skipping, dirt, CD "rot",

So you actually expect every CD player to actually play a totally "rotted" CD ?

That's the same expectation from people whinge to their mechanic as to why
their car has broken down. Then it is found that they never changed their oil and
filter.

[pixelthis]

there is no bigger issue than "convienence".

Sorry, you cannot speak for everyone on this planet. Not everyone is going to throw
away their precious CD, DVD, Vinyl, cassette collections just to buy an iPodish
flac player. Go ahead, to your backyard start a fire and throw your disc collections in.

[pixelthis]

Most play their newer stuff, the older stuff gets forgotten.

You obviously never met a vinyl enthusiast. Try to convince them that their vinyl is
worthless, here's a flac drive, use this, they'll send their dogs on you to rip that
precious little flac drive to pieces.

[pixelthis]

This is the most overlooked and least understood issue in home audio.

There will always be overlooked and least understood issues in home audio, regardless
on what the issue is.

Not everyone will be totally aware of every issue, technology in home audio.
I'm sure a large proportion of home audio people find that their priority is mainly
listening pleasure.

How that is achieved due to equipment is one thing, as long as they have their
means to listen to their music, where it sits on the shelf, or what sector in their
PC, doesn't matter to them.

[pixelthis]

This is why I like changers, I like to sit and listen to music not exercise by constantly getting up and changing discs.

With the increasing proportion of overweight and obese people in the world, it would
do them a favour if they got up and changed discs haha.

[pixelthis]

And a well built five disc changer can sound as good as a high buck single tray unit

CAN ? sometimes. Always ? definately not. Most of the highest quality CD players
are single disc players as opposed to disc changers. Research the build on the top
end models you will notice they are heavier, better quality circuitary, and more circuitary
is used due to the more space available in the unit, which is not taken up by the rest
of the tray.

When was the last time you actually saw a 400+1 CD changer listed as the "best
quality" CD playing in a year ? You probably better just keep on searching.

[pixelthis]

You dont need a computer anymore.
In Japan the PC is becoming passe, the Japanese are using Ipods, PDA'S, cellfones,
and other type devices to surf the web, download files, and text and email.
They use USB drives to store things

Dude where on earth do you think "how" those files get transfered to all those USB keys
and drives ? TELEPATHY ??? No force of will !! that's it, no wait, you can buy a
USB drive that already has your entire music collection on the shelf.

PDAs, iPods, cellFONES all come with an installation CD, hmm I wonder what those
are for, I'll play them on my CD player, because I expect my CD player to play Windows
CD ROMs as well, and if it can't then CD players are crap, I'll cut into pieces so I can
squeeze them into my flac player slot.

You actually need a means to transfer the music onto the blank usb drive/key, or
phone in the first place.

One needs software to be installed on a "PC", to "transfer" their files onto their USB
drive, or phone. Yes you could just dial up your phone company and pay for each
song, I'm sure that is the cheapest option to get music onto your phone.

Oh that's it, nooo that's not necessary, I can do that via e-mail. Let's see do I need a PC
for that ? Nooo I'll e-mail without using a PC, and even if I was able to do that, I'd have the
expectation that the rest of the world can use the same method also.

[pixelthis]

keep going down, which means they are going down.

Nope, you've missed quoted what I said.

30 GB, 60 GB etc, will be nothing in 10 years time. 1 TB will be nothing in 20.

Good chance that space on a disc will be irrelavant in 20 years time, when there
are technologies beyond drives.

Watch Red vs Blue there's an episode on technology, they pretty much have
addressed that topic well.

[pixelthis]

In the last few years we have had a half dozen record shops close down in town,
and this is a college town. And the others are on life support.

Just because your town is having cd shops close down doesn't dictate the
music world economy.

There's a good reason why some close down, and that is competition. The larger
shops attract customers to theirs because they can sell it cheaper. At the end
of the day customers like to pay less, it goes the same with supermarkets.
The larger market chains also have the power and money to bully the smaller shops
into closing down using legal/scare tactics.

You also forget the tens of 1000's of websites where you can buy CDs/DVDs, etc
online. Many of them make good profits and sales. There are less overheads, so they
can afford to offer discounts.

[pixelthis]

Open your eyes and take a look at the "real" world.

No it's your eyes that are shut, and praying that your little precious USB drives and
flac players take over the world, and that CD dies tomorrow, don't hold your breath.

[pixelthis]

And the industry is having a hissy fit because walmart "only" wants to charge eight bucks,
a markup of 400%.

Shops can charge whatever they want. Same as supermarkets for groceries. Some
shops will undercharge their items to bring in more customers, which is taking away
businesses from smaller shops, which can be a contributing factor to why they
are closing down (including your area).

Yes downloads are increasing, but a lot of music is downloaded "illegally".

[pixelthis]

I was one of those people, and I was RIGHT.
The only records today are specialty issues and they cost a fortune, and the "analog"
sound from these "records " usually comes from digital masters

Dead depends on your definition, companies will still produce vinyl, because there are
just too many vinyl owners. YOUNG as well as old. Many Dj's use vinyl, and they
are not baby boomers.

Much music come from digital masters, regardless on what format you are finally
listening to, whether it is vinyl, CD, or flac. The fact that CD is transfered from a
digital Master, you convert your music from CD to flac, so in essence, it's a copy of a
copy.

[pixelthis]

For CD, its here, its just a matter of time. And I HATE IT, I love CD

It is more likely that every one of the audio review members will be dead way before
the world stops making CDs.

I love CDs also, I also have music on hard drives, I like both. I'd rather have both, if there
is a problem with one, I have the other.

The asteroid will hit with many things eventually. With CD however people are just
not going to throw away their players, and CD collections, they spent way too much
money for it. If you believe it is not worth having a CD collection because it's so much
more "convenient" having a flac server/player, then you might as well throw away
your flac servers/players because there are companies working right now to supercede
that technology.

The rate of technology increases, rise every year. We're all becoming dinosaurs sooner
than we wish, I'd rather spend the remaining time I have on here enjoying listening to
music, than worrying about when a certain technology is going to be replaced.

Availability of CRT, smaller sized LCD, plasma etc, depends on the locale.
Shops, websites have stock depending on what they can get, what they believe will
get sales, at the time. In my area you can still get crt, and plasma. Many whingers
on here argue that there's no point buying it because it's dead. Actually
much LCT are more expensive than plasma of the same size, and crt tvs are even
cheaper. People buy small crt, or disconintued products, because it's all that they
can afford. Not everyone has the luxury to buy the latest and biggest.

With the way the economy is going, and how greater job we know the government
is at "fixing" the economy, there will always be a good proportion of people who
cannot afford to buy the latest technology all of the time, so there will always be
a low-end market.

In addition since you've been around the block a few times, if you owned a crt
tv in the past you would know it lasted a lot longer than the newer screens now.
Just like a new car, there are more electronic parts, more things can go wrong.
However the sad part about these tv screen making companies is that they can
make their product a lot better, with better parts, and make their screens last
longer. They choose not to do that because they want to make money. They'd
see no sense in building tvs that would last 20 years. If they really wanted to do
that, they'd have to charge a ridicious price to the consumer, which the majority
just won't pay.

[pixelthis]

YOU LOSE, as does anubody who underestimates the change that can happen in a market overnight

A change to stop making CDs, overnight, and for shops to stop selling them ?
OVERNIGHT ? No, no one is going to believe that.

There's no one sole company that decides the fate of the CD format, because there are too
many companies.

[pixelthis]

[QUOTE=OzzieAudiophile][pixelthis]

[QUOTE]Blasting a technology/method is not quite the same as blasting someone personally]Not a good point if you have to sidestep what you're trying to argue.

Just stating facts

[pixelthis]

My orginal point was not intended to list every format that has been out, and will be out, it would of taken days to write.

So you just left out the lossless ones.
CUTE.

Your normal normal method of operation is to look for absolutely anything that anyone has missed in any post and have a go is it ? Rather than provide actual constructive
criticism

?

lEAVING out the advantages of something isnt "missing" something, its casting blame by ommision

[pixelthis]

Of course the original points affect "Playback", stupid or not, people are still most capable of doing the above, no matter how much their love to store their precious]flac (or any other music) files onto their PC.

I'm not

So what ? Scratch on CD ? you can rule that as stupidity. Many CD players are still capable of playing CDs that have scratches on them. As if the CD players will
cheese-grate CDs. It's not even surface scratches which cause CD players to skip,
more than the dirt/grime on the disc. However it doesn't occur to some people to
keep their discs clean. It even states in some CD player manuals to advise the
owner to keep their discs clean, with even instructions on how to wipe them.

Doesnt matter how the scratches got there.
I used to play my CD's IN A CAR, no way to avoid some scratches

Troubleshooting sections raise some checkpoints to handle stupidity issues
I.e. No power on CD player.

1. Check that you have plugged in the player.
]2. Check that you have pressed the power button on the front panel to the on position.

DUH!
When does class start on how to flush a toilet?

Anyone who's at least half knowledgable with Windows know that Microsoft's largest group of software testers are "the end consumer". That's what patches and service
packs are for. The help file is althrough improving, but many errors give the
user the option to "send to Microsoft", which is as helpful as putting a bush fire out with]a can of petrol.

Never had any trouble with my XP

Just how is a Blue Screen of Death - Stupidity ? Just how in the world are you suppose to avoid every possible type of Blue Screen of Death occurance ? Your point is based that software and hardware on a PC will NEVER break down, or become damaged.

Never had" the blue screen of death", not once.
What kind of one lung computer are you using?
AND EVERYTHING IS BACKED UP, btw

blackraven raised a good point - Hard drive failure, as much care you can take, when those go, you risk losing much more, than some lousy scratches on 1 CD, where
only the songs on that CD are affected instead of the rest of your music collection.

THATS WHY YOU BACK STUFF UP

Kodak have released archival CDs and DVDs that claim files copied on there will last 300 years for CD, 100 for DVD. Certainly 99% longer than some other dodgy
brands. There are also many other formats and alturnatives to hard drive, many that
are more stable than hard drives.

SOUNDS GREAT FOR BACKUPS
And HD is bocoming more stable every year, and files are retreivable from a crashed drive

[pixelthis]

You will get plenty of causes for pauses of reading music off PCs and/or streaming files off the net, or networked PC/Server. Pretty much some of those cause are
the ones I listed above.

NOT ANYMORE

Played FLAC off a USB drive, haha, USB. I'll leave that to you to figure it out for yourself how to fix that. And NO not by necessarily changing to CD instead

.

It was going to make space on a HD for my music files, but its working fine as a server itself.
With a 470mps of datarate it should be

[pixelthis]

And taking at least reasonable care of your CDs, DVDs, anything on disc does NOT apply to someone with a brain ?

The best way to take care of them is to burn them to HD and store them, they make great backups.
I used to record my vinyl with a NAD cassette deck, save the records for listening sessions. Same thing

There's many ways to mistreat, and not take care to store discs in their cases etc.For many people who have a large CD collection, most would take at least some
reasonable care of their discs because they value the time/money they spent buying them
Should they encounter a disc which is unplayable on their player, that's 1 in 100, or 1000.
Even then, that doesn't mean that disc cannot play on another player.
There are even disc scratch repairers and cleaners.

Good luck with those

Your argument is justifying that disc players should be robust enough to play a disc regardless on how the discs themselves are mistreated by the user, that
the problem will always be the player, never the user.

Thats not my argument at all, it doesnt matter how the scratch got there,
its still a detriment to playback.
Ever piss off a woman who knows you're into audio?
FIRST thing they go for is the CD collection.
OF course thats better than the few that tried to kill me

That is the same as saying you should still be able to start your car and drive down to the shop regardless on how poor condition you've kept the engine.

Its going to break on you no matter how good you take care of it, and it doesnt matter if its your fault, you still wont get to the store

Whilst at the same time any flac setup will be more reliable and stable, and that if it doesn't work, it's "stupidity".

YOU GOT IT ACE.
AN alien once told CAPT Kirk that he had passed a test they had given him.
"well, what about my dead crew members" ? he asked
THEY told him that "flying around in space " wasnt for sissies"
Same with home audio, and especially HOME COMPUTERS

No matter how good you claim your flac files are, or any other file you can rip off a disc, no matter how technology progresses, there element of "stupidity" will always
be there. You can always count of computer illiterate people who make "stupidity"
mistakes than a CD player skip a section of 1 disc due to a bad scratches, and
dirt

.

I HAVE BEEN AROUND THIS STUFF since before you were a stain on your dads bathroom wall.
And I HAVE SEEN PEOPLE too "stupid" to use a CD player, much less a computer.
I cant be bothered by by such, like the ape in 2001 I am just going to take my new toys and enjoy them without worrying about the great unwashed.
They will suffer the fate they always have
[pixelthis]

So you actually expect every CD player to actually play a totally "rotted" CD ?

They wont play it, doesnt matter what I "expect"

That's the same expectation from people whinge to their mechanic as to why their car has broken down. Then it is found that they never changed their oil and
filter

.

YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO CHANGE THOSE?

[pixelthis]

Sorry, you cannot speak for everyone on this planet. Not everyone is going to throw away their precious CD, DVD, Vinyl, cassette collections just to buy an iPodish
flac player. Go ahead, to your backyard start a fire and throw your disc collections in.

NO, THEY WILL PUT THEM UP AT GARAGE SALES, trying to make a few bucks.
And why burn them? They make great backups
[pixelthis]

You obviously never met a vinyl enthusiast. Try to convince them that their vinyl is worthless, here's a flac drive, use this, they'll send their dogs on you to rip that
precious little flac drive to pieces.

Guess I had better get down to the pet store, I DIDNT KNOW VINYL ENTHUSIAISTS
were required to have flac drive ripping to pieces dogs.
I have a nice vinly collection, a tad small, I lost a thousand in a flood, but do you
have pristine discs you bought new in 1974?
I thought not
[pixelthis]

There will always be overlooked and least understood issues in home audio, regardles on what the issue is.

??? I need to hook you up with a guy named sir talky

Not everyone will be totally aware of every issue, technology in home audio.[ I'm sure a large proportion of home audio people find that their priority is mainly
listening pleasure.

Those people were hunted down and killed decades ago.
Nowadays the main priority is spending thousands on crap like power cords, cables,
and tube amps that can't perform as good as a radio out of a 1934 Sears catalog

How that is achieved due to equipment is one thing, as long as they have their means to listen to their music, where it sits on the shelf, or what sector in their
PC, doesn't matter to them.

Because they misplace it and forget they own it in about a week
[pixelthis]

With the increasing proportion of overweight and obese people in the world, it would do them a favour if they got up and changed discs haha.

Now I know you're not an American
[pixelthis]

CAN ? sometimes. Always ? definately not. Most of the highest quality CD players are single disc players as opposed to disc changers. Research the build on the top
end models you will notice they are heavier, better quality circuitary, and more circuitary
is used due to the more space available in the unit, which is not taken up by the rest
of the tray.

The most expensive players are single tray units.
But their specs arent any different than a five disc changer.
At least any you could discern unless you're a German shepard.
The circutry in higher end players is quite good.
The circutry in a five disc changer not as good, but you could A/B them and not be able to tell a difference

When was the last time you actually saw a 400+1 CD changer listed as the "best quality" CD playing in a year ? You probably better just keep on searching.

Not talking about those, tho I do use a 300 disc for storage of my favorite CD's.
Works well for that


[pixelthis]

Dude where on earth do you think "how" those files get transfered to all those USB keys and drives ? TELEPATHY ??? No force of will !! that's it, no wait, you can buy a
USB drive that already has your entire music collection on the shelf.

Practically everything these days has a USB plug

PDAs, iPods, cellFONES all come with an installation CD, hmm I wonder what those are for, I'll play them on my CD player, because I expect my CD player to play Windows

You can toss em if you dont have a computer, you wont need them

You actually need a means to transfer the music onto the blank usb drive/key, orphone in the first place.

Not if you download it off of the web.

One needs software to be installed on a "PC", to "transfer" their files onto their USB drive, or phone. Yes you could just dial up your phone company and pay for each
song, I'm sure that is the cheapest option to get music onto your phone.

In Japan they access the web with their portable devices.
I CAN DO THE SAME WITH MY CELL

Oh that's it, nooo that's not necessary, I can do that via e-mail. Let's see do I need a PC for that ? Nooo I'll e-mail without using a PC, and even if I was able to do that, I'd have the
expectation that the rest of the world can use the same method also.

YOU CANT ACCESS YOUR EMAIL on your cell while walking down the street
(usually intro traffic)?
Now I know you're not an American
[pixelthis]

Nope, you've missed quoted what I said.

Got nothing, dont even understand it

30 GB, 60 GB etc, will be nothing in 10 years time. 1 TB will be nothing in 20.

And a 650 mb form factor will still be around? Thanks for proving my point.
Still use a 2.5 mb floppy? Of course not, but they were quite usefull once

Good chance that space on a disc will be irrelavant in 20 years time, when there are technologies beyond drives.

that tech is already here, just expenisve

Watch Red vs Blue there's an episode on technology, they pretty much haveaddressed that topic well.

The only "red vs blue" we have here is red (republican) vs blue(democrat)
if you're getting advice from this show, delete it from your playlist

[pixelthis]

Just because your town is having cd shops close down doesn't dictate the

music world economy.

I have NEVER seen anything like this, and its not just my town, its happening everywhere

There's a good reason why some close down, and that is competition. The larger shops attract customers to theirs because they can sell it cheaper. At the end
of the day customers like to pay less, it goes the same with supermarkets.
The larger market chains also have the power and money to bully the smaller shops
into closing down using legal/scare tactics.

COMPETITION is whats closing them down, competition from DOWNLOADS

You also forget the tens of 1000's of websites where you can buy CDs/DVDs, etc online. Many of them make good profits and sales. There are less overheads, so they
can afford to offer discounts.

AND MANY OFFER DOWNLOADS ALSO
[pixelthis]

No it's your eyes that are shut, and praying that your little precious USB drives and flac players take over the world, and that CD dies tomorrow, don't hold your breath.

I actually hope CD surrives, its a great way to buy music and you ahve a backup when you burn it to flac.
But I am not hopefull.
THE NEXT RECCESSION will be a "gut ripper", CD sales will tank completely, people will be more concerned with other luxeries , LIKE FOOD.
And downloading will take over completely
[pixelthis]

Shops can charge whatever they want. Same as supermarkets for groceries. Some shops will undercharge their items to bring in more customers, which is taking away
businesses from smaller shops, which can be a contributing factor to why they
are closing down (including your area).

Shops can only charge what people will pay, they dont teach capitalism where you live?

Yes downloads are increasing, but a lot of music is downloaded "illegally".

Which is totally irelevant to anything
[pixelthis]

Dead depends on your definition, companies will still produce vinyl, because there are just too many vinyl owners. YOUNG as well as old. Many Dj's use vinyl, and they
are not baby boomers.

As a mass market medium vinyl is dead trust me on this

Much music come from digital masters, regardless on what format you are finally listening to, whether it is vinyl, CD, or flac. The fact that CD is transfered from a
digital Master, you convert your music from CD to flac, so in essence, it's a copy of a
copy.

Which doesnt matter for digital media.
The point is that turntable worshipers love vinyl because its "analog" , which it is,
but its analog from a digital source which kinda defeats the purpose
[pixelthis]

It is more likely that every one of the audio review members will be dead way before the world stops making CDs.

they gonna have a nuclear war or something?

I love CDs also, I also have music on hard drives, I like both. I'd rather have both, if there is a problem with one, I have the other.

SAME HERE, and totally irrelevant to anything BTW

The asteroid will hit with many things eventually. With CD however people are just not going to throw away their players, and CD collections, they spent way too much
money for it. If you believe it is not worth having a CD collection because it's so much
more "convenient" having a flac server/player, then you might as well throw away
your flac servers/players because there are companies working right now to supercede
that technology.

No they wont "throw it away" they will sell it at yard sales, you're repeating yourself

The rate of technology increases, rise every year. We're all becoming dinosaurs sooner than we wish, I'd rather spend the remaining time I have on here enjoying listening to
music, than worrying about when a certain technology is going to be replaced.

Then why this rediculously long post on tech being replaced?

With the way the economy is going, and how greater job we know the government is at "fixing" the economy, there will always be a good proportion of people who
cannot afford to buy the latest technology all of the time, so there will always be
a low-end market.

LOW end market?
Crack hos', you're talkin about crack hos', right?

In addition since you've been around the block a few times, if you owned a crt tv in the past you would know it lasted a lot longer than the newer screens now.
Just like a new car, there are more electronic parts, more things can go wrong.
However the sad part about these tv screen making companies is that they can
make their product a lot better, with better parts, and make their screens last
longer. They choose not to do that because they want to make money. They'd
see no sense in building tvs that would last 20 years. If they really wanted to do
that, they'd have to charge a ridicious price to the consumer, which the majority
just won't pay.

SO I just wasted a ton of time arguing with someone who doesnt know what hes talking about, but it aint the first time.

A well designed CRT will last, if your lucky , four to ten years, if you're lucky.
A LCD has a lifespan of twenty years, and thats because of the backlight, replace
that and it will go another twenty.
Solid state is always more trouble free than tubes, there are no moving parts on a MODERN tv, they are made from glass(silicon) literally.
The munber of "parts" in electronics is of no matter, your proc on your computer has MILLIONS of transistors, none of them EVER BREAK.


[pixelthis]

A change to stop making CDs, overnight, and for shops to stop selling them ?OVERNIGHT ? No, no one is going to believe that.

no, AND YOU CANT DROP AN OFFICE BUILDING IN A FEW HOURS either.
Or have the Berlin wall come down..
When CD came out records disapeared OVERNIGHT.
When DVD came out LASER disapeared OVERNIGHT.
And when lcd got to a 600 buck price point for a 32in, CRT disapeared as a main display OVERNIGHT.
As a matter of fact most things in human affairs happen OVERNIGHT

There's no one sole company that decides the fate of the CD format, because there are too many companies.

no sole company decides ANYTHING, the market decides what is viable and whats not.
And if the market decides CD is dead, IT WILL BE DEAD.
Simple as that