RESPECT (for 249$)

[pixelthis]

Receiver owners have never gotten much respect from owners of high end
audio, save the occasional NAD, Concert , or maybe a 5,000 Denon.
And for good reason, BEST BUY is selling a Pioneer receiver , 110wx5,
for 299 BUCKS.
Thats HTIB territory.
Of course theres better, spend a grand and you can get a pretty decent receiver,
and it will do mostly what you need.
However , now you can supercharge your front two channels for 249 bucks with a two channel amp from Emotiva.
Wil you get any respect? Maybe not... BUT YOU WONT CARE.
This amp is a goodie, all you need is a receiver with a decent preamp, and a decent pair of speakers, and you're ready to go.
With most of the local hi-fi sources folding up, its been awhile since I have even auditioned
a decent amp, so the Emotiva was a pleasant surprize.
Audio nirvanah for 249$.
I LIKE STEREO BASS, (yes it does exist) and with the Emo the bass from my fronts are tight, response is fast,, and the Natilus tweeters on my B&W'S sound like Angels
singing.
Results weren't as good on four ohm Axioms, might give them another try, but A-B-ing
these monsters is difficult.
With todays production methods there is no reason for a decent two channel amp to cost
north of five hundred bucks(Adcom had one for 750$).
Will a more expensive amp sound better? thats in the ear of the beholder.
I say not enough (.00000001%) to matter.
So there is relief for those who can never seem to get the scratch together for decent gear.
There is no excuse now.
A plus is that HT rocks also, your system will sound better all around, and you will get
the best of both worlds , a decent audio system and a decent HT system.
Will you finally get some "respect"?
Again, WHO CARES?
This amp is sweet.
Cant miss. I was a scoffer when I saw this company with its cheapjack prices , but brothers and sisters, after two weeks or so of toe curling musical heaven,
I BELEIVE.
Get one of these.
NOW.

[kexodusc]

Glad it worked out. That's 3 of us that have been skeptics with this brand (Mr. P, you and myself). They certainly are raising the bar in the entry/mid-level market and giving people a viable alternative to the usual Japanese company stuff. We've seen this before with the likes of Outlaw and NAD.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

There is no such thing as stereo bass. The wavelengths at bass frequencies are wider than our heads, so it is impossible for it to create a stereo image. The information that forms a stereo image happens at 100hz and above.

[E-Stat]

There is no such thing as stereo bass. The wavelengths at bass frequencies are wider than our heads, so it is impossible for it to create a stereo image. The information that forms a stereo image happens at 100hz and above.

Others may differ with your assertion that frequencies above 100 hz are the midrange. Many consider the bass to extend three octaves (160 hz) which most certainly contains directional content. I use dual subs for that very reason.

rw

[kexodusc]

Others may differ with your assertion that frequencies above 100 hz are the midrange. Many consider the bass to extend three octaves (160 hz) which most certainly contains directional content. I use dual subs for that very reason.

rw

Very good point...Middle c on a piano is probably around 250 Hz...an octave lower than that I'd consider subjectively to be in the upper bass range, so there's some overlap there.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Others may differ with your assertion that frequencies above 100 hz are the midrange. Many consider the bass to extend three octaves (160 hz) which most certainly contains directional content. I use dual subs for that very reason.

rw

Sorry Stat, but you are not correct. First I never said anything about midrange being at 100hz, so please do add words which are not there. Secondly, it has been widely established that 100hz and below is non directional, and most musicians, acousticians and audio engineers consider frequencies above 100hz as the mid bass, not the midrange.

http://www.audioholics.com/tweaks/ge...gs-made-simple

Notice these words

Low frequency information below 120Hz is, for the most part, non-directional, meaning that even if the info is “crossing over” from a surround channel, you won’t know it.

http://www.ultimateavmag.com/howto/805bass/index1.html

Under myths and confusion are these words

Low bass is NOT directional. If I had a penny for every time someone has told me they can hear bass directionality down to 20 Hz, I would be writing this article while flying to the French Riviera in my private jet. Yes, we can hear the overtones of bass instruments above 120 Hz, and those overtones should definitely be played by the main speakers correctly located in the room for proper imaging. However, we cannot-I repeat cannot-localize bass below about 80 Hz.

http://www.axiomaudio.com/bassmanagement.html

Under crossovers and filters note these words

in other words, the non-directional parts of the bass below 100 Hz (approximately).

Under caption 80hz, you have these words

Why 80 Hz? Because deep bass below that frequency (the aforementioned energy of the bass drum) is not directional;

Since these comments recite non-directionality as betwee 80-120hz, I cut the difference to 100hz. In most rooms with modes and nodes fully excited, it is terribly difficult to hear any directionality at 120hz, even more so at 100hz, and quite impossible at 80hz.

If you crossover your subwoofer to your mains at 160hz, then you will need two subs, because you can hear directionality at that frequency. However 160hz is too high of a crossover point unless your speakers are have output deficiencies below 160hz.

[E-Stat]

Sorry Stat, but you are not correct. First I never said anything about midrange being at 100hz, so please do add words which are not there.
...acousticians and audio engineers consider frequencies above 100hz as the mid bass, not the midrange.

Exactly. Last time I checked, both the mid bass and the upper bass were part of - get this - THE BASS. Your sweeping statement: "There is no such thing as stereo bass." is therefore incorrect. Had you qualified your statement as you did in more detail here, you would get agreement. The uppermost octave of THE BASS is most certainly directional.

However 160hz is too high of a crossover point unless your speakers are have output deficiencies below 160hz.

Or, choice (B), I choose a wider range so that the subs may participate in the room correction via EQ. The last thing I want to do is butcher the sound quality by running mine full range. I've done that before and it wasn't pretty.

rw

[Luvin Da Blues]

So, what about the out of phase signals in each channel below 80Hz (100Hz). Do you perfer let them cancel each other electrically or acoustcally? I run two subs and deal with this acoustically where I have at least a little control over it.

[Feanor]

There is no such thing as stereo bass. The wavelengths at bass frequencies are wider than our heads, so it is impossible for it to create a stereo image. The information that forms a stereo image happens at 100hz and above.

The frequency I've most often heard quoted is 80 Hz.

[audio amateur]

Pix isn;t even talking about subwoofers, but his main speakers.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Pix isn;t even talking about subwoofers, but his main speakers.

Irrelevant point. The principles remain the same.

[audio amateur]

to be continued....

[blackraven]

Pix must be ROFLAO seeing how this thread is going from saying how much he is enjoying his new amp to a discussion on bass

[pixelthis]

Pix must be ROFLAO seeing how this thread is going from saying how much he is enjoying his new amp to a discussion on bass

Its a great subject for disscussion.
My beemers go down to around 48 hz, in direct mode they get a straight two channel signal, no crossover, no chickanery with "sound feilds", etc, just two channels the way god intended, thats why he gave us two ears.
Just saying that my emotiva gets the most outta my mains.
Which is a pleasant surprize, not that much of a sacrifice to go without a sub.
I HAVE A NICE ONE, but for pure audio you need tyo pass on the sub.
I thought the main mprovments would be in the mid/treble area, and they do sound greatly improved, but the bass was just such a pleasant surprize.
The ad copy about releiving the receiver of the front two channels wasnt just BS, BTW.
I had to turn down the levels on my surrounds, and a tad on my center.
Now that my receiver only handles three channels its much happier, and sounds much better.
And sure below 40hz its hard to figure out where the bass is coming from, but I am talking about 48 hz and up.
The bass is just better "defined", that would be a better way of putting it I guess.
Cant beat the price anyway.
Now for that Mitshu 60" DLP.........

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Its a great subject for disscussion.
My beemers go down to around 48 hz, in direct mode they get a straight two channel signal, no crossover, no chickanery with "sound feilds", etc, just two channels the way god intended, thats why he gave us two ears.
Just saying that my emotiva gets the most outta my mains.
Which is a pleasant surprize, not that much of a sacrifice to go without a sub.
I HAVE A NICE ONE, but for pure audio you need tyo pass on the sub.
I thought the main mprovments would be in the mid/treble area, and they do sound greatly improved, but the bass was just such a pleasant surprize.
The ad copy about releiving the receiver of the front two channels wasnt just BS, BTW.
I had to turn down the levels on my surrounds, and a tad on my center.
Now that my receiver only handles three channels its much happier, and sounds much better.
And sure below 40hz its hard to figure out where the bass is coming from, but I am talking about 48 hz and up.
The bass is just better "defined", that would be a better way of putting it I guess.
Cant beat the price anyway.
Now for that Mitshu 60" DLP.........

At 48hz and up, you are still wrong. Now change that to 120hz and up, then we can agree.

[pixelthis]

At 48hz and up, you are still wrong. Now change that to 120hz and up, then we can agree.

Sorry, but you disagreeing with me is a litmus test of weather or not I am CORRECT.
Thanks.
YOU CAN GO BY WHAT THE "EXPERTS" SAY, or what your ears say.
And everytime I use a sub its like theres a big gob of bass coming outta one place.
With direct mode I CAN TELL which speaker the bass is coming out of.
Most of the time, anyway.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Sorry, but you disagreeing with me is a litmus test of weather or not I am CORRECT.
Thanks.
YOU CAN GO BY WHAT THE "EXPERTS" SAY, or what your ears say.
And everytime I use a sub its like theres a big gob of bass coming outta one place.
With direct mode I CAN TELL which speaker the bass is coming out of.
Most of the time, anyway.

Sorry you are still wrong. Pix, while I think your are strange as hell, you are not superhuman. You can say whatever you please (and you usually do) by science says that once the wavelengths of a signal become wider than our ears, the ability to detect phase differences becomes less acute. So unless your head is 11.3 ft wide or 22.5 feet wide you cannot detect the direction of a 100 hz or 50hz signal, especially not in a ordinary room full of reflections. That is science, not what the experts say.

If you use a sub, and it sounds like a big gob of bass coming out of one place, you obviously do not know how to setup or use a sub.

[MrAcoustat]

Sorry, but you disagreeing with me is a litmus test of weather or not I am CORRECT.
Thanks.
YOU CAN GO BY WHAT THE "EXPERTS" SAY, or what your ears say.
And everytime I use a sub its like theres a big gob of bass coming outta one place.
With direct mode I CAN TELL which speaker the bass is coming out of.
Most of the time, anyway.

I agree 100% subs don't make music, they make NOISE.

[Ajani]

I forgot to mention his conclusion, that a carefully assembled "car stereo system can sound as good as the best home stereo"...

He comes to this conclusion, despite not testing Car speakers versus Home Speakers (he tested source components in that article and amplifiers in a previous one)... And not testing the "room" acoustics of a car...

[audio amateur]

I've heard some Nolas, but not the flagship Sounded very good IMO...
Those are quite some speakers you got to hear EStat, which would you say you prefered out of the bunch?

[audio amateur]

Don't be embarrassed to say it Terrence, we won't mock you

[audio amateur]

Oups... too late.

[audio amateur]

I very much doubt the bass modules (sorry to coin a term used for Bose in such a context) in those - I think we can call them - state of the art speakers need any more headroom than what a single is capable of... Clearly they are meant for perfect seperation of bass between the two channels, and help to achieve an easier flat in-room frequency response. I guess you could argue that on top of this, two can achieve more headroom; however, that is not the main argument.

[E-Stat]

I very much doubt the bass modules (sorry to coin a term used for Bose in such a context) in those - I think we can call them - state of the art speakers need any more headroom than what a single is capable of... Clearly they are meant for perfect seperation of bass between the two channels, and help to achieve an easier flat in-room frequency response. I guess you could argue that on top of this, two can achieve more headroom; however, that is not the main argument.

That's not fair using logic!

rw

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I very much doubt the bass modules (sorry to coin a term used for Bose in such a context) in those - I think we can call them - state of the art speakers need any more headroom than what a single is capable of... Clearly they are meant for perfect seperation of bass between the two channels, and help to achieve an easier flat in-room frequency response. I guess you could argue that on top of this, two can achieve more headroom; however, that is not the main argument.

Two points. Using a mono amp and discrete pathways in your pre-amp will do just fine in separating the bass between two channels, you don't need two big boxes in the room to do this.

Secondly, I single sub in a corner with EQ can acheive a flat in room response.

The only real reason to use two subwoofers is to increase the headroom of the system. If you don't need the headroom, then you can ditch the two big boxes. I have not seen any research that supports the notion that summing bass results in a degrade in performance as bass frequencies. There is no distinct advantage is keeping the bass separate between two channels, at those frequencies there is no audible difference.