My apologies for being LOST, but now I'm found.

[Kam]

WAAAY early season finale prediction:

It's a never ending loop ala what Jacob said; "It only ends once, everything else is just progress."

The Losties in the alternate timeline land at LA-X, but through fate/destiny/chance, ALL still find their way to the Island, and start all over again back at Season 1 in a neverending loop, joining both realities back together.

What's your WAAAY early prediction??

[kexodusc]

I think the Temple folk are definitely Others...just following Jacob's rules as Ben and everyone did. They might be more in tune with Jacob like Richard is or whatever, so my guess is the children were brought to the Temple for a purpose.

Now...evil Locke/Smokey wants off the Island. Could the Island, or the job of the others be to keep him on it forever so he can't open the gates to hell or escape from Hell or something along those lines? (vaguely recalling some mention of Cerberus on the Blast Shield door map back in the hatch from Season 2).

[GMichael]

I am going to smoosh Kex's and Kam's predictions together and say this. The Losties in the alternate timeline end up going back, but go way back in time and become the Temple folk. From there they run everything from behind the sceens. The last episode will be of Jack coming out to kill himself and take over his new life.

[Kam]

It does tie in with Locke teaching Walt about backgammon... a light side, and a dark side...

If Smokey wants off the island, might be along the same lines as how he killed Jacob, he can't do it himself, but has to have someone else do it for him. Maybe he has to be 'released' from the island and someone has to release him?

[ForeverAutumn]

I don't have a theory yet on what's going to happen. But whatever does happen has to happen and Jacob knows it. He goaded Ben into killing him by responding to Ben's, "What about me? with "What about you?". This led me to believe that Ben is insignificant to Jacob. Jacob knows that he is just Smokey Locke's pawn. His loophole. I think he's always known it which is why he never let Ben see him.

Ben asks Smokey Locke why Jacob didn't fight back. Jacob knows what's going to happen and that he has to die. Just like Richard told Locke that he had to die.

I'm just rambling out random thoughts now. I'll stop.

[ForeverAutumn]

My favourite line from last night:

Locke (after whooping Bram and his associates asses as Smokey) to Ben: I'm sorry that you had to see me that way.

You know, when I rewatched S5 recently, I thought it was strange that when Ben went to the Temple to be judged and he fell through the floor into Smokey's cavern, Locke went off to find a rope to help him out and conveniently reappeared right after Smokey left. His timing was perfect. Now that we know that Locke is Smokey the whole thing makes sense. Why Smokey couldn't come when Ben summoned him (he was already there in the form of Locke); how Locke knew exactly where to find Smokey; Locke's timing in coming back from getting a rope; Alex's message to Ben to follow Locke.

It's like the movie The Sixth Sense, once you see the truth, you don't know how you could have missed it in the first place.

[Kam]

i'm curious if Smokey can "hide" within Locke, because Miles didn't seem to be able to penetrate the disguise or know that the real Locke was dead.

Which means....

Were all the apparitions of the past really just Smokey? Walt included?

[kexodusc]

i'm curious if Smokey can "hide" within Locke, because Miles didn't seem to be able to penetrate the disguise or know that the real Locke was dead.

Which means....

Were all the apparitions of the past really just Smokey? Walt included?

FA's comments made me think of that scene in S2 where Locke and Smokey have the stare down...

Wow....what is going on?

How many episodes left?

[ForeverAutumn]

i'm curious if Smokey can "hide" within Locke, because Miles didn't seem to be able to penetrate the disguise or know that the real Locke was dead.

Which means....

Were all the apparitions of the past really just Smokey? Walt included?

Ooooh! You bring up an interesting point. Miles and dead Locke haven't been together yet. Maybe Locke will speak to Miles at some point. I mean, there has to be some bigger reason for Miles to be on the island than what we've seen so far.

In addition, I think that there has be certain things in place for Miles to speak to dead people. I recall two occasions where he told people, "it doesn't work like that". The first was when he was asked by a dead kid's father whether his kid knew that the the father loved him. The kid had been cremated and his ashes scattered. He told the Dad that "it didn't work that way" and Miles couldn't talk to him (although he pretended to). And then when Sawyer asked Miles what Juliet wanted to tell him, Miles responded the same way (only this time it worked (pardon the pun )).

So if the deceased doesn't want to speak to Miles, then maybe Miles can't hear them.

[ForeverAutumn]

FA's comments made me think of that scene in S2 where Locke and Smokey have the stare down...

Wow....what is going on?

Oh, oh, oh, YES! You're onto something Kex. I'm sure of it!

Locke was never scared of Smokey. Even when Smokey grabbed Locke by the leg and dragged him through the jungle, Locke was never scared...it was his destiny. And then Smokey released him. It was almost like they had an unspoken trust. I wonder if Smokey knew then that Locke was the body that he'd take over. And if Locke somehow knew that he and Smokey were kindred spirits (or something like that).

Here's another question...Remember when Danielle and her crew landed on the island and Smokey grabbed one of them and his arm tore off? Her boyfriend and the others went into the tunnel to get him. Obviously they didn't get him out because Kate found his skeleten. So, what happened when they went into the tunnel? Why didn't they come out with their friend?

[Kam]

on a side note, i still find the nuttiest thing of all, that S1-4 happenned on the island in just THREE months!!! watching the recap episode, when Ben's voice over talks about them getting rescued after 90 days... i just thought... tarnataions... that's a LONG 90 days.

[GMichael]

I know that I may have missed an episode or two, but when did it become safe to make a circle of what looked like gun powder on the floor to keep Smokey out? That one guy should have made his circle bigger. I liked how Smokey got him to move and then BAM! Gotcha.

[Kam]

Oh, oh, oh, YES! You're onto something Kex. I'm sure of it!

Locke was never scared of Smokey. Even when Smokey grabbed Locke by the leg and dragged him through the jungle, Locke was never scared...it was his destiny. And then Smokey released him. It was almost like they had an unspoken trust. I wonder if Smokey knew then that Locke was the body that he'd take over. And if Locke somehow knew that he and Smokey were kindred spirits (or something like that).

Here's another question...Remember when Danielle and her crew landed on the island and Smokey grabbed one of them and his arm tore off? Her boyfriend and the others went into the tunnel to get him. Obviously they didn't get him out because Kate found his skeleten. So, what happened when they went into the tunnel? Why didn't they come out with their friend?

i thought they did later, wasn't she on the beach when they came back and she shot them thinking they were infected?

and i forgot that Miles hasn't been on that side of things yet, so hasn't even seen Locke's body.

AND... what's been great, was that Christian was never on the plane. So... who's empty casket was it? And didn't Faraday's crazy mom say they needed an avatar for Christian with Locke's body? But Christian wasn't on the plane?

[GMichael]

Is Sayid Smokey now?

[ForeverAutumn]

i thought they did later, wasn't she on the beach when they came back and she shot them thinking they were infected?

Her other friends went into the tunnel to get the guy that had been dragged in. Then must have come back out of the tunnel again. Danielle said that the Tunnel changed them and then shot them. But when they came out of the tunnel, they must have left the armless guy behind, otherwise, why would Kate have found him still in the tunnel?

As I'm typing this I'm wondering...does anyone think that there's a possible link between Danielle and Daniel? Of all the names that the writers could have chosen...

AND... what's been great, was that Christian was never on the plane. So... who's empty casket was it? And didn't Faraday's crazy mom say they needed an avatar for Christian with Locke's body? But Christian wasn't on the plane?

I interpreted that to mean that the airline did put Christian on the plane but when they landed he wasn't there anymore. The only reasonable explanation, from the Airline's perspective, for the coffin to not be there when they landed was that it was never put there in the first place. Maybe Christian's disappearance is what caused the turbulance. Just an unfounded speculation.

But here's an interesting fact. In the series pilot when Jack comments that his drink isn't very strong, the Flight Attendant gives him two bottles of booze. He puts one in his pocket and that's what he uses to clean his wound before Kate sews him up. In last night's episode, she only gives him one bottle. Why? Because the plane doesn't crash and he doesn't need that second bottle (my interpretation, not part of the fact). Spooky.

[ForeverAutumn]

Is Sayid Smokey now?

I think that Sayid might be Jacob.

Another theory of mine is that Sayid is going to be fucked up. Remember that the Temple guy told Jack that there could be some "side effects".

And...when Richard took young shot Ben to the Temple to be cured, he warned Kate and Sawyer that it will change Ben and he will never be the same.

There also has to be some significance that the "pool isn't clear".

Something is amiss at Temple Hospital. Don't drink the dirty water.

[GMichael]

I think that Sayid might be Jacob.

Another theory of mine is that Sayid is going to be fucked up. Remember that the Temple guy told Jack that there could be some "side effects".

And...when Richard took young shot Ben to the Temple to be cured, he warned Kate and Sawyer that it will change Ben and he will never be the same.

There also has to be some significance that the "pool isn't clear".

Something is amiss at Temple Hospital. Don't drink the dirty water.

He's going to be what?!

[Kam]

I think that Sayid might be Jacob.

Another theory of mine is that Sayid is going to be fucked up. Remember that the Temple guy told Jack that there could be some "side effects".

And...when Richard took young shot Ben to the Temple to be cured, he warned Kate and Sawyer that it will change Ben and he will never be the same.

There also has to be some significance that the "pool isn't clear".

Something is amiss at Temple Hospital. Don't drink the dirty water.

ooooo... maybe since Jacob was insistent that Sayid be taken to the temple it's because he wanted to inhabit Sayid's body so Sayid/Jacob could kill Smokey? Since Ben was taken to the water/temple as a kid and ended up being the one to kill Jacob, maybe that water/rebirth thingy is part of the loophole to let Smokey/Jacob kill each other?

[Kam]

and more fodder, interview on news10:

http://www.news10.net/video/default....01/64618305001

[ForeverAutumn]

ooooo... maybe since Jacob was insistent that Sayid be taken to the temple it's because he wanted to inhabit Sayid's body so Sayid/Jacob could kill Smokey? Since Ben was taken to the water/temple as a kid and ended up being the one to kill Jacob, maybe that water/rebirth thingy is part of the loophole to let Smokey/Jacob kill each other?

I have to rewatch the scenes that take place by the Temple Pool. It seems to me that when Sayid woke up, the water was clear. But I was so overloaded by then that I couldn't take it all in. If I'm right, maybe the dirt (blood?) that was in the water was Jacob's blood and it went into Sayid.

Can anyone confirm if I'm right and the pool was clear after Sayid was out of it?

[Kam]

I have to rewatch the scenes that take place by the Temple Pool. It seems to me that when Sayid woke up, the water was clear. But I was so overloaded by then that I couldn't take it all in. If I'm right, maybe the dirt (blood?) that was in the water was Jacob's blood and it went into Sayid.

Can anyone confirm if I'm right and the pool was clear after Sayid was out of it?

ok so i wanna take credit for this one, but i hadn't noticed it, read it on my searches on the interwebs but here's a theory....

Smokey takes the form of the person, but Jacob can actually take over the person's body. So if it was Christian's body that was lost on the island, then that was Jacob who took over his actual body. But the others, were just forms of the person ala Smokey-Locke vs. dead body Locke.

And also, Sayid being carried out of the pool was in a 'crucific/Christ' pose... rebirth... etc etc.

[ForeverAutumn]

And also, Sayid being carried out of the pool was in a 'crucific/Christ' pose... rebirth... etc etc.

I actually noticed that. The Temple People lift him out and carry him on his back, feet first and he has his arms straight out to either side. It looked like they were carrying Christ on the crucifix. But I didn't connect it to Jacob at the time.

[ForeverAutumn]

So if it was Christian's body that was lost on the island, then that was Jacob who took over his actual body. But the others, were just forms of the person ala Smokey-Locke vs. dead body Locke.

I was discussing this with a co-worker at lunch and we thought the opposite was true. Christian was actually posessed by Smokey.

When Ilana, Bram, et al reach Jacob's cabin, the ring of ashes has been disturbed. Ilana goes into the cabin and finds the map that Jacob left with his whereabouts. It is very old. She comes out and says that he's been gone for a long time.

So, we think that when Ben and Locke first went to the cabin and things started flying at Ben that it was Smokey throwing things. It doesn't seem like a very Jacob thing to do. Then when Locke goes into the cabin, he sees someone who says "help me". Then later, Smokey inhabits Locke's body and Locke does (involuntarily) end up helping him kill Jacob. Smokey also wants help getting off the island. Perhaps the only way he can do that is to inhabit another body.

What apparitions have we seen and who saw them?

Claire, Jack and Locke saw Christian. Who saw Walt and under what circumstances. Walt was still alive. I'm trying to figure out if the Walt apparitions could also have been Smokey or does it make more sense for them to have been Jacob?

[Kam]

Apparatitions/Body Doubles/Ghosts/Avatars

Locke - Smokey/Locke
Walt (still alive, seen by Shannon)
Charlie (seen by Hugo)
Boone (seen by Locke, or was that while Boone was alive, Locke saw him dead?)
Christian (seen by Locke, Jack, Claire)
Yemmi (seen by Ecko)
Libby (i thought she was seen as an apparition, but i may be wrong)

[ForeverAutumn]

I have to rewatch the scenes that take place by the Temple Pool. It seems to me that when Sayid woke up, the water was clear.

I was mistaken. They don't even show the water when Sayid wakes up.

But that would have been cool!