Marantz SA8003 Initial Impressions

[MarkMark]

tony340:

If you have an email address for your Marantz dealer, I would be interested. Thx.


Others praising the Benchmark DAC1:

I borrowed a DAC1 and listened to it in my system. It was fantastic. I compared it to an old NAD 5000 cd player (I believe the NAD was a steophile recommended budget player back in its day). Improved bass performance was the most immediately noticed upgrade but everything was more detailed. I'm now afraid to buy anythng less than the DAC1.

[Mr Peabody]

MarkMark, good move, listening for yourself, now you know and you are the wiser for it.

Unfortunately, now your ears have heard, they will take control, you will be at their mercy.....

[IowaCityDiehard]

Greetings. Brand new forum member here. I read this thread and there are some excellent reviews and opinions regarding the SA8003, as well as comparisons to the 8001.

As you can see below, my CD source is the weakest link in my system, and I've had the 8001 on my wish list for a while. Now the 8003/8001 decision, which just got harder after reading all of this!

What I need to do is get an 8003 (and an 8001) for a weekend demo from my local dealer. Many will poke fun at my SACD/DVD combo player, and probably justifiably so, but I have to tell you that my system sounds downright incredible, which is why I haven't upgraded the source player yet. I definitely want to hear one of the better Marantz dedicated SACD players to hear the difference!

A couple of notes:

1. I don't own a single SACD, so CD playback is my main concern at the moment.
2. The USB input of the 8003 isn't a big deal to me.
3. I wonder what an external DAC would do for my DV6400, or would that be worth it?

Thanks!!!

[Mr Peabody]

An upgraded DAC would be fine. You still wouldn't be able to listen to SACD though if that was important to you. At this point I'd probably blow off SACD and just wait for whatever the next music format might be. It's still chugging along though, in it's nitch.

[Ajani]

Greetings. Brand new forum member here. I read this thread and there are some excellent reviews and opinions regarding the SA8003, as well as comparisons to the 8001.

As you can see below, my CD source is the weakest link in my system, and I've had the 8001 on my wish list for a while. Now the 8003/8001 decision, which just got harder after reading all of this!

What I need to do is get an 8003 (and an 8001) for a weekend demo from my local dealer. Many will poke fun at my SACD/DVD combo player, and probably justifiably so, but I have to tell you that my system sounds downright incredible, which is why I haven't upgraded the source player yet. I definitely want to hear one of the better Marantz dedicated SACD players to hear the difference!

A couple of notes:

1. I don't own a single SACD, so CD playback is my main concern at the moment.
2. The USB input of the 8003 isn't a big deal to me.
3. I wonder what an external DAC would do for my DV6400, or would that be worth it?

Thanks!!!

In the price range of the 8003 you have a lot of options:

The 8003 or 8001 are ideal if you want to play just CDs, SACDS or both... Note: I'm not sold on the USB input on the 8003, since it is designed to access music stored directly on a flash/hard-drive, rather than being controlled by a computer... though in theory that's a good thing, it comes down to how good the interface on 8003 is for accessing that music conveniently...

If you are thinking of eventually using a music server (whether computer based or standalone) or have a couple of digital sources you want to improve, then a DAC such as the PS Audio Digital Link iii or the Benchmark DAC 1 would be a great choice... Between those 2, the PS Audio has USB while the Benchmark has a built in headphone amp and variable audio out... (if you are willing to spend another $300, then you can get USB on the Benchmark)...

All of those options would give you good sound, so it really just comes down to what features you are most interested in.....

[IowaCityDiehard]

Mr. P and Ajani,

Thank you very much for your excellent advice.

I'm thinking that an outboard DAC might be what I enjoy the most, for the following reasons:

1. I don't really have any interest in SACD at this time... I have too many great CDs to listen to!

2. I don't have any intention of ever using a music server (even though I'm an old IT guy), but being able to input my DVD audio into the DAC would be nice. With kids and so many other interests, a big home theater system isn't something that interests me or my wife, but we do enjoy the much better DVD audio through my below system when watching movies. Getting even better DVD audio using the DAC would be icing.

3. My current Marantz is an excellent player and would be a fine transport. With an outboard DAC, I'd lose the SACD capability, but like I said, no interest in SACD anyway.

4. USB input doesn't interest me for my reasons in #2. My Audible Illusions Pre has a nice headphone section, but I don't use it much. I'm drawn more to the Benchmark DAC1, probably due to the plethora of good reviews I've read. I just wish they made a simpler one without the headphone amp section... now that would be cool.

I'm assuming the best way to buy a DAC1 is directly from Benchmark? I would imagine good used ones are hard to find?

My current system was just completed last year after I picked up the AI preamp, and I've been enjoying music again more than I have for years. I guess I just want to make that one last tweak (for now) to get the very best out of my system. I'm also curious of how much better it can sound. The tube preamp & heavily modified Adcom have been a glorious matchup, and through my little Paradigms, the soundstage and accuracy is stunning.

OK, my apologies, as this has gotten LONG, but my last question is... given how good mys system seems to sound now, what would your expereince tell you that I MIGHT experience in regards to better sound with a current DAC (or a newer player like a Marantz SA8003)?

THANKS AGAIN!

[Ajani]

Mr. P and Ajani,

Thank you very much for your excellent advice.

I'm thinking that an outboard DAC might be what I enjoy the most, for the following reasons:

1. I don't really have any interest in SACD at this time... I have too many great CDs to listen to!

2. I don't have any intention of ever using a music server (even though I'm an old IT guy), but being able to input my DVD audio into the DAC would be nice. With kids and so many other interests, a big home theater system isn't something that interests me or my wife, but we do enjoy the much better DVD audio through my below system when watching movies. Getting even better DVD audio using the DAC would be icing.

3. My current Marantz is an excellent player and would be a fine transport. With an outboard DAC, I'd lose the SACD capability, but like I said, no interest in SACD anyway.

4. USB input doesn't interest me for my reasons in #2. My Audible Illusions Pre has a nice headphone section, but I don't use it much. I'm drawn more to the Benchmark DAC1, probably due to the plethora of good reviews I've read. I just wish they made a simpler one without the headphone amp section... now that would be cool.

I'm assuming the best way to buy a DAC1 is directly from Benchmark? I would imagine good used ones are hard to find?

My current system was just completed last year after I picked up the AI preamp, and I've been enjoying music again more than I have for years. I guess I just want to make that one last tweak (for now) to get the very best out of my system. I'm also curious of how much better it can sound. The tube preamp & heavily modified Adcom have been a glorious matchup, and through my little Paradigms, the soundstage and accuracy is stunning.

OK, my apologies, as this has gotten LONG, but my last question is... given how good mys system seems to sound now, what would your expereince tell you that I MIGHT experience in regards to better sound with a current DAC (or a newer player like a Marantz SA8003)?

THANKS AGAIN!

If you really want to save a few bucks you can try audiogon.com for the Benchmark (they usually go for around $700 used - but I have no idea about whether they are reliable and in good condition)... My advice would be to buy direct from Benchmark (that's how I purchased mine)...

The improvements you should expect to hear would be detail 1st and then more subtle improvements in just about everything else... (anyway that's my guess based on my experience with the DAC1... YMMV)

[IowaCityDiehard]

Thanks again Ajani for the excellent advice. After further research and reading reviews, for my taste in sound, I think I'm going to go with a Cullen-modded PS Audio DL III DAC. More $$ for sure, but I think it is a good fit for my system.

My wife says I need to sell a few toys first to fund it, so it will be a bit, but I'll be sure to post a review of my expereince with this DAC.

Cheers!

[mijs]

Your post really caught my eye. I own an SA-8001 and my last player was a DV-6400, so I can offer some meaningful comparisons. First of all, I have a lot of respect for that DV-6400! It is so easy on the ears (even at loud volume levels) and does so many things well. It took me back to listening to music instead of analyzing music.

A few years later when the SA-8001 came out, I decided to step up in the Marantz line.

As much as I liked the DV-6400, the SA-8001 makes it sound 2-dimensional in comparison. The SA-8001 is a very well-balanced sounding CDP with better soundstage, detail, and definition. Bass on the SA-8001 is more plentiful, deeper and tighter. The highs are there but not harsh at all. I don't know if this makes sense, but in terms of precision, it has a "professional" sound compared to every other CDP I've owned. It can darn near produce concert-level realism.

Regarding the SA-8001, SA-15S1, and Benchmark DAC, you NEED to read the Stereophile review ( http://www.stereophile.com/hirezplay...ar/index2.html ) that compared those three sources. Part of the review says "I don't believe the (sonic) differences were real", and over time the reviewer really had no preference of one over the others.

I haven't heard the SA-8003 (and have no intention of doing so) because I am so satisfied with the SA-8001. The 8001 is also a proven quantity, the 8003 has yet to reach that status.

You can find used 8001's around $500 - $600. IMHO, that's the ticket.

BTW - I use AQ King Cobras with the 8001 and they really open it up compared to the AQ Diamondback and Corals that I've used.

Hope it helps!

mijs


Equipment List:
Cayin A-50T
Marantz SA-8001
Several speakers, incl TQWT
AQ King Cobra ICs

[Ajani]

Your post really caught my eye. I own an SA-8001 and my last player was a DV-6400, so I think I can offer some meaningful comparisons. First of all, I have a lot of respect for that DV-6400! It is so easy on the ears (even at loud volume levels) and does so many things well. It took me back to listening to music instead of analyzing music.

A few years later when the SA-8001 came out, I decided to step up in the Marantz line.

As much as I liked the DV-6400, the SA-8001 makes it sound 2-dimensional in comparison. The SA-8001 is a very well-balanced sounding CDP with better soundstage, detail, and definition. Bass on the SA-8001 is more plentiful, deeper and tighter. The highs are there but not harsh at all. I don't know if this makes sense, but in terms of precision, it has a "professional" sound compared to every other CDP I've owned. It can darn near produce concert-level realism.

Regarding the SA-8001, SA-15S1, and Benchmark DAC, you NEED to read the Stereophile review ( http://www.stereophile.com/hirezplay...ar/index2.html ) that compared those three sources. Part of the review says "I don't believe the (sonic) differences were real", and over time the reviewer really had no preference of one over the others.

I haven't heard the SA-8003 (and have no intention of doing so) because I am so satisfied with the SA-8001. The 8001 is also a proven quantity, the 8003 has yet to reach that status.

You can find used 8001's around $500 - $600. IMHO, that's the ticket.

BTW - I use AQ King Cobras with the 8001 and they really open it up compared to the AQ Diamondback and Corals that I've used.


Hope it helps!

Yep... as I've said a few times in these forums:

If I wasn't into music servers (computer audio), then the Marantz SA8001 would definitely have been my CD/SACD player.... Especially considering how much cheaper it is than buying the Benchmark DAC1 + a decent transport + a digital interconnect, for CD playback....

[MinuteMan]

Hi, I'm a newby to this forum, but I coulnd't help noticing you guys were sharing SA8003 experiences. Here's mine:

For me the SA8003 was merely a redbook transport for my Musical Fidelity X-DAC and a SACD platform. And to be honest I haven't been able to properly enjoy this player since I bought it. The everpresent noise from the mechanism is so annoying it ruins the experience at low volumes completely. You can forget about classical music. I returned the device and got a new one which was even slightly worse. Marantz tested it and claims it functions within the specified parameters and the store wont even take the device back (consumer laws in my country are due for an upgrade). The player sits 14 ft. from the listening position by the way. Sadly the worst buy I ever made.

Grtz.

[Mr Peabody]

What country are you in? What's the rest of your system?

First poster that I know of mentioning the noise. I wonder if 220 vs. 110v makes any difference. Interesting though, the noise of the transport loading a disc was a negative I noted in my 7003 BD player. Normal play I can't hear it over the movie but from about 11 to 12 feet away with the cabinet door closed I can hear it grinding away when the disc is loading.

[blackraven]

I auditioned the 8003 for a week in my home and did not notice any noise, but I have read user reviews where people have complained about it.

[Ajani]

I've seen this discussion in a few different forums:

clearly defective SA8003 units have very noisy transports (and there are enough defective units for this complaint to be around) but for the most part, the SA8003 is not noisy.... So my advice for anyone thinking of purchasing one is to ensure you get a good return policy just in case you get stuck with a defective unit....

[Mr Peabody]

If it's not the norm and he can't return it, I'd definitely send it back to Marantz under warranty to get it fixed.

[MinuteMan]

I had returned the unit to Marantz. They did find a defect as a matter of fact, something with the mechanism plateau. They fixed this, but the noise remained. It's like the loading noise just remains throughout the playback of the disc. It sounds like a tapecassette being rewound. It's with any disc for that matter, CDDA, SACD, CDR.
And I didn't even mention Marantz BS response about poorly produced discs which frankly is an insult to my intelligence. They even suggested I place my amp on top of my player to reduce noise. Can you believe that.
I requested the testreport from Marantz for my unit, still waiting for that.

Thanks for the input guys and I'm Dutch by the way.

[Mr Peabody]

I do have to say Marantz customer support leaves a lot to be desired. I downloaded a firmware update to my BD7003, hoping it was done right, but I didn't get that far. They give a sequence of buttons to push that will draw the tray in with the disc and begin the update. When I push the buttons the player just says "no disc". I'm pushing them as fast as I can. They did answer my email and they did answer the phone but the best answer I could get is to take the player into a service center. Who wants to be without their player for who knows how long just for an update. At least Samsung sent me the disc and the player just updated like playing a normal disc. This will definitely discourage any future Marantz purchases. If I can't get it straightened out the unit may be going back which I hate to do because I like it a lot but if it can't be updated it will soon be a larger problem.

[mijs]

MinuteMan,

Sorry to hear about the 8003's noise and Marantz' poor support. I would have been very angry if my 8001 did that and they wouldn't admit there was a problem. These are not inexpensive players.
Good luck!

[elfingrot]

To follow up with the comments about problems playing SACDs, I had the following experience.

For more than a year, my Marantz SA8001 played both regular CDs and hybrids just fine. Then I purchased my first SACD-only recordings (Columbia Bruno Walter Beethoven 6th and Beethoven 5th/Schubert "Unfinished"). One played fine, the other played a little and then skipped around. By opening and closing the drawer, I might get a minute or two OK, but that disc would always mess up sooner or later. After a few tries and the insertion of other discs, the machine began to read "no disc" on everything I put in it.

Called Marantz, and even though I had lost the receipt in a move, they told me they would handle it under warranty and had me send it to one of their authorized places for repair. Got the machine back two weeks later, and it played CDs and SACD-only discs, but not hybrids! And I tried 20. All hybrids showed "no disc."

Machine out and back again, and now it plays everything I put in it except two brand-new hybrids (Bach Cantatas vol. 43 BIS; Beethoven Symphonies 1 and 5 Jarvi RCA). The Marantz will not even play these as regular CDs, though they play fine in my regular CD player.

Strange. I know the first repair involved replacing the optical pickup, and the second involved updating firmware. Both Marantz and the repair place have been very nice about taking care of me, but I have a feeling that sending the unit back again won't guarantee anything, and it's only those two SACDs anyway.

I certainly hope SACD succeeds. I owned an audio store for 10 years (in the 1970s and 1980s), and I remember well when customers readily welcomed any improvement in sound. I remember having a waiting list a mile long for the first Sony CD players when they came out.

Now SACD had made a clear leap over CD (even though there are some very fine CDs), but it seems that only a few of us really care about the difference.

[bobsticks]

I'm not a huge fan of Jarvi but it's a pleasure to have another sound maven on the board.

Welcome to the forum, elf, and I'm glad you were able to find at least some degree of satisfaction and customer support. Don't be a stranger.

[elfingrot]

Here's a follow-up. Just for the heck of it, even though none of my problem SACDs were ever touched and all looked clean, I put them in my Nitty Gritty machine just in case. I was amazed to find that they all then played fine with exception of the Suzuki Bach Cantatas vol. 43, of which I have two copies. Both still register "No Disc," but they play fine in CD mode. (Volumes 28-42 and 44 play fine. What's wrong with 43?)

A couple of the others had to be inserted a second time to register, but they eventually played.

So it's apparently not the discs themselves, just a finicky Marantz 8001 that wants spotless discs.

[mezzanine]

Black Raven

Cambridge Audio is carried here in the Twin Cities. Stereoland in Eden Prairie carries the line. I have a 840c and like it a lot. Listened to the Marantz 8003 today. Was very nice and easy on the ear. But seemed a little shut in on top and the soundstage just a little less then the 840c. Good player for the price for sure. Slightly better than the $800 NAD. The Rega Apollo seemed even better then the Marantz but I couldn't live with it. It's to bright on top midrange with vocals.
The Cambridge is the best of the above.

[blackraven]

Black Raven

Cambridge Audio is carried here in the Twin Cities. Stereoland in Eden Prairie carries the line. I have a 840c and like it a lot. Listened to the Marantz 8003 today. Was very nice and easy on the ear. But seemed a little shut in on top and the soundstage just a little less then the 840c. Good player for the price for sure. Slightly better than the $800 NAD. The Rega Apollo seemed even better then the Marantz but I couldn't live with it. It's to bright on top midrange with vocals.
The Cambridge is the best of the above.

I knew that Stereoland started to carry CA. I think I was the one to turn them on to CA. About 2-3 years ago I went over to their now closed Minneapolis store to listen to some paradigm and nht speakers and the owner started talking to me about my main system. I told him that I had an 840c and he started pimping me about it. I told him that he ought to carry the CA line since no one else carries it around here and that it's a lot of bang for the buck. He told me that he was looking for another line to carry and that he would consider CA.

Your dead on about your assessment about the Marantz 8003. Smaller sound stage, not as detailed with rolled off top end. Bass is not as tight, its slower paced. But over all its smooth sounding and has a pleasant sound. It does better with SACD than CD. It would be a great player for a bright sounding system.

I'm surprised you found the R.Apollo bright. I listened to it at Audio Perfection in MPLS and found it a very neutral and great sounding player. I heard Apollo Special Edition on a Theta amp and preamp with a pair of Maggie 1.6's. I convinced that some of the differences we hear are system matching. How do you compare different pieces of equipment in different stores with different speakers, amps, CDP's etc's.