Why don't audiophiles like Mcintosh?

[basite]

I think your comparason of McIntosh to Rolex is on the money. McIntosh and Rolex are for people who have more money than taste. (Just my humble opinion). I think you can get a lot more sound quality for the money if you forgo those silly bule meters. Espically in the price range you are considering. NASA picked Omega for the astronaut's watches because they work! Senators wear Rolexes because they sparkle. You need to decide if you want to say WOW, what a system, befor or after you listen!

I said WOW (a couple of times, together with other praising words) before AND after I auditioned the Mcintosh.

and before you ask, yes, I heard other high end systems too, many of them costing much more than mine.

have you actually heard a Mcintosh piece? perhaps you'd change your mind if you did.

Mcintosh is for pure music lovers. If music is what you want, Mcintosh is definately worth every penny!

Keep them spinning,
Bert.

[OzzieAudiophile]

Hello.

I have just recently posted a new topic, on whether to save the extra money in order to upgrade to McIntosh.

So in relation to this topic, music_man raised a very good point. The best high end equipment will tell you straight away if the CD you're feeding the player (or source), is of good quality or not.

I have a pair of Dynaudio Contours 1.8 Mark II's, and just as the salesman said, I would
be able to better detect if a CD recording was produced well, or not. I actually auditioned many brands of speakers, it took me 6 months and 30 shops to narrow it down to 3 brands. Dali, B&W, and Dynaudio. I managed to get the latter, and do not regret that decision.

Now it took me 6 months before making an informed decision to part with that much money. It was no where near as 12K, but since we're talking about 12K, one word of advice that you don't have to be an audiophile, or genius to work out, take your SWEET time and audition as many systems as you can. Let your ears tell you what is good as well. I just think 12K worth of money is worth a lot of time to invest before parting. Maybe it's just that I'm old-fashioned. 12K isn't normally spare change. It's harder to justify a 12K bad choice, put it that way.

I have listened recently to a McIntosh and B&W setup, it was from what I was told
a 35K pair of B&W fronts (don't know which model).

1x McIntosh MCD205 CD changer
2x MC1201's
1x McIntosh Control centre (sorry didn't take down the model number)

The overall setup was about 75K to 80K.

Then I put on 2 of my favourite CDs, and one SACD which is their copy in the shop.

Now the CD I first played contained a mp3 song, which was obtained legally from the artist directly, it had to be a good produced mp3. When I played it on my system, I could hear the choirlike sample of about 5 to 8 voices.

When I heard that same track in the shop, it was as if someone cleaned my ears out, I could hear an additional 20 voices in the same song. It was absolutely incredible.
I auditioned a new CD I brought from last week, and it was great. I got a better kick from the mp3, so it really does make a difference what CD you feed it.

I am going to find it extremely hard to find any alturnatives to McIntosh, perhaps it's the poor setups of all of the other shops that I've gone to. I just checked ebay before posting this post, that there are NO McIntosh items for sale. Only outside Australia. Ok there are not many Australian distributors (I am in Oz), but I have not heard of any returns or resales either. The only resales I have heard are tradeins for upgraded McIntosh gear.

I'll be honest, I'm not extreme expert, I have spend many years researching the jargon, and keeping up with technology. I've never taken someone's advice at face value until confirming it from other sources. Much of what I have heard about some things or another ended up being untrue.

For example, it was argued that there is no point getting equipment with balanced/XLR connections if you are working with 1 m lengths or less because there's no benefit.
About 99.99% of everyone else blatently invite me to come and see them just to prove that point wrong. Hook up unbalanced, then hook up balanced, and hear for yourself.

No you really have to hear a full McIntosh set up, and bring along at least 5 different CDs, and or SACDs/DVD-Audio if possible. You need to listen to good recorded ones, and perhaps not as good, at least you know what you're listening to, and pay close attention to picking up additional detail that you could not find in other places you've listened to the same CD to. You'll know for sure if this equipment will suit you. Also close your eyes when listening to a key part of one of your favourite songs, so you can capture a system's full potential.

A good set up and a reputable shop doesn't need to bombard you and try to justify why their product is so good, or should be brought. They should leave you alone and let you listen to an album/cd as long as you want (within reason).

The salesman, knew I was going to like the McIntosh gear, it was as if every other brand
was a waste of time to listen to. Ok, McIntosh I don't have the budget to buy it all now,
but who says I need to buy it all straight away ? one by one, layby.

Ok, I'd have to disagree with the CD player being the MOST important component in the system. If you have a $10000 player, but $50 speakers, and $50 amp, sorry, the listening experience is bad. End of story.

A resonable percentage of total cost should be invested in the source(s), the amp, AND the speakers. As a general guide, about 10% of the total cost should go towards the cabling (speakers and interconnects).

You may end up finding out that you will need more than 12K to finish the rest of your upgrades. I'd audition as many brands as possible, and the same brand in more than 2 shops, because you don't want to accept, or dismiss a certain brand based on poor set up (unless you're unfortunate like me as most brands are available in only 1 shop )

Some of the higher McIntosh amps have a built in current protection system, which protect your speakers. I believe that is a feature not worth being neglected. Go to their offcial site and find out for yourself.

I think it is worthwhile going to the official sites, and download their manuals. You need to find out what it can do. Features are also important. Some companies give you the advantage of remote hooking up all of your equipment so you just need one remote to power all 3 or 4 components.

I have been told that McIntosh have other power/shortage, surge proection features built in, so it is worth your while to go to the site and confirm that.

The cheaper brands and components just do not have such features, the dollars it costs should be a useful indicator. At least worth a read of the owners manuals.

One thing you must also consider, which has not been mentioned in this thread,
you may want to look around for additional/new technologies which are only available in the 'newer' components. You may want to consider (future-proofing) your investment, if it's possible. I.e. something which has more inputs, HDMI, or more types, will give you more options 3 years down the track. Waiting 6 months more to get that better pair of speakers, or other component may be worth it.

[E-Stat]

I have just recently posted a new topic, on whether to save the extra money in order to upgrade to McIntosh.

I would recommend listening to products from other companies as well during your search like Audio Research, VTL, Pass Labs, BAT, Conrad-Johnson, etc. subject of course to availability down under.

For example, it was argued that there is no point getting equipment with balanced/XLR connections if you are working with 1 m lengths or less because there's no benefit.

The challenge with all things cable related is all the variables. You really cannot make a blanket statement either way.

Some of the higher McIntosh amps have a built in current protection system, which protect your speakers. I believe that is a feature not worth being neglected. Go to their offcial site and find out for yourself.

Actually most any amp has some sort of internal VI current limiting designed primarily to protect the amplifier, not the speaker. Some brands, however, like Pass Labs don't need such because the output stage is more capable. I think you are referring to their Power Guard circuitry. It's a compressor. Sorry, but I think compromising the signal by putting a compressor in the signal path on a presumed high end product to protect speakers from clueless folks who don't understand (or hear) clipping is ridiculous. You find that on mid-fi and pro gear.

rw

[OzzieAudiophile]

Hello E-Stat.

Thankyou for the feedback.

I will have to do some further research about the PowerGuard. You make it sound like
it's definately not worth it.

I have heard the unit in operating performance, the quality of the sound is absolutely
supurb.

It doesn't mean I will not audition any further brands, however it is WA, I am very limited as to brand choice. Most of them are low budget, to low-middle budget ranges. My old Yamaha receiver is better than 30% of all of the amps in WA.

Cheers.

[E-Stat]

Hello E-Stat.

Thankyou for the feedback.

You're welcome. McIntosh is a grand old brand which continues to make very high quality gear. If you look at the product's "core values" (their term), however, you find their focus is on big blue meters and cosmetics. On their website, go to the integrated amplifier page. Note the first two such values.

You cannot go wrong buying Mac, but like Harley-Davidson, you will not be getting the most performance for your money. Both products emphasize image and bling over state-of-the-art performance.

Good luck in your search.

rw