What do you prefer NAD or Rotel?

[kexodusc]

Tom, Psonic:
I only have a Rotel Integrated, and the few other Rotel owners I do know have not heard this phenomenon.
Is this an intermittent problem that exist on a few models, or on a certain %? As I said, I work right next door to a Rotel dealer, and can demo these things every day (and often do)...this is an absolute first to me.
Is it only in the separates, and if so, the Pre-amps, or the amps?

[topspeed]

Hmmm... I'm with KC on this one as I've never heard any Rotel products exhibit this Jekyll & Hyde behaviour. I've heard both integrated and separates and neither had this problem. This is not to say it doesn't occur, just that I haven't experienced it.

One thought, are we sure it's not the speakers instead of the amp? Some speakers will need more juice to coalesce correctly. Take those Maggies for example. They don't have a heck of a lot of bass anyway so the more you feed them, the more dynamic they become (at least in my experience). Just a thought...

KC,
You're not the first to find the PCA somewhat wanting compared to the HCA2. I'm unsure if this is because the PCA isn't that great or simply because it isn't as dramatically different as the HCA2 and therefore hides in it's shadow. PSA kinda made their name with their pre-amps way back at the dawn of time so there's no question Paul knows what he's doing. My 4.6 ran flawlessly for 15 years and as a passive unit, it was one of the most transparent I've heard (or rather not heard).

No matter I s'pose as the new Gain Cell preamps promise to be as revolutionary as the original HCA2. Alas, no more audio gear until I address the video side of the rig...

[kexodusc]

KC,
You're not the first to find the PCA somewhat wanting compared to the HCA2. I'm unsure if this is because the PCA isn't that great or simply because it isn't as dramatically different as the HCA2 and therefore hides in it's shadow. PSA kinda made their name with their pre-amps way back at the dawn of time so there's no question Paul knows what he's doing. My 4.6 ran flawlessly for 15 years and as a passive unit, it was one of the most transparent I've heard (or rather not heard).

No matter I s'pose as the new Gain Cell preamps promise to be as revolutionary as the original HCA2. Alas, no more audio gear until I address the video side of the rig...

I wouldn't say the PCA was bad, I just wasn't wowed by it. I'd probably buy it with the HCA if I went that way. There's only a few pre-amps that impress me, offerings from Krell, Musical Fidelity, and Bryston come to mind. The rest I've just sort of viewed as necessary components. I'm not pre-amp buff by any means though, I'll readily admit...I've only ever owned a few pre's, NAD and Adcom, which I'd put again in the bang-for-the-buck category rather than audio nirvana category of things. To me the amp and speakers are the sexy gear, pre-amps are probably overlooked. I tend to prefer integrateds, as I can generally get the same components of a higher-end product line in one value added box, than I can with separates...then I add power amps if necessary or desired. I haven't generally heard much difference, if any, between an integrated and comparable separates
in the budgets I've had. I suspect that may change someday as my system evolves.
Someday I hope to buy a nice Bryston or Krell system..Maybe when my student loans are finally wiped out and I pay for the wedding.

[Cougar Guy]

I can't say as though I've heard this "jekyl and hyde" disposition with my RB-1080. I'm using it with Paradigm Studio 80's and I have no complaints. It has performed flawlessly in my system and it sounds great.

Also, I think the earlier comments posted from the the Stereophile review are a little misleading without being put into context. Look at the speakers it was driving when those comments were made . . . likely not the type of gear you would expect to drive with a $1000 amp. I think this comment from the review is more telling:

"When I ran the RB 1080 via its unbalanced inputs with more compatibly priced speakers, such as the Paradigm Reference Studio/20 or Studio/60, I had no complaint. The Rotel provided all the power the Paradigms could handle, and I heard no low-level limpness"

[Tom Bombadil]

This was Power Amp RB-1080 only. It is supposed to be a 200W behemoth - so supposed to be quite sufficient for the Maggies 1.6 played at low levels... Formerly what I was satisfied with was a Musical Fidelity XA-100 R which is 75 W per channel and is no power-monger. It is not quite a Bryston for Bass. It was the midrange that we had problems with because (for us) this is the easiest to identify. Bass problems are not easy for me to identify - cos of room interactions etc...quite complicated...High Frequency problems are again not all that easy for me to identify...so it must be midrange that it is messing about with at low volume levels....could be some "Class A" circuit that is messed...and at higher volume levels it switches to NON-Class A operation...just guessing.

It must be the 4 Ohm load somehow...but many other Amps (both Power and Integrated) I have tried do not exhibit this Mr. Hyde to Dr. Jekyll effect.

Believe me I really WANTED the Rotel - it looked so good and seemed to be made well, good heat sinks, good contacts for speaker wire etc. whatever external that I could observe was very well made. Ended up keeping the dumpy looking Myryad that cost exactly the same and was only 120 W per channel - where the Rotel was 200 W per channel. So the difference was not small.

In the past I have realised differences and made choices based on budget - acceptable loss in quality etc. E.g. When I got the Musical Fidelity XA-100R it was up against Bryston B-60. The B-60 was clearly the better but was $300 more for the same functionality (including Remote)...so knwing what I was going to miss, I kept the more affordable.

In this case I would have kept the Rotel (if it was comparable) because I wanted its good looks and reading good reviews (having missed the Dr. Jekyll reference that time ) was convinced that it would be excellent.

Tom

Tom, Psonic:
I only have a Rotel Integrated, and the few other Rotel owners I do know have not heard this phenomenon.
Is this an intermittent problem that exist on a few models, or on a certain %? As I said, I work right next door to a Rotel dealer, and can demo these things every day (and often do)...this is an absolute first to me.
Is it only in the separates, and if so, the Pre-amps, or the amps?