Pathos Logos!

[Bernd]

By the way this is an irrelevant point in the light of my previous post, The TT sounds better and it has much less power, and sounds better than the Logos on compatible loads, which was the original point anyway.

Have you ever owned or lived with any Pathos Products? Yes or No.
Have you ever compared any Pathos products againts each other? Yes or No.
Have you ever heard a Classic One drive 1.6 Maggies? Yes or No.

What is your knowledge based on? Please enlighten us.

Bernd

P.S. I had in direct comparision in my home at the same time, the Logos,Classic One,TT and Inpol2.
Case closed. But feel free to keep digging you an even bigger hole.

[Bernd]

Obviously GMichael and I did not know a heated arguement was happening or we would have been here to add some inane comments. Florian and Bernd as always handling the situation well. Keep up the good work.

Thank you John.
Just trying to help Mike get good sound with his new gear and we get Mr Hobby with his fantasy based knowledge.What can you do? I am a peace-loving man.Salt anyone?

The power of music gives you wings

Bernd

[Geoffcin]

If you want to get personal with someone your free to use PM.

[Mike Anderson]

Just for the record:

I still have the Classic One, as well as the Logos. However, I haven't gotten the 1.6qr's yet. When I do, I will try both amps with them, as well as various tubes.

Until then, it's a little premature to say whether my experience confirms or negates anything that has been said about these amps and the 1.6qr's!

Criminy... You all need to chill out!

[Florian]

And also for the record, when Mike asked for help i actually helped. The system i had is extremely close to what he will most likely have. I have lots of experience with their technology and how they work. I have recommended amps, cables speaker positioning etc.. Bernd has been very helpfull with his comments and they only person who has brought nothing to this advisery board is Mr. Hobby who only seems to look for trouble. My recommendations are based on real life and long term relationships with the mentioned products and cannot be weighted less then theoretical mumbojumbo from a person who has no Maggies, nor has he owned Maggies or the Pathos equipment. And let the record show that in my opinion, anyone who pics a Pathos Integrated over the Silverwald OTL's has no buisiness owning a electrostatic and deserves to own a Sharp. (The last part is my sole opinion)

[theaudiohobby]

I had in direct comparision in my home at the same time, the Logos,Classic One,TT and Inpol2.

All that knowledge, yet your posts suggest you were seemingly incapable of enunciating the basic sonic distinctions of the amplifiers in question. As for your questions, the answers are already their in previous replies across both threads.

Bernd has been very helpful with his comments and they only person who has brought nothing to this advisery board is Mr. Hobby who only seems to look for trouble.

Yep, so helpful that both of you omitted to mention that the Classic One lacks bass punch. So helpful, that he claimed the superior sound quality of the Logos, claiming more power, following his original logic the Logos should be best sounding Pathos of all after all it has the most power. So peaceful, his opening reply was to insult me. As I said earlier, both of you will get on handsomely, as neither of you seem capable of telling the forest for the trees. Finding it hard to respect dissenting opinions.

And let the record show that in my opinion, anyone who pics a Pathos Integrated over the Silverwald OTL's has no buisiness owning a electrostatic and deserves to own a Sharp. (The last part is my sole opinion)

Just goes to show the depth of your helpful knowledge.I repeat I am not interested in the Silverwald OTL, And please stop speaking about a imaginary choice/decision, Silverweld does not have distribution in the UK.

Finally, thanks for your backhanded comments about my system, I am here to select a system that works not to earn audiophile brownie points or bragging rights, and the wise ones do the same.

[Florian]

You bring this upon yourself, the matter of the fact is that the Classic One does have enough bass punch and that Mike hasnt gotten the chance yet to hear my recommended setup since he hasnt gotten the 1.6 yet so your entire argument is a waste of mine and Bernds time. You say the Silvaweld is not distributed into england, which means i was right and you have never heard it but can clearly say your not interested in it. Should i continue or will you leave this thread and stop with your non helpfull comments? And on the side note, if you had a clue you would know that the Classic one MKI has a sweeter more romantic sound then the MKII and that the Logo (which i didnt recommend since it was over the budget), i have never said any bad things about it or that the Classic One is better. So get your facts straight and get back to the back seats.

[theaudiohobby]

You bring this upon yourself

GMAB!

the matter of the fact is that the Classic One does have enough bass punch and that Mike hasnt gotten the chance yet to hear my recommended setup

The Classic One lacks bass punch, pure and simple, and that will sonic distinction will show up on any speaker with reasonable bandwidth, I know that because I have heard that selfsame amplifer with at least five speakers, the same sonic distinction every time, when compared to other amplifiers. That you and Bernd failed to alert Mike A to this critical sonic distinction is really a pity. Instead both of you are now happing about a side issue.

You say the Silvaweld is not distributed into england, which means i was right and you have never heard it

So what!!, talk about building castles in the air! I have not heard it and I am not interested in hearing it, neither have I ever discussed that amp, you making a totally irrelevant point!

Get your facts straight

Well, they were so straight in the first place, that you had to put up a rant to vent out your frustration . As I said earlier, if you and Bernd had been more helpful in the first place, the guy will not be in the pickle that he now is, in essense he now has two amplifiers whose essential sonic strengths seem to be at cross purposes with each other .

[Florian]

Dude your dissapearing, your into shrinking. Your arguments get less and less and you start to crumble and crawl back. How can you say the Pathos lacks bass punch when you run a old Quad that lacks in more then bass punch. It lacks in dynamic swings, bass extension and max spl etc.. Mike runs a MMG which has pretty much no bass at all. Heck even the MG20R driven active lacks bass extension and bass punch. You say you heard it on 5 speakers? I will tell you something, that amp is sitting next to and i can drive the .5 with it, the 1.6, the Apogee DIVA reference, the VMPS RM30-M or the 3.6R/SE.

I had had that amp on more speakers then you own! Ok, get the picture finally? I dont agree with your so called lack of bass punch, the Quad has no bass and that is why you run a cheesy subwoofer and talk about no integration problems. No die hard audiophile with a clue would punish the Quads, noß mattter how small to a subwoofer in the first place or use a bloddy Sharp amp no matter if its the big digital one or not.

Mike has the MMG and will have the 1.6 soon, and asked for a recommendation and listed many amps and the Pathos is the one that fitted the bill well. Heck, i would have recommended something different if there would be a better match for the Maggies in that price range. Get together man, and simply stop this crap. I can crush you in expereice with my left hand and have all of those sitting in my listening room. Get out while you can!

And for the record, if Mike had 11000$ to spend on a amp i would have recommend the big MK Industries, Silvaweld or the Sphinx amps if he can find one. Do these have more bass punch then the little Classic One? Yes! But they are close to the 7 times the price. For the money it was the right recommendation and works very well with the speakers.

[theaudiohobby]

Ah! we are back to I have more toys than you do style of argument! Whose competing with you? Get a clue, I don't care. And It would seem that all those toys have not helped your knowledge of audio a jot, as you keep lurching from one booboo to another, so much experience you commit a booboo each time discuss the Quads . I see that you have come around and accepted that the Quads may be successfully integrated with a cheesy subwoofer, one more thing to add to your knowledge and it did not cost a penny .

l suggest you get a clue.

[Florian]

Yes, i have more toys then you. I have the toys i recommend and i can back up my claims. You are just a bunch or empty words, and since Berd is smart enough to ignore you and i have tried too i will call it quits. You win, enjoy it then in the end i know where i stand and i know where you stand and so do the other who read this.

[Bernd]

Don't Sharp make Microwave ovens? I am in the market for a new one. Any good?

[theaudiohobby]

And for the record, if Mike had 11000$ to spend on a amp i would have recommend the big MK Industries, Silvaweld or the Sphinx amps if he can find one. Do these have more bass punch then the little Classic One? Yes! But they are close to the 7 times the price. For the money it was the right recommendation and works very well with the speakers.

So you now grudgingly accept that the Classic One does indeed lack bass punch, too little, too late. You could have helped your friend a lot more if you were more upfront about that in the first place rather than prancing around with a snotty attitude.

[Bernd]

I think so. Two pages of babble.Unbelievable.

Bernd

[Bernd]

What a pity! Your mutual friend is in a pickle over which amp to choose based on your 'sanguine' advice and you are jesting about a technicality, casually admiting that the amplfiier has a sonic distinction, but only in comparison to 11K amps, Why did you not mention that in the first place? Pity that your friend Bernd is not smart as you potrayed him to be, he joined the affray with some choice comments of his own, so much for peace and wisdom, obviously cut from the same cloth as you are , preaching one thing whilst conspicously engaging in the opposite.

Well...the game is still on

And your point is??????????

Pingggg!

[Mike Anderson]

What a pity! Your mutual friend is in a pickle over which amp to choose based on your 'sanguine' advice and you are jesting about a technicality, casually admiting that the amplfiier has a sonic distinction, but only in comparison to 11K amps, Why did you not mention that in the first place? Pity that your friend Bernd is not smart as you potrayed him to be, he joined the affray with some choice comments of his own, so much for peace and wisdom, obviously cut from the same cloth as you are , preaching one thing whilst conspicously engaging in the opposite.

1) I bought both amps used, and both in very good condition, so it isn't really that much of a pickle - in fact if I decide to sell the Logos, 2-to-1 says I can make a profit off it.

2) I was aware that the Classic One wouldn't be huge on bass before I bought it. I was hoping it would have enough power, and it may yet, once I get the chance to try it out with the 1.6qr's.

[Geoffcin]

1) I bought both amps used, and both in very good condition, so it isn't really that much of a pickle - in fact if I decide to sell the Logos, 2-to-1 says I can make a profit off it.

2) I was aware that the Classic One wouldn't be huge on bass before I bought it. I was hoping it would have enough power, and it may yet, once I get the chance to try it out with the 1.6qr's.

Rolling equipment, and making some $$$ at the same time....I like it!

As much as I hate to agree with Florian (it get's his head even bigger than it is if that's possible!) I would say that once you get he 1.6qr's your going to see a lot more bass.

Remember that the breakin on the 1.6's is like forever. You'll keep getting more bass after a few HUNDRED hours of playing!

[Florian]

(it get's his head even bigger than it is if that's possible!)

Considering that all the people who followed my advice and who understand me have gotten wonderfull results so far i think i can handle the growth of my head. The only people that disagree Geof. are those with systems that you and i know well and dont consider to be worth mentioning in terms of true audiophile performance regardless of cost.

-Flo

[Geoffcin]

Considering that all the people who followed my advice and who understand me have gotten wonderfull results so far i think i can handle the growth of my head. The only people that disagree Geof. are those with systems that you and i know well and dont consider to be worth mentioning in terms of true audiophile performance regardless of cost.

-Flo

It's when you join in flame wars that the problems arise.

Mike Anderson is a pretty sharp dude, I'm sure he knows who's got advice that he wants to listen to. Let him make that decision.

[Florian]

You know as well as i that i dont start the flame wars. (exept in the steel cage) You also know that i offer real help to all serious people, no matter if its a 500$ system or a 5000$ dollar system. I have written small guides, pay a monthly fee to keep the planar speaker section pictures etc.. up and running. I am the only one recommending affordable cables from Paul Speltz and before me there was never a discussion about planar speakers, italian amps etc..

You should keep your eyes open for the real bad people on this forum who seek every chance they get to offend me or to start a argument.

-Florian

PS: I know Mike is sharp, but look back at how much time i invested and what experience i have offered together with Bernd and others. I dont see a moderator in here stoping the fishing from others!

[Mike Anderson]

For what it's worth, Florian and everybody else, I really appreciate the time you've take to help me out with this. In the end, I know I'm going to have an awesome-sounding rig, with much thanks to you folks.

And I actually enjoy hearing some of the contrary opinions, provided they're voiced intelligently. Debate can be very enlightening when conducted meaningfully.

I think it's important to remember that everybody has different tastes, so I don't know whether it's valid to claim one piece of equipment sounds better than another as if this were objective fact. You can argue about bass levels, or frequency response or SPLs, or whatever can be measured objectively -- but I don't see much sense in saying "this speaker sounds terrible" unless you qualify it with a phrase like "according to my preferences."

Really, if someone prefers the sound of Bose to Maggies, who's to say they're wrong? It's kind of like saying you like one flavor of ice cream better than another; there's no right or wrong, just taste.

[Mike Anderson]

Mike Anderson is a pretty sharp dude, I'm sure he knows who's got advice that he wants to listen to. Let him make that decision.

Hey, thanks (on both counts)!

Can't say I know much about audio equipment though -- I know something about guitars and guitar amps, but nothing about audio gear.

I do try to research it though. I don't want anyone to get the idea that I just spend thousands of dollars on whatever amp somebody on this forum tells me to buy. I researched the Pathos stuff thoroughly, and it happens that the amps have just the features and quality I was looking for, and in just the right price range. If I had a decent dealer around here, I would have done an in-home audition, but it just wasn't possible - which is why I looked hard for some good prices on used models that could be turned around if necessary.

[Bernd]

It's when you join in flame wars that the problems arise.

Mike Anderson is a pretty sharp dude, I'm sure he knows who's got advice that he wants to listen to. Let him make that decision.

Hi Geoff,

Good of you to sum this up.

Bernd

[Mike Anderson]

BTW, I seem to have solved the brightness problem.

I'm not sure what was causing it, but I changed a number of things. The volume coming out of the Benchmark was too high (at max) and probably causing some slight distortion. The digital coax cable was right next to (in contact with) one of the power cords. So I made some adjustments and moved stuff around. Whatever it was, it worked.

So the Logos is now every bit as sweet as the Classic One, but with all the power and bass! I spent all last night bathed in lush, gorgeous sound, like a beautiful woman relaxing in a marble tub full of bubbles (or something like that).

Now if the 1.6qrs would just get here already... sheesh.

[Florian]

So your still waiting on the 1.6's ? That sucks, hey hit me up on MSN (overture3@hotmail.com)