If Romney gets in which country will America start a war with next?

[Feanor]

Poor question. Romney's not interested in helping the economy. He's interested in shrinking government and deregulating industry. No need to go to war for that.

Correct. And of course, lowering taxes on the Rich.

I'll remind people Republicans in recent history have shown no ACTUAL concern for reducing the budget deficits or the the debt. Since Reagan it has always been more important to arm for or fight a war and to reduce taxes on the Rich than to do these things.

Supply Side, Trickle Down, or as I call it, "Bribe the Rich" economics has had 30+ years to work but has only resulted in declining real median income, especially in the last decade. It hasn't, can't, and won't work, yet apparently more people believe that Republicans are more "fiscally responsible" and that Romney will be strong for the economy than Obama. People are idiots.

[thekid]

Correct. And of course, lowering taxes on the Rich.

I'll remind people Republicans in recent history have shown no ACTUAL concern for reducing the budget deficits or the the debt. Since Reagan it has always been more important to arm for or fight a war and to reduce taxes on the Rich than to do these things.

Supply Side, Trickle Down, or as I call it, "Bribe the Rich" economics has had 30+ years to work but has only resulted in declining real median income, especially in the last decade. It hasn't, can't, and won't work, yet apparently more people believe that Republicans are more "fiscally responsible" and that Romney will be strong for the economy than Obama. People are idiots.

While I generally believe that the Democrats and the Republicans are cut from the same cloth in their general approach to the economy for the past 30 years (short term thinking-lack of true leadership in addressing the fundamental economic issues) I just wanted to add a couple of observations.

Deficits and the size of government are not an issue when you are the party in power but are the source of all things evil when you are not the party in power. (See American Politics 1980-Present)

Romney's own behavior with his wealth illustrates the absurdity of his own economic plan. According to the proposed theory, lower taxes on the wealthy encourage investment in business thus providing more jobs and greater tax revenue. What does he do with his money??? He keeps a good portion of it in offshore bank accounts in the Cayman's and Switzerland - Not businesses. In addition because the money was kept off-shore it lowered the tax revenue to the government.

I am not aware of any good business people who decide to expand or contract their business based largely on tax policy. Market conditions, competition, technological advancements and to some degree regulatory requirements are much larger factors than tax policy to business. There is historical evidence to support this as the wealthiest people have been taxed as high as 90% during times of economic prosperity. If lower taxes actually produced substantial economic stimulus then every President who was ever faced with a recession would have just lowered the effective tax rates. Saint Ronald raised taxes several times during his time in office but this largely seems to have been forgotten.

[RGA]

Simple rule

You only get to put 1% of your net worth in off shore accounts. If you earn over $1million dollars you WILL BE AUDITED yearly. If you go over the 1% then 100% of your assets WILL BE SEIZED and sold off at auction and your bank accounts seized and taken by the government to spend on education, roads, hospitals, police, and fire.

The exception -
If you head a business - the business will be taken over and converted into a CO-OP where the employees may, if they wish, become part owners to ensure they don't lose their jobs if the owner is a douche bag and gets caught. The corrupt owner loses 100% of his rights to the company and any future earnings.

Drakonian? The rich have sucked the life out of the poor long enough. Extreme measures must be taken. You will pay to keep America going or America will take every penny you make and leave you destitute. Alternatively, the poor can rise up shoot the top 1% in the head and take it by force.

I think my plan is quite reasonable - you still get to be a mega bazilion-mazillionaire but you pay taxes and ensure the health of the entire country.

[thekid]

Simple rule

You only get to put 1% of your net worth in off shore accounts. If you earn over $1million dollars you WILL BE AUDITED yearly. If you go over the 1% then 100% of your assets WILL BE SEIZED and sold off at auction and your bank accounts seized and taken by the government to spend on education, roads, hospitals, police, and fire.

The exception -
If you head a business - the business will be taken over and converted into a CO-OP where the employees may, if they wish, become part owners to ensure they don't lose their jobs if the owner is a douche bag and gets caught. The corrupt owner loses 100% of his rights to the company and any future earnings.

Drakonian? The rich have sucked the life out of the poor long enough. Extreme measures must be taken. You will pay to keep America going or America will take every penny you make and leave you destitute. Alternatively, the poor can rise up shoot the top 1% in the head and take it by force.

I think my plan is quite reasonable - you still get to be a mega bazilion-mazillionaire but you pay taxes and ensure the health of the entire country.

RGA

I will defer to you on your knowledge on % of worth allowed to be kept in off-shore accounts. What I have heard is that in the last several years once the US government started to pressure overseas banks to provide names of their US depositors that a good number of depositors pulled their money out of overseas accounts. Does not seem to be the actions of innocent people if they were in compliance with laws like the one you state.

[bobsticks]

Simple rule

You only get to put 1% of your net worth in off shore accounts. If you earn over $1million dollars you WILL BE AUDITED yearly. If you go over the 1% then 100% of your assets WILL BE SEIZED and sold off at auction and your bank accounts seized and taken by the government to spend on education, roads, hospitals, police, and fire.

The exception -
If you head a business - the business will be taken over and converted into a CO-OP where the employees may, if they wish, become part owners to ensure they don't lose their jobs if the owner is a douche bag and gets caught. The corrupt owner loses 100% of his rights to the company and any future earnings.

Drakonian? The rich have sucked the life out of the poor long enough. Extreme measures must be taken. You will pay to keep America going or America will take every penny you make and leave you destitute. Alternatively, the poor can rise up shoot the top 1% in the head and take it by force.

I think my plan is quite reasonable - you still get to be a mega bazilion-mazillionaire but you pay taxes and ensure the health of the entire country.

Richard, I almost always defer to your knowledge of music and music reproduction and I usually consider your views on politics and institutions worthy of consideration. I do that out of respect and because you present yourself in an informed and measured way.

Please consider that when I say the following:

That has to be the most ignorant post I've ever read, anywhere, anytime...

....and I've read all of SVI's posts...





,,,and Dusty Beiber too.

[Feanor]

...

I am not aware of any good business people who decide to expand or contract their business based largely on tax policy. Market conditions, competition, technological advancements and to some degree regulatory requirements are much larger factors than tax policy to business. There is historical evidence to support this as the wealthiest people have been taxed as high as 90% during times of economic prosperity. If lower taxes actually produced substantial economic stimulus then every President who was ever faced with a recession would have just lowered the effective tax rates. Saint Ronald raised taxes several times during his time in office but this largely seems to have been forgotten.

Stop It !!! Just too much damned common sense.

A little more common sense will tell anyone but the staunchest idiot that it isn't lower taxes that companies need to start investing -- it's customers. The major underlying cause of the current recession is that typical Americans (and Canadians) have faced stagnant real incomes for 30 years and declines in the last decade.

[Worf101]

While I generally believe that the Democrats and the Republicans are cut from the same cloth in their general approach to the economy for the past 30 years (short term thinking-lack of true leadership in addressing the fundamental economic issues) I just wanted to add a couple of observations.

Deficits and the size of government are not an issue when you are the party in power but are the source of all things evil when you are not the party in power. (See American Politics 1980-Present)

Romney's own behavior with his wealth illustrates the absurdity of his own economic plan. According to the proposed theory, lower taxes on the wealthy encourage investment in business thus providing more jobs and greater tax revenue. What does he do with his money??? He keeps a good portion of it in offshore bank accounts in the Cayman's and Switzerland - Not businesses. In addition because the money was kept off-shore it lowered the tax revenue to the government.

I am not aware of any good business people who decide to expand or contract their business based largely on tax policy. Market conditions, competition, technological advancements and to some degree regulatory requirements are much larger factors than tax policy to business. There is historical evidence to support this as the wealthiest people have been taxed as high as 90% during times of economic prosperity. If lower taxes actually produced substantial economic stimulus then every President who was ever faced with a recession would have just lowered the effective tax rates. Saint Ronald raised taxes several times during his time in office but this largely seems to have been forgotten.

Hey man... don't muddy a political discussion with facts and common sense. Don't you know how the game is played?

Worf (Registered Independent for 25 years).

[Worf101]

1. The unions overplayed their hands - Too many strikes, too many ridiculous work rules all designed to keep as many on the payroll as the camel's back would bear as opposed to doing what's best for the company and country as a whole. But those kinds of unions and contracts are now all but gone.

2. The Rise of the Multinationals - As oft predicted in dystopan SciFi since the '30's Corporations divorced of a single, physical location or forced national ties will act in the company's own self interest and thier's alone.

3. Corporations no longer need America for Manufacture.

4. Corporations no longer need America as its primary market.

5. Take 2,.3 and 4 together you have a situation where corporations, shed the American work force for cheaper overseas labour with little market consequences since they can sell all they need to China and India while paying little or no taxes here.

As one observer put it, "if this trend continues we'll be a banana republic in 20 years." The corporations only need America as a safe place to spend its money, collect its toys and provide soliders to protect their interests overseas. Behind their gated walls patrolled by private security they'll watch as the whole country/world burns. The problem with fires though is that once started they can quickly get out of hand, ask the Romanoffs if you can find one.

Worf

[Feanor]

Hummm ... well, yes.

...
1. The unions overplayed their hands - Too many strikes, too many ridiculous work rules all designed to keep as many on the payroll as the camel's back would bear as opposed to doing what's best for the company and country as a whole. But those kinds of unions and contracts are now all but gone. ...

With much regret I have to agree. I've said before that I see a problem for public sector unions were they seek to perpetuate relative wage & benefit levels that are increasingly above those of private sector workers. I believe that unions once were huge boon to American workers, but the selfish obstinacy of public sector unions in the present day brings disrepute on the history role unions -- and has become a major "wedge issue" which the Right-wing exploits to divide potential liberal/progressive voters.

...
2. The Rise of the Multinationals - As oft predicted in dystopan SciFi since the '30's Corporations divorced of a single, physical location or forced national ties will act in the company's own self interest and their's alone. ...

This is so self-evident you'd think it was superfluous to state -- and in fact its mentioned by neither Republicans (as you might expect) OR Democrats (as you might well wonder why not, except for corporate donations they still get ).

...
3. Corporations no longer need America for Manufacture.

4. Corporations no longer need America as its primary market.

5. Take 2,.3 and 4 together you have a situation where corporations, shed the American work force for cheaper overseas labour with little market consequences since they can sell all they need to China and India while paying little or no taxes here. ...

Indeed. But lets understand that the Republican policy is to accelerate this pernicious globalization by redistributing wealth from the poor & middle classes to The Rich so they can invest it offshore. [Bribe the Rich to help American to win the in the Race to the Bottom.]

...
As one observer put it, "if this trend continues we'll be a banana republic in 20 years." The corporations only need America as a safe place to spend its money, collect its toys and provide soliders to protect their interests overseas. Behind their gated walls patrolled by private security they'll watch as the whole country/world burns. The problem with fires though is that once started they can quickly get out of hand, ask the Romanoffs if you can find one.

Worf

This is the Paul Ryan / Ayn Rand vision of the future.

[Hyfi]

3. Corporations no longer need America for Manufacture.

What you missed is because of #1-The unions overplayed their hands, they have also driven up the cost of products, made it so the corps send the MFG to China to save money and NOT pay the Union wages and endless bennies.

So Unions were at one time a good thing, 100 years ago, but today they have made America into a Consumer Country and not an MFG Country.

Americans can't afford to buy American Made Products. Something does not make sense about that.

Yesterday I was listening to NPR and an interview with authors of a new book about Romney and his money. Due to his questionably legal yet immoral tactics, his IRA is worth somewhere between 20 and 100 million, 1/100 of 1%- percentile have that. The way he and the others at Bain did it was by quickly switching the investments to the ones that Bain created of businesses that they would shut down for the profits as they were doing it, but they used a blind trust or whatever the term.

He himself is the one who years ago when running against one of the Kennedys started the whole Tax Return issue and now that it has turned around on him, he claims it's an issue of privacy. A-Hole!


It's a shame Obama is killing the middle class and will continue to do so if he gets re-elected, but Romney is not the better choice of two evils. He may help me to save a little of what I have for 4 years, but someone has to pay all the outrageous debt sometime and guess who it will be? The Middle Class. We are screwed no matter what over the course of time no matter which F'ed up party has control.

[Worf101]

What you missed is because of #1-The unions overplayed their hands, they have also driven up the cost of products, made it so the corps send the MFG to China to save money and NOT pay the Union wages and endless bennies.

So Unions were at one time a good thing, 100 years ago, but today they have made America into a Consumer Country and not an MFG Country.

Americans can't afford to buy American Made Products. Something does not make sense about that.

Yesterday I was listening to NPR and an interview with authors of a new book about Romney and his money. Due to his questionably legal yet immoral tactics, his IRA is worth somewhere between 20 and 100 million, 1/100 of 1%- percentile have that. The way he and the others at Bain did it was by quickly switching the investments to the ones that Bain created of businesses that they would shut down for the profits as they were doing it, but they used a blind trust or whatever the term.

He himself is the one who years ago when running against one of the Kennedys started the whole Tax Return issue and now that it has turned around on him, he claims it's an issue of privacy. A-Hole!


It's a shame Obama is killing the middle class and will continue to do so if he gets re-elected, but Romney is not the better choice of two evils. He may help me to save a little of what I have for 4 years, but someone has to pay all the outrageous debt sometime and guess who it will be? The Middle Class. We are screwed no matter what over the course of time no matter which F'ed up party has control.

I believe the Corps would've left the US eventually anyway. The Unions didn't HELP, but their greed would've led them to leave eventually. The only thing about Oil depletion is that it will force some companies to return to U.S. soil as the costs of world spanning supply lines becomes prohibitive but it won't be out of a sense of patriotism or anything else that forces them to do it. I don't see your Obama - War on the Middle Class thing but you must have a reason for believing it and you don't sound like a knee-jerker by any means.

I personally think the man inherited a "no-win" situation and has done the best he could with Congress and the rich aligned against him but who's to say.
'
As for the nation's future? I personally think the Republic is finished unless we get the lobbyists and money out of it. Elected office has devolved to an exercise of raising money to get re-elected THAT and ONLY THAT matters to the average politician of either party. Citizen's United legalized bribery and as long as the situation remains that way, we're doomed as a representative democracy.

Worf

[Feanor]

...
As for the nation's future? I personally think the Republic is finished unless we get the lobbyists and money out of it. Elected office has devolved to an exercise of raising money to get re-elected THAT and ONLY THAT matters to the average politician of either party. Citizen's United legalized bribery and as long as the situation remains that way, we're doomed as a representative democracy.

Worf

The USA is now a plutocracy. That was doubtful up until the US Supreme Court declared corporations = people, money = free speech, and allowed anonymous contributions, but it's a done deal now. I don't see a way back.

Well, it would take much smarter, better informed voters -- good luck with that.