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Thread: Wilson WP7, JBL 1400 Array, or ???

  1. #26
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    I got the 4367's to listen to during Xmas vacation but didn't officially purchase them until last month. I thought I was off the merry-go-round for a while but the opportunity to get the JBL at a good deal was too much for me to resist.

    Feanor, the JBL horns would blow away any negative opinions you may have of horns. If they were behind a curtain I doubt you'd tell. Vocals are very natural as well as instruments, I think I stated earlier brass, cymbals and piano are outstanding. I will say due to vertical dispersion, orchestral pieces aren't as tall in the sound stage. The 4367 have a really wide sound stage though and reveal layering in the music well. Not to mention they will play as loud as you can stand while remaining crystal clear. I should add a disclaimer, as long as the upstream electronics are up to it.

    The 4367's have a front port and actually seem to do better not so far into the room.
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  2. #27
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    I have to agree with Mr. P on the horns. Like you, Feanor, I had aversion to horn thanks to far too much exposure to Klipshorns and the like. A friend has a custom made JBL speaker featuring a 15" reflex loaded woofer, horn loaded mid, and a vertical horn loaded plasma tweeter that would give just about any speaker you care to mention a run for it's money. It is never harsh, completely neutral, and simply has air and extension for days. They've come a long way from the shouty, hard horns of yore. You should check them out, you'll be as surprised as I was.

    On an aside, has anyone heard the Aerial Acoustics 7T? There's a pair for sale and I know the 20T gets rave reviews, but I've never heard the brand.

  3. #28
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    I find myself wondering, if the JBL 4367 is so good, why haven't any of the major audio magazines done a review on them. Why aren't they listed in their "Recommended Components" articles in the best speakers under $15,000? I never hear any of the reviewers mention them when they're at the audio shows. Most of us don't get to hear 1/2 of the gear that these guys hear, so it just makes me wonder.

    Topspeed I've read several great reviews on the 7T. My dealer carries them, but I've never been lucky enough to give them a listen.
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  4. #29
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Personally I don't take my audio purchases directly from the recommended components from the magazines all the time. It seems the brands that get the most play are the ones that advertise the most in my opinion and the ones that don't advertise are picked because the reviewers themselves pick the brands they review a lot of times.

    I have for years as well thought of horns as a bad idea because of the likes of some Klipsch speakes that did not sound good to my ears but they are not the same as compression drivers. from my time in pro sound compression drivers are in a different league than just horn loaded tweeters. I have always had a soft spot for JBL speakers they just have never made a tower speaker that that I could afford that was anything like their over 10k stuff, its like they are two different companies.

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  5. #30
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    What are you trying to say Jack? You trying to start sumpin? Just messing.

    FYI - the 4367 was just introduced at the most recent CEDIA show in Dallas. It is a speaker designed for home use based on the M2 master reference, google that. Or, the K2 Everest.

    I also doubt if JBL really cares what an audiophile magazine thinks of it's Synthesis gear, it's mostly in the hands of custom installers opposed to boutique type stores. JBL is very popular in Asia, especially in Japan. I've been told the Array 1400 with it's vertical horn was specifically designed for that market.
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  6. #31
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    What are you trying to say Jack? You trying to start sumpin? Just messing.

    FYI - the 4367 was just introduced at the most recent CEDIA show in Dallas. It is a speaker designed for home use based on the M2 master reference, google that. Or, the K2 Everest.

    I also doubt if JBL really cares what an audiophile magazine thinks of it's Synthesis gear, it's mostly in the hands of custom installers opposed to boutique type stores. JBL is very popular in Asia, especially in Japan. I've been told the Array 1400 with it's vertical horn was specifically designed for that market.
    I've read about it on the JBL website and just find it odd that the major publications haven't reviewed them. You say that JBL probably doesn't care what the magazines thinks about its Synthesis gear and maybe they don't, but I just watched companies shell out $5,000,000 for a 30 second ad during the Superbowl and you would think most companies would like basically free advertisement.
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  7. #32
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harley .guy07 View Post
    Personally I don't take my audio purchases directly from the recommended components from the magazines all the time. It seems the brands that get the most play are the ones that advertise the most in my opinion and the ones that don't advertise are picked because the reviewers themselves pick the brands they review a lot of times.

    I have for years as well thought of horns as a bad idea because of the likes of some Klipsch speakes that did not sound good to my ears but they are not the same as compression drivers. from my time in pro sound compression drivers are in a different league than just horn loaded tweeters. I have always had a soft spot for JBL speakers they just have never made a tower speaker that that I could afford that was anything like their over 10k stuff, its like they are two different companies.
    Though arguments here are changing my mind, I guess 'till recently I had a prejudice against horn speakers. In any case speakers much over $2k are out of the question for me.

    JohnMichael has a pair of JBL Studio 530 and is quite fond of them as of last report. They have compression driver tweeters crossed over at 1.5kH. They are pretty affordable.

    The other bias I have is for planars and specifically Magneplanars. In my ~$2k range I suspect the MG 1.7's are unbeatable. And I suspect at $6k the MG 3.7i's are unbeatable too.

  8. #33
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    I wish Filecat13 would drop in, he was the resident JBL gooru.
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  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor View Post
    Though arguments here are changing my mind, I guess 'till recently I had a prejudice against horn speakers. In any case speakers much over $2k are out of the question for me.

    JohnMichael has a pair of JBL Studio 530 and is quite fond of them as of last report. They have compression driver tweeters crossed over at 1.5kH. They are pretty affordable.

    The other bias I have is for planars and specifically Magneplanars. In my ~$2k range I suspect the MG 1.7's are unbeatable. And I suspect at $6k the MG 3.7i's are unbeatable too.

    They are currently playing Beethoven's "Symphony No 9 'Choral'". A nice SACD of the London Symphony Orchestra Live. Still very impressed and the first speaker with a horn that I enjoy.
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  10. #35
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Will I will say that I have looked at the Studio 590 several times in the resent past as they have moved their page for the 590 to their Synthesis website(I guess they are calling it part of the Synthesis line now) and think they look really cool and are sure they would be dynamic which I am after I just have heard mixed reviews of how transparent and detailed they are. I am all about being musical and true to live performance sound in my house which is what I am after over all else. I would love to here the Studio 590 just to see if they would work for me since they are actually under what I have so far allowed myself to spend for speakers.

    Floorstanding Loudspeakers - JBL Synthesis

    above is the Synthesis page with the 590's on it. There are other models in the under 10,000 dollar class but if I have heard right they are being phased out and not sure what is going to replace them.

    SoundStage! Access | SoundStageAccess.com (GoodSound.com) | SoundStage! Access | SoundStageAccess.com (GoodSound.com)

    Above is the LS series that they are phasing out and I am not sure what they are going to replace these with or at all.

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  11. #36
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    I didn't have a lot of respect for JBL only knowing what was in Best Buy and some vintage models I wasn't so impressed with, it was hearing the LS60 that had me do an about face. Then I knew JBL was capable of producing some excellent speakers.
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  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by harley .guy07 View Post
    I have for years as well thought of horns as a bad idea because of the likes of some Klipsch speakes that did not sound good to my ears but they are not the same as compression drivers. from my time in pro sound compression drivers are in a different league than just horn loaded tweeters. I have always had a soft spot for JBL speakers they just have never made a tower speaker that that I could afford that was anything like their over 10k stuff, its like they are two different companies.
    There is so much truth in this paragraph. Like Feanor, I didn't realize the difference between a horn loaded tweeter and a compression driver. Huge difference. Also, like many here, I always regarded JBL very lightly thanks to their horrible boxes they sell in BB. I was just never impressed. My friend that has the custom JBL speakers is an audiophile and electrical engineer that made his own custom amplifiers, (Sheffield Labs use his amps, btw). He has forgotten more about sound reproduction than I will ever know. There is a fundamental reason he and his brother (also an audiophile and ee) use JBL speakers even though their stereo store gave them access to IRS V's if they wanted. Both are typically German in their unwavering conviction to JBL drivers, so I'm not surprised that Mr. P's speakers sound as good as he says.

    I've been leaning towards the WP7's, but this thread is really making me rethink that and lean back towards the Array's. Still gotta find those 802D's to audition, tho...

  13. #38
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    Yes the compression driver and horn combination has been a real ear opener for me. I have been so impressed by the Studio 530's but others have dismissed them due to price. They have made me question if the dome tweeter is the best way to go.

    As far as transparency is concerned the speakers sound better with the grills removed. Even though they only cover the lower frequency drivers they still interfere with the sound. Once the grills are removed use the supplied panels to complete the geometry of the horn. My mid/woofer driver is always naked.

    I had read where the 590's are a little bass heavy. You might want to check out the 580's. I would like to hear the 570's since they have two of those small but incredible woofers.
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  14. #39
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    I have lately been wondering with my work in carpentry and my ability to get a lot of JBL pro sound drivers like the 2226H if I shouldn't just build and design my own. I have knowledge in circuit design and building crossovers and cabinets as well. It would make a speaker that I would normally never be able to afford and put it into my price range. I would use a JBL 2226H 15" driver and a compression driver and horn for the highs. If this is the way I am going to go I might start them within the next few months depending on my job placement. I have a friend that owns a body and paint shop that has told me in the past that as long as I did the sanding that he would do the finishing fiberglass and paint work.

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  15. #40
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    Harley, can you get cabinet blueprints/designs from JBL? I did have a bunch of EV cabinet plans I had for years but last time my basement got wet I threw them out with a box of various product info books. If you can get a plan from JBL they are really nice giving exact dimensions, port size etc.

    I even had one for a folded horn, the finished product would have been about the size of a refrigerator
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  16. #41
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    I haven't tried JBL directly. I have been seeing prints online for different designs using JBL woofers (2226H) and compression drivers from JBL and different manufacturers. I would not have thought JBL would help with these matters but they might. I have seen many options online for designs. I am going to take my time and look at different designs to see what will work the best in my room and with my system and personal preferences. I am not sure if one woofer per speaker or 2 in a D Appolito orangement will work best.

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  17. #42
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    You'd have to deal with the Pro side where you buy the raw drivers. They should have some cabinet plans. Unless you have a really big room I'd suspect a single woofer would be fine.

    My wife sure didn't like the 4367 looks as well as the more slim F52. I about fainted when she voluntarily gave the Studio 2 a compliment on looks. I should have jumped on that opportunity, LOL. I just couldn't afford them. I got a better deal with the 4367. I've got no regrets sound wise.
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  18. #43
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    I have tried to find the plans you have talked about Mr. p but to no luck. I have been on JBLs pro website and haven't found anything yet. Let me know if you know where they exist. thanks

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  19. #44
    Forum Regular harley .guy07's Avatar
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    Actually I found the file at JBL. Thanks Mr P. It will be a bit before I get started but when I do I will keep the site posted.

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  20. #45
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    I'm glad you found it. I haven't had a chance to look. It's been a tough year so far for me. I was in the hospital for 3 nights getting IV antibiotics for some infection in the side of my face, earlier this month. Then my younger brother died on 2/14 of a heart attack. He was 46. He was a big guy and had some not so good habits but it caught me by surprise and seems so unreal.
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  21. #46
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    I'm glad you found it. I haven't had a chance to look. It's been a tough year so far for me. I was in the hospital for 3 nights getting IV antibiotics for some infection in the side of my face, earlier this month. Then my younger brother died on 2/14 of a heart attack. He was 46. He was a big guy and had some not so good habits but it caught me by surprise and seems so unreal.
    Sorry to hear about your brother, Mr P. It must a have been a shock for everyone. My condolences to the family.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    I'm glad you found it. I haven't had a chance to look. It's been a tough year so far for me. I was in the hospital for 3 nights getting IV antibiotics for some infection in the side of my face, earlier this month. Then my younger brother died on 2/14 of a heart attack. He was 46. He was a big guy and had some not so good habits but it caught me by surprise and seems so unreal.
    My condolences to you and your family on the death of your brother. Wishing you a speedy recovery.
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    Bryan, sorry to hear about your brother. I lost my brother unexpectedly 2 years ago. My thoughts are with you.

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  24. #49
    Forum Regular Jack in Wilmington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody View Post
    I'm glad you found it. I haven't had a chance to look. It's been a tough year so far for me. I was in the hospital for 3 nights getting IV antibiotics for some infection in the side of my face, earlier this month. Then my younger brother died on 2/14 of a heart attack. He was 46. He was a big guy and had some not so good habits but it caught me by surprise and seems so unreal.
    So sorry about the loss of your brother. I only have my brother left and we've never been closer and that may be because we don't have anybody else. Take care of yourself because we would miss you like a brother.
    Mr Peabody likes this.
    2 Channel System
    Dynaudio Contour 1.8 Mk II
    Pass Labs X150.5 (Amp)
    Cary SLP-03 (Preamp)
    Music Hall MMF 5.1 (TT)
    Goldring 1012GX (Cart.)
    Pro-ject SE II (Phono Box)
    Rotel RCD-1072 (CD Player)
    Bryston BDA-1 ( DAC )
    Sennheiser HD-600 (Headphones)
    Musical Fidelity Xcan V3 (Headphone Amp) _

    HT System
    Usher X-719 (Mains)
    Usher X-616 (Center)
    Usher S-520 (Surrounds)
    Rel T2 (Subwoofer)
    Anthem MCA20 (Amp)
    Yamaha RX-A830 (Receiver)
    Panasonic TH-46PZ85U (Plasma TV)
    Denon DBT-1713UD (BluRay/SACD)

  25. #50
    Forum Regular
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    St. Louis, MO, USA
    Posts
    10,178
    Thanks guys, I appreciate it.
    Mark Levinson #512 SACD & 532h power
    Pass Labs XP-10 preamp
    Clearaudio Performance DC & Maestro v2 E, AcousTech Ph-1p
    Clarus Crimson loom - AC outlet to speaker terminal
    JBL 4367's & SAM3ha
    Revel S30's & SVS PC13 Ultra (sub)
    Marantz BD-7003 > AV-8003 > LINN 5125
    Transparent cables / Tributaries HDMI
    PS Audio Quintet & Surgex SA15&20

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