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  1. #1
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Small Request for websites and speaker advice



    Hello fellas, i might be looking for a new speaker systems and need some of your guys brains. The Grand is so far the best i have heard by a margin, but the system has these shortcommings.

    1. When fully up and running takes alone 24KW of power upon turn on.
    2. Has 8 Krell power amplifiers which, lets face it, is insane.
    3. Requires over 100m2 room

    Now, i know of Audiogon, High End Palace and Higher Fi.

    My price is about 50K give or take on a new uses speaker. Currently i am possibly considereing Von Schweikert VR9SE, VR10MKII, Genesis 1.1, possibly Soundlab Majestic (but thats too tall). Any pointers to other interesting systems?

    PS: It aint a joke ;-)
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  2. #2
    Do What? jrhymeammo's Avatar
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    I was going to say VR9SE so you can play with tubes only system. If I was in your position, I would stop searching for the ultimate system...well cuz you already did.

    Would Flo be interested in SET setup?

    JRA

  3. #3
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Yeah, that would be intersting. I thought of maybe trying out a Einstein OTL amp. I looked at the new Evolution mmThree speakers. That looks tasty. You know, since i reached the top in speakers i realised that its just insane to go that high. The running cost of the system might as well be a downpayment of a car.

    The system should be runnable with a 100 watt amp, needs true fullrange sound tough. At least 14Hz flat and massive power handling obviously.

    :-)
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  4. #4
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Wish I could pay back all the help you've given me, but this is out of my range. I'll be watching close though. Good luck Flo.
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  5. #5
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    Wish I could pay back all the help you've given me, but this is out of my range. I'll be watching close though. Good luck Flo.
    Thanks GM, nothing is set in stone yet but the Grand is causing me to eat less, not a good sign ;-) I am afraid to sell them tough because i never heard anything like them. And if i sell them, i will never ever own another pair.

    -Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  6. #6
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    no more Apogee? no way!

    I have no suggestions for someone as crazy as you though

    Good luck!

  7. #7
    Mutant from table 9
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    Has anyone ever seen the episode of South Park where Cartman buys the amusement park for like million dollars, but then finds out about all the hidden costs and has to start letting other people in.
    ______________________
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  8. #8
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumpBuster
    Has anyone ever seen the episode of South Park where Cartman buys the amusement park for like million dollars, but then finds out about all the hidden costs and has to start letting other people in.
    Lol, i love Southpark and in a way its true :-) I wish i would hear a decent class d amp, that would be an interesting option,
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  9. #9
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Hey Flo

    A sad day to be sure when reality rears its ugly head and all of us have gone through it.

    My initial thought is that you should probably stay away from panels since you've been to the mountaintop and I doubt anything else will compare suitably.I seem to remember you having some positive things to say about the Kharma line. Maybe the Midi-Grand Ceramique for roughly $30k? 91 db sensitivity gives you alot of options--a damn sight more than 8 freakin' Krells.

    Maybe go for some tubes as suggested. How's about a McIntosh MC2102 for $5-6k? I heard one of these doing some sweeeet stuff even on a Verity Parsifal which IMHO is a completely average though over-priced speaker.

    I remember a conversation we had regarding your affinity for TEAC transports so throw in an Esoteric DV-50 for some serious RBCD and 2-channel Hi-Rez digital.

    That should leave you some wiggle room for a pre, something I know virtually nothing about in a comparative sense.Man, it sure is fun spending your money Flo!

    Seriously, it sounds like the goal is to find something that offers the most benefits of your current system without the overbearing negatives of running the Niagara Falls Power Plant. Whatever happens, I hope you find something that makes you happy.

    Cheers

  10. #10
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Hey Flo. Have you tried out any of the Soundlab speakers? I have never heard a pair but have seen others write about how good they are. And at 8 ohms they shouldn't take as much juice to drive.

    http://www.soundlab-speakers.com/u1.htm
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  11. #11
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    OMG! Flo, what's happening?

    so there was a reason for the "has anyone heard these at a hifi show" thread...

    not that i have too much experience with them (i've heard some of them though)
    but, anyways.

    wilson audio maxx
    http://www.wilsonaudio.com/product/maxx/
    heard them and seen them, (logically), didn't they sound really good, but let's admit it, they're ugly.

    Canton Vento Reference 1
    http://www.canton.de/de-produktdetai...ference1dc.htm
    they are huge and sound amazing

    focal-JM lab Nova utopia Be
    http://www.focal.tm.fr/accueil_en.htm (->home audio->Utopia Be->Nova et Alto Be-> click nova)
    only seen them,


    B&W nautilus speakers
    http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/...del%20Nautilus
    the 802's already catched me, so i think these will for sure. and they are beautiful.

    sonus faber things, don't know name anymore

    magnepan mg20.1

    or the von schweikert vr9se
    i heared the vr4SE once, and i already found them impressive.

    Greetings and good (read: best) luck,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  12. #12
    test the blind blindly emorphien's Avatar
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    Focal Utopia Be :drool:

    I think the Nova may be the one I've listened to.

  13. #13
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Well, i cant downgrade to a Nautilus 800 or a 20.1 Maggie, thats just not doable. No offense... ;-)

    I talked to Soundlab today, i would buy the Majestic but my ceeling is not tall enough :-( I am looking at a new Soundlab U1 with the new X panel, the Apogee Synergy, Van Schweikert VR10 MKII (kinda big tough), Sonus Faber Stradivari Homage and the Wilson Audio Grand Slam III......will see where this leads us

    Any of you heard a Kora tube amp or the new Conrad Johnsons?
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  14. #14
    Class of the clown GMichael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florian
    Well, i cant downgrade to a Nautilus 800 or a 20.1 Maggie, thats just not doable. No offense... ;-)

    I talked to Soundlab today, i would buy the Majestic but my ceeling is not tall enough :-( I am looking at a new Soundlab U1 with the new X panel, the Apogee Synergy, Van Schweikert VR10 MKII (kinda big tough), Sonus Faber Stradivari Homage and the Wilson Audio Grand Slam III......will see where this leads us

    Any of you heard a Kora tube amp or the new Conrad Johnsons?
    Have you PM's E-stat to get his input on the U-1's?

    I knew you wouldn't go back to the 20.1's. Those were like 2 or 3 speakers ago right?
    WARNING! - The Surgeon General has determined that, time spent listening to music is not deducted from one's lifespan.

  15. #15
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMichael
    Have you PM's E-stat to get his input on the U-1's?

    I knew you wouldn't go back to the 20.1's. Those were like 2 or 3 speakers ago right?
    I am gonna PM E-Stat and hope to have a chat with him. The 20.1 is a really good speaker, but after that comes the Apogee DIVA; then the Fullrange....then loooong comes nothing and then comes the Grand ;-)

    I am looking at the following

    Pathos In Control Pre Amp
    Pathos In the Groove Phono Pre
    Pathos In Power Monoblocks
    Analysis Amphitron or the likes......
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  16. #16
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florian
    Well, i cant downgrade to a Nautilus 800 or a 20.1 Maggie, thats just not doable. No offense... ;-)

    i kinda knew you were going to say that, however, i didn't mean the nautilus 800, i ment The nautilus, this one

    http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/...del%20Nautilus

    the von schweikert might suit you more, what about Kharma?

    Greetings,
    Bert.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  17. #17
    Tyler Acoustics Fan drseid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Florian


    Hello fellas, i might be looking for a new speaker systems and need some of your guys brains. The Grand is so far the best i have heard by a margin, but the system has these shortcommings.

    1. When fully up and running takes alone 24KW of power upon turn on.
    2. Has 8 Krell power amplifiers which, lets face it, is insane.
    3. Requires over 100m2 room

    Now, i know of Audiogon, High End Palace and Higher Fi.

    My price is about 50K give or take on a new uses speaker. Currently i am possibly considereing Von Schweikert VR9SE, VR10MKII, Genesis 1.1, possibly Soundlab Majestic (but thats too tall). Any pointers to other interesting systems?

    PS: It aint a joke ;-)
    At that price range the VR9 is the best I have heard (so to my ears you are already on the right track).

    ---Dave
    Integra DHC-40.2 Pre/Pro
    Coda 2 X 200 Watt Amp
    Rotel RB-985 5 X 100 Watt Amp
    2 Tyler Acoustics 2 Piece Linbrook Signature System
    1 Tyler Linbrook Signature Center Channel
    3 Tyler Taylo Reference Monitors
    1 ACI Titan II Sub
    Toshiba HD-A1 HD DVD
    Panasonic BDT-210 + 350 Blu-ray
    Consonance Droplet CDP-5.0
    Sony 55NX-810 1080p 3D-LED HDTV

    Office:
    Opera Audio Consonance CD-120
    Jolida 1301A 2 X 30 Watt Int. Amp (Sovtek Tubes)
    Opera Audio Consonance Eric-1 Speakers

  18. #18
    Crackhead Extraordinaire Dusty Chalk's Avatar
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    US$50K puts the Focal Utopia Be out of your range, but the Micro Utopia + sub might be doable.

    The 14Hz will be the hard part. I think the high end pretty much assumes you'll be using a sub at that point. So concentrate on a sub that has a high level of integration.

    I would also put the following on my shortlist, were this me:

    Kharma
    Reference 3a
    Meridian DSP series
    Focal Utopia series -- even the Nova and Diva are extremely good speakers
    Soliloquy (I think their current flagship is the 6.5is...only goes down to 22 Hz, though -- if you don't need those last 8 Hz, you could do without a sub)
    PMC
    Shahinian -- completely different design approach, not for everyone
    Quad
    Martin Logan

    8 Krell power amplifiers is insane. I understand your desire to downsize. Maybe you ought to switch to McIntosh? Why do you need so many?
    Eschew fascism.
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    Peter aka Dusty Chalk

  19. #19
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
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    Hey Dusty,

    i can get that Utopia BE easily for less in Germany but thats one of my primary speakers i would never buy ;-) I had a listen to the Genesis 201 and the big Odeon Horn a few days ago and decided to keep the Grand. I have not posted a response yet, i am sorry.

    The reason for the 8 Krells is simple. My speakers do not use a passive crossover and are 4 way fully active. All poweramps run directly to the drivers and no parts in between. Ribbons need a lot of power and very stable amps to really run. The system does over 120db at 16ft distance fullrange ;-)

    I looked at many different designs but i just cant get away from the Grand, couldnt find something that is at acceptable distance. I recommend that people check out the Odeon Horns tough, that was quite different.

    -Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

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