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  1. #1
    IRG
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    Paradigm Monitor series questions...

    I am sure this has been posted somewhere before, but my search wasn't helpful.

    Anyway, I am curious about the Paradugm Monitor series, I never considered it before (and didn't think I had a local dealer, and now I do). I have heard great things about the Reference series (which the dealer also sells) but it is a bit out of my price range new.

    Right now my dealer is selling what is left of the Monitor Series v3 at better prices. The Monitor 7 (floorstander) would be $580, normally $750. The larger bookshelf, the Monitor 5 he doesn't have in stock (he told me he has only ordered that speaker one or two times) so a new version4 would be the same price, $580. From what I have learned, there are some differences in the corssovers, and slight cosmetic changes, but otherwise, probably nothing of real significance. The Mini monitor is $400 and the Monitor 3 is $480, both would be discounted if I buy soon.

    Any and all comments on the Monitor series would be welcome. For background, I have a NAD T-743 receiver, a new sub is also in the works, room size is 13 x 19, and this will be used 80% HT/tv viewing, 20% music, with the emphasis on music even though it gets used for that less. Music varies from aggresive alternative rock to classical, some blues and jazz, and some popular country (the wife). I am not giving myself a normal budget, as I have a few other expenses floating around, but $600 is probably my limit.

    Is there a speaker in the Monitor line to avoid? One that shines above the others? If so why? I should say I sort of like the Monitor 7 because I wouldn't need stands (although I like the look of monitors on nice stands) and in my house 2 kids, one on the way, that would prevent some problems (yes, they have been toppled off before). I haven't done any serious music testing yet, obviously I will do so. Sometimes it helps to get some advice before hand, on what to listen for. Thanks y'all.

  2. #2
    3db
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    I went looking at the Monitor series

    and I was fairly impressed. Then I stumbled across PSB Image series and never looked back. Generally, I found the PSB's to have a tighter and deeper bass than the Monitor series and I found the tweeters on the Image series not be as bright as the Monitor series. They both have awesome midrange and image well

  3. #3
    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by 3db
    and I was fairly impressed. Then I stumbled across PSB Image series and never looked back. Generally, I found the PSB's to have a tighter and deeper bass than the Monitor series and I found the tweeters on the Image series not be as bright as the Monitor series. They both have awesome midrange and image well
    Thanks dB. My other dealer sells PSB, and so I will be listening there too. In addition, that dealer also sells Monitor Audio, Boston Acoustics and Klipsch. They seem to prefer the Monitor Audio overall, but everyone has their preferences. The Paradigm dealer also sells Energy (what I have now) and Revell (very nice, but pricey) and Definitive Technology (no interest for me).

    You mentioned the tweeter on the PSB as not as bright. If anything, I would prefer something a little more sizzle than my Energy. So I may actually prefer the Paradigm. My PSB dealer also felt that they two brands (Paradigm and PSB) were pretty similar, and they have been selling PSB for quite a while. I wish I have a B&W dealer locally. The closest one is about an hour or so away, and I am interested in the 602 S3. May have to make a trip to hear them too.

  4. #4
    Forum Regular axelsrd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    I am sure this has been posted somewhere before, but my search wasn't helpful.

    Anyway, I am curious about the Paradugm Monitor series, I never considered it before (and didn't think I had a local dealer, and now I do). I have heard great things about the Reference series (which the dealer also sells) but it is a bit out of my price range new.

    Right now my dealer is selling what is left of the Monitor Series v3 at better prices. The Monitor 7 (floorstander) would be $580, normally $750. The larger bookshelf, the Monitor 5 he doesn't have in stock (he told me he has only ordered that speaker one or two times) so a new version4 would be the same price, $580. From what I have learned, there are some differences in the corssovers, and slight cosmetic changes, but otherwise, probably nothing of real significance. The Mini monitor is $400 and the Monitor 3 is $480, both would be discounted if I buy soon.

    Any and all comments on the Monitor series would be welcome. For background, I have a NAD T-743 receiver, a new sub is also in the works, room size is 13 x 19, and this will be used 80% HT/tv viewing, 20% music, with the emphasis on music even though it gets used for that less. Music varies from aggresive alternative rock to classical, some blues and jazz, and some popular country (the wife). I am not giving myself a normal budget, as I have a few other expenses floating around, but $600 is probably my limit.

    Is there a speaker in the Monitor line to avoid? One that shines above the others? If so why? I should say I sort of like the Monitor 7 because I wouldn't need stands (although I like the look of monitors on nice stands) and in my house 2 kids, one on the way, that would prevent some problems (yes, they have been toppled off before). I haven't done any serious music testing yet, obviously I will do so. Sometimes it helps to get some advice before hand, on what to listen for. Thanks y'all.
    I have monitor 7's up front, mini monitors for rear and cc370 center and I absolutely love them. I don't know what else to tell you. These are some very fine speakers. I had considered the monitor 5's at one time but they are nothing more than a monitor 3 in a bigger box. I also found out from a dealer in Indiana that there were some problems with the 5's and they weren't sonically up to paradigm standards. Don't remember what the problem was but the dealer won't even recommend them anymore. And besides, you are getting the 7's at a fery good price.

  5. #5
    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by axelsrd
    I have monitor 7's up front, mini monitors for rear and cc370 center and I absolutely love them. I don't know what else to tell you. These are some very fine speakers. I had considered the monitor 5's at one time but they are nothing more than a monitor 3 in a bigger box. I also found out from a dealer in Indiana that there were some problems with the 5's and they weren't sonically up to paradigm standards. Don't remember what the problem was but the dealer won't even recommend them anymore. And besides, you are getting the 7's at a fery good price.
    Interesting about the Monitor 5s. Maybe that was why my dealer almost never sells or orders them either. At $580 that seems to be a pretty ood price on the 7s. Not sure if I can get by without them being shielded. I will have to check tonite. Where in Indiana are you? I went to grad school at IUPUI in Indy. Nice city, seemed to be improving a lot by the time I left.

  6. #6
    Forum Regular axelsrd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    Interesting about the Monitor 5s. Maybe that was why my dealer almost never sells or orders them either. At $580 that seems to be a pretty ood price on the 7s. Not sure if I can get by without them being shielded. I will have to check tonite. Where in Indiana are you? I went to grad school at IUPUI in Indy. Nice city, seemed to be improving a lot by the time I left.
    I don't live in Indiana. I was working with a dealer to have them shipped to Atlanta to see if it would be cheaper to pay him shipping as apposed to paying the sales tax here. I ended up buying local and paying the tax. I auditioned the 7's, 9's and 11's side by side bouncing back and forth. The 9's had a bit better bass as they use two 8" vs two 6.5". The 11's, well, I couldn't hear any difference between them and the 7's so I ended up with the 7's at $659 out the door and never looked back. I didn't need the extra low end because I use a sub. I can't tell you how to spend your money other than stay away from the 5's.

  7. #7
    Forum Regular axelsrd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    Not sure if I can get by without them being shielded.
    If you have a projection tv it won't matter.

  8. #8
    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by axelsrd
    If you have a projection tv it won't matter.
    No I have a regular flat screen tube unit. Where in Atlanta do you live? My wife is from Marietta, and we might move back to that area in another year. I like it, except for the traffic. Are there any good audio shops in the area? There must be, given its size. If not, maybe I will open my own shop, then I can switch gear all the time!

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    IRG -

    I currently use Mini-Monitors (V1) with the PS-1000 sub. They are great.

    Recently I considered buying a pair of Monitor 7s on ebay, which went for $275. I went to my local Paradigm dealer and auditioned the Minis and 7s side by side. Was there a difference? Without a sub involved the 7s had more bass than the Minis (obviously). With a sub, there was a difference, but not much. Little better mid range with the 7s, better imaging. But to me, it wasn't a $275 improvement, so I didn't buy the 7s.

    My opinion is, if you are using your speakers for 80% HT, and you are using a sub, the Monitor 7s won't be that much better to justify the cost.

  10. #10
    IRG
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    Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by bikehikefish
    IRG -

    I currently use Mini-Monitors (V1) with the PS-1000 sub. They are great.

    Recently I considered buying a pair of Monitor 7s on ebay, which went for $275. I went to my local Paradigm dealer and auditioned the Minis and 7s side by side. Was there a difference? Without a sub involved the 7s had more bass than the Minis (obviously). With a sub, there was a difference, but not much. Little better mid range with the 7s, better imaging. But to me, it wasn't a $275 improvement, so I didn't buy the 7s.

    My opinion is, if you are using your speakers for 80% HT, and you are using a sub, the Monitor 7s won't be that much better to justify the cost.
    Thanks, I appreciate your comments. I suspect what you are saying is probably pretty close to what I would find too. In a bigger room, I could see the 7s making more sense as well. This is a small/medium sized room.

    I am still considering a pair of JM Labs Chorus 706 S as well. Another dealer has them for a good price. Plus I wouldn't pay tax either, which adds up in NYS (8.25%). But I do like to support local dealers if possible. Hopefully this weekend I will be able to do some listening to see if anything grabs me.

  11. #11
    Forum Regular axelsrd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    No I have a regular flat screen tube unit. Where in Atlanta do you live? My wife is from Marietta, and we might move back to that area in another year. I like it, except for the traffic. Are there any good audio shops in the area? There must be, given its size. If not, maybe I will open my own shop, then I can switch gear all the time!
    Now this is getting weird...I live in Marietta but I am being transfered to New Orleans. Have to be there on the 11th. Anyway, bikehikefish has a good point, if it is a small room then maybe mini monitors up front and maybe a pair of Titans for rear and of course a center and sub. This is the setup I had before I moved the minis back and got the 7's.

  12. #12
    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by axelsrd
    Now this is getting weird...I live in Marietta but I am being transfered to New Orleans. Have to be there on the 11th. Anyway, bikehikefish has a good point, if it is a small room then maybe mini monitors up front and maybe a pair of Titans for rear and of course a center and sub. This is the setup I had before I moved the minis back and got the 7's.
    Does anyone like the Monitor 3 over the minimonitor? At this price point, I can get the JMLabs Chorus 706 S for about the same price, and I would probably go for those. TOugh to decide when I can't hear both back to back. Good luck with the move to New Orleans. I've never been there, but will be there in May for a conference. Supposed to be a fun town!

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    I like Paradigm speakers; I'm a Reference Studio owner. And Paradigm's Monitor series are not bad speakers at all for the price. But to my way of thinking, JMLab Chorus series speakers are a step or two up from Paradigm's Monitor series. And IMO they are much nicer to look at. Assuming you really like the sound of the JMLab, go with those over the Paradigm Monitors.

  14. #14
    cam
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    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    Does anyone like the Monitor 3 over the minimonitor? At this price point, I can get the JMLabs Chorus 706 S for about the same price, and I would probably go for those. TOugh to decide when I can't hear both back to back. Good luck with the move to New Orleans. I've never been there, but will be there in May for a conference. Supposed to be a fun town!
    I have auditioned all the monitors and ended up buying the 7's. Reason I did, besides the sound, was that I wouldn't need stands. The 9's and 11's were more money with no real improvement. If I had to buy a standmount I would have bought the 3's although I would have been satisfied with the mini's. The 5's sounded thin and less dynamic and to be perfectly honest, looked very goofy on stands. The 3's on the other hand are a tad fat which may need a little getting use to visually, but sound very full and can take alot of abuse. One thing to consider here is the speaker efficiency, example, the mini's are 90db 1/w1/m, while the 7's are 93db. If you had a 75 watt amplifier powering the 7's, to reach the same volume with the mini's you would need a 150 watt amp. Having the 7's can save you from having to buy more power down the road. Just a thought.
    Last edited by cam; 03-31-2005 at 07:16 PM.

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    IRG
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasmit
    I like Paradigm speakers; I'm a Reference Studio owner. And Paradigm's Monitor series are not bad speakers at all for the price. But to my way of thinking, JMLab Chorus series speakers are a step or two up from Paradigm's Monitor series. And IMO they are much nicer to look at. Assuming you really like the sound of the JMLab, go with those over the Paradigm Monitors.
    That is kind of what I have been thinking lately too. The Monitor's seem nice enough but they really aren't much of a step up from what I have now, and don't look as nice either (got to keep the wife happy). The JM Labs do look nice, and the Monitor Audio Silver look even better. I would like to demo the B&Ws before I make any decision, but not sure when I can do that. I may look at the PSB Image speakers too, another decent speaker in this category, and something that is local. Still looking...

  16. #16
    Forum Regular thepogue's Avatar
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    if you enjoy "sizzle" in your upper end...

    B&W would not impress you...in fact they tend to be layed back...smooth as butter...well worth a listen but not as all sizzling...

    Good Luck! Peace, Pogue


    Quote Originally Posted by IRG
    Thanks dB. My other dealer sells PSB, and so I will be listening there too. In addition, that dealer also sells Monitor Audio, Boston Acoustics and Klipsch. They seem to prefer the Monitor Audio overall, but everyone has their preferences. The Paradigm dealer also sells Energy (what I have now) and Revell (very nice, but pricey) and Definitive Technology (no interest for me).

    You mentioned the tweeter on the PSB as not as bright. If anything, I would prefer something a little more sizzle than my Energy. So I may actually prefer the Paradigm. My PSB dealer also felt that they two brands (Paradigm and PSB) were pretty similar, and they have been selling PSB for quite a while. I wish I have a B&W dealer locally. The closest one is about an hour or so away, and I am interested in the 602 S3. May have to make a trip to hear them too.
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    My own preference in the Monitor line is for the Monitor 5's or the Mini Monitors...If a sub is DEFINITELY in the mix, cross it over at 60 Hz or below and don't look back...The larger ones tend to have some cabinet resonance issues in my opinion...
    PSB and Energy have comparable products in my opinion that have just a slightly different flavour than the Monitors, not better or worse, just different. If you're looking for a bit more sizzle a the top, the Monitor line is as much sizzle as I'd care to try without it becoming harsh...

    For home theater use more than 2-channel stereo use, I see no reason to spend more money on the larger speakers (unless your room is huge)...the best value would be in the Mini Monitors and as good a sub as you can buy...
    Good luck.

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    cam
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    Quote Originally Posted by kexodusc
    My own preference in the Monitor line is for the Monitor 5's or the Mini Monitors...If a sub is DEFINITELY in the mix, cross it over at 60 Hz or below and don't look back...The larger ones tend to have some cabinet resonance issues in my opinion...
    PSB and Energy have comparable products in my opinion that have just a slightly different flavour than the Monitors, not better or worse, just different. If you're looking for a bit more sizzle a the top, the Monitor line is as much sizzle as I'd care to try without it becoming harsh...

    For home theater use more than 2-channel stereo use, I see no reason to spend more money on the larger speakers (unless your room is huge)...the best value would be in the Mini Monitors and as good a sub as you can buy...
    Good luck.
    Hey Kex, I agree that the mini's coupled together with a capable sub would meet most peoples needs. The mini's are a very good recommendation. You say your preference would be for the 5's, I'm just wondering though, have you actually heard them, I know you have the studio 40's so maybe you are biased towards this style of standmount. Both RGA and I would most definetaly recommend the less expensive 3 over the 5. The 3 sounds alot better in everyway (to me) and save you some money as well. Maybe the studio line the 40's are better then the 20's but maybe in the monitor line the 5's are a step back from the 3's. For the most part, I have never heard anyone say anything good about the 5's except you and Wooch and both you guys have the 40's. Hmmmm, I heard the 5's and believe me you, they suck, and I'm not surprised they have sold so poorly.

  19. #19
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cam
    Hey Kex, I agree that the mini's coupled together with a capable sub would meet most peoples needs. The mini's are a very good recommendation. You say your preference would be for the 5's, I'm just wondering though, have you actually heard them, I know you have the studio 40's so maybe you are biased towards this style of standmount. Both RGA and I would most definetaly recommend the less expensive 3 over the 5. The 3 sounds alot better in everyway (to me) and save you some money as well. Maybe the studio line the 40's are better then the 20's but maybe in the monitor line the 5's are a step back from the 3's. For the most part, I have never heard anyone say anything good about the 5's except you and Wooch and both you guys have the 40's. Hmmmm, I heard the 5's and believe me you, they suck, and I'm not surprised they have sold so poorly.
    That's interesting because my understanding is that the Monitor 3 is one of the poorest sellers in the Monitor lineup. Generally, I liked the Monitor 5 the best in the Monitor lineup, although the Monitor 3 and 11 are the two models that I have not listened to. In my listenings, the 5 had the best overall balance, with less of the resonance and other liabilities that I picked up from the tower models. Kex and I are not alone in this assessment either, as The Absolute Sound rated it as a best buy on their recommended components list a couple of years ago, and I've seen plenty of positive impressions of the 5s on this and other boards.

  20. #20
    cam
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer
    That's interesting because my understanding is that the Monitor 3 is one of the poorest sellers in the Monitor lineup. Generally, I liked the Monitor 5 the best in the Monitor lineup, although the Monitor 3 and 11 are the two models that I have not listened to. In my listenings, the 5 had the best overall balance, with less of the resonance and other liabilities that I picked up from the tower models. Kex and I are not alone in this assessment either, as The Absolute Sound rated it as a best buy on their recommended components list a couple of years ago, and I've seen plenty of positive impressions of the 5s on this and other boards.
    Absolute Sound can rate any product as a best buy, but when total sales are concerned, the 5's sell poorly. And you are right, the 3's don't sell that well also, it seems that the mini's get all the attention. And why not, they do sound good and they are the perfect size, visually, on 22 to 24 inch stands. If you listen to the mini's extensively to the 3's with some material you are familiar with, you will notice that the overall sense of depth and clarity goes to the 3's, and for only $50 more, atleast in my area. Notice the specs between the mini's and the 3's are similar, yet a more dynamic sound can be had with the 3's. I did listen extensively to both and regardless of total sales, the 3's sound better. The 5's sound thin and less dynamic, and I can only assume because they don't sell very many, that alot of people are hearing the same thing I am. Many Paradigm sales people I have dealt with have said the same thing, they have a tough time selling those 5's, and if they were as good as you say, then they would be having a tough time having them in stock.........., or maybe no one is buying them so they don't bother stocking them. Just so no one flames me, if you own the 5's, they are a good speaker, in fact all the monitors are good, (the studios are better in every way), it is just a matter of personal taste in evaluating them in order of better to best. For standmounts 1st - 3's, 2nd - mini's, and 3rd - 5's. For floorstanders you could choose either the 7's, 9's or 11's but for the money, if you would buy anything more then the 7's, your money would be better spent on the studio line. Of course everything I have said is my own preference.

  21. #21
    RGA
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    How did you know I liked the 3's more than the 5's? Quantity of sales has zip to do with quality ie Bose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    Cam

    How did you know I liked the 3's more than the 5's? Quantity of sales has zip to do with quality ie Bose.
    Previous threads you stated what I had already experienced. The 3's sound really good. It does use an 8 inch driver which might be the reason, but I never felt that the 9's with dual 8 inch drivers over the 7's with dual 6.5's was any better. Again, just my personal preference. And when I bought my 7's, if the 9's were better, I would have spent the extra $200 since my wife had already givin me the go ahead.

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    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cam
    Absolute Sound can rate any product as a best buy, but when total sales are concerned, the 5's sell poorly. And you are right, the 3's don't sell that well also, it seems that the mini's get all the attention. And why not, they do sound good and they are the perfect size, visually, on 22 to 24 inch stands. If you listen to the mini's extensively to the 3's with some material you are familiar with, you will notice that the overall sense of depth and clarity goes to the 3's, and for only $50 more, atleast in my area. Notice the specs between the mini's and the 3's are similar, yet a more dynamic sound can be had with the 3's. I did listen extensively to both and regardless of total sales, the 3's sound better. The 5's sound thin and less dynamic, and I can only assume because they don't sell very many, that alot of people are hearing the same thing I am. Many Paradigm sales people I have dealt with have said the same thing, they have a tough time selling those 5's, and if they were as good as you say, then they would be having a tough time having them in stock.........., or maybe no one is buying them so they don't bother stocking them. Just so no one flames me, if you own the 5's, they are a good speaker, in fact all the monitors are good, (the studios are better in every way), it is just a matter of personal taste in evaluating them in order of better to best. For standmounts 1st - 3's, 2nd - mini's, and 3rd - 5's. For floorstanders you could choose either the 7's, 9's or 11's but for the money, if you would buy anything more then the 7's, your money would be better spent on the studio line. Of course everything I have said is my own preference.
    I dunno, two of the dealers in my area (one of which closed last year) don't stock the Monitor 3 because from what they told me at least, the majority of their standmount customers pick between the Mini and the 5, and don't bother with the 3. In addition, the Monitor 5 is also frequently auditioned by customers who are considering the Monitor 7, because the driver configuration on the two speakers is identical. I much preferred the 5 over the 7, because in my listenings the 5 imaged better and it had less cabinet resonance than the 7.

    I pointed out the Absolute Sound review because you seem certain that few people outside of Kex and myself would like the 5. One review isn't the end all, but that plus my observations on this and other boards provides plenty of fodder to the contrary. It's fine to have your own preference, but reinforcing it by speculating on how few or how many people share your observations is a tangental presumption.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer
    I dunno, two of the dealers in my area (one of which closed last year) don't stock the Monitor 3 because from what they told me at least, the majority of their standmount customers pick between the Mini and the 5, and don't bother with the 3. In addition, the Monitor 5 is also frequently auditioned by customers who are considering the Monitor 7, because the driver configuration on the two speakers is identical. I much preferred the 5 over the 7, because in my listenings the 5 imaged better and it had less cabinet resonance than the 7.

    I pointed out the Absolute Sound review because you seem certain that few people outside of Kex and myself would like the 5. One review isn't the end all, but that plus my observations on this and other boards provides plenty of fodder to the contrary. It's fine to have your own preference, but reinforcing it by speculating on how few or how many people share your observations is a tangental presumption.
    You and Kex prefer the 5's over the other standmounts. Nothing wrong with that. Just as a few people such as Rga and I prefer the 3's. All four of us are in the minority. The 3's and the 5's do not sell in quantity as the mini's and 7's. If you listen to these boards, people own the mini's, 7's and 11's the most. If the 5's sold well such as the 40's, these boards would be full of monitor 5 enquiries and questions. They are not. Nobody talks about the 3's either, but to me they are a definate improvement for the money over the mini's and 5's.

  25. #25
    RGA
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    Cam

    You are probably right -- A dealer in Qualicham the next town over from me carries Paradigm and they only carry the very entry Paradigm standmounts because they're cheap (Atom and Titan) and then they carry the 7,9 and Studio 100. They said people are unwilling to spend big dollars on the 20, 40 or even the 5 because the speakers don;t have enough bass and the 7 is only a little more than the 5 here ($125.00 more or so). The 40 they sat on for 18 months. They have a 705 though -- sold exactly one in the last 5 months.

    Most average folks do not listen to classical strings they listen to blue collar music --- so do I and it's no insult but Joe sixpack want AC/DC and he wants it loud with impact and a bit of box noise isn;t so bad if you get BALLS in your system. All of these standmounts have none of this in any credible way.

    If you get the chance to hear a Cerwin Vega D9 one day or one of the replacements which use a 15 inch woofer then you'll know what I mean -- They are by no means perfect with numerous obvious problems - but one can buy one of these PARTY speakers and I bet most people listening to the heavy rock are going to laugh at monitors and so they should. When you go to ANY nightclub they usually have some monster JBL with huge woofer and gigantic horn -- lots of them played real loud. Sorry but most monitors are not going to do that.

    He said selling a Monitor at $1300.00 versus a floorstander like the B&W 603S3 for ~$14000.00Cdn --- the customers were buying them at a clip of 20-1. And I can tell you right now that if it's between spending $2300.00 on the B&W 705 which is laughably pathetic with anything of bass or dynamic or dynamic bass content, and the B&W 604S3 which is reasonably competant in the bass for $2000.00 ($300.00 less money and I don't need to pay extra for for stands), there is simply no contest as to which one I would buy. The colouration offered up by the 604 is a good trade for the puny bass, dynamics offerred up by the 705.

    The sad part is that the Monitor 3 I would probably buy over the 705 as well...and the reason is that for the price difference I could buy a $2000.00 Rel Subwoofer for the differnece. Yeah maybe the 705 has a better tweeter but -- the 3/Rel combbo would kill it under 100hz.

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