B&W 703 Floorstanders

[gonefishin]

Thanks for your opinion. I did demo the 703's but should have also been looking at many other speakers in the price range.My lesson learned is simply"if it ain't broke don't fix it" The Proac speakers I replaced were fantastic.I had the right mix of equipment and the sound was special.Upgrading just for the sake of change can be a huge disappointment and waste of money.Lesson Learned!!!!!

Lesson learned? Then ask yourself why your traveling down that road again?





good luck

dan

[BillyB]

Lesson learned? Then ask yourself why your traveling down that road again?





good luck

dan

Now that I've invested $3000 on a speaker upgrade, I don't think spending another $700 to replace a 12 year old obsolete CDP is going down the same road.Of course I wish I bought the CDP first but too late for that.If I'm lucky the new CDP will show off the strengths of the B&W 703's.It's a chance I have to take.

[JohnMichael]

BillyB I feel your pain. When you have lived with a system for a long time and like it but you want to take that next step up it gets tricky. I have a 9 year old CDP and I will be replcaing it soon. I am concerned about throwing the system out of balance. Next I will be shopping for speakers. The few times I have not enjoyed listening to my system is when I had the wrong cables for the componets in use. I lean to changing cables to improve the sound. IMO silver plated copper cables and interconnects are bright. I would also work with speaker positioning others recommended. After all that is a free tweak. Check how you have the speakers toed in. Having the tweeters pointing at your listening position could give you too much high frequency. I would hate for you to take a loss if a simple fix will help.

[BillyB]

BillyB I feel your pain. When you have lived with a system for a long time and like it but you want to take that next step up it gets tricky. I have a 9 year old CDP and I will be replcaing it soon. I am concerned about throwing the system out of balance. Next I will be shopping for speakers. The few times I have not enjoyed listening to my system is when I had the wrong cables for the componets in use. I lean to changing cables to improve the sound. IMO silver plated copper cables and interconnects are bright. I would also work with speaker positioning others recommended. After all that is a free tweak. Check how you have the speakers toed in. Having the tweeters pointing at your listening position could give you too much high frequency. I would hate for you to take a loss if a simple fix will help.

It's pain indeed!!Those of us with limited finances simply can't replace equipment at our every whim. Purchases need to be thoroughly planned and I think sometimes you need a little luck.It's rare to be able to hear speakers your looking to buy with your exact mix of equipment and cables.Then of course there"s the acoustics of the stereo shop versus home.I truly thought the 703's were a good choice. I was shocked at how awful they sounded at home.When I mentioned this to my salesman he assured me they would tone down after a lengthy Burn-in.Well 2 years later they still hurt my ears!!!Thanks for the reply.

[RGA]

It's pain indeed!!Those of us with limited finances simply can't replace equipment at our every whim. Purchases need to be thoroughly planned and I think sometimes you need a little luck.It's rare to be able to hear speakers your looking to buy with your exact mix of equipment and cables.Then of course there"s the acoustics of the stereo shop versus home.I truly thought the 703's were a good choice. I was shocked at how awful they sounded at home.When I mentioned this to my salesman he assured me they would tone down after a lengthy Burn-in.Well 2 years later they still hurt my ears!!!Thanks for the reply.

I used to like B&W but the 700 series IMO is garbage. Whatever the reviews I have listened to this line several times at several locations and with quality gear. My front runner was B&W as i used to own a pair but my dealer www.soundhounds.com intrioduced me to stuff they sell but also buy for their own homes. B&W's 700 series is so truly bad IME, and following up ont he equally bad CM series that it is really really difficult for me not to compare them to Bose for the affluent. The 705 at $2300.00Cad is a bad speaker IMO and what's worse it's not jsut overpriced it is a good $1700.00 overpriced. At $500.00Cad it would STILL be unremarkable. Bright is the least of the problems.

[StanleyMuso]

Billy, I feel for you. In an ideal world with unlimited finances we could just keep changing gear until we were entirely satisfied. As it is, most of us with ordinary jobs and family commitments have to save for a long time, research as much as possible and hopefully find something which is value for money and satisfy us long term.

I too bought the 703s just a little over a year ago after searching for a number of years. I did not intend to get such an expensive speaker, but agreed to listen to them just to see what they were like. I also listened to their predecessors. Since a large part of my musical interest is classical and vocal, I always assumed I would end up with a speaker which had a soft dome silk tweeter because so many reviewers said they were good for such music, and that metal domes were shrill and harsh. In my years of listening I heard quite a few harsh metal dome tweeters, and had finally found a two way floor stander with Scandinavian made silk dome tweeter and woofers/mids (based on reviews which praised it highly) which I thought would suit my purpose. I went to the hi-fi shop to have a listen, and found I was disappointed. I then asked to listen to the 703 again. Side by side, the 703 was superior. The first set of speakers sounded muffled, as if the music was coming out of a box stuffed with cotton. The 703s were airy and clear. I could clearly hear every instrument, and every word sung, both male and female. I tried it against other speakers in the shop, went away for a couple of weeks and listened to other speakers in other shops. In the end, I couldn’t go past the 703s.

However, once I had them home, I had a serious case of buyer’s remorse – they sounded shrill and harsh. I thought I had made a terrible mistake. After about two weeks of solid playing, they settled down. I am now very pleased with their mid and high range performance. I had a lot more trouble with bass boom, and did a lot of experimenting with room placement and using different combinations of the bungs. I find that they sound best when placed a little over two feet away from the walls, and well out of the corners. I used a laser pointer to aim the tweeters, and have them aimed about two to three feet to the sides from where I sit. There are Persian rugs and painting on the walls, heavy drapes on the one window wall, several bookshelves and lots of soft furniture and rugs on the floor. These, I suppose, would be absorbing a lot of the high frequency energy.

To drive them, I’m using a Rotel pre-amp and a Musical Fidelity amp. I wonder if it’s the amp which is contributing to the good mid and upper sounds? Until I can afford something better, I’m using a Marantz DV4300 for both music and DVDs, and a Luxman tuner. As I said before, I’m now reasonably happy with their sound. It doesn’t stop me from wondering, of course, if I could have found something better in that price range. Guess one has to learn to be satisfied with what one’s got, otherwise it’s a never ending hunt for something better.

One final hint: I heard of at least one person who claimed to have tamed the harshness of the tweeters by placing tissue paper inside the wire covering of the tweeter so that the bottom half of the tweeter was covered. Perhaps this could help your situation. I personally have not tried this because, at least in my room, I don't need to.

[jocko_nc]

What Topspeed said... Take a look at the room considerations.

Being down in Atlanta over the holidays, I noticed my father-in-law has BW 703's. (Rather, I remembered what they looked like long enough to look them up.) I must say they sound pretty darn good. He has a good room, big with lots of attention to acoustics. It is a dedicated theatre room. As far as an amp, he has whatever the "flagship" Pioneer Elite model was about two years ago. I don't know that I would buy the 703's for the money, but his sound pretty good.

jocko

[BillyB]

Billy, I feel for you. In an ideal world with unlimited finances we could just keep changing gear until we were entirely satisfied. As it is, most of us with ordinary jobs and family commitments have to save for a long time, research as much as possible and hopefully find something which is value for money and satisfy us long term.

I too bought the 703s just a little over a year ago after searching for a number of years. I did not intend to get such an expensive speaker, but agreed to listen to them just to see what they were like. I also listened to their predecessors. Since a large part of my musical interest is classical and vocal, I always assumed I would end up with a speaker which had a soft dome silk tweeter because so many reviewers said they were good for such music, and that metal domes were shrill and harsh. In my years of listening I heard quite a few harsh metal dome tweeters, and had finally found a two way floor stander with Scandinavian made silk dome tweeter and woofers/mids (based on reviews which praised it highly) which I thought would suit my purpose. I went to the hi-fi shop to have a listen, and found I was disappointed. I then asked to listen to the 703 again. Side by side, the 703 was superior. The first set of speakers sounded muffled, as if the music was coming out of a box stuffed with cotton. The 703s were airy and clear. I could clearly hear every instrument, and every word sung, both male and female. I tried it against other speakers in the shop, went away for a couple of weeks and listened to other speakers in other shops. In the end, I couldn’t go past the 703s.

However, once I had them home, I had a serious case of buyer’s remorse – they sounded shrill and harsh. I thought I had made a terrible mistake. After about two weeks of solid playing, they settled down. I am now very pleased with their mid and high range performance. I had a lot more trouble with bass boom, and did a lot of experimenting with room placement and using different combinations of the bungs. I find that they sound best when placed a little over two feet away from the walls, and well out of the corners. I used a laser pointer to aim the tweeters, and have them aimed about two to three feet to the sides from where I sit. There are Persian rugs and painting on the walls, heavy drapes on the one window wall, several bookshelves and lots of soft furniture and rugs on the floor. These, I suppose, would be absorbing a lot of the high frequency energy.

To drive them, I’m using a Rotel pre-amp and a Musical Fidelity amp. I wonder if it’s the amp which is contributing to the good mid and upper sounds? Until I can afford something better, I’m using a Marantz DV4300 for both music and DVDs, and a Luxman tuner. As I said before, I’m now reasonably happy with their sound. It doesn’t stop me from wondering, of course, if I could have found something better in that price range. Guess one has to learn to be satisfied with what one’s got, otherwise it’s a never ending hunt for something better.

One final hint: I heard of at least one person who claimed to have tamed the harshness of the tweeters by placing tissue paper inside the wire covering of the tweeter so that the bottom half of the tweeter was covered. Perhaps this could help your situation. I personally have not tried this because, at least in my room, I don't need to.

I'm glad you have come to appreciate the 703's.They're a big investment.I find their reproduction of instruments to be very solid.My biggest complaint is with the FST midrange. It's too out front with vocals for me. I think this speaker is better suited for jazz and classical,the inherent edginess of rock and pop CD's is pronounced with the 703's.On the other hand a lot of people like these speakers. It comes down to personal taste,equipment,room acoustics, and music choice.I can't do much with acoustics.My listening room is my living room with looks being more important then acoustics.My room needs a warmer speaker so I'll have to sell my 703's at a loss and start over.I should be able to get at least $1500 for my 2 year old 703's. I'm going to limit myself to that amount for my new speaker purchase. I'm confident I can find an excellent speaker in that price range.My previous Proac 2-ways were $1300 and sounded sweet in this same room with the same components.Thanks for the reply and I'm glad the 703's settled in for you.
,

[BillyB]

I'm intrigued by your strong negative opinion of the B&W 700 series.You owned a pair of B&W's and it sounds like you liked them.The 703's were my second major speaker purchase,and I put too much emphasis on reviews and being wowed by the B&W name.While they get good reviews, those that don't like them all say the same thing.Too much top end!!! I truly don't think that dollar for dollar I could be any unhappier.I don't think a speaker should need perfect component interaction,room acoustics,placement, and CD choice to sound great let alone tolerable.Is a speaker this revealing good to anyone with less than perfect conditions??

[StanleyMuso]

these speakers are better for classics and jazz. Mine are used all the time for TV and DVD viewing, and as far as music goes, I listen mostly to jazz and classics, with some older pop - and mostly, for me the sound is great. I listen to Rock only occassionaly, so perhaps I missed noticing what you are experiencing. I'll put some on tonight and see if I can hear what you are describing. Perhaps I have been lucky in having such a well damped room. I can understand what a great disappointment they must be for you, especially bearing in mind their cost. Speakers are the most important part of ones system, so if they don't cut it for you, you will never be satified. I too tend to like a warmer speaker, and if I had more money, I think I might keep the 703s for the positives which they give me, but buy a second set for use with program materials which don't siute them. That's what one of my friends has done. He has one set of floor standers and another set of stand mounted bookshelf speakers, and alternates between them for different types of music. But then again, he also has a solid state pre-amp as well as a valve pre, which he also constantly alternates. Perhaps that's going overboard?

[RGA]

I'm intrigued by your strong negative opinion of the B&W 700 series.You owned a pair of B&W's and it sounds like you liked them.The 703's were my second major speaker purchase,and I put too much emphasis on reviews and being wowed by the B&W name.While they get good reviews, those that don't like them all say the same thing.Too much top end!!! I truly don't think that dollar for dollar I could be any unhappier.I don't think a speaker should need perfect component interaction,room acoustics,placement, and CD choice to sound great let alone tolerable.Is a speaker this revealing good to anyone with less than perfect conditions??

Equipment matters yes but every B&W owner I personally know - and they are and were many continaully are trying new amps and speakers to find something anything that will make them sound good. Sorry but while I know equipment makes a big difference after a while you have to look at the speakers. Rotel is more than an adequate match for B&W speakers which is why B&W shared importin to North America. While some makers will darken down the sound and sound better Rotel's separates (at least their power amps) should be more than enough to drive them without adding too much glare.

I owned the 302s back when i was moving to where my college was located I could not lug around my big top of the line Wharfedales - so I listened to practically every mainstream well reviewed budget ~$300.00Cdn standmounts as a tide me over. The 302 and the 602S2 were in the running and the 302 sounded better. It sounded better to me than most speakers up to $500.00 because it was a smart inventive little design witht he open backed port and a very nice vocal band. The 602 sounded bigger had more power and in most every way beat the 302 except for two things -- treble fatigue and cohesiveness. I don;t care how much bass and treble extension and "slam" you get - if you can hear the treble calling attention to itself or being etchy or the sound not sounding as one then it has problems. Not that the 302 was great in this regard but at the price it sure as hell was. I liked it way more than the new 303 as well.

The funny thing was when I traded the 302 in at soundhounds within 1hour and while I was still in the store another customer scooped them up. So I met the guy who bought my 302's it was a busy day and a few others noted including a salesperson that "why they got rid of this (302) for that new one was beyond all of us". I regret trading it in in many ways because after hearing so many other $500.00Cad speakers out there and how annoying most of them can be that 302 is looking and sounding like a little gem.

I was a huge B&W supporter and i still recommend many speakers from them. The CDM 2SE I liked better at $1200.00 than the $2k Totem model 1 for example.

Interestingly the 302 was the only speaker they made in a soft dome and a non kevlar driver. Umm yeah.

B&W is not the only company that over the last 5 years has really begun to show me they're just selling appearance and name recognition. I liked the CDM 1NT for about $1650.00Cad -- so when the 705 came out at $2300.00 nearly 50% more money one would hope for an improvement and in a couple of less important areas it is. But the bass and the dynamic bass and the dynamics are just abysmal. I suppose to be fair it depends what you compare them directly against. many B&W dealers in my province compare them against very similar designs offerring pretty much the same sound and it makes it very difficult to discenr much. If yoyu listen to 5 speakers and all have the same general design concept then people will talk about bass and treble...I did for years on this forum arguing for B&W over another brand..I would hear them head to head and one would sound to me that bit better so I would recommend it. Then comes a few no namers that just crushed them and for less money so I don;t get involved in the B&W versus that other one I blasted because the differences between the two are now seemingly so small and so unimportant that I wonder why I bothered arguuing them at all -- experience is the key.

My dealer soundhounds who is a big B&W dealer told me that it's almost good for people to own B&W and some of the similar speakers he sells for a while so that they will much more appreciate the stuff they think is actually worth buying. I have been only in this for 15 years now and I have bought stuff based on reviews or at least listened based off reviews so many times and most of the time I regretted it so I don't buy magazines anymore unless there is a particular article I want to see -- so maybe one issue every three years.

I think the B&W 600 series is a good starting point for beginning audiophiles - after that I would nto touch B&W with a ten foot pole. The N801 and N802 for the money are tough to swallow as well - hype hype and more hype but they just are not musically rewarding loudspeakers long haul -- they look great are seemingly well built but after hearing a few no name brands at half and 30% their price tag and I scratch my head in disbelief.

I still own my Wharfedale Vanguards from 1991 and no they are not a technically wonderous marvel in audiophile E's but at the same time they don't sound like constipated uninspired amusical bore inducing treble fatiguing overpriced hyped to the hilt speakers.

My Wharfedales are called the Vanguards and sold from 1988-1993 and were three way versions of the one in the link I am providing. The E-70 is from the 1970s and the Vanguard looks very similar but with one midrange unit (a much better one) and what looks like Fostex horn tweeter (no they sound nothing like Klipsch) and the Vanguard is much more solid in the bass 40hz-23khz but at level. Listen to any canadian made standmount claim 40hz and then listen to the vanguards claim of 40hz and you will know quickly why spec sheets and advertising is BS. The Wharfedale's soundstage is big (too big perhaps and it's imaging is nothing to write home about but what it does well the 703 could not carry the Vanguards bags. the Vanguard will pound it musically, dynamically, bass roomfillidness and that draw your toe to tapping quality and the ALIVE you will hear me and you will pay attention to what I'm playing, quality of the speaker is tough to deny. In terms of pure frequency response (and what is judged to be more accurate) they won't beat most of the newer speakers I have no doubt - but at the same time a LOT of Wharfedale Vanguards sold and I have never ever seen any on the used market ever. One repair place has seen a great many come in for re-rubberring and people abusing them because they play very very loud.

But everytime i go out to audition a speaker I say ok you beat the Wharfedale in soundstaging and imaging but what else you got. the answer is usually nothing. Now granted this was the top Wharfedale speaker and it was $2kUS in 1990 which probably means it would be $4k now but you get the idea. And by no means was the Wharfedale the only consideration - there were some Klipsch models (few admittedly) that were way more fun to listen to than some of these 6.5 inch stacked up below a 1 inch metal tweeter that just sound so wrong in the vocal band (nasal) and so dynamically inept. Anyway here is the link and the Vanguard is significantly better than the E70 but there is no Vanguard article. I bet the E-70 for the 150 pounds it would get on the used market would give any $3k B&W a real run and most of the $3ki speakers out there a real run in terms of MUSICAL satisfaction. The technical prowess maybe not but which is more important - being satisfied or showing firends white papers and graphs. http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/hfw/olde...fedalee70.html

Sorry about the rant but

[pdmonty1965]

I used to like B&W but the 700 series IMO is garbage. Whatever the reviews I have listened to this line several times at several locations and with quality gear. My front runner was B&W as i used to own a pair but my dealer www.soundhounds.com intrioduced me to stuff they sell but also buy for their own homes. B&W's 700 series is so truly bad IME, and following up ont he equally bad CM series that it is really really difficult for me not to compare them to Bose for the affluent. The 705 at $2300.00Cad is a bad speaker IMO and what's worse it's not jsut overpriced it is a good $1700.00 overpriced. At $500.00Cad it would STILL be unremarkable. Bright is the least of the problems.

.....IMO yours is WRONG!

1st - As some in here have correctly inferred any system is only as good as it's weakest link. Example: you can't go out and by a $3000 pair of high end speakers that are "renowned" for their ability to reveal the best or the worst in source material and then pair them with ancient or inferior source components/materials and expect good results! If you've auditioned the 703's and fell in love with them in the store as I did, then that same sound is in fact reproducible in your home assuming you have at your disposal similar or identical equipment, room treatments/geometry etc....period. There's no magical slight of hand going on here...no deception on the part of the sales people.

2nd - if you have assembled a system over the course of "years" chances are you have grown accustomed to the unique sonic signature and it has served mould / bias your sound preferences. Everyone is different...what you call a warm sound, I call muddy...what you call a harsh sound I call revealing. Bottom line is, if you are going to go and buy any new component and add it to your existing system, particularly if your system is fairly old then you'd better be pre-paired to shell out extra $$$ to upgrade your source components and source material as well because technology keeps on rolling and sound evolves because of it. B&W knows this and subsequently are ahead of the curve. IMHO the 703's are an amazing speaker and probably B&W's best price to performance offering...EVER.

[Feanor]

.....IMO yours is WRONG!

1st - As some in here have correctly inferred any system is only as good as it's weakest link. Example: you can't go out and by a $3000 pair of high end speakers that are "renowned" for their ability to reveal the best or the worst in source material and then pair them with ancient or inferior source components/materials and expect good results! If you've auditioned the 703's and fell in love with them in the store as I did, then that same sound is in fact reproducible in your home assuming you have at your disposal similar or identical equipment, room treatments/geometry etc....period. There's no magical slight of hand going on here...no deception on the part of the sales people.

2nd - if you have assembled a system over the course of "years" chances are you have grown accustomed to the unique sonic signature and it has served mould / bias your sound preferences. Everyone is different...what you call a warm sound, I call muddy...what you call a harsh sound I call revealing. Bottom line is, if you are going to go and buy any new component and add it to your existing system, particularly if your system is fairly old then you'd better be pre-paired to shell out extra $$$ to upgrade your source components and source material as well because technology keeps on rolling and sound evolves because of it. B&W knows this and subsequently are ahead of the curve. IMHO the 703's are an amazing speaker and probably B&W's best price to performance offering...EVER.

Hi, pdmonty, and welcome to AR Forums.

I tend to agree that a system is only as good as it's weakest link, but you aren't going to get a rise out of RGA. He bailed from ARF a few years ago in a fit of peak because he was scolded for for a hyperbolic political opinion.