Teens say they like vinyl records over CDs

[Geoffcin]

A Canadian scientist says teens who used to view CDs as superior to older vinyl records now consider vinyl superior to the newer format.

Full Story;

http://www.physorg.com/news64807495.html

[JoeE SP9]

So do I!

[Bernd]

Me too!

Bernd

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Am I going to listen to the opinion of group of folks who chose MP3 over DVD-A and SACD? Don't think so!

I can understand their objection to what is being offered on CD.

[texlle]

Finally...

My generation gets it...

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Finally...

My generation gets it...

Or not!

[E-Stat]

Finally...

My generation gets it...

Or at least some members do. The passion for music transcends any generation. Nice system!

rw

[Woochifer]

You mean the college crowd has stopped downloading MP3s and started listening to more of their music on turntables than on iPods?

If anything, I've been hearing about this vinyl lovefest among the twentysomethings since at least the early-90s when alternative bands like Soundgarden and Pearl Jam pressured their record companies to put out vinyl releases of their albums. I've just yet to see the proof that it's amounted to anything more than a lot of talk and a few extra albums sold. I mean, has it actually translated into notable gains in market share or changes in actual listening habits? The sales figures for new LPs indicate not, since one hit CD can still outsell all LP titles combined. While vinyl's image has been turned around into this hip and anti-establishment embrace and the DJ market alone will keep the format alive past the next ice age, it's one thing to say that you're a vinyl fan for an academic study and quite another to prove it by actually buying vinyl. (Doesn't sound like the study includes any listening tests either, so it's really more about gauging perceptions and biases than trying to validate anything)

I love my vinyl and still have a turntable plugged into my main system, but these types of studies that talk about how consumer attitudes are so supportive of the vinyl format IMO reflect a lot of wishful thinking. Sure, these teens will SAY that they love vinyl (face it, the CD format is about as exciting as a 20-year old washing machine), but the finding means absolutely nothing if the vast majority of teens continue to download music; use iPods, computers, and car audio systems for most of their listening; and buy far more CDs than LPs. I would love it if vinyl were truly on the rebound, since it means more stores would carry LPs, turntables, and vinyl accessories. But, the evidence of a rebound big enough to make any kind of ripple in the market has been lacking from what I've seen. IMO, vinyl remains a niche market and probably will remain so even after another digital medium (whether high res, or multichannel, or downloading, or on-demand streaming) supplants the CD format.

[audio_dude]

I'm 14 and I love vinyl records, not because they are "hip" but because I love the music and some of it was only released on vinyl, also, I was raises around turntables and audio equipment, we were the first family on the block to have a "home theater". A harmon/kardon receiver, passive sub, celestion mains...ahhh, the joy of 2.1, lol

[texlle]

I just need a phono preamp so I can revive my 1976 B&O Beogram 3000. It works perfectly and looks new. Some kids don't know what good audio is these days...investing in infinity and monster cable. Give em a little dose of The Wall on LP amped by some tubes. Mmmm...doesn't get much better than that.

[emorphien]

I've been meaning to get a copy of The Wall. So far a good sample has eluded me.

[Mr Peabody]

I think the operative adjective in that story is "music enthusiasts". I've had vinyl since childhood and still do but it hasn't inspired my children yet to be vinyl lovers nor any of their friends. Look at the music chains that have died lately. I think it would be the same and the industry was the same when there was records. The majority of teens, I feel are into the downloading of music and sharing music on MP3's or whatever and care less what the sound is like. Well, let me retract that, it has to have some bad ass bass. On the other hand, some one is buying vinyl again. It's obvious that vinyl has made some what of a come back. Whether it's a passing fad remains to be seen. I can't remember the label but one of the big companies have recently reissued several titles on vinyl. So if the big boys are joining in some one smells money.

[PAT.P]

A Canadian scientist says teens who used to view CDs as superior to older vinyl records now consider vinyl superior to the newer format.

Full Story;

http://www.physorg.com/news64807495.html

They dont say if teens were on drugs at time .I know by experience in the 70 after having a few I just sit and round and round the vinyl would go and if there was a great lable it put me in a trance

[texlle]

Well, i just now had a little and i can literally hear the static on my burned copy of red light district, and it's a good copy. Never been able to do that before, haha. And I'm playing it quietly.

[PAT.P]

Well, i just now had a little and i can literally hear the static on my burned copy of red light district, and it's a good copy. Never been able to do that before, haha. And I'm playing it quietly.

Peace Love ,Flower Power and if you cant smoke it dont grow it

[DaHaq]

I view the vinyl resurgence as a direct reaction to the availability of MP3s. I don't believe for a second that the kids are interested in vinyl because of any real improvement they can hear in sound quality. Sure, they've heard that its supposed to sound better, and that becomes part of the appeal, but IMO you need a pretty good rig to hear the difference, and that's something the vast majority of teens do not have. The real reason for the comeback is that kids can download anything on MP3 for free, and then what is a CD but a flimsy five inches of plastic with some artwork you have to squint to see? Much better to buy the LP for its uniqueness and beauty and continue doing most of the actual listening with the MP3s on your iPod. Especially when many new LPs are cheaper than their CD counterparts and used vinyl is even less.

[shokhead]

I say BS. I bet you could take a poll of 100 13-16 year olds and plenty wouldnt even know what a record is,come on.

[JohnMichael]

I have a nephew who is now 17 and when he was young he made fun of my turntable. I think he thought it was for spin art. As he learned to love music and play the guitar all of a sudden turntables were cool. So for his 15th birthday I gave him my Thorens table with AT 440 ML cartridge. He thought that was so much better than the usual cash. He has purchased a lot of new and used vinyl.

[PAT.P]

I have a nephew who is now 17 and when he was young he made fun of my turntable. I think he thought it was for spin art. As he learned to love music and play the guitar all of a sudden turntables were cool. So for his 15th birthday I gave him my Thorens table with AT 440 ML cartridge. He thought that was so much better than the usual cash. He has purchased a lot of new and used vinyl.

JohnMicheal Thanks now I know there another purpose for my 4 turntables none hook-up .I'll call Phono Art,a few blob of paint and let it rip.Any advice for Reel to Reel?

[swwdts]

I was in my pre- teen years when vinyles were just like the older 8 tracks slowly fading away.I listen to old music groups like Ozzy/Black Sabbath & kiss.Their music sounded like sh.. on vinyl.But,when it got re-mastered to cd .It sounds alot better.Although,I hope they start doing more mini cds ( The size of a half dollar coin or a NGC console game)

[dwass5656]

I think certain albums need to be heard on vinyl to really understand how great the music was. (to our childrens children by the Moody Blues comes to mind right away) I am in my mid 20's, have a tiny vinyl collection but have since claimed my fathers massive collection when he passes (hopefully in about 35 years) but I love listening to records, something about the sound just seems to flow better.

dwass



Listen to Fake Tales Of San Francisco (Album Version) by Arctic Monkeys : http://www.napster.com/player/tracks/16351031

[Rock&Roll Ninja]

Have any albums sold more than 50,000 copies on vinyl since 2000?
If they want to do a study I can find some teens who prefer the sound of wax cylinder or only listen to music played backwards. The biggest factor is that these people are so rare that it doesn't matter what they think, they can't change an industry that caters to the masses.

[nightflier]

Kexo, R&R Ninja,

You're all focusing too much on sales of new LP's. Most of the vinyl that is being sold is second-hand. The one thing I have noticed is how these have gone up in price over the last three years, both on eBay and at the flea markets. A good-quality LP will sell from $3-5 now, and if it's out of print and not available on CD, the sky's the limit ($30-60?). Now I don't know of many used CD's that sell for that.

I've also noticed that TT prices have gone up online, more so than what could be attributable to inflation. It's not significant in a let's-invest-our-retirement-savings-in-vinyl-sense, but it is interesting from an academic perspective. I would argue that maybe this is more about rebellion than anything else; rebellion against commercialization, high prices, bad music, repetitive playlists, and yes, also bad quality. When we were teens we wanted to belong, right? That's what teens want now, too. They see movies like Forest Gump, Almost Famous, Detroit Rock City, and they are amazed at how much more exciting life was for kids their age 20-30 years ago. Most kids today have never been to a a rock concert (attending the final of American Idol with prompted applause signs doesn't count). Tell them what a Kiss, RunDMC or Cool In The Gang concert was like, and they won't believe you. So they want to wear the same clothes, have the same parties, and listen to the same music. Most of that music is not easily found at Walmart or Circuit City. So they turn to LP's because its a rebellion in the medium as well as the music. It's kuuul, as they say on South Park.

And if in doing so they discover that it sounds a lot better than an MP3 and often better than a CD, what is the harm in that?

[Woochifer]

Kexo, R&R Ninja,

You're all focusing too much on sales of new LP's. Most of the vinyl that is being sold is second-hand. The one thing I have noticed is how these have gone up in price over the last three years, both on eBay and at the flea markets. A good-quality LP will sell from $3-5 now, and if it's out of print and not available on CD, the sky's the limit ($30-60?). Now I don't know of many used CD's that sell for that.

Sorry about the tardiness of the response, but I hadn't followed this thread for a while!

Anyway, you're right that a lot of vinyl is now traded second hand, but there's no data as to how many units are actually sold (especially compared to how many used CDs change hands). As for what drives prices for LPs, a lot of it will fall under the typical factors used in evaluating collectibles -- scarcity, condition, and demand.

Unlike with CDs, the vast majority of LP titles are now out of print, and the prices for LPs can vary wildly. Also unlike with CDs, the condition of the LPs will vary a lot, as will the sound quality as you look into different versions and press runs of a particular title. With LPs, collectors will scrutinize the condition of the record (mint, near mint, VG++, etc.), as well as which edition/press run it came from. LP collectors will also look for pressings made from earlier stampers, which presumably are a closer match with the original lacquer master.

CDs don't need this kind of scrutiny with the condition (it will either play or it won't play) and might not have gone through as many remasterings or version changes as LPs, so their prices are more driven by simple supply and demand. The LP market is very different because the condition and sound quality of a particular title will vary from copy to copy, which makes the scarcity dimension far more prevalent.

I've also noticed that TT prices have gone up online, more so than what could be attributable to inflation. It's not significant in a let's-invest-our-retirement-savings-in-vinyl-sense, but it is interesting from an academic perspective. I would argue that maybe this is more about rebellion than anything else; rebellion against commercialization, high prices, bad music, repetitive playlists, and yes, also bad quality. When we were teens we wanted to belong, right? That's what teens want now, too.

With the turntable (and cartridge) prices, it boils down to simple economies of scale. Turntables are not mass produced on the scale that they were before. Not a lot of turntables made now date back to the vinyl heyday, but plenty of cartridges do and I can tell you that the prices on those units have gone way up. The Ortofon OM20 that I used on my turntable and continually replaced since 1985 used to cost me $60. Now, it goes for $190. The Shure V15 cartridge in the mid-80s sold for $150, and cost less than $200 when it went out of production in the early-90s. When Shure brought it back a few years later, they increased the price to over $300 and produced at a much lower volume.

I don't know if it's rebellion against commercialization, because if anything the MP3 downloading culture has a definite anti-establishment and anti-commercial angle to it. Like I said earlier, I've been hearing about vinyl revivals for at least the past 15 years and everytime I hear about it, it's phrased as if this revival is a new thing. When Soundgarden, Pearl Jam, and a whole slew of indie rockers were touting the virtues of vinyl in the early-90s, that was hyped up as a sign of a vinyl revival, and the vinyl revival talk has periodically popped up ever since. IMO, it's nothing more than an evolution of a niche market that never went away in the first place.

That's the ubiquitous argument against Vinyl. I've been hearing it for 20 years now, along with the one about playing records in the car. Fact is, people move around a lot less now than they used to. It may not be healthy, but it's a fact. When I was young we used to play outside all the time, but you hardly see that anymore.

While it's true that teens don't play outside as much, what they do indoors typically does not involve sitting in front of their stereo playing LPs either. Just look at the size of the video game industry if you want to see how teens occupy their time!

And while teens don't play outdoors, they still like to carry their music with them wherever they go (they may not exercise, but they do drive). Not really a new phenomenon here either, since before MP3 players, we had Walkmans, and before that we had boomboxes and 8-tracks. Why do you think prerecorded cassette sales passed LP sales before the CD format was even launched? Lack of mobility is often cited as a reason why multichannel music has so far failed to catch on with the teen crowd.

Most kids stay indoors and while iPods have their place, like it or not, playing records is a new trend that is growing.

While anecdotally it might seem like a growing trend (and maybe it is), MP3 player sales in 2005 totaled more than $4 billion, which more than tripled the $1.2 billion in sales tallied by the ENTIRE home audio component market. The iPod definitely has its place -- basically in a dominant position and bigger than the combined remainder of the home audio market.

http://www.twice.com/article/CA6319031.html

[Mr Peabody]

The things I've been hearing are true. And even though kids are in the digital age with Ipods, some are definitely into vinyl and Classic Rock.

I was at a gathering over the weekend and just sitting in a room drinking some ice water. In the room was several kids ranging from 10 to 15 and one had a guitar playing at it. I began to listen to what they were talking about which was music. That's what caught my ear. These kids were telling each other they had Tom Petty, The Stones, Zepplin and other Classic Rock artists in their collection. One kid bought some kind of all in one stereo from K-mart which had a turntable and he had a few vinyl records. I didn't even know those kinds of stereos were still available. I know things seem to come back into style after so many years but darn, am I that old. I was truely astounded. I thought they would be into the latest Pop or Alternative being force fed on the radio today.