Outlaw cancels the Model 997 moving on to 998

[rob_a]

Or they might try designing their own stuff-oh, wait, sorry, they just rebadge other peeps stuff, being a marketing company, not a audio.

I would say 90% of company "rebadge". My receiver is made by Marantz but is using products form TI, Pioneer, Cirrus, Analog Devices, DTS, Dolby, ect... Pretty much the same thing Outlaw is doing. Why does Outlaw have a great product for less??? Direct sell and small overhead is most of the reason, also the chain stores are jacking up the prices on the store brands beyond their true value. So if a company like outlaw can create a better product for less, that is great. Give the stores some competition. Keeps prices down and quailty up.

[pixelthis]

I would say 90% of company "rebadge". My receiver is made by Marantz but is using products form TI, Pioneer, Cirrus, Analog Devices, DTS, Dolby, ect... Pretty much the same thing Outlaw is doing. Why does Outlaw have a great product for less??? Direct sell and small overhead is most of the reason, also the chain stores are jacking up the prices on the store brands beyond their true value. So if a company like outlaw can create a better product for less, that is great. Give the stores some competition. Keeps prices down and quailty up.

NOT REALLY.
Your MARANTZ uses parts designed by someone else in order to create an
original design, the canceled Outlaw product was a clone of an existing receiver,
with a few minor changes, incl taking out the amps.
My receiver has Audessey and several chips found in other receivers, but it is an original design.
BADGE" ENGINEERING is taking an entire product and putting a new name on it.
BIG DIFF.

[rob_a]

NOT REALLY.
Your MARANTZ uses parts designed by someone else in order to create an
original design, the canceled Outlaw product was a clone of an existing receiver,
with a few minor changes, incl taking out the amps.
My receiver has Audessey and several chips found in other receivers, but it is an original design.
BADGE" ENGINEERING is taking an entire product and putting a new name on it.
BIG DIFF.

I know what you’re saying; like what lexicon did with the Oppo BD player. That’s in the macro sense, total copy and thats what outlaw is doing. I was stating more of the micro sense, most companies re-badge in some small way. We could argue about what the definition of "re-badge" is all day, but my main point is that a company like Outlaw and other boutiques are good for the market. Plain and simple, you start losing them and you start seeing choice and quality go down and prices go up. I understand you don't think they are a real audio company, that’s cool, but they still have an impact on the audio industry.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

NOT REALLY.
Your MARANTZ uses parts designed by someone else in order to create an
original design, the canceled Outlaw product was a clone of an existing receiver,
with a few minor changes, incl taking out the amps.
My receiver has Audessey and several chips found in other receivers, but it is an original design.
BADGE" ENGINEERING is taking an entire product and putting a new name on it.
BIG DIFF.

It is not a clone Mr. Misinformation. A clone would be an exact replica, and the Outlaw is going to be a pre-pro with features shared by the Sherwood receiver. It is going to be quite different from the Sherwood receiver, and the only real thing they share is the Trinnov setup processing. The quality of the features on the Outlaw will be a lot higher, it will have far more processing power, a higher version of the HDMI connection, beefier power supplies, and will be far more feature rich than the Sherwood receiver.

That does not sound like a clone to me!

[pixelthis]

It is not a clone Mr. Misinformation. A clone would be an exact replica, and the Outlaw is going to be a pre-pro with features shared by the Sherwood receiver. It is going to be quite different from the Sherwood receiver, and the only real thing they share is the Trinnov setup processing. The quality of the features on the Outlaw will be a lot higher, it will have far more processing power, a higher version of the HDMI connection, beefier power supplies, and will be far more feature rich than the Sherwood receiver.

That does not sound like a clone to me!

It was going to be a "pre pro", cant even get your tense straight.
Any difference between an "Outlaw" and what it copies is purely cosmetic.
Now, a lot of companies have been doing this for years, at Walmart they had half a dozen boomboxes, all with a few differences but basically the same thing, but with different brand names, like SONY, PANASONIC, etc.
All of these companies contracted out to the same Asian manufacturer, and nothing wrong with that.
But these companies do make original product, they just contract out their mass market
stuff they dont want to mess with.
My point is that they DO some original work, parts get shared , for good economiesw of scale.
But companies like Outlaw don't do anything but slap their name on products,
and they surrive only until someone figures out that their products are only overpriced
clones of value brands like Sherwood( a good economy brand, but certainly not high end).
And some companies create outfits like Outlaw, so that they have a place to send product that is not quite up to snuff for their line, but "good enough" when their name isn't on it.
An old practice, and not one just done by electronics companies.
Beer companies, car companies, etc, all have "value" brands

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

It was going to be a "pre pro", cant even get your tense straight.

Majoring in minors toothless one, from this point on your empty of true facts arguments will fall apart.

Any difference between an "Outlaw" and what it copies is purely cosmetic.

Since there are zero products that Outlaw has copied, and at least 1 that another manufacturer has copied from Outlaw, your point falls apart beginning here.

Now, a lot of companies have been doing this for years, at Walmart they had half a dozen boomboxes, all with a few differences but basically the same thing, but with different brand names, like SONY, PANASONIC, etc.

Can you explain to me(and those reading this) how something can be "different" but be the same at the same time? That would defy the both words same+different wouldn't it? Did you pull all of these boomboxes apart so you could examine them in detail? Probably not, so you cannot factually say that even their innards are exactly the same.

All of these companies contracted out to the same Asian manufacturer, and nothing wrong with that.

Yes, but you fail to mention that a single Asian manufacturer can put together dozens of entirely different products for different companies as well. That is a big detail to leave out.

But these companies do make original product, they just contract out their mass market

This is a vague explanation of reality since Oppo does not do this practice. In case of many companies, they do all of the design work, and only contract out assembly. Most pick all of the parts of the product by hand, so they work to tight tolerance and deliver high quality and performance. Others, like what you consider as state of the art(Vizio comes to mind) source the cheapest part from many suppliers(that are not designed to work together from the ground up) and put them together which results in lower prices, but lower quality as well.

My point is that they DO some original work, parts get shared , for good economiesw of scale.
But companies like Outlaw don't do anything but slap their name on products,
and they surrive only until someone figures out that their products are only overpriced
clones of value brands like Sherwood( a good economy brand, but certainly not high end).

Your information is continually flawed slowpixel. Outlaw has designed every one of their products themselves, and the only outsourcing they have done is assembly. They have sourced zero of their product from other manufacturers, and that is a fact that not even your stupid lies can erase.

Sherwood designed a receiver with the Trinnov set up system. That receiver is much more simplistic in design that what Outlaw was going to release. The Outlaw version of the Trinnov setup is far more complicated than the Sherwood receiver, hence why it it both different, and far more difficult to design. Every aspect of the Outlaw processor was going to be more sophisticated than the Sherwood receiver. It was so far more difficult to assemble that complications set the final design of the pre-pro far back than Outlaw could predict, hence the announcements of delay, and now the cancellation of the 997. Sherwood has already released its receiver, and quite frankly it was full of bugs, but much easier to design, logic would lean towards Outlaw making a wise decision in this case.

Once again I am going to tell you that a little critical thinking goes a long way. Not enough thinking makes you look foolish and ignorant.

And some companies create outfits like Outlaw, so that they have a place to send product that is not quite up to snuff for their line, but "good enough" when their name isn't on it.

Can you name a single Outlaw product this scenario applies to? And just what company created Outlaw aside from Outlaw?

An old practice, and not one just done by electronics companies.
Beer companies, car companies, etc, all have "value" brands

Can you tell me how the practices of a Beer company(any of them would do) operate just like Outlaw?

The weakness and down right untruthfulness of your arguments is staggering but par for the course for you faultypixel.

[pixelthis]

[QUOTE=Sir Terrence the Terrible]Majoring in minors toothless one, from this point on your empty of true facts arguments will fall apart.

Since there are zero products that Outlaw has copied, and at least 1 that another manufacturer has copied from Outlaw, your point falls apart beginning here.

just a bald-faced lie, OUTLAW used to (and might still) get their amps from ATI.

Can you explain to me(and those reading this) how something can be "different" but be the same at the same time? That would defy the both words same+different wouldn't it? Did you pull all of these boomboxes apart so you could examine them in detail? Probably not, so you cannot factually say that even their innards are exactly the same.

They were the same in that the jacks, controls, and the general form factor were
identical.
THERE "INNARDS" were the same with the exception of a little more amp power
thrown in to cater to the "raw power" market

Yes, but you fail to mention that a single Asian manufacturer can put together dozens of entirely different products for different companies as well. That is a big detail to leave out.

It is a minor detail, everybody knows that a lot of manufacturing is sent to Asian subcontractors these days.
And they tend to put out product for several different brands at the same time,
with only minor variations that the various customers ordered.
It would probably be more intellectually honest for outlaw to get these guys to build their stuff, instead of cloning product from real audio manufacturers who actually care
about what they put out there.
Like Cambridge, a company that designs their stuff at the home office in England,
ships it to their office in Hong Kong, who then sends it to mainland China to be built.
At least Cambridge is doing some audio work.

This is a vague explanation of reality since Oppo does not do this practice. In case of many companies, they do all of the design work, and only contract out assembly. Most pick all of the parts of the product by hand, so they work to tight tolerance and deliver high quality and performance. Others, like what you consider as state of the art(Vizio comes to mind) source the cheapest part from many suppliers(that are not designed to work together from the ground up) and put them together which results in lower prices, but lower quality as well.

Everybody gets the lowest prices for parts that they can.
Couldnt resist a dig at Vizio , could you?
Mine is two years old, teh one I gave to my parents four years old, my brothers four years old, and the ones from various friends, none of them have failed.
And I AM constantly being asked by mine, people who see it love the pic as much as I do

Your information is continually flawed slowpixel. Outlaw has designed every one of their products themselves, and the only outsourcing they have done is assembly. They have sourced zero of their product from other manufacturers, and that is a fact that not even your stupid lies can erase.

Keep on digging yourself in with your lies and misinfo.
Outlaw HAS NEVER BUILT ANYTHING, dont have to as they have others doing the work for them.
They are a marketing company, selling the idea of cheap stuff over the net due to
reduced food chain, they are answering a marketing niche.
Nothing wrong with that, doesnt make them an audio company tho.

Sherwood designed a receiver with the Trinnov set up system. That receiver is much more simplistic in design that what Outlaw was going to release. The Outlaw version of the Trinnov setup is far more complicated than the Sherwood receiver, hence why it it both different, and far more difficult to design. Every aspect of the Outlaw processor was going to be more sophisticated than the Sherwood receiver. It was so far more difficult to assemble that complications set the final design of the pre-pro far back than Outlaw could predict, hence the announcements of delay, and now the cancellation of the 997. Sherwood has already released its receiver, and quite frankly it was full of bugs, but much easier to design, logic would lean towards Outlaw making a wise decision in this case.

LOGIC would guide Outlaw to clone a better manufacturer next time.
They went with Sherwood last time to save a buck, and it cost them.
THEY NEED to try to copy quality next time

Once again I am going to tell you that a little critical thinking goes a long way. Not enough thinking makes you look foolish and ignorant.

And thats what, do as I say, not as I do?
Nothing wrong with my "thinking", and "thinking " has nothing to do with just stating the facts, facts being something you are woefully deficient in.

Can you name a single Outlaw product this scenario applies to? And just what company created Outlaw aside from Outlaw?

ATI did their amps, or at least used to, don't know if they still do.

Can you tell me how the practices of a Beer company(any of them would do) operate just like Outlaw?

All companies have certain production standards.
Some product doesnt meet that standard but can still be used.
So substandard COORS becomes Keystone, Substandard MILLER becomes
MILWALKEES BEST.
And the substandard product of an audio company has to wind up somewhere.
Dont know for a fact , but it wouldnt surprize me if it winds up with an outlaw badge.
Doesnt mean its not fit to use, just not top drawer

The weakness and down right untruthfulness of your arguments is staggering but par for the course for you faultypixel.

In other words I am telling a truth that your corporate masters dont want talked about.
There are those of us that haven't sold their souls quite yet.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Pix, anyone who has known the history of Outlaw knows that you are a bald face liar. I am going to leave it at that.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Pix, anyone who has known the history of Outlaw knows that you are a bald face liar. I am going to leave it at that. You are such a gullible nitwit for drinking the cool aid of internet rumors.