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  1. #1
    VIP Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Dish dropping AMC networks



    Dish subscribers who love AMC's "Breaking Bad" may be out of luck if a feud between the satellite broadcaster and the cable channel's parent AMC Networks isn't resolved soon.

    Besides AMC, home to "The Walking Dead," "Breaking Bad" and "Mad Men," other channels that could be dropped include WE, which caters to females, and IFC and Sundance, which focus primarily on independent cinema. Dish's contract with AMC Networks is up at the end of June. Dish has just over 14 million subscribers around the country.

    Dish Network Corp. said it is dropping the channels because the ratings for the networks do not justify a rate increase that it says AMC Networks is seeking. Dish also said it was not happy that shows such as "Mad Men" and "Breaking Bad" are made available on other platforms such as Netflix and iTunes soon after the shows have aired on AMC.

    In a statement, AMC said Dish's plans to drop the channels has nothing to do with the performance of its networks or their cost, but instead with another legal battle the two companies are in.

    In 2008, Voom HD, a now-defunct group of cable channels owned by AMC, sued Dish for $2.5 billion for breach of contract. The case is wending its way through the courts and last week Dish lost an appeal, which AMC said is the cause for the bad blood.

    Dish responded that the Voom litigation is a "separate matter" and that AMC's statement "distorts the facts of the current situation and incorrectly attempts to tie together two separate issues."

    Dish says it is dropping AMC Networks - latimes.com

  2. #2
    Suspended markw's Avatar
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    ...and you wonder why service providers raise prices?

    "Dish Network Corp. said it is dropping the channels because the ratings for the networks do not justify a rate increase that it says AMC Networks is seeking. Dish also said it was not happy that shows such as "Mad Men" and "Breaking Bad" are made available on other platforms such as Netflix and iTunes soon after the shows have aired on AMC."

  3. #3
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    You blowin' smoke again? The channels haven't been cut off yet, and the contract goes through the end of June. In the world of pay TV carriage disputes, that's an eternity.

    These kinds of carriage disputes happen all the time. Both sides reach an impasse, and then start threatening to pull the programs if the other side doesn't give in, and then the dispute gets resolved at the last minute, usually without any program disruption.

    This dispute is only making alarmist headlines because entertainment writers obsess over Mad Men and Breaking Bad, which tend to generate more headlines and salivating reviews than viewers. Heaven forbid if some TV blogger (who very well might access AMC through Dish Network) loses access to his favorite show, and we can no longer read their oh-so-insightful plot summaries and analyses.

    As the article mentions, the AMC/Dish dispute has been ongoing for years. It's all a matter of who blinks in the end.

    And why are you now posting all these pay TV threads, given that you don't even pay for TV service?
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  4. #4
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markw View Post
    "Dish Network Corp. said it is dropping the channels because the ratings for the networks do not justify a rate increase that it says AMC Networks is seeking. Dish also said it was not happy that shows such as "Mad Men" and "Breaking Bad" are made available on other platforms such as Netflix and iTunes soon after the shows have aired on AMC."
    At this point, it's nothing more than posturing. I doubt that there's even serious negotiating going on, given that the existing contract still has more than a month and a half left.

    Dish says that AMC's ratings are low (which they are).
    AMC will fire back that their audience is more valuable because their viewers are in the desired demographics (which they are) and their programs have a loyal following over which viewers will switch services in order to continue viewing (which many will).

    From Dish's perspective it will come down to how many subscribers they think they will lose by dropping AMC versus how much carriage fee expense they can absorb. From AMC's perspective, it comes down to how much audience they would potentially lose by dropping Dish, and how that impacts on their carriage fee revenues and advertising rates. Dish accounts for more than 15% of the pay TV subscriptions in the U.S., so that's a big audience that AMC would lose if the carriage dispute drags out.

    Directv used a lot of the same arguments about low ratings when they refused to offer AMC in HD. Coincidentally, Directv added AMC HD about a month ago, just in time for the Mad Men season premiere. But, also only a few months before Dish's contract expires.
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  5. #5
    VIP Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markw View Post
    ...and you wonder why service providers raise prices?
    Well, I understand if commercial free channels (such as premium) raise their pirces due to cost as God knows everything else is going up. But I thought channels that carry commercials suppose to be self sufficent in their revenues, like local OTA stations. AMC also carry commercials.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wooch
    These kinds of carriage disputes happen all the time. Both sides reach an impasse, and then start threatening to pull the programs if the other side doesn't give in, and then the dispute gets resolved at the last minute, usually without any program disruption.
    I wonder how they are going to resolve the dispute over AMC offering their signature shows on other platforms so soon after it aired on AMC. Maybe Netflix and iTunes will also get involve in this dispute.

    And why are you now posting all these pay TV threads, given that you don't even pay for TV service?
    Knowledge is power

  6. #6
    Suspended markw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post
    At this point, it's nothing more than posturing. I doubt that there's even serious negotiating going on, given that the existing contract still has more than a month and a half left.

    Dish says that AMC's ratings are low (which they are).
    AMC will fire back that their audience is more valuable because their viewers are in the desired demographics (which they are) and their programs have a loyal following over which viewers will switch services in order to continue viewing (which many will).

    From Dish's perspective it will come down to how many subscribers they think they will lose by dropping AMC versus how much carriage fee expense they can absorb. From AMC's perspective, it comes down to how much audience they would potentially lose by dropping Dish, and how that impacts on their carriage fee revenues and advertising rates. Dish accounts for more than 15% of the pay TV subscriptions in the U.S., so that's a big audience that AMC would lose if the carriage dispute drags out.

    Directv used a lot of the same arguments about low ratings when they refused to offer AMC in HD. Coincidentally, Directv added AMC HD about a month ago, just in time for the Mad Men season premiere. But, also only a few months before Dish's contract expires.
    Keep in mind that AMC and other content providers have no way to get it's product, and bundled commercials, to the consumer without service providers like Dish, DirectTV, cable providers oad other of that ilk. Granted, their shows have a following but how big would it be, and how much advertising would they be able to sell, if they had to get their product directly to the consumer without those intermediaries? It would be like writing letters and having no way to send it.

    It's a symbiotic relationship. If AMC gets too pushy and Dish drops it both may suffer, but who would suffer more? How many service providers could AMC afford to lose before it starts to feel the pinch? Likewise, how many content providers could Dish afford to lose before it started losing it's customers? It's a gamble that they are staring each other down about now. But, how many content providers and how many service providers are there?

    Of course, another option is for Dish to move AMC which, as I now understand it, is a fairly basic channel to a higher tier service thereby offering the consumer the final choice. That would be kinda like having to buy a sunroof in order to get ABS, IMHO.


    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post
    And why are you now posting all these pay TV threads, given that you don't even pay for TV service?
    Offhand, schadenfreude comes to mind.

  7. #7
    Man of the People Forums Moderator bobsticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markw View Post
    Offhand, schadenfreude comes to mind.
    Somebody give this guy some Greenies!
    So, I broke into the palace
    With a sponge and a rusty spanner
    She said : "Eh, I know you, and you cannot sing"
    I said : "That's nothing - you should hear me play piano"

  8. #8
    VIP Member Smokey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woochifer View Post
    You blowin' smoke again? The channels haven't been cut off yet, and the contract goes through the end of June. In the world of pay TV carriage disputes, that's an eternity.

    These kinds of carriage disputes happen all the time. Both sides reach an impasse, and then start threatening to pull the programs if the other side doesn't give in, and then the dispute gets resolved at the last minute, usually without any program disruption.
    Well Wooch, looks like not this time. Dish is dropping IFC, WE and AMC at midnight tonight (June 30th), and replacing them with HDNet Movies, Style and HDNet. There is going to be alot of unhappy Dish customers, especially “Mad Men,” “Breaking Bad” and “The Walking Dead" fans.

  9. #9
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smokey View Post
    Well Wooch, looks like not this time. Dish is dropping IFC, WE and AMC at midnight tonight (June 30th), and replacing them with HDNet Movies, Style and HDNet. There is going to be alot of unhappy Dish customers, especially “Mad Men,” “Breaking Bad” and “The Walking Dead" fans.
    These programs are very popular programs, and all this will do is move those that like these programs to cable. So this is Dish's loss in this case.
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  10. #10
    Can a crooner get a gig? dean_martin's Avatar
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    Yep. AMC is gone. All my crap is bundled - DISH, phone and internet. What a pain in the ass it's gonna be to get another service in time for Breaking Bad's season premiere.

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