Bill Gates call Blu-ray Anti-consumer.

[nightflier]

Not to add more fuel to the fire but:

China To Launch Next-Gen DVD Format (http://www.ultimateavmag.com/news/1013chinadvd/).

[Woochifer]

But Isn't it true that standard (non-HDTV) broadcasts will soon be removed from the airwaves? I'm sure it will be pushed back several times, but currently it's supposed to be terminated in 2009, if I remember correctly. When that happens, I'm sure that the only access to media will be through a subscription based service.

Actually, the only mandate is that ANALOG over-the-air broadcasts end sometime in the future. It only mandates that future broadcasts be digital, not necessarily that they broadcast in HD. And that future has been pushed back at least a couple of times. The original mandate required that analog broadcasts end in 2006. That termination date is now a lot more open ended, pretty much it will end only when the percentage of households buying digital-ready TVs reaches a majority of sets sold.

The other thing to consider is that most households get their broadcast TV thru cable and satellite, and those are still compatible with existing sets, so you are right about subscription services having a big role in the future.

That is why I suspect that this new format war is a non event; because the industry is pushing for downloadable content only. This way, there won't be any disks to own or copy anymore. All digital content will be limited-time use and non shareable. This is the wet dream that Gates, Stringer, Renzer, and Turner would like us all to slip into.

I think that's reason why there's such a huge push on right now to get Blu-ray and/or HD-DVD established in the market. The hardware manufacturers are well aware of the burgeoning competition from on-demand services, HD broadcasts, and downloaded content. With the DVD, all of these services will surpass the DVD's picture and audio quality in a relatively short time.

All of this nonsense could have been avoided if the DVD hadn't been rushed to market so quickly. I've said many times on this board that the DVD should have been a HD format from the very beginning. The digital TV specs were approved back in 1992, well before development on the DVD format was finalized. The players in the DVD consortium have viewed the DVD as an interim format (or at least that's what they're saying now). Problem is that they created an interim format that's now installed in almost 100 million households, with a lot of them already investing a huge amount into their disc libraries. The studios and the hardware manufacturers were well aware that HDTV was on the horizon, but they got greedy and created a non-HD disc format on the presumption that they could persuade consumers to invest in an all-new HD format once it became available. All they have to do is look at the marketing disaster of DVD-A and SACD to see what can happen when they make these kinds of presumptions (and what can happen when draconian copy protection schemes detract from the practical functioning of a format).

[nightflier]

Actually, the only mandate is that ANALOG over-the-air broadcasts end sometime in the future. It only mandates that future broadcasts be digital, not necessarily that they broadcast in HD. And that future has been pushed back at least a couple of times. The original mandate required that analog broadcasts end in 2006. That termination date is now a lot more open ended, pretty much it will end only when the percentage of households buying digital-ready TVs reaches a majority of sets sold.

But am I correct in presuming that my trusty old Panasonic non-HDTV will not be able to pick up digital broadcasts? It has rabbit ears, composite inputs, and a BNC cable hookup. Several of my neighbors have similar non-HDTV sets. These are not capable of receiving a digital broadcast, right?

One fact that the industry is forgetting is that so many people out there may have digital connections on their TV's and DVD players, but they use the cheapest cables they can get, which means that my neighbor for example has a new HDMI TV, DVD player, and cable box but he won't spend $100 on cables. He was just glad to get it hooked up and working. Until companies actually include decent quality cables with the units, many people will just use the basic ones that are usually included, and miss out on HD w/o knowing it.

Furthermore, with to many different connectors on the back of each unit competing for our dollars in a down economy, I'm not surprized that I see so many composite and s-video hookups. Actually for most people, the s-video/optical hookups are the simplest and cheapest standards they will pay extra for. Anything beyond that is still considered overkill.

I know this does not apply to most of us here, but just ask your own extended familty to see how they have things hooked up. Unless you've hooked it up for them, they probably won't even know how to answer your question. Another fun test is to go down to CC, BB, or GG and ask them what cable you should buy. The pimple-faced sales guy isn't going to know that either. BlueRay and HD-DVD is so far removed from most people's lives that downloadable content will arrive before they have replaced their players and beloved movie collections.

I think I'm going to buy some Cox & DishNetwork stock this week....

[snodog]

Sony and Microsoft are both greedy, and power-hungry. The gaming consoles are a reflection of the ongoing battle. Most people on this site would have a general idea of what to look for in newest media formats and what not, but the average person who shops at Best Buy would not. It would be up to those underachievers to educate them on what to buy. Hell, my parents never figured out how to set their damn clocks on the vcr, let alone figure out the differences in HD technology. For sure, I will be buying one as soon as I can but do hope that they can reconcile their differences and utilize players that will accomodate both formats for the average joe.

[Geoffcin]

Sony and Microsoft are both greedy, and power-hungry.

Yes I agree. This whole BlueRay/HD-DVD argument is more about world domination of the market than providing a next-gen solution for the public.

[CharlieBee]

Bluray has more capacity, so what. The junk they will add to the poor quality the basic movie is not worth the $30 cost they will charge.

They plan to keep sellling DVD's for years because that is what the masses own to play movies on, the players and computers.

Dream on Bluray. the consumer, both legal and illlega.l will determine the winners of the future.

Most importantly for you " gotta have it first types" remember

" the second mouse gets the cheese" and this will really apply here.

The picture benifits will not be worth not waiting several years to upgrade. The time of the $35 DVD player is still King and will be for several years.


Charlie

[snodog]

I think they will both be cutting their own throats so to speak by making it confusing for average consumers who will become irritated at having to worry wether or not they bought the right dvd. It is BS. There will eventually come a time when the damn dvd picture is only going to get so good unless they begin hologram video. I agree too, the junk that they will put on the dvd as extras will not be worth paying the extra money for. How often has it really ever been? I bought the lord of the rings movies and after paying double for the first special extended edition with hours of extra interviews and stuff I didnt really care about, wasnt about to do it with the others.

[hermanv]

But Isn't it true that standard (non-HDTV) broadcasts will soon be removed from the airwaves? I'm sure it will be pushed back several times, but currently it's supposed to be terminated in 2009, if I remember correctly. When that happens, I'm sure that the only access to media will be through a subscription based service.

In theory the local stations will switch to an HDTV format. Then you will be able to receive commercials with an occasional few seconds of entertainment video, all in a non-subscription high definition format.

Of course all pay services will also include commercials some only for their own shows or services they offer.

Is this a great country or what?

[Woochifer]

But am I correct in presuming that my trusty old Panasonic non-HDTV will not be able to pick up digital broadcasts? It has rabbit ears, composite inputs, and a BNC cable hookup. Several of my neighbors have similar non-HDTV sets. These are not capable of receiving a digital broadcast, right?

The current mandate is for analog broadcasts to end by 2009, and that very well might happen because the only people that this will affect are people who still watch TV using over-the-air antennas. And those consumers are already way down in the minority of the overall TV audience. About 2/3 of all TVs are connected to cable, then you add satellite customers, and those TVs that are only used for DVDs or video games. What you have left is the shrinking analog broadcast audience. Digital tuners on new TVs are rapidly becoming commonplace (and I believe will soon be required on all TVs sold in the U.S.), so replacement sets will likely be compatible with the new broadcasts as well.

If you currently have cable or satellite, then presumably the providers will maintain analog compatibility as long as most of their customers demand it.

One fact that the industry is forgetting is that so many people out there may have digital connections on their TV's and DVD players, but they use the cheapest cables they can get, which means that my neighbor for example has a new HDMI TV, DVD player, and cable box but he won't spend $100 on cables. He was just glad to get it hooked up and working. Until companies actually include decent quality cables with the units, many people will just use the basic ones that are usually included, and miss out on HD w/o knowing it.

I think that issue is way off in the future. The termination of analog broadcasts is only one step among many that still lie ahead. The vast majority of cable and satellite receivers will still use the older analog video outputs. I also suspect that in the future, HDMI and other digital video cables will be a lot cheaper than they are right now, once the connection becomes standard equipment on all TVs. Just look at how inexpensive a lot of computer cables are. Already you can get firewire and USB cables for pretty cheap, and I don't see any reason why HDMI cables won't have a similar price decrease as it becomes more commonplace.

Furthermore, with to many different connectors on the back of each unit competing for our dollars in a down economy, I'm not surprized that I see so many composite and s-video hookups. Actually for most people, the s-video/optical hookups are the simplest and cheapest standards they will pay extra for. Anything beyond that is still considered overkill.

I don't think that the connectors are much of an issue. People will use what's available. That three-way RCA video/audio cable is what comes with most DVD players, so that's what people will use. Once digital connections become more commonplace, then the HDMI cables will be the default, especially with HD-DVD or Blu-ray players.

I know this does not apply to most of us here, but just ask your own extended familty to see how they have things hooked up. Unless you've hooked it up for them, they probably won't even know how to answer your question. Another fun test is to go down to CC, BB, or GG and ask them what cable you should buy. The pimple-faced sales guy isn't going to know that either. BlueRay and HD-DVD is so far removed from most people's lives that downloadable content will arrive before they have replaced their players and beloved movie collections.

Oh they already know which cable you should buy -- the most expensive ones!