Receiver auditioning hints, tips and tricks

[pixelthis]

There is a restaurant in Chicago called Debevic's where all the employees take each and every opportunity to insult you. That is part of their job description and people pay to have them do this. Of course we all think its fun and funny.

You've missed your calling in life. if you know what I mean...

Here you are giving away your trade for free.

If you don't have a Debevic's in your area, you should start your own. You would be very good at it.

You have the ability to insult people and make them laugh at the same time.

The other guys were right, "you are a lot of fun". I'm serious about this...LOL

Of course, if you got a job, you would not be able to spend as much time posting here and that would be sad. You would be missed.

By the way I was looking at your equipment list in your personal information and now I understand why you can't relate to people with hi-end stuff.

vizio l37
klipsch set of rb speakers
integra 7.4 receiver
samsung 840
sony dvd recorder
homebuilt pc/ server
technics turntable from 80s
sony 300 cd changer
monster cable

You are like a Chevrolet Chevette owner attending a Corvette rally.

I'm not really insulting your choice of equipment, they are okay for what they are, but if this is your reference for discussing high end then that explains everything.

Your turn Pixel ( or should I say, Debevic?).

Have fun and let me have it!

Seriously, you are a teenager, aren't you?

There is one thing I would like to know about. Your home built computer.

What motherboard are you using and what processor.
What video card?
What power supply?
What type of RAM and how much?
What operating system are you running?
How big is your hard drive and how many do you have?
Is it set up in RAID configuration and if so, which one?
You also said it was a server. Do you mean music server or network server?
Do you have it overclocked and by how much?
Do you use it for games or just surfing the net?
Do you have one of those cool cases with all the lights inside?

Glad you dont take my insults too seriously, some on this board can dish is out but act like little kids when they get it back.
My home built computer is nothing fancy, a generic box that came with a 250 watt power
supply.
I got a deal on an asus MB with 2 gig of ram, its only 400mhz but system bus is 800 I beleive, so I will upgrade, but its not important. My proc is 1,6 gig, all you need really.
I HAVE THREE hd'S, and a usb 320 gig that I just ripped my CD collection to.
No Raid, but I have been toying with setting up an independent server type computer,
and would probably RAID it. A tech friend at work gave me a box and a new dell 15 monitor, has promished me a board with a proc on it but I am still waiting.
Actually the simpletech is working fine for playing my music, so I might forgo the
server deal, but it might be fun to try.
As for overclocking I dont need the horsepower, and for a video card its an ati 256 mb.
Dont play games much anymore, takes up too much time.
And its funny that you think I AM IN HIGH SCHOOL, thats a hoot.
Actually the reason my rig is so modest is that I am trying to set some cash aside for retirement.
And the fact that you think that I am a "chevette" owner also shows some immaturity
on your part.
If you could walk into a store and get a great rig just by throwing some cash around
everybody would be an expert. I use 40 years of experience in this hobby to spend well
because my present circumstances dont allow me to spend MUCH.
My receiver runs about 1200 $, the plan was to hook a high end amp into it with a decent damping factor and wattage, my former employer didnt care about my plans when they put me and several hundred others out of work.
So now I get by with a decent Samsung upconverter DVD player with sacd, dvdaudio,
and a ton of pretty good cables, and a decent Vizio that serves also as a great computer monitor, its going if I get my rebate, probably be replaced with a Sony product.
I have a 2,000 set of B&W, being B&W they outperform much higher line speakers from other lesser brands.
BTW this isnt a forum for "high end" equipment, most of which is overengineered junk meant to be marketed well, sorry if you think so.
THERE IS A GUY ON THIS SITE, SHOWED A SIX MILLON DOLLAR system,
and that is a great example of money not buying you happiness.
This guy did almost EVERYTHING wrong with a HT that you could do basically.
Anyway it ebbs and flows, stay in this past YOUR highschool years and you'll understand that.
I HAVE HAD SYSTEMS COSTING AS MUCH AS TEN GRAND and a system based on an old sx90 pioneer receiver that a friend found in a dumpster, except for a scratcy vollume know it sounded great.
But it aint the bucks, its the know how, and there is the law of diminishing returns.
My system is a good 95% of some of the fanciest on this board, they paid big bucks to get another 4%.
Its not that I am a "chevette owner," its just that I cant afford thousands for that extra 4%,
would like to, but I would rather put my money into the 401k for right now, don't wanna be eating dog food when I RETIRE.
Life ebbs and flows, and again, you'll understand that when YOU get out of high school

[StevenSurprenant]

Glad you dont take my insults too seriously, some on this board can dish is out but act like little kids when they get it back.
My home built computer is nothing fancy, a generic box that came with a 250 watt power
supply.
I got a deal on an asus MB with 2 gig of ram, its only 400mhz but system bus is 800 I beleive, so I will upgrade, but its not important. My proc is 1,6 gig, all you need really.
I HAVE THREE hd'S, and a usb 320 gig that I just ripped my CD collection to.
No Raid, but I have been toying with setting up an independent server type computer,
and would probably RAID it. A tech friend at work gave me a box and a new dell 15 monitor, has promished me a board with a proc on it but I am still waiting.
Actually the simpletech is working fine for playing my music, so I might forgo the
server deal, but it might be fun to try.
As for overclocking I dont need the horsepower, and for a video card its an ati 256 mb.
Dont play games much anymore, takes up too much time.
And its funny that you think I AM IN HIGH SCHOOL, thats a hoot.
Actually the reason my rig is so modest is that I am trying to set some cash aside for retirement.
And the fact that you think that I am a "chevette" owner also shows some immaturity
on your part.
If you could walk into a store and get a great rig just by throwing some cash around
everybody would be an expert. I use 40 years of experience in this hobby to spend well
because my present circumstances dont allow me to spend MUCH.
My receiver runs about 1200 $, the plan was to hook a high end amp into it with a decent damping factor and wattage, my former employer didnt care about my plans when they put me and several hundred others out of work.
So now I get by with a decent Samsung upconverter DVD player with sacd, dvdaudio,
and a ton of pretty good cables, and a decent Vizio that serves also as a great computer monitor, its going if I get my rebate, probably be replaced with a Sony product.
I have a 2,000 set of B&W, being B&W they outperform much higher line speakers from other lesser brands.
BTW this isnt a forum for "high end" equipment, most of which is overengineered junk meant to be marketed well, sorry if you think so.
THERE IS A GUY ON THIS SITE, SHOWED A SIX MILLON DOLLAR system,
and that is a great example of money not buying you happiness.
This guy did almost EVERYTHING wrong with a HT that you could do basically.
Anyway it ebbs and flows, stay in this past YOUR highschool years and you'll understand that.
I HAVE HAD SYSTEMS COSTING AS MUCH AS TEN GRAND and a system based on an old sx90 pioneer receiver that a friend found in a dumpster, except for a scratcy vollume know it sounded great.
But it aint the bucks, its the know how, and there is the law of diminishing returns.
My system is a good 95% of some of the fanciest on this board, they paid big bucks to get another 4%.
Its not that I am a "chevette owner," its just that I cant afford thousands for that extra 4%,
would like to, but I would rather put my money into the 401k for right now, don't wanna be eating dog food when I RETIRE.
Life ebbs and flows, and again, you'll understand that when YOU get out of high school

Ahhh, The real Pixelthis at last...

When I walked into this, your feathers were ruffled and that is how I saw you. When it got to the point of name calling... Well, I think you understand.

It's really good to see the real you!

I'm sure that you understand that the guys were playing with you. Albeit, sometimes the line between fun and anger is very thin.

Many years ago when I first came to this forum my enthusiasm was very high and I wanted to impart my experiences to anyone who would listen. With some members I was totally out of my league and promptly got put in my place. I meant well, but there was still much to be learned, both in audio and in how to respond without stepping on peoples toes.

I traveled all over the Midwest and east coast listening to all the highend systems I could. Fortunately, I was old enough that the owners figured that I was affluent enough to afford their best and were eager to demonstrate them for me. Two systems stood out above all the rest. First there was the flagship of Avalon ($70,000 just for the speakers) connected to Spectral gear. The soundstaging was so precise that I felt that I could actually walk between the performers. The images were solid and the space between them was very defined. Most systems produce a layering, but this system went beyond that and produced a holographic image. The second system was Wilson/Watt driven by Pass Labs (45 watt amp). It too, produced a totally holographic image. I realize that very few people have heard this level of audio and for the most part, never will. It became my standard for the ultimate system, one that I could never approach on my income.

I bought a set of Quad Esl's and was thrilled with the sound. The only cravat was that they had very little soundstaging. The problem was that they needed a lot of room to do that and I didn't have the it. I tried many amps, DAC's, wires, preamps, and so on, but never did get it to sound the way I wanted. Don't get me wrong, what they did well they did better than almost every speaker I ever listened to. You know how sometimes your system just doesn't sound right and you get the urge to get something else? When that would happen, I would hit the highend shops and in short order, I returned home knowing I made the right choice. It was me and not my system. Most good systems had attributes that I prefered over my Quad's but as a whole, I liked my Quad's better.

When my Quad's were down for repair, I bought a small pair of B&W's. I finally started getting soundstaging. Clarity wise and tonally, they were no match for the Quads, but they did produce a soundstage.

This is turning into my life's story and I didn't mean that to happen...

Jumping ahead...

I sold all my gear and built my own speakers and couldn't be happier. I have clarity and soundstaging, both better than my Quads. Still, it is not at the level of the systems I described above, but not too shabby. I am still upgrading, but instead of buying new equipment, I am into modifying what I have.

The whole point of this story is that I had to go through what I did to understand/appreciate what some of the people here have gone through to get the systems they have today. For most, It's not about the money. It's about the adventure and discovery. Through it all, they have learned a great deal and I respect that. Some people here are where I was over 35 years ago and there is nothing wrong with that. There are also people here that will always know more than myself. Sometimes I feel intimidated by them, but it is what it is.

Some of the other boards I go to are into modifying their gear. when I am there, I struggle to understand what they are talking about. I still enjoy it very much. I don't post much for good reason, but I learn a great deal.

Most of us older people are opinionated, myself included. Still, we need to respect each other's opinions.

As far as this not being a forum for highend equipment, I agree. It's a mixture people of people in all stages of this hobby. Frankly, I think that it works very well considering the diversity here.

I do understand about saving for retirement.

Well, I gotta go, but thanks for letting the real you shine through. I might play with you later, but don't take it personal, but feel free to slam me once in a while if the urge hits you. It can be fun, as long as we know we are just playing. If it goes over the top, just let me know. I'll quit...

Respects

[Rich-n-Texas]

Interesting story Steven. I don't want to take anything away from it, but two lines in Pix's retort stood out in my mind...

Glad you dont take my insults too seriously, some on this board can dish is out but act like little kids when they get it back.

And then...

Life ebbs and flows, and again, you'll understand that when YOU get out of high school

The first quote is his first sentence, and the second quote is his last sentence. It's so ironic that it's humorous.

[StevenSurprenant]

Interesting story Steven. I don't want to take anything away from it, but two lines in Pix's retort stood out in my mind...

And then...

The first quote is his first sentence, and the second quote is his last sentence. It's so ironic that it's humorous.

I understand.

Peoples perceptions usually favor themselves, right or wrong, and irony seems to be part of the human condition.

[GMichael]

I understand.

Peoples perceptions usually favor themselves, right or wrong, and irony seems to be part of the human condition.

Condition? Are you saying that I have a condition? I'll have you know that I was cleared of my so called condition. All the voices are quiet now.

[Rich-n-Texas]

All the voices are quiet now.

Not mine! What meds are you taking? And don't say one dose of marriage/day either.

[GMichael]

Not mine! What meds are you taking? And don't say one dose of marriage/day either.

Vytorin and metamorphine. But the voices didn't go away because of the meds. I killed them all off one by one as my team of doctors suggested. They pronounced me better and even game me a diploma. Well, not really a diploma. But a piece of paper that looks just like one. I was deemed to no longer be a threat to society.

[Mr Peabody]

My favorite part of Pix's post was where he says, " and I have some pretty good cables". This is also ironic since he is arguing on another thread you can use any RCA, ie. audio, composite, for a component video connection and says he has done that before and cable don't matter. I'd like his definition of "pretty good".

He also must think highly of his system if he thinks there is only 4% left between it and the ultimate. Of course, "ultimate" would be subjective.

[StevenSurprenant]

My favorite part of Pix's post was where he says, " and I have some pretty good cables". This is also ironic since he is arguing on another thread you can use any RCA, ie. audio, composite, for a component video connection and says he has done that before and cable don't matter. I'd like his definition of "pretty good".

He also must think highly of his system if he thinks there is only 4% left between it and the ultimate. Of course, "ultimate" would be subjective.

Pixelthis, Ya see what I mean about being careful about what you say...

You boys having fun with this? LOL

My favorite part was:

"Condition? Are you saying that I have a condition?"

Then:

"But the voices didn't go away because of the meds. I killed them all off one by one as my team of doctors suggested. They pronounced me better and even game me a diploma. Well, not really a diploma. But a piece of paper that looks just like one. I was deemed to no longer be a threat to society."

That was very very funny! I had to read it to my people at work...

[Rich-n-Texas]

Of course the voices didn't go away because of the meds! Vytorin's for cholesterol you dummy! Haven't you seen the commercials? And metamorphine's a pain killer or something isn't it?

Steven, how 'bout selling me some of your animations (smilies, but don't tell L.J.)?

[GMichael]

Pixelthis, Ya see what I mean about being careful about what you say...

You boys having fun with this? LOL

My favorite part was:

"Condition? Are you saying that I have a condition?"

Then:

"But the voices didn't go away because of the meds. I killed them all off one by one as my team of doctors suggested. They pronounced me better and even game me a diploma. Well, not really a diploma. But a piece of paper that looks just like one. I was deemed to no longer be a threat to society."

That was very very funny! I had to read it to my people at work...

Thanks, I'm sure I didn't make that up though. I must have heard it before somewhere.

What's that? Huh? Be quiet. I wasn't talking to you.

[GMichael]

Of course the voices didn't go away because of the meds! Vytorin's for cholesterol you dummy! Haven't you seen the commercials? And metamorphine's a pain killer or something isn't it?

Steven, how 'bout selling me some of your animations (smilies, but don't tell L.J.)?

Dude, quote the man's post and there's the website for the pics.

Metamophine is for Diabetes.
But, if you've got something for pain, I may be willing to make a trade.

[Rich-n-Texas]

There is a restaurant in Chicago called Debevic's where all the employees take each and every opportunity to insult you. That is part of their job description and people pay to have them do this. Of course we all think its fun and funny.

You've missed your calling in life. if you know what I mean...

Here you are giving away your trade for free.

If you don't have a Debevic's in your area, you should start your own. You would be very good at it.

You have the ability to insult people and make them laugh at the same time.

The other guys were right, "you are a lot of fun". I'm serious about this...LOL

Of course, if you got a job, you would not be able to spend as much time posting here and that would be sad. You would be missed.

By the way I was looking at your equipment list in your personal information and now I understand why you can't relate to people with hi-end stuff.

vizio l37
klipsch set of rb speakers
integra 7.4 receiver
samsung 840
sony dvd recorder
homebuilt pc/ server
technics turntable from 80s
sony 300 cd changer
monster cable

You are like a Chevrolet Chevette owner attending a Corvette rally.

I'm not really insulting your choice of equipment, they are okay for what they are, but if this is your reference for discussing high end then that explains everything.

Your turn Pixel ( or should I say, Debevic?).

Have fun and let me have it!

Seriously, you are a teenager, aren't you?

There is one thing I would like to know about. Your home built computer.

What motherboard are you using and what processor.
What video card?
What power supply?
What type of RAM and how much?
What operating system are you running?
How big is your hard drive and how many do you have?
Is it set up in RAID configuration and if so, which one?
You also said it was a server. Do you mean music server or network server?
Do you have it overclocked and by how much?
Do you use it for games or just surfing the net?
Do you have one of those cool cases with all the lights inside?

No linky when I quote. Only the animated character. Like I said, there must be something I have to turn on somewhere to enable links in posts.

[StevenSurprenant]

You might like this animation site.

http://www.all-creatures.org/anan/index.html

[StevenSurprenant]

Here's another site...

http://foxtrotters.tripod.com/animate.htm

[Rich-n-Texas]

But, if you've got something for pain, I may be willing to make a trade.

Repaint your living room. That'll ease the pain.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Thanks Steven. Now that I've made a big issue out of it, thus killing the spontaneity and wow factor, I'll go crawl back in my cave...

[StevenSurprenant]

Thanks Steven. Now that I've made a big issue out of it, thus killing the spontaneity and wow factor, I'll go crawl back in my cave...

Opps, sorry!

It just occured to me that we can search for the coolist images and share them with each other?

Wadda ya think?

[Rich-n-Texas]

As long as knucklehead L.J. doesn't find out, sounds good.

[pixelthis]

Pixelthis, Ya see what I mean about being careful about what you say...

You boys having fun with this? LOL

My favorite part was:

"Condition? Are you saying that I have a condition?"

Then:

"But the voices didn't go away because of the meds. I killed them all off one by one as my team of doctors suggested. They pronounced me better and even game me a diploma. Well, not really a diploma. But a piece of paper that looks just like one. I was deemed to no longer be a threat to society."

That was very very funny! I had to read it to my people at work...

This is a prime example of the total lack of reading comprehension on this board, not to mention
a total lack of what passes for common audio knowledge on other boards.
I do have some pretty good cables, doesnt change the fact that most rcas' on the market are very similar.
However you can buy better, and I do when I can afford to.
But I AM NOT GOING TO ADVISE anybody to waste a ton of money when the most they will be using the cable for is 480p, probably from a cheap DVD player.
As for my system being 95% of the best you can buy, it might even be a tad closer.
THIS IS CALLED THE LAW OF DIMINISHING RETURNS.
A thousand dollar audio system will be greatly improved over a 200$ one.
Maybe 90%, you get a pretty big bang for your buck.
But to get another 3-5 % or so you have to spend thousands (like I did).
The last 5% or so could cost several hundred thousand dollars, even several million.
So my system, while a bit modest, is probably close to 95% of what you can get.
A 50,000 SYSTEM ISN'T FAR OFF.
This is a common engineering term, and of course totally unk to the clueless on this board.
As for GM not being a "threat" does that include the vernareal disease?
Doesnt that threaten your crack hos that you frequent?
And its metformin that diabetics take, type 2 at least.
Although I AM SURE THAT GM HAS TRIED HIS SHARE OF METAMORPHIN

[pixelthis]

Ahhh, The real Pixelthis at last...

When I walked into this, your feathers were ruffled and that is how I saw you. When it got to the point of name calling... Well, I think you understand.

It's really good to see the real you!

I'm sure that you understand that the guys were playing with you. Albeit, sometimes the line between fun and anger is very thin.

Many years ago when I first came to this forum my enthusiasm was very high and I wanted to impart my experiences to anyone who would listen. With some members I was totally out of my league and promptly got put in my place. I meant well, but there was still much to be learned, both in audio and in how to respond without stepping on peoples toes.

I traveled all over the Midwest and east coast listening to all the highend systems I could. Fortunately, I was old enough that the owners figured that I was affluent enough to afford their best and were eager to demonstrate them for me. Two systems stood out above all the rest. First there was the flagship of Avalon ($70,000 just for the speakers) connected to Spectral gear. The soundstaging was so precise that I felt that I could actually walk between the performers. The images were solid and the space between them was very defined. Most systems produce a layering, but this system went beyond that and produced a holographic image. The second system was Wilson/Watt driven by Pass Labs (45 watt amp). It too, produced a totally holographic image. I realize that very few people have heard this level of audio and for the most part, never will. It became my standard for the ultimate system, one that I could never approach on my income.

I bought a set of Quad Esl's and was thrilled with the sound. The only cravat was that they had very little soundstaging. The problem was that they needed a lot of room to do that and I didn't have the it. I tried many amps, DAC's, wires, preamps, and so on, but never did get it to sound the way I wanted. Don't get me wrong, what they did well they did better than almost every speaker I ever listened to. You know how sometimes your system just doesn't sound right and you get the urge to get something else? When that would happen, I would hit the highend shops and in short order, I returned home knowing I made the right choice. It was me and not my system. Most good systems had attributes that I prefered over my Quad's but as a whole, I liked my Quad's better.

When my Quad's were down for repair, I bought a small pair of B&W's. I finally started getting soundstaging. Clarity wise and tonally, they were no match for the Quads, but they did produce a soundstage.

This is turning into my life's story and I didn't mean that to happen...

Jumping ahead...

I sold all my gear and built my own speakers and couldn't be happier. I have clarity and soundstaging, both better than my Quads. Still, it is not at the level of the systems I described above, but not too shabby. I am still upgrading, but instead of buying new equipment, I am into modifying what I have.

The whole point of this story is that I had to go through what I did to understand/appreciate what some of the people here have gone through to get the systems they have today. For most, It's not about the money. It's about the adventure and discovery. Through it all, they have learned a great deal and I respect that. Some people here are where I was over 35 years ago and there is nothing wrong with that. There are also people here that will always know more than myself. Sometimes I feel intimidated by them, but it is what it is.

Some of the other boards I go to are into modifying their gear. when I am there, I struggle to understand what they are talking about. I still enjoy it very much. I don't post much for good reason, but I learn a great deal.

Most of us older people are opinionated, myself included. Still, we need to respect each other's opinions.

As far as this not being a forum for highend equipment, I agree. It's a mixture people of people in all stages of this hobby. Frankly, I think that it works very well considering the diversity here.

I do understand about saving for retirement.

Well, I gotta go, but thanks for letting the real you shine through. I might play with you later, but don't take it personal, but feel free to slam me once in a while if the urge hits you. It can be fun, as long as we know we are just playing. If it goes over the top, just let me know. I'll quit...

Respects

Imaging is one of the most elusive aspects of good sound to acheive, and my gold standard.
One of the reason B&W is such a bargain and a audiophiles friend is that they put
a lot of quality into even their inexpensive speakers, and they image like speakers costing a lot more.
I got a pair of DM305 SEVERAL YEARS AGO, floorstanding versions of the bottom of the line beemer, the exelent 302. The 302 has little blades in the cabinet, breaks up standing waves. These speakers rival my 602s2 that I have in front. They certainly have more "air".
THEY hold up well, even past teh half decade mark.
And you have just seen a peek at the "real" me, maybe sometime I will show you the police officer me, who has seen more life and death than most can imagine.
Certainly not the ninnies who predominate this board.
But it is fun here when I GET TIRED OF THE real AUDIO FORUMS
You know, the ones where people actually know stuff and are willing to teach it to you

[Rich-n-Texas]

But it is fun here when I GET TIRED OF THE real AUDIO FORUMS
You know, the ones where people actually know stuff and are willing to teach it to you

Ya know Pix I think you've just convinced a LOT of people that you really are just trolling here. What do you mean by "fun"? Do you mean you like to provoke people here? In the "REAL" forums, do you attack people who don't share your opinion like you do here? It's obvious you're not here to learn right?

[GMichael]

As for GM not being a "threat" does that include the vernareal disease?
Doesnt that threaten your crack hos that you frequent?
And its metformin that diabetics take, type 2 at least.
Although I AM SURE THAT GM HAS TRIED HIS SHARE OF METAMORPHIN

The crack of my hos are not your concern sir. You can have them when I'm through with them.

Diabetic type 2. Yup, that's me. At least I'm loosing weight now.

[Mr Peabody]

The person that could actually teach Pixel should get a Nobell prize, or something. You'd have to be an oil driller to get anything through his thick skull.

[pixelthis]

The crack of my hos are not your concern sir. You can have them when I'm through with them.

Diabetic type 2. Yup, that's me. At least I'm loosing weight now.

You will lose weight because you cant eat ANYTHING.
And they are crack hos because I am through with them