BFD Installation and Setup Help

[kexodusc]

Ugly amp? I think it's quite stunning really. The LED's are a bit bright if you're in a small room, but in my larger dark room they look pretty cool.

Glad you're getting the hand of it Rich. You'll notice quite the difference. Do you have your speakers set to small or large? Worth going back later and experimenting with small if you don't have them that way already.

[Rich-n-Texas]

I think they're set to large. I used the Yamaha Receiver Manager s/w to set the levels so I wouldn't have to constantly start and stop the S&V disk while I was setting the levels using the GUI menu. That tool is coming in handy for this process.

So did anybody hear what I said... +75 degrees HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!! ?

About 80 degrees today. Might just cook a steak on the grill for dinner.

[GMichael]

I think they're set to large. I used the Yamaha Receiver Manager s/w to set the levels so I wouldn't have to constantly start and stop the S&V disk while I was setting the levels using the GUI menu. That tool is coming in handy for this process.

So did anybody hear what I said... +75 degrees HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!! ?

About 80 degrees today. Might just cook a steak on the grill for dinner.

That's way too hot for this time of year. How can you put up with it?

[Rich-n-Texas]

No such thing as "way too hot for this time of year". No sir!

[GMichael]

It's unnatural. Call Gore.

[f0rge]

It's unnatural. Call Gore.

i agree, stop global warming, we need the ice for parties.

[Rich-n-Texas]

I never should've said it. It just encourages the alarmist camp I suppose.

(A high of 80 degrees today.)

[GMichael]

Hold on everybody! Somebody here said something ultra-important, and we missed it.

Rich, you said something about the weather. Cute, but boring. That wasn't it.
I said something about Gore. Smart, but that's not it either.
That leaves f0rge. You said something about global warming. That's just stupid. NOT IT! Oh wait. Here is is. You also said "PARTIES!"
THAT'S IT! That was the equation. Parties cancel out boredom.
BRILLIANT!
Who's got the drinks?

[Rich-n-Texas]

Here's a question...

For those with a PS3 (and BFD of course), would you use it or your DVD player to run the test tones when setting up a preset for movie playback?

[L.J.]

Here's a question...

For those with a PS3 (and BFD of course), would you use it or your DVD player to run the test tones when setting up a preset for movie playback?

PS3 since it's my main source. You can set up a different set of filters for each source if you like.

[f0rge]

Who's got the drinks?

i could totally go for a couple of beers right about now, first round is on me

[GMichael]

Rich was caught groping Jess in public.

Rich, I set you up with a nice girl, and this is how you treat her?

[kexodusc]

The red just means the BFD is close to clipping the signal....it's not optimal if it goes much beyond that...sort of the final warning. I would just turn the volume on the sub up a bit, and manually decrease the sub level in the receiver's settings a bit to compensate.

Rich, setting filters is a iterative process. Set your first 2 filters (starting low to high) and then measure again, you may find some other frequencies outside the target range were affected...especially multiples of the frequency in question.

When you get really brave with it you can use it to boost your subs lower frequencies a bit to compensate for where it starts to roll off. It's sort of cheating but it's a great little perk to this thing.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Well I've completed reading the manual setup guide (I'll still be using it step-by-step) and I'm going to start in on it this weekend.

The thing that still bugs me is the logic behind the level setup. Isn't all this referencing movies for loud passages, all the way through adjusting the sub level at its amp kind of arbitrary? Compounded further by the fact that, like L.J. says, the loud passage doesn't really have to peak in the red? I understand kex what the red LED is indicating, but all the pre-measuring excercises seem kind of irrelevant to me.

[Woochifer]

Well I've completed reading the manual setup guide (I'll still be using it step-by-step) and I'm going to start in on it this weekend.

The thing that still bugs me is the logic behind the level setup. Isn't all this referencing movies for loud passages, all the way through adjusting the sub level at its amp kind of arbitrary? Compounded further by the fact that, like L.J. says, the loud passage doesn't really have to peak in the red? I understand kex what the red LED is indicating, but all the pre-measuring excercises seem kind of irrelevant to me.

If you're hitting the red LED on the BFD, then you might want to dial back the subwoofer level from your receiver and compensate for that by raising the level on the subwoofer itself. You'll still wind up with the same decibel level, but you won't get a distorted/clipped signal sent through the BFD.

[Rich-n-Texas]

That's what I did Wooch. The setup guide says it's okay if the level hits the "Clip" LED occasionally (I know what clipping is), but I mean, I could run level tests with different movie tracks all day and I'd never get the same results twice, so that's why it just seems arbitrary to me. Other than the fact that clipping is not good.

[kexodusc]

It's not really arbitrary, but it is splitting hairs a bit. We're only recommending you bump the volume on the sub up and turn the gain from the receiver down to minimize any clipping possibilities on every sound track. Some movies will be a bit louder than others, what you want to avoid is the BFD clipping the signal before it reaches the sub's amp. The sub's amp will amplify what it receives until it's clipping point, and you most likely have more headroom on the sub than you do on the receiver. But still, you could probably leave it the way you have it and not notice any clipping effects as long as you own it. It's just a question of how sure you want to be.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Okay. When I test again with U-571, I'll adjust so there's no possibility that explosions will clip (Y'all got me paranoid now )

[L.J.]

Okay. When I test again with U-571, I'll adjust so there's no possibility that explosions will clip (Y'all got me paranoid now )

your funny

[kexodusc]

I wouldn't worry too much about it. When I blast the music or a good movie I'll hit the red a few times during the movie. I don't notice any nasty stuff, the walls are too busy shaking and looking over my shoulder to see if Lucifer himself has cracked the earth and crawled into my HT room.

As long as it's only hitting the red when it's really, really loud, louder than you normally listen to(ie, your loudest peaks) then that's all you need to worry about. If it was tripping the red at your normal listening volume you'd want to change the setting.

[Rich-n-Texas]

BTW, when I came home from work the other day I noticed a picture sitting on the floor below it's hanger. It's in a very old frame with a thick cardboard frame eye; don't think its related to my experimentation, but if it's a sign of things to come...

[Rich-n-Texas]

This is a before graph. I'll start setting up filters next, but I just wanted to get some comments...

[kexodusc]

This is a before graph. I'll start setting up filters next, but I just wanted to get some comments...

Rich, does this include the correction values for the Rat-shack meter?


Ha ha ha....look at that..bet you didn't think you were missing half an octave of bass did ya?

This is where the fun begins. And this is where all bets are off too on what the "right thing to do is". For my setup, it was a few days of trial and error. I can't just look at a graph and say this frequency, that Q, that many dB's, presto.

Maybe Sir T or Wooch can chime in but, I would probably start with a guess that you'll want a cut for starters around 38Hz or so to lower all that stuff a bit...maybe at 1/6 octave bandwidth? You might even want to cut all that stuff below 40 Hz down to minimize the effect of that big dip, but I'm guessing that's 2 filters. You might get lucky though and get away with one filter, leaving you a nice "house curve" below 35 Hz that gradually rises. Then on the other side of your sick suckout at 45 Hz I'd probably want to think about cutting the peaks at 56, and 80Hz.

After each filter is set, go back and measure again...the curve might look different outside the range of frequencies of the filter. Always start from lowest to highest.

[Rich-n-Texas]

Rich, does this include the correction values for the Rat-shack meter?

What gets plotted is the compensated SPL with the correction added in using a formula for each cell.

Ha ha ha....look at that..bet you didn't think you were missing half an octave of bass did ya?

I don't know. Did I set something up wrong? I used the test tones that started @ 16Hz - 160Hz, so for the graph I deleted the rows in the table that contained tones below 16Hz and above 160Hz.

This is where the fun begins. And this is where all bets are off too on what the "right thing to do is". For my setup, it was a few days of trial and error. I can't just look at a graph and say this frequency, that Q, that many dB's, presto.

Understood. I haven't read the explanation on Q and House Curves yet, but one good thing about trial & error is that I'll be able to setup filters and such in my sleep after all's said and done.

Maybe Sir T or Wooch can chime in but, I would probably start with a guess that you'll want a cut for starters around 38Hz or so to lower all that stuff a bit...maybe at 1/6 octave bandwidth? You might even want to cut all that stuff below 40 Hz down to minimize the effect of that big dip, but I'm guessing that's 2 filters. You might get lucky though and get away with one filter, leaving you a nice "house curve" below 35 Hz that gradually rises. Then on the other side of your sick suckout at 45 Hz I'd probably want to think about cutting the peaks at 56, and 80Hz.

Don't know. I haven't read that part yet. Thanks for the ideas though.

After each filter is set, go back and measure again...the curve might look different outside the range of frequencies of the filter. Always start from lowest to highest.

Maybe I'm interpreting my graph wrong, but when I compare it to the sample graph included in the Shack's guide, it seems flatter overall.

I'll tell ya one thing, I spent a LOT of time silencing all the rattles in the room that the test tones caused. The TV rattled, the fireplace rattled, stuff in the front hall closet rattled... and on and on and on. I've got shims all over the place!

[L.J.]

Great post Kex. I tried to dish out some green but I need to recharge.

Rich, you got a freakin crater going on over there

Kex is right. You gotta get yourself a couple of free hours and have a crack at it. This is when those ear plugs are gonna come in handy Make sure you record everything you do.

I'm interested in what the rest of the guys have to say. Come to think of it, does Sir T drop in anymore?