What other hobbies or interests do you have?

[Feanor]

...
One of the problems with giving universal health care in the US, is that we will all be paying at minimum, 50% income tax to pay for it. This is a multi TRILLION dollar problem that the government has no answer for. Also, under this system, health care will be rationed and people in this country will not go for that.

Reports of health rationing and waiting lists in Canada are hugely exaggerated by critics in the US, most of them with a vested interest in the current American system.

My story about Canadian medical care has a much different flavor from yours. I had a triple coronary bypass two years ago. After diagnosis I waited a total of 5 months for surgery. This was not a problem in my case since I responded extremely well to medication and was not deem to be at risk; surgery was considered elective.

My consultation involved two highly regarded cardiologists and a surgeon who is considered a world-class expert in "robotic" surgery. My case was considered for "robotic" surgery, (much less invasive), and that's what was expect 'till I went into the hospital. However the surgeon decided he could not do a good enough job robotically and elected to do the good old sternectomy (did I get that right?). Nevertheless he was able to do it without using a heart-lung machine and without transfusing any blood. I sayed 5 days in the hospital, receiving more consultation and physiotherapy. I went to a cardiac rehabilitation program including diet and exercise counseling .Since the operation I have had annual check ups with my cardiologist (Holter monitor, ultrasonic readings of my heart and cardioid artery, plus stress tests), the first time less than 6 weeks after the operation, in each case with excellent results.

For all of the preceeding I was charged at total of a $800 surcharge for a semi-private hospital room plus my presciption drugs, (other than those I received in the hospital which were no charge); my employer's insurance plan paid these expenses. Had I been over 65 the prescriptions would have been paid by the Province of Ontario except for a $3.16 dispensing fee.

Please, since you're a doctor, tell me what is wrong with any of this? While you're at it, tell me why if the Canadian system is so flawed, no Canadian politician would have the chance of a fart in a wind storm if he advocated serious reductions in the public health system. Or why the Saskatchewan premier who introduced the first universal health care system in this country was recently voted the greatest Canadian of all time?

Please don't spread lies and half-truths about the Canadian medical system. Also, I regard that it is a LIE to say that the cost of medical services would increase in the US with a universal insurance system. Yes, it would cost governments much more, but the people less. For example, it is a fact that cost to hospitals and doctors in Canada to bill and receive payment is only 20% of what it is in the U.S. And yes, Doc, Canadian emergency rooms collect 100% of their billings.

[melvin walker]

Reports of health rationing and waiting lists in Canada are hugely exaggerated by critics in the US, most of them with a vested interest in the current American system.

My story about Canadian medical care has a much different flavor from yours. I had a triple coronary bypass two years ago. After diagnosis I waited a total of 5 months for surgery. This was not a problem in my case since I responded extremely well to medication and was not deem to be at risk; surgery was considered elective.

My consultation involved two highly regarded cardiologists and a surgeon who is considered a world-class expert in "robotic" surgery. My case was considered for "robotic" surgery, (much less invasive), and that's what was expect 'till I went into the hospital. However the surgeon decided he could not do a good enough job robotically and elected to do the good old sternectomy (did I get that right?). Nevertheless he was able to do it without using a heart-lung machine and without transfusing any blood. I sayed 5 days in the hospital, receiving more consultation and physiotherapy. I went to a cardiac rehabilitation program including diet and exercise counseling .Since the operation I have had annual check ups with my cardiologist (Holter monitor, ultrasonic readings of my heart and cardioid artery, plus stress tests), the first time less than 6 weeks after the operation, in each case with excellent results.

For all of the preceeding I was charged at total of a $800 surcharge for a semi-private hospital room plus my presciption drugs, (other than those I received in the hospital which were no charge); my employer's insurance plan paid these expenses. Had I been over 65 the prescriptions would have been paid by the Province of Ontario except for a $3.16 dispensing fee.

Please, since you're a doctor, tell me what is wrong with any of this? While you're at it, tell me why if the Canadian system is so flawed, no Canadian politician would have the chance of a fart in a wind storm if he advocated serious reductions in the public health system. Or why the Saskatchewan premier who introduced the first universal health care system in this country was recently voted the greatest Canadian of all time?

Please don't spread lies and half-truths about the Canadian medical system. Also, I regard that it is a LIE to say that the cost of medical services would increase in the US with a universal insurance system. Yes, it would cost governments much more, but the people less. For example, it is a fact that cost to hospitals and doctors in Canada to bill and receive payment is only 20% of what it is in the U.S. And yes, Doc, Canadian emergency rooms collect 100% of their billings.

I will not try and compare health care in the U.S. and health care in Canada. The two systems has it's critics and supporters.
The question is are American citizens willing to pay the higher taxes for national health care ? If taxes are increased what would be the effect on American business as well as the individual tax payers ?

Western Europe has seen slow growth , high unemployment and tax avoidance because of high governmental taxes. ,. In America what would happen to our consumer based economy if the consumer has less to spend due to higher taxes.
How many Americans would have the extra money to spend on that new LCD ?,
newer surround sound system ?, , replace that 7 year old car ?, move into a larger home ?
update that aging computer ? etc. Would it mean a slower growth consumer market ,?, that usually spells recession !



The issue is higher taxes are lower taxes. Most Americans have health care. The poor Medicaid , the elderly Medicare , and most of those working, company health care.
It is those unskilled and semi-skilled workers in the middle that has little are no health care. The final question is how much health care does one require and who should pay for it ? A friend of mine asked the question , what kind of health care are do we want the government to provide Cadillac health care are Chevrolet health care.
Using an audio metaphor , separates health care or receiver health cars ?
It's your money.

[Feanor]

I will not try and compare health care in the U.S. and health care in Canada. The two systems has it's critics and supporters.
The question is are American citizens willing to pay the higher taxes for national health care ? If taxes are increased what would be the effect on American business as well as the individual tax payers ?

Western Europe has seen slow growth , high unemployment and tax avoidance because of high governmental taxes. ,. In America what would happen to our consumer based economy if the consumer has less to spend due to higher taxes.
How many Americans would have the extra money to spend on that new LCD ?,
newer surround sound system ?, , replace that 7 year old car ?, move into a larger home ? update that aging computer ? etc. Would it mean a slower growth consumer market ,?, that usually spells recession !

The issue is higher taxes are lower taxes. Most Americans have health care. The poor Medicaid , the elderly Medicare , and most of those working, company health care.
It is those unskilled and semi-skilled workers in the middle that has little are no health care. The final question is how much health care does one require and who should pay for it ? A friend of mine asked the question , what kind of health care are do we want the government to provide Cadillac health care are Chevrolet health care.
Using an audio metaphor , separates health care or receiver health cars ?
It's your money.

Melvin, your questions are all quite valid and it will be up to Americans to answer them.

A few things to bear in mind during the debate:

• If a thing is "free" from the perspective of the consumer, them some sort of rationing is inevidable. But bear in mind that is applies whether the rationing agency is a government health department or a private for-profit organization, e.g. an HMO.
• Take care to distinguish between the cost to government, (i.e. taxpayer), and the overall cost of the system, (i.e. the total cost per patient treated). The former might be higher while the latter is lower, e.g. there are potentially huge administrative cost saving in a universal one-payer system
• Beware of the selfishness factor, (as I call it), that is, the notion among healthy/wealthy citizens that their personal level of health care will inevidably decline if they have to "subsidize" the less well/well-off. There could be a degree of truth here, but the degree of care forfeiture and/or "subsidy" might be less than they supposed -- and much less than vested interests constantly imply.

[bobsticks]

[*]Beware of the selfishness factor, (as I call it), that is, the notion among healthy/wealthy citizens that their personal level of health care will inevidably decline if they have to "subsidize" the less well/well-off. There could be a degree of truth here, but the degree of care forfeiture and/or "subsidy" might be less than they supposed -- and much less than vested interests constantly imply.[/LIST]

Much respect to your point of view Feanor, but let's remember that everything is relative. With an estimated 12 to 15 million illegal immigrants already in the U.S. enjoying free medical health care and not contributing to the system the call for a big warm fuzzy is a bit disproportionate to the very real amount of graft within that system.

I have no problem paying taxes to address the problems of the citizenry I just expect that everyone is contributing...not necessarily to my ability but to the best of theirs. And to use a point of reference for the system being out of control I would point to the three hospitals that have gone out of business in Orange County over the last couple of years. The administrators in these facilities simply couldn't collect enough billables to stay afloat, much less make a profit. And try and find a clinic in the O.C...

Frankly, I don't care if there is a lack of transparency in the current immigration policy. To wade through it would seemingly indicate a willingness to conform to at least the rudimentary elements of citizenry. Anyone who goes through that will be welcomed as my neighbor with open arms and anyone else...not so much

[Rich-n-Texas]

Melvin you are just laughable.

[Rich-n-Texas]

How 'bout skiing Bert? Aren't there some great ski hills in Belgium?

[basite]

How 'bout skiing Bert? Aren't there some great ski hills in Belgium?

in france there are, or in Switzerland, or in Austria, or in northern Italy, but in Belgium? nah

Belgium is pretty much flat for the biggest part. We do have some 'mountains' in the south, but I'd think I'd go to somewhere else if I wanted to ski

They ain't callin us (belgium and the netherlands) "the lowlands" for nuttin

[Rich-n-Texas]

Okay. My last geography class was about thirty years ago.

[Groundbeef]

Okay. My last geography class was about thirty years ago.

Huh, you musta gone to school with Melvin's grandson.

[audio amateur]

Huh, you musta gone to school with Melvin's grandson.

looooooooooooool

[Rich-n-Texas]

Huh, you musta gone to school with Melvin's grandson.

Naaa, the other kids were constantly beating him up. I stayed away.

[topspeed]

No, it's all about speed. The adrenalin rush from 0 to +100 mph in a stock street car in the 1/4 is orgasmic.

I've got a SMG man, it ain't that hard! Engage Launch Control, drop the hammer, let go of the stick and flick the right paddle when the shift light comes on. A monkey can reel off high 12's. Road racing requires SOOOOO much more concentration and you have to keep that focus a helluva lot longer than 10-12 seconds at a time!

Gave up on the video games I see.

Nah, I just haven't found the courage to try COD4 online and get shredded by some snot nosed kid. Ego's are a delicate thing, ya know?

[bfalls]

Other hobbies include collecting Coca Cola memorabilia. I have over 700 collector series glasses, trays, etc.. I collect CDs (800+), LDs (100) and DVDs (750+). I also perform ISF video calibrations and I'm a state certified EMT.

[Rich-n-Texas]

I've got a SMG man, it ain't that hard! Engage Launch Control, drop the hammer, let go of the stick and flick the right paddle when the shift light comes on. A monkey can reel off high 12's. Road racing requires SOOOOO much more concentration and you have to keep that focus a helluva lot longer than 10-12 seconds at a time!

Alright! decode the FnF and SMG Abbrev's wiseguy! I reeled off high 12's, but I had to feather the peddle 'cause the 3K stall torque converter and 3.73 gears made it hard to keep the MT E/T streets under me. No "monkey" is gonna do that!!!

Did I say stock?

Nah, I just haven't found the courage to try COD4 online and get shredded by some snot nosed kid.

I probably never will game online, even though Bert's trying to bring me out of my shell.

Ego's are a delicate thing, ya know?

Yeah they are. Hey I'm impressed with your online gamer lingo. Fragged huh?

[audio amateur]

I believe SMG is the M3's transmission. It'a paddle-shift a.k.a touch-tronic (semi-automatic with gear leavers at the wheel). Not 'stick' as you americans would put it. It's a shame though manuals are a blast

[topspeed]

FnF=Fast n' Furious. You know, rice racing in street drags.

SMG=Sequential M Gearbox. It's a normal 6MT gearbox with a computer controlled electro-hydraulic clutch. It's not a slushbox as there is no torque converter. In full kill mode, it'll snap off shifts in .8 seconds, faster than any human can. The best part however, is the rev matched downshifts as you don't have to worry about money shifts and can concentrate on your braking point and line.

[O'Shag]

Hi Pete O',

My lad was gentle when stroked, fierce when provoked. I remember late one night I took him down as was customary for a walk along the bike path at the beach. It was fairly dark, and as he wasn't on a lead he wandered down to the beach. I walked along the path, and noticed approaching quite rapidly were three large guys with somewhat of an air of menace about them. I prepared myself for any 'eventualities' grabbing the keys in my pocket and making a fist. Out from the dark popped Saxon, all 175lbs of him. Dags know when there is danger, and Saxon was the gentlest soul (wonderful with children and the elderly) but proud and powerful as they come. An Irish Wolfhound 'disturbed' is something to behold. He began walking deliberately in a tense fashion (like a lion I kid you not) towards the approaching threesome, and an 18hz growl began eminating from his massive muzzle (the wolfhounds head and neck is huge). In about a milisecond the threesome turned and ran. Saxon was 36" at the shoulder which is about average for a Wolfhound but I've seen much bigger. They're the largest member of the greyhound family, and whilst the slowest, they'll leave most any other type of dog in the dust with their double-suspension sprint i.e. incredibly fast for their size. I've seen some Scottish Deerhounds that were phenomenally fast.

Saxon and I used to go down to a 'puppy play group' where owners would bring their dogs. There was among them a Greyhound rescued from the track, a large greyhound appropriately named Bullet. For those of you that have never seen a greyhound in full flight it is mindblowing. He would toy with other dogs, Bullet, in just four strides, was ancient history, none of the other dogs could even keep up with his dust. Ah, my dear Saxon, how I miss him...

[O'Shag]

Bill B.,

If you have a local pub up there, you might consider joining the darts team. Its a bit of fun and some exercise. Melvin is right about the exercise.

By the way Melvin, hope your enjoying those wonederful Hartsfields. The price is skyrocketing on them.

[topspeed]

There are high end audio equipment that cost almost as much as these cars $ 100,000 +
These audio systems are for the audiophiles of today. preamps $50,000 amps $75,000.
speakers $100,000.
it was not unusual for an audiophile to pay $7000.00 for an audio system in the day when a Daytona Ferrari cost $18,000 and a 911 Porsche cost $8,000.
No different today

Ugh. As much as I hate to admit it, you're actually right on this count.

The good news is just like a $5000 Nuforce 9se will give owners of $60,000 Burmester 911's serious pause, a $69,000 Nissan GT-R will lap the Nordschleife faster than a $123,000 Porsche 997tt or the mighty $1.6m Bugatti Veyron. Very soon, the ZR-1 Corvette...yes, a red-white-and-blue-mom-baseball-and-apple-pie-Vette, will knock every Euro blueblood on its pompous ass.

Performance vs. pedigree: You can pay for what's on the hood or what's under it.

I'll take what's under it.




To O'shag,

I've got my German shepherd/Irish Wolfhound laying behind me as I type this. Great dog, deceptively fast (as you noted) and very obedient...now. Before 3 yrs, she was nightmare and had more energy than a 1kW amp at clip. Thankfully, she grew out of it and is much more manageable now. As you know, when dogs of this size get a full head of steam, you really don't want to be standing in the middle of the tracks. Her name is Kublai.

[Rich-n-Texas]

HEY! If I want paddle shifters I'll get a Mitsubishi Lancer. So there!

[Rich-n-Texas]

TS, have I told you I've had my car dyno'ed on the same machine Lou Gigliotti tunes his race cars on?

[topspeed]

TS, have I told you I've had my car dyno'ed on the same machine Lou Gigliotti tunes his race cars on?

Well, since this thread is completely off topic anyway, you might as well spill:

Let's see the graph F-boy!!!

[O'Shag]

Quote from Ajani......."You ask about the percentage of minorities in Canada... ok how about this.... you explain to me what is required to gain US citizenship and I'll explain what's required to get Canadian...

"Canada has far more immigrant friendly policies... It's not to hard to figure out whether you'd qualify for Permanent Residence (and eventually citizenship)... and it's relatively easy to get that....

I've never heard anyone praise the US' attitude towards immigation..."

Ajani, this is not statement against Canada's obviously excellent immagrant policies. But I think your above statement is incorrect. One thing that cannot be argued with, is that the USA has had and continues to have the most liberal immigration policies anywhere at anytime. More immigrants have landed on these shores to call it home than in any other country; period.

I think Melvin has a good point, but I also agree in a sense with what your saying. The USA is not the be-all and end-all, but there's no denying its important role as a world leading power, and how decisions made in this country have great effect in the world.

[Ajani]

Quote from Ajani......."You ask about the percentage of minorities in Canada... ok how about this.... you explain to me what is required to gain US citizenship and I'll explain what's required to get Canadian...

"Canada has far more immigrant friendly policies... It's not to hard to figure out whether you'd qualify for Permanent Residence (and eventually citizenship)... and it's relatively easy to get that....

I've never heard anyone praise the US' attitude towards immigation..."

Ajani, this is not statement against Canada's obviously excellent immagrant policies. But I think your above statement is incorrect. I am an American, having immigrated from Great Britain 20 odd years ago. One thing that cannot be argued with, is that the USA has had and continues to have the most liberal immigration policies anywhere at anytime. More immigrants have landed on these shores to call it home than in any other country; period.

Though I appreciate your point I must note a few things:

1) Immigration from another 1st world country such as the UK to America is not what I'd consider the best test of fair and transparent immigration policies... and while you had a fairly easy time, I'm not sure how many Mexicans and Jamaicans found the process to be quite so simple...

2) There is no denying the shear volume of immigrants in America, but that also has a lot to do with the overall size (land and population) of the country.... I would expect a country like Grand Cayman to have far less immigrants than the US... etc....

3) While the US has accepted many immigrants, there is still a lack of transparency and simplicity in the process... now compare that to Canada which operates on a simple point system (you can basically go online and determine whether you'd be likely to qualify for citizenship) and you see why I regard the US policies as not being immigrant friendly...

I think Melvin has a good point, but I also agree in a sense with what your saying. The USA is not the be-all and end-all, but there's no denying its important role as a world leading power, and how decisions made in this country have great effect in the world.

I'll agree that the US is EXTREMELY important in the world... it is a large superpower... but my real problem with Melvin's post is that it reflects the attitude that the US is doing the rest of the world a huge favour, and that everyone should be thankful to have the US around to save their butts... which is absurd.... The world would continue without the US, it wouldn't be the same (some things a lot worse) but it would continue...

[melvin walker]

Though I appreciate your point I must note a few things:

1) Immigration from another 1st world country such as the UK to America is not what I'd consider the best test of fair and transparent immigration policies... and while you had a fairly easy time, I'm not sure how many Mexicans and Jamaicans found the process to be quite so simple...

2) There is no denying the shear volume of immigrants in America, but that also has a lot to do with the overall size (land and population) of the country.... I would expect a country like Grand Cayman to have far less immigrants than the US... etc....

3) While the US has accepted many immigrants, there is still a lack of transparency and simplicity in the process... now compare that to Canada which operates on a simple point system (you can basically go online and determine whether you'd be likely to qualify for citizenship) and you see why I regard the US policies as not being immigrant friendly...



I'll agree that the US is EXTREMELY important in the world... it is a large superpower... but my real problem with Melvin's post is that it reflects the attitude that the US is doing the rest of the world a huge favour, and that everyone should be thankful to have the US around to save their butts... which is absurd.... The world would continue without the US, it wouldn't be the same (some things a lot worse) but it would continue...

You are correct without the U.S. the world would continue. What kind of world would we have. Europe is safer because of NATO , the backbone of NATO is the U.S. The United Nation plays a major role in what little peace we have , the United Nations would be unworkable without the U.S.
Trade and commerce would not be effective if it was not the presence of the U.S. navy , which protects the sea lanes.
The American dollar backed up by a strong GNP gives stability to other nations currences.

The U.S. does act in it's interest. The standard of living has been improving in the rest of the world thinks to international trade promoted and protected by the U.S.
The largest contributor to the U.N. is the U.S.A. The world would be a more dangerous place to live in without the U.N. National disasters and health issues in poorer countries has been aided by the U.N. financed mostly by the U.S.

The 19th and 20th century has seen the world progress at a rate 100 times greater than at any time in the world's history. Thanks to the stabilizing influences and military power of the British and the United States.
What would happen in the Middle East if the Arab militants were allowed to reintroduce
Muslim fundamentalism ? What would have been the results if NATO backed by the U.S.
had not intervened in the Baltics , where two world wars began.

Many people dislike a stern and powerful super power , Who else would you prefer as that super power ? China ? Russia ? Japan . Germany ? Great Britain ?
The United States is not a perfect nation , but over the last 200 years no nation has worked has hard as the U.S. to solve problems that many thought was unsolvable..