Listening Space update

[Hyfi]

Actually, a diagonal arrangement can work very well especially in challenged rooms where the room dimensions are even multiples. My only suggestion would be to provide some first reflection point absorption for the right speaker.

rw

Can you explain that? Did you see the pics from above link of the rest of my room?

[Worf101]

Feel free to ask a question on Optimus speakers on the appropriate sub-forum (i.e. "Speakers"). There are several members that currently use them and more that have experience with them.

I looked at your Site. Your business seems very nice and the website organized well. It did not, however, pertain to audio in any way. Please do not post the link again as it is violation of our advertising policy.

Thank you and welcome.

As Fang would say on Soupy Sales...

"Ruh Roe!"

Hell there's a new sherrif in town and he used to fly into to the ring on cables.

Worf

[E-Stat]

Can you explain that?

The diagonal arrangement or addressing the first reflection points?

Did you see the pics from above link of the rest of my room?

Unfortunately, they are only available to AK members.

rw

[Hyfi]

first reflection points?


Unfortunately, they are only available to AK members.



rw

Here is the opposite corner and sweet spot

[E-Stat]

Here is the opposite corner and sweet spot

Ok, now I understand. To an extent, your furniture is dictating system placement. My suggestion is to accommodate it - rather than fight it . Instead of attempting to fire the speakers directly down the length of the room, situate the gear and couch more from a front right to back left orientation. That provides a more balanced speaker arrangement and could minimize room bass modes. You would also rotate the rear speakers to reflect that change. And still need some first reflection point absorption for the right front speaker.

I am in no way saying that will automatically be better. On the other hand, I think it is worth a try. What are your room dimensions?

rw

[Hyfi]

Ok, now I understand. To an extent, your furniture is dictating system placement. My suggestion is to accommodate it - rather than fight it . Instead of attempting to fire the speakers directly down the length of the room, situate the gear and couch more from a front right to back left orientation. That provides a more balanced speaker arrangement and could minimize room bass modes. You would also rotate the rear speakers to reflect that change. And still need some first reflection point absorption for the right front speaker.

I am in no way saying that will automatically be better. On the other hand, I think it is worth a try. What are your room dimensions?

rw

I am stuck with exactly the placement I have now for this room. I think it is 12 x 20 but would have to double check. I don't fire the speakers down, they are on approx 40 degree angle pretty much leaving the corner seat as the center point direction.

Not quite sure what you mean by
"situate the gear and couch more from a front right to back left orientation."

and
"first reflection point absorption for the right front speaker."

[E-Stat]

I think it is 12 x 20 but would have to double check. I don't fire the speakers down, they are on approx 40 degree angle pretty much leaving the corner seat as the center point direction.

Yet the gear is clearly offset to the right wall and your surrounds are oriented for a centered arrangement.

"first reflection point absorption for the right front speaker."

The image gets confused from reflections by a side wall. You need to place a sound damping panel adjacent to the speaker on the wall to prevent that. That topic and others are covered here.

Nice system.

rw

[Hyfi]

Yet the gear is clearly offset to the right wall and your surrounds are oriented for a centered arrangement.


The image gets confused from reflections by a side wall. You need to place a sound damping panel adjacent to the speaker on the wall to prevent that. That topic and others are covered here.

Nice system.

rw

OK, i get ya now. The rears are only for my half baked HT setup and I am not super critical of that, just enjoy the movies. I do concentrate more on 2 CH reproduction.

So you are suggesting that I place an absorption panel of some sort on the wall next to the right speaker. How High and wide?

And thanks, I do enjoy it a bunch....and thanks for the tips.

[E-Stat]

So you are suggesting that I place an absorption panel of some sort on the wall next to the right speaker. How High and wide?

Ideally about three or feet tall by about two feet. In the real world, smaller would still be beneficial. Even a thick tapestry would be helpful. There have been a number of threads regarding room treatments. There are also quite a few DIY formulas out there if you are a hands on guy. I even use damping panels out in the garage - largely to address slap echo.

Treating the room is often the last thing an audiophile does while it can have a significant effect on the end result.

rw

[Hyfi]

Yet the gear is clearly offset to the right wall and your surrounds are oriented for a centered arrangement.

rw

Just browsing back over this thread. I realize why now why the corner placement is being questioned.

Behind the left speaker is a double wide open doorway that is the front door foyer and steps to 2nd floor. That is not clear due to the angle of my shot. If I was to straighten it out, I would be blocking more than half the doorway. As it is I am 2 feet into the opening but since it is 6 feet behind the left speaker, the blockage is not noticed when walking through.

[frenchmon]

Just browsing back over this thread. I realize why now why the corner placement is being questioned.

Behind the left speaker is a double wide open doorway that is the front door foyer and steps to 2nd floor. That is not clear due to the angle of my shot. If I was to straighten it out, I would be blocking more than half the doorway. As it is I am 2 feet into the opening but since it is 6 feet behind the left speaker, the blockage is not noticed when walking through.

Hyfi...not trying to get into your mix...and the missus must have her run of the house...at least that's the way it is in mine and she don't like me messin around with it to much without her say so, so I suspect it is in yours as well. But I can kinda see how it is in your family room through the mirror in that one pic, #104. I can sorta understand your problem with the furniture and your a/v systems placement. But if it where me, I would sweet talk the missus in letting me re-arrange the room for best audio sound. I think your sectional can be re-arranged...looks like the wedge can be removed, furniture re-aranged, and a/v system place back to one of the wall....but hey, I'll stop before I over step more of my welcome into you lovely home. And if you bring that up to the missus...you didn't here that from me.

[Hyfi]

Hyfi...not trying to get into your mix...and the missus must have her run of the house...at least that's the way it is in mine and she don't like me messin around with it to much without her say so, so I suspect it is in yours as well. But I can kinda see how it is in your family room through the mirror in that one pic, #104. I can sorta understand your problem with the furniture and your a/v systems placement. But if it where me, I would sweet talk the missus in letting me re-arrange the room for best audio sound. I think your sectional can be re-arranged...looks like the wedge can be removed, furniture re-aranged, and a/v system place back to one of the wall....but hey, I'll stop before I over step more of my welcome into you lovely home. And if you bring that up to the missus...you didn't here that from me.

LOL, how gently you put that!

First, the reflection in the mirror of #104 is actually right back to where my rack is. The newer shot I posted was before I put the tree back. If you are an AK member, you could see the posted shot of my actual Family Room with the JM Labs and seating.

The room I use for my AV room is actually supposed to be a formal Living Room so right off the bat, I got it made! The seating and furniture arrangement is more me than her anyway. I was the one who had to have the Leather Sectional, and absolutely love it. The current layout is the overall best use of the room for many reasons. I'm fine with it and will suffer through the slight downside of audio playback for now. My next house should have a basement and a real Man Cave will be in order but for now......

Anyway, when most people hear what I have going on, the first reaction is more of a "jaw drop" as opposed to someone telling me that there is a little first point reflection going on.

Not that I have anything real special compared to what is available, it's more that most people listen to crap systems. I have heard on more than a few occasions that my setup was the best stereo someone has ever heard. But, I surely have heard way better systems in other peoples homes and of course, high end showrooms.

Thanks for the input and feedback and no, no offense taken in anyway.

brian

[manlystanley]

My latest setup. VTI BL series.

I can't get the right speaker away from the side wall but I get a decent soundstage with this spacing.

HyFi, Wow! what a setup. I don't know what type of speakers they are but they are gorgeous! Thanks for sharing.

[frenchmon]

LOL, how gently you put that!

First, the reflection in the mirror of #104 is actually right back to where my rack is. The newer shot I posted was before I put the tree back. If you are an AK member, you could see the posted shot of my actual Family Room with the JM Labs and seating.

The room I use for my AV room is actually supposed to be a formal Living Room so right off the bat, I got it made! The seating and furniture arrangement is more me than her anyway. I was the one who had to have the Leather Sectional, and absolutely love it. The current layout is the overall best use of the room for many reasons. I'm fine with it and will suffer through the slight downside of audio playback for now. My next house should have a basement and a real Man Cave will be in order but for now......

Anyway, when most people hear what I have going on, the first reaction is more of a "jaw drop" as opposed to someone telling me that there is a little first point reflection going on.

Not that I have anything real special compared to what is available, it's more that most people listen to crap systems. I have heard on more than a few occasions that my setup was the best stereo someone has ever heard. But, I surely have heard way better systems in other peoples homes and of course, high end showrooms.

Thanks for the input and feedback and no, no offense taken in anyway.

brian

And thank you for the grace...and not blasting me.

Cheers

[poppachubby]

I added a Panasonic 32" Tau, Marantz SR 640, Sony PS2 and Paradigm Model 7se. Strictly 2 channel for gaming and music DVDs. Actually sounds pretty good...

[dakatabg]

I added a Panasonic 32" Tau, Marantz SR 640, Sony PS2 and Paradigm Model 7se. Strictly 2 channel for gaming and music DVDs. Actually sounds pretty good...

Popa looks great but doesn't it the magnet and the vibrations of the speaker affect your TV monitor?

I had it like that before and my monitor started changing colors and it didn't last for long.

[poppachubby]

The magnets on the Paradigm are powerful but I backed them out until it wasn't an issue.

[thekid]

I added a Panasonic 32" Tau, Marantz SR 640, Sony PS2 and Paradigm Model 7se. Strictly 2 channel for gaming and music DVDs. Actually sounds pretty good...

Tres bon!
Looks like a place where I could hang out awhile.

[thekid]

Well I have decided to create an all sony ES set-up upstairs so things got moved around. Moved the vintage silver face Kenwood downstairs to use as a little mini-system with the KEF's. Seems to have a high WAF.

Moved the LD player inside the wall unit. I had been hesitant to do that because the drawer is so large and sticks out alot when it is open. Moved the Oppo and the cable box in as well. All the remotes work fine through the glass door.

Next set-up is setting up the ES system in the bedroom. A little weary because the Kenwood drove the A-25's so well.

[thekid]

Moved the last of it.....

[poppachubby]

Domo Ori Gato Mr Kid-boto. Looks great, but how does it sound overall?

[thekid]

Domo Ori Gato Mr Kid-boto. Looks great, but how does it sound overall?

Pretty good. I have moved the GA8ES around several times since I picked it up and it has always done well with whatever I matched it up with though you do have to be carefully with some of those soundfields on certain speakers. This receiver has plenty of features that I have not really explored so it will be interesting to see what happens as I become more familiar with it. An interesting feature (at least to me) on some of these ES pieces is that when you change the volume or output with the remote it actually rotates the knob rather than just changing the digital display change. The SACD player I have had for awhile and it is a great performer though a little slow and noisy to load. Have very limited use of the deck but very impressed so far. Very quiet player but seems to produce a very full and detailed sound.

These moves allow me to enjoy the best of both worlds. By moving the Kenwood combo downstairs I get to listen to it every morning as I get ready for work. The 8300 tuner is an awesome performer that often makes you forget you are listening to radio.

[thekid]

Posted a picture of the new amp in the "New Finds" thread but here is picture of it in its new home. As I mentioned in previous thread I was impressed enough with the Adcom GFP-555 that i started searching for a matching amp. They are common enough on the Bay but the 555's still go for a healthy amount. Managed to combine a weekend getaway with a CL score of GFA-545 II.

Only have about 2 hours of listening with this set-up but I am very happy with the preliminary results. I have heard others talk about systems that allow them to locate the instruments in a recording and have managed to get a sense of this after listening to some Aaron Copland. I do not have the ear or the eloquence of other members here who right about their listening experiences but in a word a would say that this set-up has depth. Previous systems have imaged well and captured the range of sound but I can now actually hear a forground and background in some recordings.

[poppachubby]

Great stuff kid! Looks awesome too. Can you distance the speakers any further apart? The reason I ask is that this has alot to do with your experience of depth and imaging. If indeed the Adcom is transparent enough to give you greater 3D, 6-8 feet will really allow some more space between the players.

I know what you mean regarding the improvement. You say your ear is not good, but you heard the difference right away. Clearly your ears are in sync with what you're hearing.

What I am wondering is how would you describe the sound? Warm, neutral or cool? I am also interested in your opinions on the phono stage, particularily vs. the Basic.

Oh I see, you're working out from a corner. Interesting. I get some pretty wacky effects with my comp system. The room modes push the stage way out beyond the speakers, it's almost eerie. Well enjoy my man. Will you be sitting on this one, or just having a taste?

Let's see. Sony ES, Kenwood Basic and now Adcom. Next will be Audio Note or Linn perhaps?

[thekid]

Great stuff kid! Looks awesome too. Can you distance the speakers any further apart? The reason I ask is that this has alot to do with your experience of depth and imaging. If indeed the Adcom is transparent enough to give you greater 3D, 6-8 feet will really allow some more space between the players.

I know what you mean regarding the improvement. You say your ear is not good, but you heard the difference right away. Clearly your ears are in sync with what you're hearing.

What I am wondering is how would you describe the sound? Warm, neutral or cool? I am also interested in your opinions on the phono stage, particularily vs. the Basic.

Oh I see, you're working out from a corner. Interesting. I get some pretty wacky effects with my comp system. The room modes push the stage way out beyond the speakers, it's almost eerie. Well enjoy my man. Will you be sitting on this one, or just having a taste?

Let's see. Sony ES, Kenwood Basic and now Adcom. Next will be Audio Note or Linn perhaps?

I would describe the sound from these pieces as neutral because it does not seem like it is trying change or shape the recorded material into any given direction by emphasizing or adding to highs or lows beyond their presence in the original recording. Given the nature of the bass in the Klipsch some may say that is a problem but IMO a little work with the bass control on the pre-amp solves the issue and brings enough bass to the table when it is needed. I would rather have the tighter bass that this combo gives over sloppier but deeper bass provided by other systems.

I have not given the phono stage a fair trial yet as I am having a variety of problems with my various TT's. I need to bite the bullet and get some new needles for my Duals and this set-up has convinced me to get that done ASAP.

Speaker set-up is somewhat limited by the corner restriction. I am on vacation this week so plan on trying to move some things around that may allow for more separation. The WAF is becoming less of an issue since the Klipsch have been established and the "wall of speakers" has been retired.

My plans are to as you put it "sit on" this for some time to come a promise I have made before but really think I will be able to keep. I still maintain 2 vintage mini set-ups through out the house which scratches my itch in that area. The ES gear has found a permanent home in the MBR in part because of its sound but also because I run everything off of a remote which gives it a distinct advantage over the Basic gear. I will continue to look and keep my eyes open but to find something better in the thrift/budget world I move in will be extremely difficult. The set-up as pictured except for the MSB DAC was purchased second hand for $535 which includes $120 to repair the pre-amp. I actually did pass on a pair of Linn speakers the other day in part because I have too many speakers siitting idle already and reviews of them indicated their sound would be similar to my KEF's but with a much larger footprint. Maybe the owner of them is breaking up a Linn system so you never know.....