I once was LOST... and i don't want to be found (S5)

[GMichael]

Ben can not die yet. The island won't let him. He has too much to do first.

[Kam]

maybe ben's not dead in that 'island won't let him' way, and in the 'faraday says you can't change what already happenned' way, and explains why, in a 'terminator you send back the cause of what made you' way he is so manipulative and hiding serets from everyone, because everyone tried to kill him as a kid, because of how manipulative and secretive he is.

edit: confused myself with that one again. but meant, how in the 'present' he used sayid ruthlessly, because in ben's "past" sayid tried to kill him, even though that was going to be sayids "future" from meeting ben. so when ben met sayid for the first time in sayid's life, ben had already met sayid in BEN'S life. and sayid tried to kill him. so... ya know... go figure he is a bit of a prick to him.

[Groundbeef]

Well, I guess that Ben isn't dead after all.

Good episode. Richard is sort of scary. I am wondering if he is an instrument of the devil. He seemed to really want to make sure that Kate and Sawyer understood he would "save" Ben, but the result would be a conversion of some sort.

It gave me the willies.

I liked the banter between Hurley and what's his face. I loved the part where Hurley was watching his fingers ala Back to The Future. The writers love to poke fun at the viewers. But they did throw us a bone in a sorta explanation of what was going on.

Thoughts?

[Groundbeef]

did anyone catch what that guy said to richard, that part about "Shouldn't you consult with ___ and Charles first?"
and richard said i don't answer to them. I didn't catch that first name, but sounded like Eli or something?

According to Sledgeweb, it was Ellie.

[Kam]

the hurley and miles dialogue was fantastic! and hurley brought up that great point about Ben not remembering Sayid... and then we got the answer from Richard, that Ben wouldn't remember anything that had happened uptil then. an island 'rebirth' i guess.

did anyone catch what that guy said to richard, that part about "Shouldn't you consult with ___ and Charles first?"
and richard said i don't answer to them. I didn't catch that first name, but sounded like Eli or something?

[ForeverAutumn]

I heard Ellie and Charles too. But they were both Dharma members when Faraday visited them. And now they appear to be senior members of The Others. WTF?!

So if Jack hadn't been such an ass about saving Ben then Kate wouldn't have taken Ben to Richard. And Ben would have had a very different life. So now everyone is mad at Jack, but actually if he had saved Ben he would be changing the future and that, apparently, is not allowed. Only no one knows that Jack would be changing the future and now everyone just thinks that Jack's a jerk. Weird huh?

Overall I was kind of bored with last night's episode. Although it did answer a few questions, like what Kate did with Aaron. While raising some new ones of course.

[Kam]

I heard Ellie and Charles too. But they were both Dharma members when Faraday visited them. And now they appear to be senior members of The Others. WTF?!

So if Jack hadn't been such an ass about saving Ben then Kate wouldn't have taken Ben to Richard. And Ben would have had a very different life. So now everyone is mad at Jack, but actually if he had saved Ben he would be changing the future and that, apparently, is not allowed. Only no one knows that Jack would be changing the future and now everyone just thinks that Jack's a jerk. Weird huh?

Overall I was kind of bored with last night's episode. Although it did answer a few questions, like what Kate did with Aaron. While raising some new ones of course.

same, i thought it was the weakest episode of the season so far, but it's been a fantastic season!

and i was expecting something much more dramatic with aaron given Kate's massivly dramatic speach to Jack saying he can't ever ask about what happenned with him. that was kind of a let down.

[ForeverAutumn]

I heard Ellie and Charles too. But they were both Dharma members when Faraday visited them. And now they appear to be senior members of The Others. WTF?!

Oops. An error on my part. A friend reminded me that Ellie and Charles were always Others.

[Worf101]

Of course what's the most interesting thing out of last night's episode is the obvious power struggle/line of succession problems evident with The Others/Hostiles. Charles Whidmore was always trouble always going to be trouble and somehow, little Ben got him kicked off the Island and moved it so he couldn't find it. Bottom line is who decides who's running the show out there? The spirits in the cabin? Richard? Characters themselves ala Ben?

Best part of the night, Locke's little smile as he stares into the eyes of that bug eyed little bastard. Priceless.

Da Worfster

[Groundbeef]

Well, after last episodes letdown as far as plot goes, I would say that this weeks was AWESOME.

The Locke-Ben dynamic was almost funny to watch. Ben for 95% of the show kept thinking that he was still in control. But really, it was Locke who was running the show.

And the Widmore/Ben conflict was explained nicely. I am now not so sure that Ben is the "Bad" guy. He might not be nice, but it seems that he is more or less working for the island.

I liked that Penny didn't die. And Desmond handed down a nice beatdown to Ben to boot.

The only thing left is to figure out how the other people (on the plane) have a connection to the island. I was not sure what to make of their question about what lives in the shadow of the statue.

Well, that's my top of the head rant. Anyone else?

[ForeverAutumn]

Holy intesity Batman!

When Ben was in the cave with Smokey, I was curled up on the couch, hugging the cat and GLUED to the TV. Hubby walked in, looked at me and said, "what's wrong!". Without even moving my eyes from the TV I just said, "this is really intense". He walked out. I wasn't watching but I'm sure that he was shaking his head at me as he left. LOL. Afterwards, he said that I looked like I was about to cry.

I think that this was probably the best directed episode yet. When Ben saw the light and shadow in his house and said, "that's Alex's room" I got chills. As he was slowly making his way through his house towards her room, I was on the edge of my seat waiting to see what/who was there. The suspense that was building was fabulous! And then when he broke through the floor under the temple and you realized that there was another temple (of sorts) underneath. Man! That was awesome!

Aside from the usual great story development, this episode was all about mood setting for me. Much more so than any previous episode IMO.

From a story perspective...some good insights to Ben who, obviously, has a soft spot for children. Perhaps because of his own crappy upbringing. Is that why they stole the Tailie kids? Because Ben thought that he could provide them with a better life than a bunch of people in a plane crash who are just trying to survive?

I'm finding it very interesting to watch things spin out of Ben's control. Up until this season, he's been the manipulator. Always cool. Always the man with a plan. But now he's realizing that its all slipping away. He didn't know that the Losties were in the Dharma Initiative. He didn't know about Smoky living under the Temple.

He's fully aware now that the Island wants him to follow Locke. But the big question is...will he?

[Worf101]

Good episode, not a great one if you ask me.

1. Desmond's beat down of Ben wasn't long enough or graphic enough to suit me. If ever a character deserved a nice long ass whuppin it's that little bug eyed bastard.

2. Ben is a softee of mom's, infants and little kids, because he never knew his. Nice to see him display a leetle humanity.

3. So are the whispers we hear with Smokey those who've died on the Island?

4. Are these new Losties, Whidmore's plants (that's why they allowed Ben to go back to the Island, remember what he said about Whidmores men finally being through with him and letting him go). Or descendents of that ancient egyptian cult that worshiped Smokey or Osiris who was depicted dealing with Smokey?

5. Ben may just have been slapped around enough by recent events to "go with the program" and help Locke unconditionally. Puddin' remarked how much Locke had changed and how she enjoyed his pimp slapping Ben and every turn.

6. New Losties and the box. Explosives? Do they want to destroy the temple? Destroy the wheel? Destroy destruction?

Things to think of...

Da Worfster

[Kam]

that temple stuff sure looked egyptian, and the lil temple section that ben came across, having not looked it up yet, looked like Anubis calling forther smokey. and anubis is the dude who escorts the dead, so if smokey is working for him... AND that giant statue did look like anubis from the back at least.

and seeing how Smokey judged and let ben live, really is making me wonder why Smokey killed Echo? i'll have to check that episode, but i thought Echo had done the 'morally' right thing in acknowledging his part in his brothers death and his own life, and was trying to make amends for his past, and yet... Smokey still killed him.

Also, Ben's line to Rousseau, about the whispers...

Worfsters points - i wonder too if it's the whispers that are linked to Smokey, or still something else.

Worf#4 - ooooooooooooooooooo! now that would be yet another interesting twist. if we now have ANOTHER group on the island that is looking to serve Anubis/Smokey/etc. as part of that ancient civilization come back to claim THEIR stake on the island. Although Cesar took a pretty solid buckshot in the chest.

Also... didn't someone JUST say how Pyschic dude's role was getting thin and BAM! he takes center stage next episode.

i lurve this show.

[Worf101]

that temple stuff sure looked egyptian, and the lil temple section that ben came across, having not looked it up yet, looked like Anubis calling forther smokey. and anubis is the dude who escorts the dead, so if smokey is working for him... AND that giant statue did look like anubis from the back at least.

and seeing how Smokey judged and let ben live, really is making me wonder why Smokey killed Echo? i'll have to check that episode, but i thought Echo had done the 'morally' right thing in acknowledging his part in his brothers death and his own life, and was trying to make amends for his past, and yet... Smokey still killed him.

Also, Ben's line to Rousseau, about the whispers...

Worfsters points - i wonder too if it's the whispers that are linked to Smokey, or still something else.

Worf#4 - ooooooooooooooooooo! now that would be yet another interesting twist. if we now have ANOTHER group on the island that is looking to serve Anubis/Smokey/etc. as part of that ancient civilization come back to claim THEIR stake on the island. Although Cesar took a pretty solid buckshot in the chest.

Also... didn't someone JUST say how Pyschic dude's role was getting thin and BAM! he takes center stage next episode.

i lurve this show.

I "lurve" (?) it too. On the new losties. Perhaps the box is a trap for smokey? Mebbe it's full of worship gear, you know robes and incense stenchers and such? Cesar, wow, didn't see Ben smoking him but Ben's proven to be one of the most cold blooded killers in Television history. I mean Good God WTF IS his body count over the years?
Also you're right that IS Anubis not Osiris as I'd thought. That statue was of Anubis, four toes like a dog.

Da Worfster

[Groundbeef]

and seeing how Smokey judged and let ben live, really is making me wonder why Smokey killed Echo? i'll have to check that episode, but i thought Echo had done the 'morally' right thing in acknowledging his part in his brothers death and his own life, and was trying to make amends for his past, and yet... Smokey still killed him.

I hadn't thought about Echo. That is a good point.

And was Alex just a manifestation of Smokey?

[Kam]

I hadn't thought about Echo. That is a good point.

And was Alex just a manifestation of Smokey?

yeah i thought Alex came to Ben in the same way that Echo's brother came to him. Maybe one final test after the judgement. Just like how Echo faced down Smokey, but then when confronted by his brother said... (something) and then Smokey killed him. Maybe Smokey would have killed Ben if he hadn't agreed to the Alex apparition telling him he has to follow Locke.
(?)

[Worf101]

And was Alex just a manifestation of Smokey?

Yes. I believe she was. She was what Smokey showed him, she was the form his messenger took to convince him to straighten the f**k up and start actin' right.

Da Worfster

[Kam]

I "lurve" (?) it too. On the new losties. Perhaps the box is a trap for smokey? Mebbe it's full of worship gear, you know robes and incense stenchers and such? Cesar, wow, didn't see Ben smoking him but Ben's proven to be one of the most cold blooded killers in Television history. I mean Good God WTF IS his body count over the years?
Also you're right that IS Anubis not Osiris as I'd thought. That statue was of Anubis, four toes like a dog.

Da Worfster

lurve = lolcat speak.

i'm a big fan of lolcats and the whole icanhascheezburger movement.

don't laugh.

srsly.

[Groundbeef]

So it appears that Smokey manifests itself as someone you know. Which leads us to the question...how does Frank, and Sun know Christen? Or is he not Smokey, but "Jacob"?

[Kam]

So it appears that Smokey manifests itself as someone you know. Which leads us to the question...how does Frank, and Sun know Christen? Or is he not Smokey, but "Jacob"?

i always thought christian was a manifestation of "Jacob" since Smokey (so far) tends to show up to people as someone from their past... which now makes me wonder, if those apparitions of backwards-talking, water-soaked Walt were manifestations of "Jacob" as well?

[Groundbeef]

Well, last nights episode was pretty good.

Miles is a complicated fellow. And I think it helped drive the story along.

Best line of the night...."It's OK, I'm in the circle"

For me, the weakest part of the entire show was the bit about Ben's father. It was really awkward, and just didn't have a polished feel too it. No one at camp seemed concerned that a boy just up and was gone.

And the bit with Kate and the Dad, was really weird.

[Worf101]

Pretty crappy episode if you ask me. Writing was weak. I know Kate's all empathetic for parents in trouble but jeeze louise, the guy's a child abusing, functional alcoholic Kate, gimme an effin break!!! The only thing we do learn is that this new group of Island competitors are now being drawn into focus. "What lies within the shadow of the statue" or some such nonsense.

They're the team that's going to win eh? Who are they competing with? Obviously Whidmore but where do they fit in with the "Others"? Quite interesting. How did they know about the flight? How'd they get on the plane, would they have had more folks there if Hurly hadn't bought up all the seats?

So now we know that you can see yourself on this island and the world doesn't end. Kinda interesting Miles watching himself with his father... interesting as hell.


Da Worfster

[Kam]

So now we know that you can see yourself on this island and the world doesn't end. Kinda interesting Miles watching himself with his father... interesting as hell.


Da Worfster

that was a very sci-fi cool, dramatic-touching moment combined in one.

i liked getting the backstory to Miles and the hurley/martin campbell miles dad/ miles dynamic in the van. and all the miles/hurley scenes. i have to agree with worf on the kate-is-pushing-the-irritating-boundaries-too-far in all her scenes now. she's on the top of the Smokey-needs-to-lay-the-smacketh-down-on list for me.

[ForeverAutumn]

that was a very sci-fi cool, dramatic-touching moment combined in one.

i liked getting the backstory to Miles and the hurley/martin campbell miles dad/ miles dynamic in the van. and all the miles/hurley scenes. i have to agree with worf on the kate-is-pushing-the-irritating-boundaries-too-far in all her scenes now. she's on the top of the Smokey-needs-to-lay-the-smacketh-down-on list for me.

Yeah, Kate can go now. She bores me. So does Jack for that matter.

So, what did I learn from this episode? That Jack can erase blackboards in lightning speed. For those of you that PVR'd the episode go back and watch that scene. No way that Jack could clear those boards that quickly. That scene where he's in the classroom with Ben's daddy was kind of pointless if you ask me. So pointless that all I noticed was how quickly Jack cleared the boards. Oh, and that the lesson was all about Egypt (as in the huge Egyptian statue that something is allegedly in the shadow of). I agree that was the weakest episode of the season so far.

What else did we learn? Where Miles came up with the 3.2 million dollars that he asked Ben for not to turn him in. Remember that? We discussed how it was such a specific number. Now we know where it came from.

And don't you just love Hurley? The guy's writing The Empire Strikes Back. Pure genius!

[ForeverAutumn]

Michael Emerson is my new acting hero (well, next to Kam, of course). You can actually see the moment that he slips into character. And he's so damn good at it!

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