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Thread: The Book of Eli

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    The Book of Eli

    The Book of Eli

    Another post apocalyptic movie...how many can they make. Mad Max was the forerunner and still one of the best.

    The Book of Eli starts off slow, dark and not real entertaining. Then it goes into a little slice and dice action with some creative filming as to not show all the gore outright.

    Eli is walking west and protecting the last King James Bible as after the end of life as it was known. Eli and the bad guy Carnegie are two of the old timers that existed before the change while most others in the movie were born after whatever tragedy had taken place. While walking West, to wherever, Eli tries to stay on his path but gets side tracked defending a few from the bad guys and scavengers along the road.

    Not until halfway into the movie do you really even have a clue what it's about, as long as you never read anything about it. Then the twist kicks in and you realize that Eli is protecting the last known bible since all others were destroyed. But, that is not the good twist, the fact that Carnegie wants the bible to controll the masses is the real twist since it is exactly what it is still used for today. Once there were no more bibles, and christianity (wherever this movie was taking place), nobody had any faith or words to live by. (read"be controlled by")

    I won't actually give any real spoilers here in case anyone cares to watch the movie. It was pretty low budget with only a few people in the movie as well as some of the shots looking totally fake and CGed along with Eli and Sumara rowing a boat. Also the film is done in an odd off color not quite B&W but greenish gray for the most part.

    Other actors in this movie to note are Jennifer Beals who plays Bett in The L Word and Mila Kunis from That 70s Show.

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    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    I hated it, it took far too long to develop, and it just could not hold my attention.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    I hated it, it took far too long to develop, and it just could not hold my attention.
    Would it have helped if AJ played the part of Eli instead of Denzel?

    It surely isn't one I would watch a second time either. My review was neither pro or con, just that I watched it and what it was about.

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    A truly awful movie, and this from an admitted sucker for the post-apocalyptic genre, in general.

    I detested the Christian POV and the idiotic blind warrior schtick. It was just cliche piled on bible-thumping dogma, piled on cliche. A stupid, preachy movie that truly insulted my intelligence.

    But heck, I bet someone liked it.

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    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    Would it have helped if AJ played the part of Eli instead of Denzel?

    It surely isn't one I would watch a second time either. My review was neither pro or con, just that I watched it and what it was about.
    I never had the impression you gave an opinion by your words. I am not sure anything but a complete re-write and a larger budget could have helped this film.
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    I gave it a "C-minus"

    I didn't care for it much. Too long, too preachy for too little payoff. Rent "The Road", far superior film with less religious mumbo jumbo to distract.

    Worf

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    I didn't think the movie was that bad. It's not on my purchase list but i think I must have liked it better than you all from what you wrote. "C" is about right. Other than the book turning out to be a bible I don't remember any "preachy" stuff in the movie. One little flaw I find humorous, if any one knows anything about braille the entire bible would have been enough volumes to fill a van I am a pretty big Denzel fan so having him in the movie probably helped. I didn't quite buy his role in Man On Fire though.
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    Decent movie and I did not find it to be too preachy other than saying without god there is chaos. It's certainly not the first movie to send that message.
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    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    The Book of Eli
    ...
    Eli is walking west and protecting the last King James Bible as after the end of life as it was known. Eli and the bad guy Carnegie are two of the old timers that existed before the change while most others in the movie were born after whatever tragedy had taken place. While walking West, to wherever, Eli tries to stay on his path but gets side tracked defending a few from the bad guys and scavengers along the road.

    Not until halfway into the movie do you really even have a clue what it's about, as long as you never read anything about it. Then the twist kicks in and you realize that Eli is protecting the last known bible since all others were destroyed. But, that is not the good twist, the fact that Carnegie wants the bible to controll the masses is the real twist since it is exactly what it is still used for today. Once there were no more bibles, and christianity (wherever this movie was taking place), nobody had any faith or words to live by. (read"be controlled by")
    ...
    I haven't seen it and didn't intent too. But I like your interpretation of current and putative future role of the Bible, Hyfi. Maybe I'd watch this flick if there were a ray of hope ... in the climax or denouement does our man Eli hurl the acursed thing into a fire to its distruction?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor
    I haven't seen it and didn't intent too. But I like your interpretation of current and putative future role of the Bible, Hyfi. Maybe I'd watch this flick if there were a ray of hope ... in the climax or denouement does our man Eli hurl the acursed thing into a fire to its distruction?
    Oh man, exactly the opposite! Stay away, trust me.

    Those of you not finding the movie very preachy, by its very existence, the entire movie is a sermon. The whole motivation for Eli's travels and plot is entirely dogma-driven, however subtle it appears to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy
    Oh man, exactly the opposite! Stay away, trust me.

    Those of you not finding the movie very preachy, by its very existence, the entire movie is a sermon. The whole motivation for Eli's travels and plot is entirely dogma-driven, however subtle it appears to you.
    Yeah, true but I saw it from a different angle and my wife took a 3rd viewpoint. She saw Carnegie as a possible Anti-Christ who would use the power in a negative way, while I saw Carnegie as just wanting to control people, and the 3rd viewpoint is that the book was needed for good to continue in the world.

    I doubt the makers of the movie really thought too much about the flip side messages, only that the bible would somehow save mankind.

    Yes, the whole movie is a sermon but you can take away several conflicting messages from it as I did.

    The last twist as to the book, not actually being a tangible item was pretty clever and I didn't see it coming. I just thought the one he hid behind the TV was a decoy or copy.

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    wow Troy, you musta been crushed by Steven King's The Stand
    Repost this on your wall if you love Jesus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    Yeah, true but I saw it from a different angle and my wife took a 3rd viewpoint. She saw Carnegie as a possible Anti-Christ who would use the power in a negative way, while I saw Carnegie as just wanting to control people, and the 3rd viewpoint is that the book was needed for good to continue in the world.

    I doubt the makers of the movie really thought too much about the flip side messages, only that the bible would somehow save mankind.
    Sure, I figured out all those angles on my own. And all 3 play into the Christian dogma that dripped from every frame of the movie. Especially that 3rd point. Nauseating.

    And I pose to you that if you and I figured it out by watching it once, I can assure you that the guys that wrote and directed this movie, who lived and breathed this movie every day for years, as it was being conceived and created, knew exactly what they were doing!

    Quote Originally Posted by 3LB
    wow Troy, you musta been crushed by Steven King's The Stand
    Not sure what you're trying to say to me here . . . But I loved it. It's one of my favorite books, period. See, the the Christian dogma aspect of The Stand plays only a small part of that incredibly long and complex story for me. It's a more abstract good vs. evil story that covers the bases in all religions. No one is saving some ridiculous sacred Christian book that's going to save humanity. Earth Abides covers the ground for religion, as a concept in a post-apocalyptic context, the best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Troy

    And I pose to you that if you and I figured it out by watching it once, I can assure you that the guys that wrote and directed this movie, who lived and breathed this movie every day for years, as it was being conceived and created, knew exactly what they were doing!
    Or they were highly christian and had typical tunnel vision thinking everyone would just assume that the world would end without the book. The other possibilities could not possibly be. After all we are just sheep, right?

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    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    Or they were highly christian and had typical tunnel vision thinking everyone would just assume that the world would end without the book. The other possibilities could not possibly be. After all we are just sheep, right?
    Well, I have to say that I am Christian, but not the sheeple type, so all Christians can't be painted with generalizations. I support gay marriage, and don't believe in organized church denominations. I cuss sometimes, but know when not to do it. I know how to separate dogma from helpful spiritual practices. Tunnel vision is not typical of Christian folks, that is for sure. It may be for some, but not all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    Or they were highly christian and had typical tunnel vision thinking everyone would just assume that the world would end without the book. The other possibilities could not possibly be. After all we are just sheep, right?
    Excuse me while I turn up my sarcasm detector.

    Tunnel vision? It seems like every christian in America is lapsed, or playing fast and loose with their tenets. I mean really, what kind of 'good christian' would make such a violent film in the first place? So if this is the case, and the movie's reliance on so much bible-thumping and obvious symbolism is inadvertent, then wow, it's even worse than I thought . . . But I seriously doubt it. Even selecting the name 'Carnagie' for the villain is loaded with double meanings. No, it was all very carefully calculated, as is every film made. So, I personally do think the Hughes Brothers are suffering from christian tunnel vision.

    The film simply panders to christian fantasy. It plays out as a total "told you so" scenario; a christian cautionary tale. The final payoff? Hallelujah! We finally managed to get a copy of the bible (even though it's the most common book on earth and copies can be found in every motel room in America), and now we can finally start rebuilding society!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    Well, I have to say that I am Christian, but not the sheeple type, so all Christians can't be painted with generalizations. I support gay marriage, and don't believe in organized church denominations. I cuss sometimes, but know when not to do it. I know how to separate dogma from helpful spiritual practices. Tunnel vision is not typical of Christian folks, that is for sure. It may be for some, but not all.
    T, I certainly don't want to start any kind of political/religious argument here.

    If you reread my post, I said WE are ALL sheep, I did not say all Christians.

    Secondly, you either believe that the book is the word of god or you don't. You can't believe that only some parts are true and others are not. Gay marriage and cursing have nothing to do with whether or not someone or group believes that the bible is the word of god and the ONLY words to live by as almost all Christians believe.

    Tunnel vision is a problem with just about every religion as they all, but for very few, believe that their way is the only way and you go to hell if you don't believe.

    Swedenborg, which is a branch of Christianity will openly say that ALL religions are just different pathways to the same thing (god).

    Tunnel vision is when people say and make banners that say God Bless America, as if he/she/it doesn't bless each and every one of us, not just americans. Do you think god is only on the american side of every war we are in?

    I could go on and on here but I won't as this is not the place. I'd love to take it off line anytime though.

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    Forum Regular blackraven's Avatar
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    If you paid attention to the end of the movie, it showed other religious books like the Koran and Torah among others. It was about preserving all religions. Sure the movie had a christian tone but the end showed it was not just about christianity.
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven
    If you paid attention to the end of the movie, it showed other religious books like the Koran and Torah among others. It was about preserving all religions. Sure the movie had a christian tone but the end showed it was not just about christianity.
    Yeah sure, I saw that. The tone of that final scene was one of "now that we have a bible, the salvation of man can be complete." The other religious books were represented in a cursory fashion. Almost am afterthought. It was all about the bible, even in that scene.

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    There is a difference between Christians and people who call themselves Christians. The majority of people in the U.S. call themselves Christians, the term has obviously become to be used very loosely. Hyfi, is correct, you take the Bible as a whole or not at all. God loves every one as He is no respecter of persons, He is also love, but only those who are obedient to God's word will inherit heaven according to the Bible. The path is narrow to heaven yet wide to distruction. If you believe He is love you also have to believe He destroyed the world by flood due to the lack of righteousness in the world. That's the problem today is too many cherry pick from the Bible and create their own religion. There is a pattern in the Bible for Christians and if you don't fit it then you aren't one no matter what you call yourself.
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackraven
    If you paid attention to the end of the movie, it showed other religious books like the Koran and Torah among others. It was about preserving all religions. Sure the movie had a christian tone but the end showed it was not just about christianity.
    I did catch that part and gave it little thought but that it sure was easy to get every other book from other countries to a little spot in the states, but a local bible was hard as hell to get hold of.

    And Troy could not have said it better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
    There is a difference between Christians and people who call themselves Christians. The majority of people in the U.S. call themselves Christians, the term has obviously become to be used very loosely. Hyfi, is correct, you take the Bible as a whole or not at all. God loves every one as He is no respecter of persons, He is also love, but only those who are obedient to God's word will inherit heaven according to the Bible. The path is narrow to heaven yet wide to distruction. If you believe He is love you also have to believe He destroyed the world by flood due to the lack of righteousness in the world. That's the problem today is too many cherry pick from the Bible and create their own religion. There is a pattern in the Bible for Christians and if you don't fit it then you aren't one no matter what you call yourself.

    Wow, this post has gotten way more attention than I ever expected. Now that everyone thought the movie sucked, lets regroup and consider the thought it now has provoked. That alone makes it a better movie than ones we watch, say oh wow that was great, and move on.

    Just to throw out there where I stand on this, I "label" myself Spiritual, not Religious. The bible, and most other teachings of similar content from all cultures, basically say the same thing. The underlying message is pretty simple to understand and follow without being tunneled into any one religion of a single belief set. I am anti organized religion but I will never tell you that you should not believe whatever it is you believe. That is up to each individual to decide, on their own, not by following the crowd which is how I see many people. I know people who go to mass more because they are worried about who will notice they are not there and talk about them than because they will miss that days positive message. And when a certain church wants to give you envelopes with your name on it so they can tally up just how much you give, I call bull**** on that.

    I have a little book called Jesus - Buddha where each facing page has a sentence that Buddha said and on the facing page has a passage that was something Jesus supposedly said. But for slight wording and translation differences, they say the same thing. The message in the bible was around a long time before it was pieced together to tell the story it does so how could christianity possibly be the one and only true religion?

    Oh well, last night I watched yet another post apocalyptic movie to start a new thread on.

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    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    There are also many who think they know the bible(and the way) when they really don't. If you let bible scholars tell it, many so called christrians haven't a clue of what they are reading, taking loads of things out of context, and using the bible as a weapon of control. And many of the same people that accuse others of cherry picking, and doing a fair amount themselves. Christrians have gotten judgemental, very unloving, as as of late have all but declaired war on other religions.

    Many so called christrians are nothing more than hypocrites, and they do the same things as non-christrians do - like attempting to smear someone in a post when they don't like what a person says. Where is the love in that...right there isn't because their christianity is like a coat that you pull on and off at will.

    Some folks talk a wonderful game, but the walk is much like a empty wagon rolling down a bumpy road.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyfi
    Just to throw out there where I stand on this, I "label" myself Spiritual, not Religious. The bible, and most other teachings of similar content from all cultures, basically say the same thing. The underlying message is pretty simple to understand and follow without being tunneled into any one religion of a single belief set. I am anti organized religion but I will never tell you that you should not believe whatever it is you believe. That is up to each individual to decide, on their own, not by following the crowd which is how I see many people. I know people who go to mass more because they are worried about who will notice they are not there and talk about them than because they will miss that days positive message. And when a certain church wants to give you envelopes with your name on it so they can tally up just how much you give, I call bullshit
    ditto

    I believe you can cherry pick the bible as it is just a book; a collection of stories and parables that's been retranslated, reinterpreted and agendized several times over the ages. Prolly the same can be said for other religious texts.

    Organized religion's main objective (IMO) is the control of masses and the accumilation of revenue from its membership.

    I believe individualism is the grandest expression of the human condition. Collectivism, while useful in many respects, eventually elevates and exhaults the status of a few, embuing a minority with power that eventually rivals that of the collective. Happens every time. Problem is, people like being sheep and individualists upset their sense of hiercy.

    The over arching theme of the new testament was individualism and that was stressed over orgaization and ritual. If you read the new testament, that theme starts getting bastardized just a few chapters past the last gospel. It hasn't been fixed since.
    Repost this on your wall if you love Jesus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Terrence the Terrible
    There are also many who think they know the bible(and the way) when they really don't. If you let bible scholars tell it, many so called christrians haven't a clue of what they are reading, taking loads of things out of context, and using the bible as a weapon of control. And many of the same people that accuse others of cherry picking, and doing a fair amount themselves. Christrians have gotten judgemental, very unloving, as as of late have all but declaired war on other religions.

    Many so called christrians are nothing more than hypocrites, and they do the same things as non-christrians do - like attempting to smear someone in a post when they don't like what a person says. Where is the love in that...right there isn't because their christianity is like a coat that you pull on and off at will.

    Some folks talk a wonderful game, but the walk is much like a empty wagon rolling down a bumpy road.
    Well said Mr T. Even if people knew what they were reading, it is still just a put-together-as -they - wanted it to read book and all the other texts were burned. The Dead Sea Scrolls, written many years before the bible contain several books that are in the bible but are very different because the texts were altered to read the way they do.

    As far as taking things out of context, the bible is merely a story using all correspondences as a way of getting a message across. Back then, there were so many sects all writing in code so the others didn't quite understand what they were saying. The book was in no way intended to be taken literal word for word. If that were true, the gospels of Matt Mark Luke and John would not all totally contradict each other as they do.

    If you really want to read something interesting, check out the writings of Emanual Swedenborg called Arcana Celestia, where he interprets the first several books of the old testament word by word - sentence by sentence explaining the correspondence and giving several other locations in the bible where the same phrase is used so you then get more of a clue as to what it was meant to be saying.

    See this link:
    http://www.sacred-texts.com/swd/ac/index.htm

    Then read his most popular book called Heaven and Hell which he explains what he felt were the relationships between the two and how he saw the physical structure.

    After reading Heaven and Hell, watch the movie What Dreams May Come where you will see in vivid detail the book come to life as Robin Williams travels the depths of hell to find and bring his wife back to a better place.

    From AC:
    "And the Spirit of God moved upon the faces of the waters."

    Then in the movie there is a scene where RW and his guide are paddling a boat through waters with all faces looking up out of it.

    Now as far as wearing the coat as needed goes, I have a favorite little thing I like to say as I drive past churches on sunday mornings, especially the local catholic church in my neighborhood as they all exit after mass.....

    "Peace be with you, now get the F out of my way!"

    These people think that they are speacial because they go to church once a week but as soon as they exit the doors, it's all me, me, me until next sunday.

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