Musical Hall or Rega

[mjennings909]

I am also going to listen to a Music Hall 9.1 on Friday so that will be good reference for the Clearaudio on Saturday. I am leaning now on the Concept with a Ortofon 2M blue Verso and a Musical Surroundings Phonomena 2 Preamp. That will be Max of my budge

[Mr Peabody]

I am also going to listen to a Music Hall 9.1 on Friday so that will be good reference for the Clearaudio on Saturday. I am leaning now on the Concept with a Ortofon 2M blue Verso and a Musical Surroundings Phonomena 2 Preamp. That will be Max of my budge

Sounds like a nice set up

[frenchmon]

I really appreciate everyone's input, obviously I want to make the right decision. Does anybody have a dealer they recommend, I live in Raleigh NC, is Needle Doctor reputable?

Have you been to Audio Advice down on Glenwood Ave? I use to go there all the time and check out the gear.

[frenchmon]

Thanks for that, they are going to actually let me take a Clearaudio Concept with MC home to play it on my system for 2 days. This one has 100 hours on it and they will sell it to me if I like for $1800

Oh great, so you have been to Audio Advice! Good! Also right around the corner from Audio Advice is two more audio stores....at least there was when I lived in Durham. I forget the name of the street, but its right around the corner on the same street as a Target store. One store sells a lot of gear and the other sells mostly British gear with Quads. Also on Glenwood up the street from Audio Advice was another store....I think it was called Audio Xperts are something like that....Oh how I miss Raleigh/Durham.

[mjennings909]

Yes, that is who is going to let me take a Clearaudio Concept table home to play it on my system as wells as a Sutherland Insight phono pre

[mjennings909]

I listened to the Music Hall 9.1 today it was hooked up to a PS Audio preamp and a PS Audio Amp, the table had a Grado Cart, cant remember the model but it was in the $600 range. The speakers were Electrostatic I cant remember the brand NOT Martin Logans. I listened to my LP's and they sounded good but I am comparing to my table so not a good reference point, but it sounded ok, it didn't blow me away, I didn't know if it was the table or the speakers but the sound was warm and sounded vinyl and I kept turning the volume up and it responded nicely and you knew you were listening to vinyl because you still could hear some noise from the LP but not much, the lows were good but the highs and vocals did not jump out, it wasn't very detail as I was expecting, again I don't have that much experience with the Electrostatics. Tomorrow will be very interesting listening to the Concept on my system with the Insight pre. Stay tune for round 2, I did like the Hall 9.1 very smooth and quiet, had a thick heavy duty platter.

[Mr Peabody]

Typically electrostats are very detailed but don't give you a physical sensation like a dynamic speaker would. I think the overly warm sound was probably the Grado cart. Keep us posted.

[mjennings909]

Ok, first impression after listening to a variety of LP's is that the first thing that jumped out was the incredible imaging and detail, I heard sounds that I hadn't noticed like in Pink Floyd's Shine on you crazy diamonds I heard a stream of bells in the beginning of the guitar piece. I am blown away it doesn't sound like this was my stereo, that I am listening to something else, I cant believe what is coming out of my speakers. The detail and the overall sound is incredible, its even keeping true the heavier rock pieces. With that said now here is the problem. When I went to pick up the Concept with MC table and Insight phono pre, I knew I was getting a Sutherland Insight pre and its out of my budget but what I didn't know I was getting a set of Transparent Musiclink Phono cables to go from the pre to my NAD AV T163. This set of Transparent cables are $1400.00, way way past my budget. So my question to you guys is how much is the cables adding to my excitement of this system? I could wait for a while to save more for the Insight but trying to get these cables would be very difficult and are they worth it. I don't have another phono cables to put in to see if there is much difference. Comments are much appreciated???

[02audionoob]

Don't worry. Leave yourself $100 for that interconnect and you'll be good. That $1,400 cable isn't going to make or break what you're hearing.

[Jack in Wilmington]

Agreed, I replaced my stock cable with a $200 cable and that's all you really need. I can't see paying as much for a cable as you pay for the turntable.

[Mr Peabody]

That is a bit crazy to put that level of cable on the Concept. The detail you heard will still be there to some extent but it's foolish to say the Transparent didn't make a difference. Some fine detail could be lost or at least not as vivid as you heard it in your audition. You might see if they'd put the stock back in place for another audition. Or, maybe Transparent comes with the deal .

[mjennings909]

Yea, I cant afford the $1400 cables and they want $1800 for the Concept with a Clearaudio MC, which is $200 off what it is originally. I am thinking about getting the Concept with a Ortofon 2M Blue vesero for $1659.00 and get the Musical Surroundings 2 phonomena for $600 which brings the total to $2259. vs, the $5125 sitting in my house right now and hope I don't lose very much in sound quality, unless you guys think that the deal for the concept with the MC is a good deal for $1800 and then get the musical surroundings and be at $2400 vs, the $2259?

[Mr Peabody]

No, you are on the right track, the Ortofon will be a better cart in my opinion. They should remove that cable, seems a bit sleezy to leave it on, I can't imagine any one paying as much for the cable as the table. If you were going to spend more money I'd suggest stretching for the Super Nova 2 but it's twice as much. I think the package you have selected makes good use of your budget.

[Mr Peabody]

Hey, I talked to a Clearaudio dealer and something isn't right, the phono cables on the Clearaudio are intregral to the arm and integrated into the anti-skating as well so it's not just something you can put an aftermarket cable on. Are there RCA outputs on the table or do they go into the arm? The guy I talked to didn't say it was impossible but even if they are aftermarket they would have to cut the stock cable and leave part of it to attach to, so either this isn't a typical Concept or some one has really jacked around with it, either way you may want to pass on that one and get one still in the box. The Concept is basically plug & play out of the box if you even wanted to find another dealer.

[02audionoob]

Hey, I talked to a Clearaudio dealer and something isn't right, the phono cables on the Clearaudio are intregral to the arm and integrated into the anti-skating as well so it's not just something you can put an aftermarket cable on. Are there RCA outputs on the table or do they go into the arm? The guy I talked to didn't say it was impossible but even if they are aftermarket they would have to cut the stock cable and leave part of it to attach to, so either this isn't a typical Concept or some one has really jacked around with it, either way you may want to pass on that one and get one still in the box. The Concept is basically plug & play out of the box if you even wanted to find another dealer.

The high-dollar cable isn't on the turntable. It's on the phono preamp.

[02audionoob]

I'm not following how one can say the Ortofon 2M Blue is better than the Clearaudio Concept MC. How are we coming by that one?

[Mr Peabody]

Here's what was told me;

"I’ve never seen a Clearaudio tonearm that was terminated right behind the bearing and base with a pair of RCA or XLR jacks, but I know that Clearaudio has made some that way for customers in other places in the world. The Clearaudio wire is made by a famous maker of copper wire cables. I’m not sure exactly who since they’ve kept that a secret, but it is one of the European cable makers. "

Since all of the Clearaudio turntables that are imported into the U.S. have an integral tonearm cable, I’m not sure how this guy had a Transparent Audio tonearm cable on his Concept. Was he in some other country?"

"In order to change the tonearm cable you would have to either cut off the one you have and leave the original wire in the tonearm, which doesn’t make a lot of sense, or you would have to rewire the tonearm. I don’t know of anyone who has done either offhand. Another thing to consider is that on the Concept the tonearm wiring is also part of the anti-skate mechanism. If you replaced the wire you would have to do so with something almost identical in order for things to work correctly."

[02audionoob]

Here's what the OP said:

"...Transparent Musiclink Phono cables to go from the pre to my NAD AV T163. "

[Mr Peabody]

LOL, wow, thanks for reeling me in, apparently something didn't register. On the upside all that detail was coming from the table or else it wouldn't have been heard.

[Jack in Wilmington]

I think that's where we got confused, the OP said they were "phono cables" where in fact they were IC cables.

[mjennings909]

Sorry my bad, I meant interconnect cables, sorry for the confusion

[mjennings909]

Ok, moment of truth do I get this 100 hour demo Concept with Clearaudio MC for $1800.00 or get a new one with a Ortofon 2M Blue Verso for $1659?

[mjennings909]

Ok, done with the decision, here it is
1. Concept
2. Ortofon 2M Black
3. Musical Surroundings Phonomena2
4. Transparent MusicLink Phono IC's

[Jack in Wilmington]

Ok, done with the decision, here it is
1. Concept
2. Ortofon 2M Black
3. Musical Surroundings Phonomena2
4. Transparent MusicLink Phono IC's

All that gear lists for around $4100. Isn't that stretching your budget a little.

[mjennings909]

I went on Transparent's website and found Phono IC cables for $185