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Quote:
Originally Posted by poppachubby
Hi-Fi salesguys always hate anything you own. It's never good for any amount of reasons. Too old, too lo-fi, too ugly. They have to in order to better sell their wares. I love the local guys I deal with but when it comes to the "biz" side of things, I just snicker.
I've bought my share of gear from him over the years, amp, subwoofer, wifes TV last Christmas and that's the stuff I still own. He's been with this company for 20 years and the guys that work with him say he's got gear put away in his closets that would make you drool.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack in Wilmington
Thanks Guys, that will be something to look forward to when I get back from vacation. If it wasn't for you guys, I might not have thought of a phono pre. I also noticed the Pro-ject Speed Box when I was at my dealer. I'll let you know when it's time to suggest that. I need to get some more vinyl now.
Hey Jack,
I have noticed a notable improvement with the SpeedBox II with my Pro-Ject Xpression I used have, but I didn't think it was a must have item. If I was in your position, I think I would rather purchase more LP. Enjoy your vacation!
JRA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack in Wilmington
Traded it in on the 5.1. That's what made me jump on the deal. It's nice that this guy will take your old stuff in trade. That's why I always keep my eye on his used and demo gear.
I went to my Pro-ject dealer to talk about an Xperience table, but they don't do trade-ins.
He's still trying to talk me out of my Usher X-719's. The only thing that his has that fits my budget are a pair of Vienna Acoustics "Mozarts". He had me bring in my Ushers for a shoot out between them and a pair of Paradigm Sig 2's. Then he tried the Studio 20's
It took the small floorstanders ( Mozarts and Studio 60's) to equal the bass extension of the X-719, but then the mids weren't as detailed and the highs were a little more etchy. Especially on the Studio 60's. Sorry to ramble on so. When I was in yesterday to order the Pro-ject Phono Pre, he was like " Hey still enjoying those Ushers" . I know he wants another shot.
For the life of me, other than the furniture grade wood on the Vienna Acoustics, I just don't understand what others see in those laid back speakers. For the money there are a lot more choices in speakers that sound miles ahead better than VA's speakers. I mean they have a deep bottom end, but they have no pizazz...no sparkle, nothing to draw you in. They are some of the most boring speakers I have ever heard....I like speakers to have life, energy...pizazz. I have listen to Vienna Acoustics over and over again to try and like them, but I just don't. I don't find them engaging at all.
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Originally Posted by jrhymeammo
Hey Jack,
I have noticed a notable improvement with the SpeedBox II with my Pro-Ject Xpression I used have, but I didn't think it was a must have item. If I was in your position, I think I would rather purchase more LP. Enjoy your vacation!
JRA
Whats your honest opinion of the Pro Ject Xpression 1?
I think the newer Xpression III is suppose to be even greater...you would think.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchmon
For the life of me, other than the furniture grade wood on the Vienna Acoustics, I just don't understand what others see in those laid back speakers. For the money there are a lot more choices in speakers that sound miles ahead better than VA's speakers. I mean they have a deep bottom end, but they have no pizazz...no sparkle, nothing to draw you in. They are some of the most boring speakers I have ever heard....I like speakers to have life, energy...pizazz. I have listen to Vienna Acoustics over and over again to try and like them, but I just don't. I don't find them engaging at all.
Frenchie they are a fickle speaker. I've heard them sound boring at Tweeter, when they were in business. Must have been the electronics or the room. When I heard them at my Pro-ject dealer, I didn't think he had the Mozarts playing. He was running them through Ayre equipment and they really opened up. That is one speaker that I would have to audition at home with my own gear. They are what I call "polite".
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchmon
Whats your honest opinion of the Pro Ject Xpression 1?
I think the newer Xpression III is suppose to be even greater...you would think.
I have heard several ProJect Expression tables in great length. They are wonderful tables at their price point, the Carbon arm is an absolute joy to listen to and brings life out of any cart I've heard on it.
I recently did a shoot out with an Expression Mahogany and the new 1.3 Genie. They both had the same cart and the Expression was so much more musical with better imaging and staging. Blew the Genie out of the water frankly, which was dissapointing for me as I wanted the Genie to be better.
My local shop deals Pro-Ject and has for years. Any idle afternoon I have, if the wifey is out with the kids, I can spend it there listening to gear. They have several rooms which mimic a real room in a home, of course the amplification is always super hifi...
The rooms are viewable in the "Store Tour"
http://www.targethifi.com/
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I've listen to them over and over again. And they where just plain old laid back. I've never heard them open up at all. Those speakers are very dark. I think they are darker than Dynaudio speaker. I would love to do a shoot out with them and Dynaudio speakers....the Dyns would have more life.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poppachubby
I have heard several ProJect Expression tables in great length. They are wonderful tables at their price point, the Carbon arm is an absolute joy to listen to and brings life out of any cart I've heard on it.
I recently did a shoot out with an Expression Mahogany and the new 1.3 Genie. They both had the same cart and the Expression was so much more musical with better imaging and staging. Blew the Genie out of the water frankly, which was dissapointing for me as I wanted the Genie to be better.
My local shop deals Pro-Ject and has for years. Any idle afternoon I have, if the wifey is out with the kids, I can spend it there listening to gear. They have several rooms which mimic a real room in a home, of course the amplification is always super hifi...
The rooms are viewable in the "Store Tour"
http://www.targethifi.com/
Thanks PoppaC. I plain on making it my next table. Do you mean the Xperience Classic? If so that table cost $1499 while the Genie is $499 and the Xpression lll is $699. I would think both would be an upgrade from the Genie 1.3
What I have heard is the the Xpression lll is basically the same as the Music Hall 5.1 with a few trade offs. While the 5.1 has better isolation and two plinths...the Xpression has a quieter motor and better arm and a cheaper price. I dont know how true that is but thats what I heard. But to me they seem to be two different tables altogether.
I will try and get pictures up tomorrow.
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If I had a choice between the two, I would take the Xpression based on the arm's value and sound. You can always isolate the table with DIY tricks or after market products. The dual plinth of the Music Hall is indeed great, but not enough to trade off a better arm IMO.
Check out the Xpression Mahogany, I think it's look is right up your alley...like the Xperience you had pictured for a while.
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PoppaC...that is a nice store. They also have some nice used gear
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchmon
PoppaC...that is a nice store. They also have some nice used gear
You guys were chatting about VA, I heard the Bachs that were at Target. I didn't mind them.
I spend most of my time there, but there is one other high end shop in town. They deal Linn, Krell, Mac and other big names. The analog guy there is a guru, so I like to stop in and pick his brain, or just hang and listen to the shop's LP12.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchmon
Thanks PoppaC. I plain on making it my next table. Do you mean the Xperience Classic? If so that table cost $1499 while the Genie is $499 and the Xpression lll is $699. I would think both would be an upgrade from the Genie 1.3
What I have heard is the the Xpression lll is basically the same as the Music Hall 5.1 with a few trade offs. While the 5.1 has better isolation and two plinths...the Xpression has a quieter motor and better arm and a cheaper price. I dont know how true that is but thats what I heard. But to me they seem to be two different tables altogether.
...and don't forget the platter is different, too. These really are two very different turntables. It sounds like the only thing that's the same is where they're made.
Quote:
Originally Posted by poppachubby
If I had a choice between the two, I would take the Xpression based on the arm's value and sound. You can always isolate the table with DIY tricks or after market products. The dual plinth of the Music Hall is indeed great, but not enough to trade off a better arm IMO.
I think each person just has to hear one and see what he thinks. I tend to agree on the importance of the arm, but there's synergy that some turntables have and some don't.
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What is new, and an average used price on a LP-12 these days? I sent Frenchmon a CL listing for one, I think seller was asking like $1495.00. I had no idea just caught my eye.
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Oh, and Frenchie, don't be too hard on Vienna, you haven't heard Vandersteen yet.
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The price of an LP12 would depend on the arm, power supply and cartridge. There was one near me for $800, this past weekend.
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Noob is right. There are a ton of upgrades offered by Linn for this machine. 1500 seems like a great price for a unit loaded with a few extras and a decent arm.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Peabody
Oh, and Frenchie, don't be too hard on Vienna, you haven't heard Vandersteen yet.
Good point Mr. P. Vandersteen is really laid back. They should come with a warning label. "Use of this product may cause drowsiness" My Pro-ject dealer just starting selling them. I haven't heard Frenchie's Canton 403's have you?
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I have heard the 403's. In my room they were a bit bass shy but Frenchie says that is not normal. It's hard to explain the Canton midrange, it's a bit forward but it allows for the sound to be very live in the room sounding. Things like organ had more of a 3D feel to the music. 3D may not be accurate when referring to music but I don't know how else to say it, the sound was more able to fool my mind it was live rather than mechanical. I really would like to hear a set of floorstanders.
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