Blew up the Krell S-300i

[frenchmon]

Oh...JM, sorry about your gear man. I know it hurts man. Don't trip off RGA. It really does not matter what he thinks man, he is not a fan. The sad part is he RGA seems to care more about hurting your feelings rather than holding his thoughts at such a ruff time in your life. Some audio bud he is. For me music is like part of me...so is my gear. It would hurt to not be able to have my systems when I needed it.....Its my therapy after work or when I am stressed. Some people drink or eat when stressed or depress...I don't drink...I don't smoke...no drugs...don't chase skirts any more so the only vise I have is my rig and the music I play. Out side of my family and dog and house, it's the most important thing to me. And I'm sure it's has a place in side your heart as well. RGA...your tripping man.

[RGA]

Sorry John Michael - I thought you were the poster who had to return the Krell because their power cords could catch on fire so I thought you were sending this back a "lot."

It's good that they are repairing it under warranty and it will be up and running and making you happy for the foreseeable future.

[JohnMichael]

Oh...JM, sorry about your gear man. I know it hurts man. Don't trip off RGA. It really does not matter what he thinks man, he is not a fan. The sad part is he RGA seems to care more about hurting your feelings rather than holding his thoughts at such a ruff time in your life. Some audio bud he is. For me music is like part of me...so is my gear. It would hurt to not be able to have my systems when I needed it.....Its my therapy after work or when I am stressed. Some people drink or eat when stressed or depress...I don't drink...I don't smoke...no drugs...don't chase skirts any more so the only vise I have is my rig and the music I play. Out side of my family and dog and house, it's the most important thing to me. And I'm sure it's has a place in side your heart as well. RGA...your tripping man.

Frenchmon thanks for expressing how I am feeling. Music is also very important to me and for a few weeks I will not get to hear it at it's best. At least the best of the level of what I can afford. Living alone my dog is first followed by my Krell based stereo and third is my art collection.

I depend on music to keep me going. I recently had a client die and another is in the hospital with pneumonia. My late clients wife who I still provide care is very sick and most of my day was spent transporting her back and forth, cleaning her and the areas where she became ill. So music is what helps me relax and prepare for tomorrow.

I was able to buy the Krell due to an inheritance. Nice little windfall that allowed me to have some things that I could not justify at my income. Oh and my trip to Paris.

[JoeE SP9]

I feel for you JM! I truly understand how much a system can mean. I've been ill myself and I also live alone except for Lucy my cat.

As for RGA, he should be ashamed of himself. I'll bet that were it a piece of Audio Note gear that broke his attitude would be entirely different.

[frenchmon]

Frenchmon thanks for expressing how I am feeling. Music is also very important to me and for a few weeks I will not get to hear it at it's best. At least the best of the level of what I can afford. Living alone my dog is first followed by my Krell based stereo and third is my art collection.

I depend on music to keep me going. I recently had a client die and another is in the hospital with pneumonia. My late clients wife who I still provide care is very sick and most of my day was spent transporting her back and forth, cleaning her and the areas where she became ill. So music is what helps me relax and prepare for tomorrow.

I was able to buy the Krell due to an inheritance. Nice little windfall that allowed me to have some things that I could not justify at my income. Oh and my trip to Paris.

Well man, hang in there. Now some people may read this and think we are loosers....weird cats that's sobbing over a stereo...but for me out side of my family its my crutch. I can go down in the 2 channel room and sit and be moved inside my soul by sound. Some may call me a looser, weird, stupid....I don't care any more. I am what I am. But I do feel there should be boundaries....and whats dear to a person whether its his God, dog, car, family or whatever, should be off limits. I thought RGA being as knowledgeable as he is and a fellow brother in the hobby would understand that side of it. Art K is also a little down over at the Audiokarma forum as well because of his Rega Apollo-R player, so its wide spread with audiophiles.... Some things and thoughts and opinions are better off not said.

[frenchmon]

I feel for you JM! I truly understand how much a system can mean. I've been ill myself and I also live alone except for Lucy my cat.

As for RGA, he should be ashamed of himself. I'll bet that were it a piece of Audio Note gear that broke his attitude would be entirely different.

Ahh, I dont mean any ill towards RGA either, I suspect he is still a kid maybe in his late 20's or maybe late 30's....I could be wrong, but hey....we all grow up some times I hope.....or we die trying.

[JohnMichael]

Hey JM are you going through a local dealer or did you contact Krell yourself?

I am dealing with Krell directly. They are very nice and you get the feeling that they truly want to take care of your product. Or do they hear the seperation anxiety in my voice?

[LeRoy]

JM, bummer that the Krell is in for repair again. Good for you that Krell is stepping up to fix the problem. I never knew wires could reek havoc on an amp though. I always thought as long as pos and neg wires did not touch then all would be okay. Anyway, good thing you have "back-up" with the Onkyo to help get you through.

[JohnMichael]

JM, bummer that the Krell is in for repair again. Good for you that Krell is stepping up to fix the problem. I never knew wires could reek havoc on an amp though. I always thought as long as pos and neg wires did not touch then all would be okay. Anyway, good thing you have "back-up" with the Onkyo to help get you through.

Yes I am glad I have the Onkyo. The way the cables are designed they create an interesting load for the amp. I had been using a single run of wires off and on for years and they sounded great with the Krell. Of course if single wire sounds so good I had to find out what bi-wire would sound like. It sounded like distortion and thermal shutdown.

When the Krell is returned I will try it with the bi-wires and the resistive network that is placed across the tweeter binding posts. Well after I receive the all clear from Krell and AlphaCore will I try the MI1 cables again.

The main difference between the Krell and any other int. amp I have owned is a lack of non musical sounds. The Onkyo, Cambridge Audio and Rotel all had enough of a sonic signature that they imparted a sound that would mask some of the finer details. CD's would sound similar to each other due to that coloration. The Krell let everything shine through.

[JohnMichael]

Since I am unable to listen to my S-300i I am reading it's many reviews. The one common thread is my amp is richer in the midrange than previous Krell int. amps. Rich as far as Krell's sound and solid state. No one claims it is tube like.

I bought some packing tape to seal the inner and outer boxes. I always keep the original packing during the warranty period. Since I am shipping it by UPS I want the boxes to be secure and I buy the insurance to cover the replacement cost.

Then I will just patiently wait on it's welcomed return.

[JohnMichael]

The Onkyo A-9555 is sounding better with a speaker cable change. It does not have 5 way binding posts so I could not use the AntiCables. The spades will just not work only bare wire and bananas. I had been using some older stranded bi-wire cables but the sound was fuzzy. Even though a solder joint on one banana of the AQ Slates failed I decided to use them any way. 7 of the bananas are in use the one bare wire was tightened down by the binding posts.

The sound is more focused. The stranded cables made everything sound warm and wooly. I am feeling better about the Onkyo but it is still not the S-300i. Oh well it is more listenable in the mean time.

[YBArcam]

Wow. It's not like RGA said something offensive about JM's wife or kids. He took a shot at Krell. JM's Krell is getting fixed, under warranty I might add, and will arrive safe and sound after that. JM still has a system to listen to. Let's not overreact here. I've had troubles with audio gear before and while we all love the hobby, I think we can all recognize at the end of the day it's not one of the important things. Audio gear are things and things can be replaced. Sure RGA could have been a little more polite but to take offense at what he said is being super-sensitive, IMO.

Anyways JM, hope the Krell gets fixed and gives you years of trouble free enjoyment going forward.

[Feanor]

Wow. It's not like RGA said something offensive about JM's wife or kids. He took a shot at Krell. JM's Krell is getting fixed, under warranty I might add, and will arrive safe and sound after that. JM still has a system to listen to. Let's not overreact here. I've had troubles with audio gear before and while we all love the hobby, I think we can all recognize at the end of the day it's not one of the important things. Audio gear are things and things can be replaced. Sure RGA could have been a little more polite but to take offense at what he said is being super-sensitive, IMO.

Anyways JM, hope the Krell gets fixed and gives you years of trouble free enjoyment going forward.

RGA had no intention of offending JM personally. It's just that he has very strong opinions about Krell equipment and similar s/s designs.

RGA is an adherent of the theory that anything with feedback is causes bad sound due to high-order harmonic distortion. Unfortunately if you want to avoid feedback altogether you are constrained to Single Ended Triode (SET) designs and the extremely low power they produce. For an interesting discussion initiated by well-known audiophile pundit, see HERE.

[JohnMichael]

Wow. It's not like RGA said something offensive about JM's wife or kids. He took a shot at Krell. JM's Krell is getting fixed, under warranty I might add, and will arrive safe and sound after that. JM still has a system to listen to. Let's not overreact here. I've had troubles with audio gear before and while we all love the hobby, I think we can all recognize at the end of the day it's not one of the important things. Audio gear are things and things can be replaced. Sure RGA could have been a little more polite but to take offense at what he said is being super-sensitive, IMO.

Anyways JM, hope the Krell gets fixed and gives you years of trouble free enjoyment going forward.

I think it is considered poor form by some members. If your favorite car is an AMC Pacer and you total it do you want someone to empathize with you or tell you it was crap. I know his likes and dislikes and I am just glad it did not turn into yet another Audio Note commercial.

[Jack in Wilmington]

I think it is considered poor form by some members. If your favorite car is an AMC Pacer and you total it do you want someone to empathize with you or tell you it was crap. I know his likes and dislikes and I am just glad it did not turn into yet another Audio Note commercial.

I don't think I'm going out on a limb here, but if your favorite car is an AMC Pacer, your "stereo" probably centers around the AM radio in that Pacer.

[JohnMichael]

I don't think I'm going out on a limb here, but if your favorite car is an AMC Pacer, your "stereo" probably centers around the AM radio in that Pacer.

No I never liked the Pacer. Sadly due to income levels I did drive a Chevette once. Now that you mention it I drove too many cars that only had AM radios.

[YBArcam]

RGA had no intention of offending JM personally. It's just that he has very strong opinions about Krell equipment and similar s/s designs.

RGA is an adherent of the theory that anything with feedback is causes bad sound due to high-order harmonic distortion. Unfortunately if you want to avoid feedback altogether you are constrained to Single Ended Triode (SET) designs and the extremely low power they produce. For an interesting discussion initiated by well-known audiophile pundit, see HERE.

For what it's worth, RGA has given some praise to Simaudio and Creek, to name two s/s designs.

I think it is considered poor form by some members. If your favorite car is an AMC Pacer and you total it do you want someone to empathize with you or tell you it was crap. I know his likes and dislikes and I am just glad it did not turn into yet another Audio Note commercial.

There cannot be too many Pacers around, so if you total one that you love I think that's a different story. The Krell amp isn't totaled, and even if it was it is likely not overly difficult to replace it with the exact same model.

FWIW, RGA does have strong views that most people probably don't agree with. I'm thankful he has shared them though, as it has led me to look at other design philosophies than I would have otherwise. Same can be said for Poultry...still not sure I agree with using super cheap amps like the Miniwatt (though I've never heard one so my opinion probably means nothing), but his open baffle and high efficiency diy posts have opened my eyes to those designs.

[JohnMichael]

For what it's worth, RGA has given some praise to Simaudio and Creek, to name two s/s designs.


FWIW, RGA does have strong views that most people probably don't agree with. I'm thankful he has shared them though, as it has led me to look at other design philosophies than I would have otherwise. Same can be said for Poultry...still not sure I agree with using super cheap amps like the Miniwatt (though I've never heard one so my opinion probably means nothing), but his open baffle and high efficiency diy posts have opened my eyes to those designs.

Yes I agree that he has wide ranging experience that is beneficial to AR. Early on I thought he was an AN troll and I almost banned him.;-)

I guess it was the nature of the thread. I was not asking for opinions about Krell but was sharing my frustration and fear. Wondering if I had damaged it beyond repair, how much will the repair cost and how long will I be without it? Of course having Krell tell me it will be repaired under warranty made me feel better.

My sister always says if you want sympathy it is in the dictionary between sh!t and syphillis. Well I received some sympathy, a little sh!t but luckily no syphillis.

[JoeE SP9]

I had a Chevette once. I had a pair of Acoustats at the same time. I guess it's rather obvious where my head is at.

[RGA]

Maybe I am not the most sensitive to these things - I like audio but the gear is a thing and things break - so it goes. I had a tube in my OTO blow and it sizzled and almost took the board with it. Fortunately they separate the boards so it's not a costly fix. I had to take it in and they replaced the tube and there you go. Stuff happens. The Marantz receiver no longer outputs to loudspeakers - so it's now a glorified headphone amp. Wharfedale speakers have too much grit in the bass/treble controls makes them unlistenable until I get them fixed.

I thought the Krell was the same one that kept getting sent back for non age related reasons but appeared to be faulty so my view was to sell it while you can get something for it and buy something else. Problem solvers solve problems. I didn't know the OP had an emotional attachment to the product. I have an emotional attachment to my Wharfedale speakers because I bought them with my dad and he passed away - so I simply won't sell them. The rest of my gear I have no attachment to. The CD 6 a little because it's been going for something like 16 years so I just want to see how much longer it will go.

Other points raised
As for SE sound I prefer it yes but it is often impractical either power or price so I do like other things. Forums tend to be discussions about best sound without practical or economical aspects considered. Practically I just bought a Push Pull low feedback but not no feedback design. I prefer the Meishu or Jinro sure - anyone with decent ears would, but I don't have $20,000 laying around so you makes the compromise.

SS amps - yes like plenty of them - I tend not to like expensive ones because I don't find them to offer good value in that tubes take over in sound and build quality at lower price points. Lots of luck finding a $5k amp that sounds better than Line Magnetic or Audio Space at $1,600 - I've never heard one from anybody ever.
But practically not everyone wants to deal with tubes. personally it's a light bulb a screwdriver and read a meter for 5 minutes every 5 years which is not a whole lot of work. And they usually last decades and easier and cheaper to repair (unless the transformer goes but that's true of SS).

SS I have liked for price performance: Rotel, Creek Audio, Audio Refinement, Sim Audio, Sugden, Heed Audio, Shengya, Roksan.

As for the Krell - hopefully it will be fixed and last many decades. As for taste - if we all shared the same there would only be one product.

[JohnMichael]

In these days of fewer audio stores many of us make our choices based on reviews, product reputations, looks and specs. Many of us live in communities where online shopping is all that is available to us. We look for 30 or 60 day return options.

I enjoyed a Rotel RA 970BX integrated amp for years. If I were more patient I might still be enjoying it. Sadly I thought a channel was cutting out but it turned out to be the Sony ES cd player. I in a panic of not having music ordered a Cambridge Audio 640A int. amp. The older Rotel was a better amp. Still thinking it was the Rotel that had the problem I lent it to a friend who melted it down by hooking up too many pairs of speakers. I should have given him the CA 640A to melt down.

The 640A became annoying with it's sound and I was anxious to replace it. I began to read raves for the Onkyo A-9555 and was curious. On a fluke I won $500 in the lottery and I thought what the hell so I ordered it. It was better than the 640A but it to became fatiguing quickly. I knew at the time I needed to shop for something better.

While owning the Onkyo A-9555 I bought a new pair of speakers. The speakers were the Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs and they were the Original Master Loudspeakers 1. The folks at Music Direct were concerned about the Onkyo being able to power the speakers. In my small room it did okay. Of course the seed was planted, did I need something better? Again I found myself not completely pleased with the sound.

About that time I inherited some money and I thought now was the time to upgrade. I was interested in the Exposure 2010S, LFD Zero, Simaudio and Portal Panache. Having been told the OML1's were tough to drive I wondered if the Exposure or LFD could supply enough power. Since I enjoy a lot of big music with wide dynamics I began to think about power reserves. It was then I learned of the Krell S-300i. I read some good reviews and liked that the amp had output at 150 watts into 8ohms but doubled into 4ohms. So home came the Krell.

Three years with the Krell and I still love the sound. Most components get on my nerves after a few months and they are given away or trashed. I believe what most reviewers are saying that this new integrated amp is the best of all the Krell integrated amps. This amp is worth a listen if you are curious about it.

[texlle]

Sounds like Krell has been very helpful to make the repair process pleasant enough, which is always relieving. I haven't blown up an amp yet (fingers crossed), but the remote activated motor on my Cambridge A500's potentiometer has stopped working this weekend, so now I have to get up to adjust the volume. It actually still receives power, but the gear or whatever mechanism that turns the potentiometer has broken or stripped out. I've emailed Cambridge to obtain the part number or even better, a supplier who carries the part I would need to get this working again. My friend did blow the amp section on his Yamaha receiver last weekend, so he's using my old Sony STR-DE845 while the Yamaha gets fixed. Hey, he gave me an old Sony analog tuner from 1982, so I can't complain.

Oh, and my Jolida is currently on ebay if anyone is interested. Stay tuned for updates.

[JohnMichael]

The Krell is in the safe hands of UPS. Of course I did insure it for $2,500 in case those hands were not so safe. The S-300i will arrive at Krell on Wednesday.

While at UPS today this woman was complaining about how difficult it was to get to UPS. I am glad that we actually have a UPS hub in town. I do not need to use the UPS stores or if I miss a delivery it is not far to pick up the package. As this woman was complaining for all to hear the clerk said Ma'm this was delivered by mail, the USPS, and we all grinned as she took her package and left.

Now the waiting begins.

[Florian]

Hi John,

i hope they fix your Krell. Dan is no longer with Krell, since they booted him and his son out of Krell. But i do want to drop a sentence or two about the sound quality. As you know i personally owned several Krells including their flagships. (4x KRS 200; KSA250; KSA150; KSA100MKII; KRC-HR; DAC32). The best of them all where the KRS200s. They are true balanced monoblocks with two transfers and fourty transistors per channel! They had 310 Watts @8ohm and could really drive any speaker. Even 1ohm Scintillas with no problems. They are robust, reliable and hard to kill. But, and dont take personal offence please, is in a very different league then any Krell integrated ever prodocuded and much better then their current flagships the EVO series.

I dropped them in a second for 60 Watt SET amplifiers. My experience goes hand in hand with RGAs. SET, Zero Feedback. The NAT SE2-SE are better in every aspect by leagues. If you get a change please try to hear a NAT Single. Here is some info on it. Click me

Another fantastic way to improve your sound over any Krell is a combination of Monarchy Audio NM24 and SE160 Hybrid amps.

All the best

Flo

[Feanor]

Hi John,

i hope they fix your Krell. Dan is no longer with Krell, since they booted him and his son out of Krell. But i do want to drop a sentence or two about the sound quality. As you know i personally owned several Krells including their flagships. (4x KRS 200; KSA250; KSA150; KSA100MKII; KRC-HR; DAC32). The best of them all where the KRS200s. They are true balanced monoblocks with two transfers and fourty transistors per channel! They had 310 Watts @8ohm and could really drive any speaker. Even 1ohm Scintillas with no problems. They are robust, reliable and hard to kill. But, and dont take personal offence please, is in a very different league then any Krell integrated ever prodocuded and much better then their current flagships the EVO series.

I dropped them in a second for 60 Watt SET amplifiers. My experience goes hand in hand with RGAs. SET, Zero Feedback. The NAT SE2-SE are better in every aspect by leagues. If you get a change please try to hear a NAT Single. Here is some info on it. Click me

Another fantastic way to improve your sound over any Krell is a combination of Monarchy Audio NM24 and SE160 Hybrid amps.

All the best

Flo

Flo, did I read that the NAT SE2-SE's are 115,000€ the pair? I'd love to hear 'em but sadly it's unlikely that I will

Of course, Poultrygeist well tell us that a Decware Zen SE84C+ for US$775 is approximately as good but it's 2 wpc. Meanwhile my $600, 300 wpc class D, $250 passive pre, and $75 DAC are the best system I've heard; it does some of the things SETs are supposed to do, viz. transparent, detailed, grain & etch-free.