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  1. #1
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    recommendations for bookshelf that will compare to mission 752?

    Hi Guys,

    Due to space limitations I have to reluctantly move to a bookshelf size speaker. I'm looking for recommendations so that I won't drop too much quality in the move, and spend up to about $800 US?

    My setup:

    Musical Fidelity A3 integrated & matching A3 2 CD player.
    Mission 752 freedom.
    Cable Talk wires.

    I love this system, but have to move to the smaller speakers

    Anyway recommendations are welcome, I saw some posts suggesting Quad 11L/12L or Paradigm Studio 20, any others??

    Oh and if any Australian (I am in Sydney) is interested in purchasing the Missions I am asking $AU850 private sale, just send me an email

    cheers.

    Rich.

  2. #2
    Suspended topspeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgi
    Hi Guys,

    Due to space limitations I have to reluctantly move to a bookshelf size speaker. I'm looking for recommendations so that I won't drop too much quality in the move, and spend up to about $800 US?

    My setup:

    Musical Fidelity A3 integrated & matching A3 2 CD player.
    Mission 752 freedom.
    Cable Talk wires.

    I love this system, but have to move to the smaller speakers

    Anyway recommendations are welcome, I saw some posts suggesting Quad 11L/12L or Paradigm Studio 20, any others??

    Oh and if any Australian (I am in Sydney) is interested in purchasing the Missions I am asking $AU850 private sale, just send me an email

    cheers.

    Rich.
    Those are great speakers, it's too bad you have to get rid of them. It appears that you like the Mission sound so my question would be if you want to stay within the same basic parameters or are you looking for something different this time? Do the Freedoms do anything untoward that you'd like to address while you have the opportunity? BTW, I have 780 Argonauts so I'm very familiar with the Mission sound.

  3. #3
    RGA
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    The paradigm would be a big step down in my opinion - and sound nothing like the missions. have not heard the Quad but it seems to be on the right track - but quad does have the pedigree backing them. Remember that when you put a standmount on a stand it takes up the same space as most floorstanders - and if you're not going to put the speaker on a proper stand - don't spend $800US because it will be wasted.

  4. #4
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    This is interesting, and possibly bad news for me I think. I was working under the assumption that a decent quality wall bracket system would be practically equivalent to a speaker stand.

    Please let me know the reasoning why this wouldn't be so, I am curious? Also how disastrous would a bracket mounted speaker be opposed to a stand mount? I am really short on options

    Admittedly I have done little research into this aspect so am very uninformed...

    cheers.

    Rich.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgi
    This is interesting, and possibly bad news for me I think. I was working under the assumption that a decent quality wall bracket system would be practically equivalent to a speaker stand.

    Please let me know the reasoning why this wouldn't be so, I am curious? Also how disastrous would a bracket mounted speaker be opposed to a stand mount? I am really short on options

    Admittedly I have done little research into this aspect so am very uninformed...

    cheers.

    Rich.
    I've not heard anything particularly wrong with wall mounting. It does place the speaker rather close to the back wall, which should result in some moderate bass boost. Speakers that have a port in the rear are not a good idea for wall mounting. You would have to try the speakers out in the location you want.

    As well, speakers generally do best with the primary axis of radiation at ear level (often at tweeter level, although some speakers have the tweeter below the midrange to give the best response level with or somewhat above the speaker). The vertical radiation pattern for most speakers is not as good as their horizontal radiation, so height is usually important.

    Many of us like the Paradigm Reference Series, and I certainly think you should audition them since they are available to you. Mission makes smaller models, too, and B & W, Kef, and numerous others. I'm not really familiar with Australian speakers. The Paradigm Studio 20, v. 2, is a very nice speaker, front ported, but it does have a somewhat elevated bass and upper bass already, so it might need some bass cut with the tone controls. I've never heard the version 3 or seen its measurements, but I suspect the same is true for it.
    "Opposition brings concord. Out of discord comes the fairest harmony."
    ------Heraclitus of Ephesis (fl. 504-500 BC), trans. Wheelwright.

  6. #6
    Suspended topspeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgi
    This is interesting, and possibly bad news for me I think. I was working under the assumption that a decent quality wall bracket system would be practically equivalent to a speaker stand.

    Please let me know the reasoning why this wouldn't be so, I am curious? Also how disastrous would a bracket mounted speaker be opposed to a stand mount? I am really short on options
    I wouldn't necessarily characterize a wall mount as "disastrous", however a stand does offer considerable advantages. As Pat noted, speakers aren't at their best when placed so close to the wall unless they were designed for that such as B&W's FPM line, Def Tech's Mythos', or Vienna Acoustics Shonberg line. Generally, a normal speaker will suffer from both lack of soundstage depth and bass irregularities, especially if it is rear ported where it will suffer from chuffing and other nastiness. The only rear ported speaker that I know of that was designed to be mounted close to or even against a wall are Polk Audio's with the Powerport (a complete departure from your Missions however).

    A stand affords more placement and toe-in possibilities to get the best sound based on your room's acoustics. With a wall mount, the bass energy is transferred into the wall whereas a decent stand will absorb most of the energy while coupling it to the ground. Bottom line, you'll get cleaner and more accurate bass with a stand.

    Hope this helps.

  7. #7
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    Me thinks mission is a step down from the studio 20's.

    Quote Originally Posted by RGA
    The paradigm would be a big step down in my opinion - and sound nothing like the missions. have not heard the Quad but it seems to be on the right track - but quad does have the pedigree backing them. Remember that when you put a standmount on a stand it takes up the same space as most floorstanders - and if you're not going to put the speaker on a proper stand - don't spend $800US because it will be wasted.
    asasas

  8. #8
    RGA
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    Quote Originally Posted by richgi
    This is interesting, and possibly bad news for me I think. I was working under the assumption that a decent quality wall bracket system would be practically equivalent to a speaker stand.

    Please let me know the reasoning why this wouldn't be so, I am curious? Also how disastrous would a bracket mounted speaker be opposed to a stand mount? I am really short on options

    Admittedly I have done little research into this aspect so am very uninformed...

    cheers.

    Rich.
    The reason I say it is not a good idea is because most speakers simply are not designed to be wall bracketed or even close to walls and people buy higher end speakers because they do audiophile things better than say a $200.00 speaker such as soundstaging and imaging etc. So I'm saying why spend extra money for advantages that will be immediately cut by positioning them in such a way as to sound worse?

    By all means you can buy something like the B&W LM(Leisure Monitor) 1 and WM series which are specifically designed for bracketing and even outdoor/patio set-ups. Tone controls are not smart enough to control the individual speaker you're having a problem with - they take all frequencies and drop or raise them. http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/...nge%20Monitors

    A cheaper alternative might be the DM 303 which is my favorite in the sub $350.00 price range that is using a metal tweeter ...has a slightly bright tweeter but that is true of the costlier designs mentioned thus far.

    Presumably you chose Mission because you liked their sound - so I would look and see what Mission offers up in this regard http://www.mission-usa.com/index1.htm -- going to something with a metal tweeter may wow you initially and annoy you later...The PSB alpha B is an underrated little speaker if it is still around was a bit boring but never annoying.

    Mission is one of the reamining British sounding designs and even they are being drawn into the the sess-pool of the current we love it bright and in your face sound currently in fashion.

    Personally I would try and squish those Missions in somewhere - you'll take a big hit selling them. If you must buy knew consider the Mission M72. For ~$299.00 Cdn I would take it over a lot of other speakers already mentioned that go for about 3 times that. It's harder to find though.

    The 781 is quite good and it's tube amp friendly ringing in at 88db 8 ohm but a very easy 5.6 min impedance which won't make tubes wheeze. However I don't know, again, if it would be good on a wall.

    Frankly I would send Mission an e-mail and ask them - they can inform you best as to which of their models are wall mount friendly.

    Some rear ported speakers like to be very close to walls - some front ports suck donkey balls close to a wall.

  9. #9
    Forum Regular N. Abstentia's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=RGA]The paradigm would be a big step down in my opinion - and sound nothing like the missions. QUOTE]

    I think he said the Paradigm Studios..they would be far from a step down.

  10. #10
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    Let's not get personal bias' involved. Whether or not it's a "step down" or not, the fact is RGA's right; Paradigm's and Mission's don't sound similar at all. The poster likes the Mission sound. There's a very good chance he won't like Paradigms. Simple.

  11. #11
    Forum Regular N. Abstentia's Avatar
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    Well he won't know whether or not he likes something else better unless he goes to hear them. He might discover that he didn't like the brigtness of Missions after all.

  12. #12
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    Huh? You readin' the same thread I am?

    Quote Originally Posted by N. Abstentia
    Well he won't know whether or not he likes something else better unless he goes to hear them. He might discover that he didn't like the brigtness of Missions after all.
    Quote Originally Posted by richgi
    My setup:

    Musical Fidelity A3 integrated & matching A3 2 CD player.
    Mission 752 freedom.
    Cable Talk wires.

    I love this system
    Where did he say he found the Freedom's were bright? Believe it or not, there are a LOT of people that would argue the Studio's are much brighter and more aggressive than the Missions, especially the V2's and earlier. The V3's have smoothed out the treble response to my ears, but they still don't sound like Missions.

  13. #13
    RGA
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    Quote Originally Posted by topspeed
    Where did he say he found the Freedom's were bright? Believe it or not, there are a LOT of people that would argue the Studio's are much brighter and more aggressive than the Missions, especially the V2's and earlier. The V3's have smoothed out the treble response to my ears, but they still don't sound like Missions.
    And most people who don't like Paradigm or buy something else comment on the Paradigm's being bright - just because I'm one of the only people here discussing what I perceive is Paradigm's problem is because most people into high end audio don't hang out on this non high end forum. People here think I'm hard on Paradigm I'm actually benign to them - they're OK given the competition - I don't idolize them because I've heard better for the same money. The more you listen to the more you know where things stand. And I should say where they stand to my preferences.

  14. #14
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    Question

    hi,

    I'm looking for 4 of those speakers as second hand :
    Quad 11L or 12L vs Diapason Micra III or Prelude III vs Castle Trent II
    Which one do u prefer ?
    Which homecinema ampli will u put on it ? I've got today an Harman Kardon AVR3000.
    Have u put ur speakers on the wall ? if yes, have u buy a specific attach ?
    Which model do u have as central speaker and woofer ?

    Best regards,

    Eric from France

  15. #15
    tow
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    I myself own a pair of Castle Trents and love them.I use to own the Linn Kans and heard the Rogers LS35A at my friend place and I can honestly tell you for the price on the used market these days the Trents gives you 85% of what the Rogers offers in sound and on par with the Linns,in fact it surpasses the Linns in width and extensions.If you use a decent tube app and play SACD's or hi res recordings the Trents are shockingly good.Weakness is bass is limited,not ultra quick and highs rolls off a bit quickly.Everything is fleshed out beautifully with the Trents.

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