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  1. #1
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    My Realistic Mach One Restoration

    So I just bought a pair of 4024 realistic mach ones from a local that are beat, i mean BEAT. looking like they came outa si-fi movie.
    Now im just playing, there not bad.

    I do have sorta a plan of what needs to be done.......,.,.,.,.,.

    They are the originals so they do have the long lasting surrounds, but there long past there day so they need to go...

    So were...
    Re-surrounding
    Wet-looking the woofers
    Re-Insolating
    Possible internal wire/crossover work
    Pulling out a indented dust cap
    If even possible....putting in a banana plug port in the back.
    Fixing the huge chunk missing in on the side
    Sanding down inperfections
    Re-finishing
    Sealer
    Sanding edges of board to stain as well.
    try and find a mint l-pad, mine has cracks everywhere

    this should be a living hell, but its worth it seeing that they sound fantastic!!!


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  2. #2
    I put the Gee in Gear.... thekid's Avatar
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    Howard's Restor-A-Finish and 0000 steel wool will bring back most cabinets without the need for sanding and re-staining. Howard's Feed-N-Wax will keep them that way. About 20minutes worth of work versus a couple of hours.

    http://www.minksemporium.com/Demonstration.html

  3. #3
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewillisdead112
    So I just bought a pair of 4024 realistic mach ones from a local that are beat, i mean BEAT. looking like they came outa si-fi movie.
    Now im just playing, there not bad.

    I do have sorta a plan of what needs to be done.......,.,.,.,.,.

    They are the originals so they do have the long lasting surrounds, but there long past there day so they need to go...

    ...
    Free, sorry, but I think you are wasting your time restoring this junk. It will be a lot of work to get a nice result, and I'm not sure how you will repair the missing venier on the corners (for example). Even it you succeed, the resale value will be minimal

    -- Not to mention the sound quality. I remember the Mach I when it was the latest thing from RS; I didn't have the least interest at the time despite the relatively low price.

    My earnest advice is to hurl these POS in to the nearest trash receptical. Get yourself some other vintage speakers of greater inherent qualty -- Advent, Dynaco, AR, KLH, JBL, KEF -- and spend your effort to restore them instead.

  4. #4
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    i think they sound quite good, thank you very much. im young and have all the time in the world to have a fancy stereo system. These are going to be for load, jumping around the house fun. and they sound quite pleasant at low levels.

    thanks for your kind input though.

  5. #5
    Shostakovich fan Feanor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewillisdead112
    ... These are going to be for load, jumping around the house fun. and they sound quite pleasant at low levels.

    thanks for your kind input though.
    They might work in the garage or basement.

  6. #6
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    there going in a second bedroom when im finished with them, there not for critical listening or anything serious, just a blast from the past!

    they honestly dont sound that bad

  7. #7
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Feanor is only echoing the sentiments of a lot of members here. I believe you have started a thread about this at AK under the name PrestonP. I know you will get a different response there. Most of those guys are more concerned with vintage than sound quality. There are quite a few people there who have Mach Ones and like them. I don't really understand that at all. Mach Ones, Cerwin Vega's and other "Frat House" speakers make lots of noise on a few watts. To my ears that's the only thing they have going for them. Contrary to Cerwin Vega's ad; Loud is not good no matter how clean it is when it doesn't sound like music.
    A pair of AR's, Advents, KLH's or JBL's will walk all over those Mach Ones. The time and money you are going to sink into Mach Ones would be better spent on a pair of those I just mentioned.
    It might be an ear opener for you to go somewhere and listen to some good gear. Doing that would give you an idea how good gear sounds. At the very least it would give you some kind of target to aim for sound quality wise. On a personal level, I don't like any speakers in a box but I'd take any of the ones I mentioned over Mach One's.

    Save your money and buy some decent gear. It will sound better and you'll be more satisfied in the end. People that are satisfied with the sound of their system stop tweaking and play music. Most of the posters at AK change gear like I change socks. I have a post there that politely raises the question.

    Could it be?
    "People that are happy with the way their system sounds just play music. People that tweak and constantly swap speakers and other gear in and out are basically not satisfied with their systems."
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  8. #8
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    Feanor is only echoing the sentiments of a lot of members here. I believe you have started a thread about this at AK under the name PrestonP. I know you will get a different response there. Most of those guys are more concerned with vintage than sound quality. There are quite a few people there who have Mach Ones and like them. I don't really understand that at all. Mach Ones, Cerwin Vega's and other "Frat House" speakers make lots of noise on a few watts. To my ears that's the only thing they have going for them. Contrary to Cerwin Vega's ad; Loud is not good no matter how clean it is when it doesn't sound like music.
    A pair of AR's, Advents, KLH's or JBL's will walk all over those Mach Ones. The time and money you are going to sink into Mach Ones would be better spent on a pair of those I just mentioned.
    It might be an ear opener for you to go somewhere and listen to some good gear. Doing that would give you an idea how good gear sounds. At the very least it would give you some kind of target to aim for sound quality wise. On a personal level, I don't like any speakers in a box but I'd take any of the ones I mentioned over Mach One's.

    Save your money and buy some decent gear. It will sound better and you'll be more satisfied in the end. People that are satisfied with the sound of their system stop tweaking and play music. Most of the posters at AK change gear like I change socks. I have a post there that politely raises the question.

    Could it be?
    "People that are happy with the way their system sounds just play music. People that tweak and constantly swap speakers and other gear in and out are basically not satisfied with their systems."
    ive heard good gear. ive heard great gear. I never said that the machs sounded like god pee'd but they are cool and retro, im socking fifty bucks into them not a million. throwing them into a bedroom with a okay receiver for when the guys are over playing xbox. def not for critical listening, thats what i plan to put my money into a dedicated 2 channel system. and the jbls i traded for these on a sonic note were quite worse in my eyes/ears. there nore brassy tin to the machs but at low levels...which they will always be at, they sound quite okay for the 80 dollar eqiv of what i paid for them.

    Ive heard b&w, martin logan, paradigm, jbl, klipsch and all different types of speakers. and ill agree 100% that they are in a whole other world then the machs, but they will fit well in my planned retro room im setting up, just for ****s and giggles.

    hays for horses sir!

  9. #9
    Aging Smartass
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    [QUOTE=JoeE SP9]

    Save your money and buy some decent gear. It will sound better and you'll be more satisfied in the end. [QUOTE]

    I strongly agree with this, and Feanor's comments. My initiation to this business was my 14-year stint at Lafayette Radio (Radio Shack's major competitor), whose private label speakers were sold under the "Criterion" brand. To me, restoring either a Realistic Mach something or other makes about as much sense as restoring an old Criterion: none were that good to begin with, so why bother?

    Still, my primary objection to the initial poster isn't the question about restoring speakers, but his appalling English. He may be only 19, but I too was 19 (a looonnngggg time ago!) and at 19 I knew how to use capital letters, apostrophes when printing a conjunction, and knew the difference between "their," "there," and "they're."

    I find it a bit insulting to read something written in a manner that ignores standard English as a matter of "style." We are not very young teenagers here texting to one another, but (hopefully) mature individuals attempting to communicate with one another. Let's try to write the language we speak as it was meant to be written.

  10. #10
    _ Luvin Da Blues's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emaidel
    I find it a bit insulting to read something written in a manner that ignores standard English as a matter of "style." We are not very young teenagers here texting to one another, but (hopefully) mature individuals attempting to communicate with one another. Let's try to write the language we speak as it was meant to be written.
    weigh to much werk, ware wood the instant gratification be doing things wright
    Back in my day, we had nine planets.

  11. #11
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    Chill out, im just trying to fun with something older then me. I'm not rolling in money like alot of you are. This Is just something to do for fun, not for any real reason. It's fifty bucks not a million.

    And I'm young, I don't have to spell everything right or make a perfect sentence. This is a forum not my college thesis paper.

    Relax, as I said, I'm building a real two channel for the living room, this is only for fun. You can feel free to buy me a good speaker to restore, and i kindly will.

    Until then, I'm going to mess around with my mach's

    Enough proper english?

  12. #12
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    First, it's "Trying to have fun". "Trying to fun" is unbelievably bad grammar.

    Most of us are not rolling in money. A lot of us have kids your age who are going to college on our money. In my case I've been paying >$25K a year for my son's education. This is his senior and last year I'm paying for. Finally, I'll have some discretionary income!

    We have been involved with this hobby for a while. In my case for 41+ years. Consequently, we have knowledge acquired over time about things relating to decent sound. Those same years have allowed the accumulation of some pretty good sounding gear. Please note, none of us started with the kind of gear we have now.

    The time and money you intend putting into Mach One's would be better spent on something worth it. The JBL's you sold would be a better project than the Mach's. They would also sound much better after the work is done. Bear in mind, JBL's are nowhere near my favorite speaker. AR's, KLH's, Advent's or NHT's are all higher on my list.

    Sure this is a forum but it's not twitter, texting or a site where poor grammar and misspelling are the norm. The members here write as if they were holding a conversation with a friend. Although I've never met any of you guys I feel as if we are friends. At the very least we are certainly kindred spirits in our mutual addiction.

    If you want advice and camaraderie from the members here it would behoove you to write in a manner that will make us want to respond. We try to compose and write our posts in a literate and intelligent way. It's simple courtesy that should make you want to respond in a like manner.
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  13. #13
    Aging Smartass
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    First, it's "Trying to have fun". "Trying to fun" is unbelievably bad grammar.

    Most of us are not rolling in money. A lot of us have kids your age who are going to college on our money. In my case I've been paying >$25K a year for my son's education. This is his senior and last year I'm paying for. Finally, I'll have some discretionary income!

    We have been involved with this hobby for a while. In my case for 41+ years. Consequently, we have knowledge acquired over time about things relating to decent sound. Those same years have allowed the accumulation of some pretty good sounding gear. Please note, none of us started with the kind of gear we have now.

    The time and money you intend putting into Mach One's would be better spent on something worth it. The JBL's you sold would be a better project than the Mach's. They would also sound much better after the work is done. Bear in mind, JBL's are nowhere near my favorite speaker. AR's, KLH's, Advent's or NHT's are all higher on my list.

    Sure this is a forum but it's not twitter, texting or a site where poor grammar and misspelling are the norm. The members here write as if they were holding a conversation with a friend. Although I've never met any of you guys I feel as if we are friends. At the very least we are certainly kindred spirits in our mutual addiction.

    If you want advice and camaraderie from the members here it would behoove you to write in a manner that will make us want to respond. We try to compose and write our posts in a literate and intelligent way. It's simple courtesy that should make you want to respond in a like manner.
    I was afraid I'd get angry responses from other members telling me not to be so critical, and to leave this poor lad alone. The above-quoted posting said what I felt better than I could have, or did. Thanks!

  14. #14
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emaidel
    I was afraid I'd get angry responses from other members telling me not to be so critical, and to leave this poor lad alone. The above-quoted posting said what I felt better than I could have, or did. Thanks!
    You and Feanor gave me the courage to write that post. The "dumbing" down of America is something I'm not to happy about. My post was just a protest against it. It's good to know I'm not alone in my feelings. Thanks to both of you!
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  15. #15
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    First, it's "Trying to have fun". "Trying to fun" is unbelievably bad grammar.

    Most of us are not rolling in money. A lot of us have kids your age who are going to college on our money. In my case I've been paying >$25K a year for my son's education. This is his senior and last year I'm paying for. Finally, I'll have some discretionary income!

    We have been involved with this hobby for a while. In my case for 41+ years. Consequently, we have knowledge acquired over time about things relating to decent sound. Those same years have allowed the accumulation of some pretty good sounding gear. Please note, none of us started with the kind of gear we have now.

    The time and money you intend putting into Mach One's would be better spent on something worth it. The JBL's you sold would be a better project than the Mach's. They would also sound much better after the work is done. Bear in mind, JBL's are nowhere near my favorite speaker. AR's, KLH's, Advent's or NHT's are all higher on my list.

    Sure this is a forum but it's not twitter, texting or a site where poor grammar and misspelling are the norm. The members here write as if they were holding a conversation with a friend. Although I've never met any of you guys I feel as if we are friends. At the very least we are certainly kindred spirits in our mutual addiction.

    If you want advice and camaraderie from the members here it would behoove you to write in a manner that will make us want to respond. We try to compose and write our posts in a literate and intelligent way. It's simple courtesy that should make you want to respond in a like manner.
    I guess things are just not the same when your used to having things that make things more simple. Texting without having to use correct words or whole words as that. My bad If I was not as proper as I should have been. I guess I can blame the age I am living In for that.

    And as for the Jbl's, they were far to muddy and the tweeters were screamers. I didnt feel that they were worth my time to try and fix. I also was not able to open them up, as the speaker was for some odd reason sealed in place. I was scared to damage them by tearing the woofer out.

    Was this really that bad of a move? They have better seperation then the jbl's had, but the jbl's had more of a fidelity to them. So i agree they were a better speaker, but i was bored with them and thought It would be fun to fix something of random.

    Could I have some model numbers to some REAL vintage speakers worth my time? I must have been really dooped If you guys hate them that much.

  16. #16
    Retro Modernist 02audionoob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewillisdead112
    I must have been really dooped If you guys hate them that much.
    As you've probably seen mention here, the folks at vintage-oriented forums are not nearly as hard on the Mach One as some of us here at this forum. I thought you like the sound of the Mach One speakers better than your JBL's. If so, why worry about the criticism they get here?

  17. #17
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    im just curious of the way they would sound next to a vintage "hi-fi" speaker. I've never heard a quality old speaker.

    I wanna hear what what makes them better, so if i had model numbers of some i could watch for stuff on craigslist and go take a listen if I could. I dont have a good speaker to put next to these to know what I'm missing.

    Thats all, I'm keeping them no matter what anyone says.

    They look cool as hell!

  18. #18
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewillisdead112


    im just curious of the way they would sound next to a vintage "hi-fi" speaker. I've never heard a quality old speaker.

    I wanna hear what what makes them better, so if i had model numbers of some i could watch for stuff on craigslist and go take a listen if I could. I dont have a good speaker to put next to these to know what I'm missing.

    Thats all, I'm keeping them no matter what anyone says.

    They look cool as hell!
    If you like them that's all that really matters. They just happen to be "Frat House" type speakers. That is, they like Cerwin Vega's (another "Frat House" speaker) will play loud with little power. Lots of beer as an anesthetic is needed to keep listening fatigue away.

    Vintage speakers from that era tend to fall into two approaches. The "East Coast" school represented by AR and KLH are smooth and laid back with very good deep bass. The "West Coast" school represented by JBL have an in your face mid-range with very aggressive highs. Personally the JBL sound has never appealed to me. AR's and KLH's I can listen to for a while. Mach Ones to my ears are very similar to Cerwin Vega's. They (once again) to my ears combine the worst of both schools.

    Other speakers contemporary to Mach One's
    Original Advents, Smaller Advents (no model numbers)
    Acoustic Research AR-3, AR-2
    KLH 6, 23, 17

    All of the above sound better than Mach One's in my opinion.
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  19. #19
    Listener MikeyBC's Avatar
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    At least he's not trying to restore a pair of Mach 1 4029's or the Mach 2's the 4024's were at least half decent in their day (much better than the 4029's introduced in 1982) and seem to have a bit of a cult following.

    The surrounds look good enough to me...if you get replacements chances are they wont fit well and they'll be cheap foam...might just ruin a perfectly good woofer...if there are no holes leave them alone.

    as for the cabinets...just bondo the corners and re-veneer the whole thing. You can buy oak veneer at home depot.
    Last edited by MikeyBC; 08-10-2009 at 03:58 PM.
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  20. #20
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyBC
    At least he's not trying to restore a pair of Mach 1 4029's or the Mach 2's the 4024's were at least half decent in their day (much better than the 4029's introduced in 1982) and seem to have a bit of a cult following.

    The surrounds look good enough to me...if you get replacements chances are they wont fit well and they'll be cheap foam...might just ruin a perfectly good woofer...if there are no holes leave them alone.

    as for the cabinets...just bondo the corners and re-veneer the whole thing. You can buy oak veneer at home depot.
    Agreed, the surrounds do look good. Bondo would work. Plastic wood may be even better.
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  21. #21
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    the surrounds just look nasty, I might not even fix the corner, when there on the floor you can not see the missing part. I would love to just buy/build a grill and call it a day. It's going to cost 18 bucks to restain them, thats a bette route then whole new shabang. Not to handy here.

    I made sure they were the 24's or I was not going to take the trade. I ready that these sound alot better and have a better build then the 29 and 2's. They sound quite fanstastic at low levels, about as clear as my jbls were but with more depth and seperation. It might be bad to say, but I've never heard a song where you could tell which side of the set the cymbol was hitting. It's quite nice I must say.

    My paradigms I had were so warm you could fall asleep listening to them. It was to damn relaxing. Then these on the other hand your jumping to turn down when louder songs come on. Very straight forward sound, but not always a bad thing. I think my Int. amp just Is not powerful enough to power them after notch 2 out of 10, I can for sure sence a clip.

    I just don't know If It's worth spending money to power them more. I need a new receiver and or Integrated amp soon as my lamps are going out so mise well.

    Oh and I had a pair of cerwin vega ls-12's about 3 months ago and these sound 43454543393450345304 times better then they did. I could not take the tweeter one more second so off they went. I only paid 30 bucks for them and sold them for 75 so i was happy!

  22. #22
    Deathcore for life Freewillisdead112's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    Agreed, the surrounds do look good. Bondo would work. Plastic wood may be even better.
    Bondo?

    Please excuse me, single mother child.

  23. #23
    I put the Gee in Gear.... thekid's Avatar
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    I apologize in advance for offending some of the established members here but I feel obligated to respond to some things that have been said here.

    I recall FA posting a thread a few weeks back on the topic of how to revive this site. My response to this thread was that IMO new blood gets chased away because of overly critical responses or inter-member flame throwing that ignores the OP.

    Here in this thread we have a perfect example of what I was trying to say. The newbie here has been told that he is wasting his time with these and his grammar is poor. Would anyone be surprised if he decided not to come back??

    I just remember my own initial experience here was different and even though I waxed poetically about a pair of RtR speakers and my Bose 201's I was generally given enough information and encouragement to come back and learn a more (though I am still a relative naif re gear) and pursue this hobby. Had the responses I had received to my mediocre gear and newbie questions been along the lines of some the responses here it may have been different.

    I am not saying we can not be honest but there are ways to provide information and encouragement w/o seeming to be judgemental or harsh. I appreciate the members here everytime I flip the power switch to one of my many pieces of gear that I have picked up since those early. Let's give the new faces in the crowd the same opportunity.

  24. #24
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewillisdead112
    Bondo?

    Please excuse me, single mother child.
    Is that because you don't know what Bondo is? It's sort of "plastic wood" for car dents. It's easy to work with. You can mold it, sand it and put veneer over it. It's available at most auto supply stores. It's also reasonably priced.
    One of the good things about Mach One's is, they don't need much power. How much power does your integrated produce?
    One last comment. Almost any speaker that's not a tower type or panel will sound much better on stands. A stand that raises the speaker high enough to put the tweeters at ear level when listening is highly recommended. If you are economizing you could use one or two cinder blocks under each speaker. wrap black plastic trash bags around the block. Tape them shut and tuck the ends out of site. Even if you don't like the results the cost is virtually nil.

    Raising speakers makes the treble cleaner and clear. It also firms up the bass and removes the muddy sound floor placement causes.
    Last edited by JoeE SP9; 08-12-2009 at 07:35 AM.
    ARC SP9 MKIII, VPI HW19, Rega RB300
    Marcof PPA1, Shure, Sumiko, Ortofon carts, Yamaha DVD-S1800
    Behringer UCA222, Emotiva XDA-2, HiFimeDIY
    Accuphase T101, Teac V-7010, Nak ZX-7. LX-5, Behringer DSP1124P
    Front: Magnepan 1.7, DBX 223SX, 2 modified Dynaco MK3's, 2, 12" DIY TL subs (Pass El-Pipe-O) 2 bridged Crown XLS-402
    Rear/HT: Emotiva UMC200, Acoustat Model 1/SPW-1, Behringer CX2310, 2 Adcom GFA-545

  25. #25
    3LB
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    cunning linguist 3LB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thekid
    The newbie here has been told that he is wasting his time with these and his grammar is poor. Would anyone be surprised if he decided not to come back??
    Agreed.

    I peruse the speaker forum every now and then just incase there are any interesting DIY threads going, and was quite saddened to read most of this post.

    I do have to agree that those Mach One's are not worth a lot of money and effort as far as resale value goes, but if a person was wanting a good set of speakers on which to practice restoration technique, it may as well be these. I don't know exactly how old this young dude is, but if we remember right, we all had different tastes in gear when we was youngins. Hell, I'd still rather own a set of Klipsch Cornwalls than any speaker I've heard since...if I were inclined to buy speakers instead of build them myself. Those Mach Ones with the flaired horn are going to sound different from a lot of current designs, especially in a world where DSPs determine imaging as much as design. Sometimes its not always about sounding better, just different, and in audio, its ok to keep a harum.

    Finding exact replacement drivers for that particular speaker, speaking of the horn mid/tweets, could be somwhat of a challenge. It depends on whether or not the midrange driver unit can be seperated from the back of the big horn (if its threaded that'd be great). The smaller tweeter might be replaced with a tad bit of alteration to panel in which its mounted, and L-pads are easy to replace. Any of these drivers can be sourced at Parts Express dot com. We could talk Theil/Small parameters later, but I doubt the crossovers in these things are anything more than 1st order capacitors, making driver replacement a lot less complicated. Some older Ratshacks' cabinets are actually pretty good. Back in them days, double-sided veneered cabs were the cheap cabinet of their day, but in these times, a sheet of double-sided veneer will cost you pert near $70-$80! Few mass market speaker manufacturors use anything that expensive today. Too bad that these have corner damage. If its just impact damage, then you could fill it and stain it to serviceable effect, but if the cabs have water damage, then any repairs you perform is just, well...chasing your tail. If particle board gets too wet, its history.

    As far as correcting grammar goes, I understand where this is coming from... we want to help, but we have wonder to what extent we'll be listened to anyway, given that attempting decent grammar within a text is usaully (not always) a good indicator of a person's apptitude and comprehension. Nobody wants to spin their wheels, nor watch someone else spin their wheels. However pertinent the advise on grammar was, such things are better suited for a PM. None of us here practise perfikt grammer anyhoo.
    Repost this on your wall if you love Jesus.

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