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  1. #1
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Miller And Kreisel Mx-70

    So i came across a M&K MX-70 subwoofer for about $50 and i was wondering since i've never had experience what everyone thought of these who have? I heard that were pretty good, more so for music, but decent deep bass and good response....

    Worth the $50 as a good buy?

    I see a low pass filter switch and a bass level switch, self powered obviously...looks older but decent shape, i see one speak aimed down from the top of the box through a hole in the back and i guess theres another one somewhere cuz reading up on these i noticed people sayin theres two 8in woofers inside?
    -Shift was here

  2. #2
    Audio/HT Nut version 1.3a
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    I'm no expert on used equipment, but if that is in reasonable condition and the surrounds are not shot it sounds like a decent buy. I think it is about 10-15 years old or so. Is it a MX-70 or MX-70B?

    M&K just went out of business. They were a very fine consumer/studio speaker company with a reputation for excellent performance and build quality. Their subs were top rate. This one you are looking at was the smallest in their MX line. It is a push-pull configuration with two 8 inch drivers. It would be designed for small to medium (satellite or bookshelf) speakers and rooms. Probably excellent for music and OK for a small home theater system, keeping in mind that for HT it probably doesn't go much below about 27-28Hz @ -3dB's and not super loud.

    Whether it is good for your circumstances would depend on your other speakers, your receiver/pre and controls, inputs and switches it has on the rear (or photo).

    RR6

  3. #3
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Its just the MX-70 not the B i believe, heres a picture of the back of it

    MX-70 REAR PIC - 0.04MB

    Seems to be in good condition, yea im in a small room, i have a Panasonic SA-HE70 Receiver with some Yamaha floor standing speakers in front, and small Cambridge Soundworks in the rear, and my center is just a small sub speaker from old computer speakers so its not a great setup, ive just been looking for more bass out of my system and i wanted to get something hooked up to the sub pre out and this seems like a good choice, not to big and will add some decent bass to a smaller room
    -Shift was here

  4. #4
    Audio/HT Nut version 1.3a
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    It's sort of hard to clearly see that photo. If the sub is in good shape it should be a good deal for you and add lots of quality bass.

    If you do buy it I would suggest the following.

    Looks like you have two RCA line inputs for the sub. The SA-HE70 seems to have a sub crossover at 100, 150 and 200 hertz. Since you didn't give any info on the Yamaha left and right I'll have to guess. I presume these are not very expensive Yamaha's and probably not very low bass.

    I would suggest you try hooking up the sub from the receiver sub line out to the sub line in (looks like there is a left and right), one or the other or a y connector to both, either way should be OK.

    Use the sub crossover on the receiver, set at 100Hz, and set all the speakers to "small". On the sub turn the low pass dial to max and set the volume to about 10 o'clock or 40%. Calibrate, set and adjust the sub volume on the receiver (watch it, many set the sub volume too high). Make sure the sub is up front near the front speakers and not on the side or rear wall. I would also suggest you try setting the center speaker to "off" and using only the front 2 speakers and the two surrounds. The receiver (check the manual) will create a phantom center channel thru the left and right speakers. This is better than using a center that is a gross mismatch for the left and right.

    Good luck.

    RR6

  5. #5
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Hey i got another question for you

    I could get this this sub for $50 i think its like 125watts?
    I could get a Phillips Sw990 [cant find any info on] but guy said its 75watt for $25
    or could get a Sony 150 watt sub + a sony 5.1 receiver for $50

    All 3 are powered subs

    my question is what would you do? Anyone know anything about sony subs, im not sure what the model is but its like a 10in speaker aiming front to small knobs up top right corner, small port front bottom left........? I dont know much about M&K or Phillips subs but the sony one looks pretty good [cleanest out of all 3]
    -Shift was here

  6. #6
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    Hey i got another question for you

    I could get this this sub for $50 i think its like 125watts?
    I could get a Phillips Sw990 [cant find any info on] but guy said its 75watt for $25
    or could get a Sony 150 watt sub + a sony 5.1 receiver for $50

    All 3 are powered subs

    my question is what would you do? Anyone know anything about sony subs, im not sure what the model is but its like a 10in speaker aiming front to small knobs up top right corner, small port front bottom left........? I dont know much about M&K or Phillips subs but the sony one looks pretty good [cleanest out of all 3]
    Stick with the M&K. They have a reputation for making high quality subs. Neither Sony, nor Philips do.
    Sir Terrence

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  7. #7
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Ok heres the pictures if you can tell which youd pic of these 3

    Sony receiver and subwoofer [interest is subwoofer tho] $50
    SONY 150watts - 0.02MB

    Phillips SW990 for $25
    Phillips 75watts - 0.03MB

    or M&K MX-70 for $50
    M&K 125watts - 0.06MB

    So you still thinking my best best is the M&K? Best value and sound?
    -Shift was here

  8. #8
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    Ok heres the pictures if you can tell which youd pic of these 3

    Sony receiver and subwoofer [interest is subwoofer tho] $50
    SONY 150watts - 0.02MB

    Phillips SW990 for $25
    Phillips 75watts - 0.03MB

    or M&K MX-70 for $50
    M&K 125watts - 0.06MB

    So you still thinking my best best is the M&K? Best value and sound?
    Stands up on pulpit, puts bullhorn in front of mouth, and says "GET THE M&K BEFORE I BREAK YOUR LEGS!!!". Puts bullhorn down, and exits stage left.....
    Sir Terrence

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  9. #9
    Audio/HT Nut version 1.3a
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    Sir Terrence is right. The M&K sub listed close to $1000 when new. The others are junk in comparison.

    RR6

  10. #10
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Well lets say that that M&K is no longer available, which one would be the next best lol
    -Shift was here

  11. #11
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    Well lets say that that M&K is no longer available, which one would be the next best lol
    You can listen to this advice, or not. If you cannot get the M&K, do not get any of the other either. They are cheap underperforming subs not matter how you slice it. Save your money, and get a good quality sub that is not all that expensive. SVS and HSU subs fit that bill perfectly.

    Never run after cheap crap. In this case, you get what you pay for. Boomy bass, that does not go very deep, or play very loud is what you are going to get from a Philips and a Sony subwoofer. These companies are not known for producing good subs, or speakers for that matter.
    Sir Terrence

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  12. #12
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    Well lets say that that M&K is no longer available, which one would be the next best lol

    how do you mean? someone else bought it?

    in that case, go smash your head on a wall.



    seriously, both the philips and the sony are not worth any money, and even then, if I were given them for free, I still would not even consider using them.

    if you cannot get the M&K save on for a new sub. or wait for another great deal, but this time, don't let it slip away.

    Keep them spinning,
    Bert.
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  13. #13
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    No, after the person told me they'd sell it, they send me an email saying that'd rather sell the sub with all the other equipment they had, which i dont know anything about so im tryin to contact them and see what else they had, but they havent answered my emails so i have no idea what the deal is........also what about Yamaha?

    A YAMAHA YSTSW50 Sub woofer opportunity has presented itself for $50, or are those sub just as bad as Sony and Phillips?
    -Shift was here

  14. #14
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    No, after the person told me they'd sell it, they send me an email saying that'd rather sell the sub with all the other equipment they had, which i dont know anything about so im tryin to contact them and see what else they had, but they havent answered my emails so i have no idea what the deal is........also what about Yamaha?

    A YAMAHA YSTSW50 Sub woofer opportunity has presented itself for $50, or are those sub just as bad as Sony and Phillips?
    Shift,
    A subwoofer is the foundation to your entire speaker system. If it sucks, you entire speaker package will suck just because of its weaknesses. $50 is just not going to get you a quality subwoofer, and neither is $100 or $200. The quality of the drivers, and the cabinet at these prices just does not support good subwoofer performance. If you are looking for a used sub at a reasonable price, look on EBAY for a HSU or SVS, or better yet, save your money and buy one new. I cannot stress this enough. You absolutely cannot skimp on your subwoofer, and doing it on the cheap will cost you more money in the long run once you realize that it just does not perform well.

    The two brand names I mention are known for producing high quality subwoofers for a reasonable price, that price being around $500 and maybe a little less if you find a deal. These subwoofers are so good, that if you move to another larger room, you could just add another one of the same model, and it will perform well in that larger room as well as a single one did in a smaller room. Take my advice(please!!), save your money and purchase a quality subwoofer. Hometheater is a long term investment. Those who attempt to do it on the cheap, end up paying far more money in the long run.
    Sir Terrence

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  15. #15
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Oh, well im a college student, this is a system for my room in my college house. Right now i cant afford anything of that caliber and lookin at the job market doesnt seem like ill be able to invest in a subwoofer that expensive so i was just lookin for something cheap to tide me over until i was able to afford an awesome one.....i dunno i guess what your sayin is about those above it doesnt matter much of which one of those i were to go with becuz they are all gunna be crappy quality regardless? So in other words, anything under $200-$300 is gunna sound the same
    -Shift was here

  16. #16
    Audio/HT Nut version 1.3a
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    Here is an excellent quality 8" sub new for $99 (closout). This Energy sub sold before for about $275. It has an excellent frequency response down only about -3dB's at 30Hz. It is great for a small room and good for a medium room. It will play loud in a small room but not rock party loud in a large room. Energy is a very fine Canadian speaker company. Probably about $125 shipped.

    http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=ENESW8

    Here is a review on an Energy system that has this sub. See the lab results, the frequency response curve (very flat) and -3dB points are great for this class of sub.

    http://www.hometheatermag.com/compac...rgy/index.html

    RR6

  17. #17
    M.P.S.E /AES/SMPTE member Sir Terrence the Terrible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shift
    Oh, well im a college student, this is a system for my room in my college house. Right now i cant afford anything of that caliber and lookin at the job market doesnt seem like ill be able to invest in a subwoofer that expensive so i was just lookin for something cheap to tide me over until i was able to afford an awesome one.....i dunno i guess what your sayin is about those above it doesnt matter much of which one of those i were to go with becuz they are all gunna be crappy quality regardless? So in other words, anything under $200-$300 is gunna sound the same
    Okay, I see and I fully understand. Take RR advice. If the energy sub can be found at that price, get it. It is better than Sony and Philips that is for sure.
    Sir Terrence

    Titan Reference 3D 1080p projector
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    Oppo BDP-103D
    Datastat RS20I audio/video processor 12.4 audio setup
    9 Onkyo M-5099 power amp
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    18 custom 3 way horn DSP hybrid surround/ceiling speakers
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  18. #18
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    Yeah i might have to look into that....anyone heard of the subwoofer JBL Bass 20? i cant seem to find any reviews or anything on it, someone is selling one for $50 and i knew someone with JBL car subwoofers and they bang, would this company fall into the same category as Sony Phillips and Yamaha as well?
    -Shift was here

  19. #19
    Volume Cranker shift's Avatar
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    ??? How is JBL, i think this woofer is 150watts, got pictures, looks decent, looks like only one knob on the back for adjustments....
    -Shift was here

  20. #20
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    SVS, HSU, M&K, Outlaw Audio, Definitive Technologies, Velodyne, Energy, Jamo, and KEF all make high quality powered subwoofers (as well as others).

    I sold an HSU STF-3 and kept an M&K instead because I thought the M&K was more musical sounding and fit my average size living room better. The HSU was really too large, both physically and acoustically for it.

    Don't worry so much about wattage ratings, especially with "sealed" cabinet designs. The M&K V75 MkII I kept is only 75watts but performed at least as well and in many cases much better than many other subs I've had with much higher wattage ratings (The HSU was 300 watts, a great sub, the M&K worked better *in my living room*)

    Size of the woofer does matter as it generally takes a larger cone to produce the really deep stuff. I find a really good 12" to be about ideal although an excellent quality 10" might also get pretty low. A 15" takes a lot of power to get moving. Generally the larger the woofer the more power it takes to move which often translates into a speaker that won't sound it's best until it reaches a certain output level and unless you are very careful in mixing speakers can easily overwhelm the rest of your setup. Also the larger the woofer the more mass there is to try and switch directions which means that generally you will loose some of a woofer's "quick", "tight", and "accurate" attributes as the size goes up. On the flip side of that coin most smaller woofers can be very "quick" and "accurate" but most cannot hit the really low lows, as pointed out earlier in this thread.

    I love M&K subs, had three of them until yesterday (down to two now) and highly recommend them, especially the sealed cabinet models. You should be able to find something like my 12" V75 MKII used for under $300... great compromise between movie and music performance, sealed, relatively easy to place, doesn't really start rolling off until 20Hz, have tested down to 10Hz with still usable dbs. Check ebay or your local craigslist. Have had SVS, HSU, Outlaw, Velodyne, Infinity, Yamaha and even Sony (hey, at least I'm honest!)

  21. #21
    AR Newbie Registered Member
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    For the most part stay away from any subwoofer that could have been designed and/or sold as part of a HTiB system... that includes all the major big box store brands like Onkyo, Yamaha, Sony, Phillips, Panasonic, JBL, etc. Try to buy a subwoofer from a company that ONLY SELLS SUBWOOFERS, or least primarily does (Velodyne, M&K and others have taken half-hearted stabs at selling other speakers too but still specialize in subs!) M&K, SVS, HSU, Outlaw, Velodyne (watch for the cheaper models!), Jamo, etc.

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