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  1. #1
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    Question Mains that match Paradigm CC-370 Center channel....

    .....the closest. Hi all. Of all the speakers in Paradigm's Monitor line which would you say matches the frequency response of the Paradigm center channel the closest? I have the monitor 7's and theyre slightly darker but enough to notice. I was thinking maybe the Monitor 5 because of it's similar driver compliment as well as cabinet volume. All opinions are appreciated.

  2. #2
    cam
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    Quote Originally Posted by newbsterv2
    .....the closest. Hi all. Of all the speakers in Paradigm's Monitor line which would you say matches the frequency response of the Paradigm center channel the closest? I have the monitor 7's and theyre slightly darker but enough to notice. I was thinking maybe the Monitor 5 because of it's similar driver compliment as well as cabinet volume. All opinions are appreciated.
    Mini mon's, mon 5's, mon 7's, and the mon 11's. All have the same size tweeter and woofers and they are all crossed over at the same frequency. I don't think the cabinet volume should be of any concern as apposed to driver size matching.

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    Lightbulb sure does

    Quote Originally Posted by cam
    Mini mon's, mon 5's, mon 7's, and the mon 11's. All have the same size tweeter and woofers and they are all crossed over at the same frequency. I don't think the cabinet volume should be of any concern as apposed to driver size matching.

    It sure does cam. Bigger cabinet equals more bass. and side by side the 7's dont sounds quite as similar as the center. even with the pink noise it's quite different.

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    cam
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    Set to small

    Quote Originally Posted by newbsterv2
    It sure does cam. Bigger cabinet equals more bass. and side by side the 7's dont sounds quite as similar as the center. even with the pink noise it's quite different.
    If all your speakers are set to small and all are crossed over at lets say 80 hz you will have a completely seamless match from speaker to speaker with the mini's, 5's, 7's, or 11's.

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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by cam
    If all your speakers are set to small and all are crossed over at lets say 80 hz you will have a completely seamless match from speaker to speaker with the mini's, 5's, 7's, or 11's.
    You know what cam? After experimenting with the locations of the speakers(and of my ears) I've found that keeping the tweeters of the mains and of the center channel as level as possible has a profound effect on timbre matching. I always thought the Monitor 7's sounded too dark but the problem was that I was sitting too close to them and my ears were too far below the tweeters. Thanks for your help though it got me thinking and you're right. Set up properly the centers, while not EXACTLY the same, came pretty damn close to matching the mains. Thanks cam

  6. #6
    Forum Regular N. Abstentia's Avatar
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    You'll never get them to sound identical as long as the center is positioned on top of a TV so it does not matter which mains you have.

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    RGA
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    N. Abstentia

    And further to this the volume of the speaker and cabinet plays a huge role in the sound of the speaker. I have never ever heard a system using a center channel speaker(designed as a center channel speaker) that is acceptable to me as what one would call a seamless match(The ML set-up was pretty close but that was front projector so the center panel was nearly at the same height). That said you can certainly make-do with it and it can sound good.

    I agree with the other at least try and get the tweeter at the same height or tilted in such a way as to integrate better.

    Hopefully those front projectors get more popular and people can have thee identical speakers across the front. When I can affor that it is the only option that will be acceptable to me - so until then it is phantom mode.

    As to the original try and get the best Center channel within the family - 80%+ is said to be from the center channel alone - so while the panning effect won't be quite seamless - I would worry more about getting the 80% really right than having the seamless part improved but the dialog is lousy.

    Good dealers will let you take it home to try - and I would not deal with anyone who isn't a good dealer.

    But it sounds like you have the center channel and are matching the mains? Same deal applies take the mains home and hear.

  8. #8
    Forum Regular Woochifer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by N. Abstentia
    You'll never get them to sound identical as long as the center is positioned on top of a TV so it does not matter which mains you have.
    Yes and no. The point of a center speaker is not to get an identical sound, but to get as close a match as possible. And that does not mean that the match with the mains is irrelevant.

    Ideally, you would have three identical speakers across the front. However, a TV typically sits exactly where an identical middle speaker should go. Therefore, the horizontal center speaker is a compromise by necessity, even though the horizontal alignment means that the match will not be perfect.

    Given this compromise, you need to listen carefully and go with a center speaker that has similar voice characteristics, and in most cases, the closest match is going to come from the same manufacturer. For example, pairing a Paradigm CC-370 with a set of Bose 301s for example would not make any sense given how differently the two speaker series are voiced, and how their tonal characteristics translate. The Monitor series speakers that share the basic drivers with the CC-370 are a much closer match, and sufficient to keep the front soundstage coherent.

    But, keep in mind that even within the same speaker families, the "matched" center speakers will not always be an adequate match to avoid the center speaker standing out as a point source. B&W, Boston Acoustics, and Bose for instance have all made center speakers that in my listenings were an insufficient match for the mains that were recommended for them.

    Overall, even with the horizontal alignment of the center speaker, the imaging stability and off-axis coherency is greatly enhanced when you use a center speaker with 5.1 sources. Unlike with two-channel sources, where the phantom center imaging is deliberately mixed in by design, a 5.1 source is designed to be played back with a center speaker anchoring the center image. Not using that center speaker means that the image will vary considerably from soundtrack to soundtrack, and not be especially stable. IMO, the way that a reasonably well matched center speaker (again, it does not have to be perfect) imparts these advantages are more than enough to off-set any tonal shifts caused by the horizontal alignment. The less that the mains and center match, then these advantages lessen and at some point further down you're actually better off going without a center speaker altogether, despite the disadvantages that the center channel downmixing gives you.

    In addition to using as closely matched a speaker as possible, you need to make sure that the center speaker is setup correctly. First, if you have the front three speakers lined up along the same horizontal plane, you actually will need to increase the delay timing for the center speaker because the center speaker sound is closer to the listening position than the mains from that alignment. Second, you need to make sure that the SPL levels are identical for the front three.

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