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Thread: Lack of bass

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  1. #1
    Forum Regular royphil345's Avatar
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    Don't think he'll be able be able to put the original 10" in the 12" hole guys!!!

    Yes, The larger driver would likely require a larger cabinet or port for optimum bass response.

    Yes, If you replace a 6 ohm woofer with an 8 ohm woofer, any other drivers in the system will get louder in comparison.

    You could easily add an L-pad volume control for each tweeter, allowing you to adjust the balance between the woofer and tweeter on your speakers. You could try simply adding a 2 ohm non-inductive resistor to the positive tweeter lead instead, if you're sure you went from a 6 to an 8 ohm woofer and you don't want adjustable controls. Either way, you'd basically be raising the resistance of the tweeter to match the higher resistance of the replacement woofer. Adding resistance will lower the crossover frequency of the capicitor(s) to your tweeter slightly, probably not significantly. A lower crossover would be better than higher considering the larger woofer anyway. Adding a resistor / L-pad should be worthwhile for you. Would probably improve your soundstage / mid-range considerably, even if the woofer isn't perfect for the cabinet.

    Definitely make sure your woofers have been installed correctly and in phase, and that your speaker wires are hooked up properly and in phase. Though... it does seem like the woofer change is causing the bright sounding speakers in your case...

  2. #2
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    well, i tried something to rule out some things,
    I used my dad's subwoofer (b&w asw600) and placed it in my room.
    according to the conclusions we made in this post, i should be smashed into the nearest wall because the sub is pretty big, sure this whould have happened in the right room, but here it didn't, instead, it did... Nothing at all,

    the sub (and the speakers) were giving all they had (volume was halfway open on sub), and where i sat, nothing happened,
    i tried 3 different placings: 1) between the speakers, this did nothing, really really nothing
    2) against the wall to my left side, this did a little little bit, but
    actually too less to mention,
    3) i suddenly remembered what the dealer said when we bought
    the sub, place it where you have good bass, so i did, (hard to
    describe, please look at the third photo) this did something
    noticable: the whole room started to shake and there was a
    little increasement in the bass,

    after that i kindof concluded that it had something to do with the room itselves, i made a drawing in paint so you can look a bit too. (4th pic)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Lack of bass-subplacing-1.jpg   Lack of bass-subplacing-2.jpg   Lack of bass-subplacing-3.jpg   Lack of bass-my-room.jpg  
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  3. #3
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    besides rebuilding the room to something more audio friendly, are there any other solutions??

    could it be that the woofers in the advents are cancelling the sub somehow??
    if that is, that would mean that the woofers are out of phase.
    if not,
    would a down firing subwoofer help?

    Thnx,
    Basite.
    Last edited by basite; 10-08-2006 at 10:30 AM.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  4. #4
    Forum Regular anamorphic96's Avatar
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    I would start over and change the woofers to something compatible with the Advents. There really is no other way around this issue. The driver you put in is not compatible and causing problems.

    I just did a Google search and 5 seconds later came up with this link. Could be a start. There are many companies that specialize in repair of older Advents. It even looks like they have replacements for your large Advents for 50.00. Not a bad deal if ask me.

    http://layneaudio.hypermart.net/repair.htm

  5. #5
    Phila combat zone JoeE SP9's Avatar
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    The replacement woofers you are using were designed for a ported cabinet. They will never work properly in a sealed (acoustic suspension) cabinet. You need to replace them with woofers designed for acoustic suspension type cabinets. If you do that you should replace any stuffing you have removed. Placing the wrong size and type of woofer in those cabinets has not been any help in your search for better sound. If you replace the current 12" woofers you will probably have to go with 12"s instead of tens like the cabinet size was designed for. Just make sure you get woofers designed for sealed box placement.
    When replacing individual speakers of a "system" you must replace them with drivers that are compatible with the speaker as it was designed to be used. You can't just throw any driver you find at it and expect it to work properly.
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  6. #6
    Forum Regular royphil345's Avatar
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    Sounds like you're getting bass because of the room shaking... What you're most likely missing is the flat, linear frequency response required for a "solid", "punchy" sound. Adding a resistor to the tweeters would help. There is definitely a driver / box mismatch. This would mostly effect your lowest frequencies though. If you get the crossover smoother between the woofer and tweeter, bring out the mids and upper bass, the speakers should sound MUCH better with a sub and probably OK on their own, minus great response at the lowest frequencies.... You may have somewhat of a "hole" in the midrange due to the larger woofer not being able to play frequencies high enough to blend with the tweeter properly. Adding a resistor / L-pad to the tweeter wiil also lower your crossover frequency a bit. If the high frequency driver is capable of playing a little lower, it will. Might lower the power rating of your speaker a bit by increasing the frequency range of the tweeter.
    Last edited by royphil345; 10-08-2006 at 09:36 PM.

  7. #7
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by royphil345
    Sounds like you're getting bass because of the room shaking... What you're most likely missing is the flat, linear frequency response required for a "solid", "punchy" sound. Adding a resistor to the tweeters would help. There is definitely a driver / box mismatch. This would mostly effect your lowest frequencies though. If you get the crossover smoother between the woofer and tweeter, bring out the mids and upper bass, the speakers should sound MUCH better with a sub and probably OK on their own, minus great response at the lowest frequencies.... You may have somewhat of a "hole" in the midrange due to the larger woofer not being able to play frequencies high enough to blend with the tweeter properly. Adding a resistor / L-pad to the tweeter wiil also lower your crossover frequency a bit. If the high frequency driver is capable of playing a little lower, it will. Might lower the power rating of your speaker a bit by increasing the frequency range of the tweeter.

    this l-pad/resistor thing, on the back of the advent there is a switch, named "high frequency control", it has 3 positions: normal, decrease, increase normal is 0db, decrease is -3db and increase is +3db, can it be that this is kind of the same thing??
    if so, would it help if i set it to "decrease"??
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
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    I'm a happy 20 year old...

  8. #8
    I took a headstart... basite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeE SP9
    The replacement woofers you are using were designed for a ported cabinet. They will never work properly in a sealed (acoustic suspension) cabinet. You need to replace them with woofers designed for acoustic suspension type cabinets. If you do that you should replace any stuffing you have removed. Placing the wrong size and type of woofer in those cabinets has not been any help in your search for better sound. If you replace the current 12" woofers you will probably have to go with 12"s instead of tens like the cabinet size was designed for. Just make sure you get woofers designed for sealed box placement.
    When replacing individual speakers of a "system" you must replace them with drivers that are compatible with the speaker as it was designed to be used. You can't just throw any driver you find at it and expect it to work properly.
    how do you know a driver is made for a ported cabinet or a sealed cabinet??
    and i didn't do the new woofers, my dad did, i was lik 5 years old then.


    Quote Originally Posted by PeruvianSkies
    Ok, I hope this does not come across as being mean-spirited, so here goes...

    I am looking at your setup and your information along with the responses, which have alll been highly knowledgable and very interesting, but my question is simple: Wouldn't it just be easier to get something that is good straight out of the box instead of tweaking around with what you have? I mean, it seems like you are causing more problems by messing around with parts here and there and it would all be solved by getting something that sounds great straight from the getgo.

    Do you have a budget plan in mind for when you upgrade in the near future as you mentioned? It might be smart to reallly think through your options based on certain financial stipulations and really attack this thing sharply. I think that many of us would agree that we wish we would have planned for things a bit better over the years when it comes to components etc etc.

    how do you mean "out of the box"
    i probably upgrade next summer, when i hope to have some work,
    the budget will be from 500€ (hopely more) to 1000€ the upgrades (which will be speakers) i thought of will probably be wharfedale diamond 9.5 or 9.6 speakers or a focal speaker, not sure which one fits the budget though. keep in mind that i'm only 16 so money is hard to get.
    Life is music!

    Mcintosh MA6400 Integrated
    Double Advent speakers
    Thiel CS2.3's
    *DIY Lenco L75 TT
    * SME 3012 S2
    * Rega RB-301
    *Denon DL-103 in midas body
    *Denon DL-304
    *Graham slee elevator EXP & revelation
    *Lehmann audio black cube SE
    Marantz CD5001 OSE
    MIT AVt 2 IC's
    Sonic link Black earth IC's
    Siltech MXT New york IC's
    Kimber 4VS speakercable
    Furutech powercord and plugs.

    I'm a happy 20 year old...

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