Full Review of the new B&W 800D

[thepogue]

Being a new B&W owner, I of course was interested in this thread. And it's turned out to be quite lively, to say the least! Funny how heated discussions about audio can get.

I have not heard the new 800D, or any of the newest 800 line, so I can't comment about them, but I would like to offer an opinion about B&W and value. In my limited experience, I find B&W to offer competitive value at most price points, if you really closely compare. I have not heard the 300 series, but I find the 600's to be very competitive in their class. And also the 700's. The 700's may seem overpriced at first glance, but if you consider driver and cabinet quality, and all-around performance, I feel they are competitive, although perhaps less so than the 600's. The 800N series are, IMO simply the most refined, technologically solid speakers on the market. No hocus-pocus, no bs, just pure engineering expertise. Although they are pretty much all out of my price range, I do lust after them!

So far, I've just dealt with performance, engineering, and build quality issues, and just on those terms alone I think B&W offers fair value. But then, you have to factor in some of the less tangible things that effect value. For example, I value conservatism in a loudspeaker manufacturer. I don't like flavor-of-the-week, market-driven companies that change out speaker lines like I change the oil in my car. I also value doing business with a company that has been around awhile, and that I have confidence in to be around a long while to come. Resale value, as someone mentioned, is also something to consider. And B&W is extremely strong in that area too.

So to me, if you look at the big picture, B&W definitely does offer competitive value across most of it's line. My 703's certainly aren't the cheapest thing in their size class, but in their quality class, I think they're darned hard to beat!

I fully respect your position because it's well thought out, clear and honest. Good for you...when you approach equipment shopping in this manner you'll never be sorry...BTW I've spend at least 4 or 5 hours with the 800D and they are very special indeed...but I think it's the 20K part that I get stuck on....


Peace and well written post, Pogue

[jdm56]

I fully respect your position because it's well thought out, clear and honest. Good for you...when you approach equipment shopping in this manner you'll never be sorry...BTW I've spend at least 4 or 5 hours with the 800D and they are very special indeed...but I think it's the 20K part that I get stuck on....


Peace and well written post, Pogue

Hey, I think it's debatable whether or not ANY speaker, even one with diamond tweeters can possibly be worth $20,000! I think high-end audio pricing has more to do with what someone will pay than any absolute value. I suppose as long as there is a market for gear at those prices, you could make a valid case that they are worth it, though. I'd love to have a pair, but I'm a working-class audiophile with a family, so they out of the question; which btw, causes me to lose no sleep at all! I can be very happy much lower down the food chain. I think the old law of diminishing returns starts kicking in pretty hard when you get past $2000/pr for loudspeakers.

[theaudiohobby]

Hey, I think it's debatable whether or not ANY speaker, even one with diamond tweeters can possibly be worth $20,000! I think high-end audio pricing has more to do with what someone will pay than any absolute value. I suppose as long as there is a market for gear at those prices, you could make a valid case that they are worth it, though. I'd love to have a pair, but I'm a working-class audiophile with a family, so they out of the question; which btw, causes me to lose no sleep at all! I can be very happy much lower down the food chain. I think the old law of diminishing returns starts kicking in pretty hard when you get past $2000/pr for loudspeakers.

Does any painting worth $20M? Does any car worth $1M? Does any house worth $70M? the list goes on and on. Does any speaker worth $20K? Some manufacturers thinks so, those in the market or who have bought such speakers also think so. If I like a 20K+ speakers and I can afford it, I will buy it, irrespective of diminishing returns.

[PAT.P]

Any of you guys received their DVD A SOUND EXPERIENCE ? I for one could say after looking at it I could say it looks like they do take time making these .As for the sound of them I'll have to listen to them just for the fun of it .I'll trust my ears and see if they are as great as their craftmanship.Pat.P

[jdm56]

Any of you guys received their DVD A SOUND EXPERIENCE ? I for one could say after looking at it I could say it looks like they do take time making these .As for the sound of them I'll have to listen to them just for the fun of it .I'll trust my ears and see if they are as great as their craftmanship.Pat.P

yup, got it! also, i've got a similar DVD from Dynaudio. Both are impressive, but especially the B&W.

[jdm56]

Does any painting worth $20M? Does any car worth $1M? Does any house worth $70M? the list goes on and on. Does any speaker worth $20K? Some manufacturers thinks so, those in the market or who have bought such speakers also think so. If I like a 20K+ speakers and I can afford it, I will buy it, irrespective of diminishing returns.

Hey, don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking spending more than 2K on a pair of speakers. I've spent more than that a number of times! My current speakers (B&W 703's) listed for $3000. I paid $2700. It's just that imho, around 2K is the point beyond which twice the bucks may not get you twice the sound quality. Of course, it's impossible to really make a hard, fast rule. There are some giant killers under 1K/pr.

FWIW, I think you can "get the magic for 2K" (or less). Try a pair of B&W 705's for $1500, or a pair of 805's for 2K. They may not get you deep bass or high spl's, but they definitely will give you a generous helping of the magic. If by magic you mean what I mean: A holographic, 3D soundstage and disappearing speakers!

[Florian]

Hey, don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking spending more than 2K on a pair of speakers. I've spent more than that a number of times! My current speakers (B&W 703's) listed for $3000. I paid $2700. It's just that imho, around 2K is the point beyond which twice the bucks may not get you twice the sound quality. Of course, it's impossible to really make a hard, fast rule. There are some giant killers under 1K/pr.

FWIW, I think you can "get the magic for 2K" (or less). Try a pair of B&W 705's for $1500, or a pair of 805's for 2K. They may not get you deep bass or high spl's, but they definitely will give you a generous helping of the magic. If by magic you mean what I mean: A holographic, 3D soundstage and disappearing speakers!

What i mean by magic is explained by the word "real". On the Adiemus Songs of Sanctuary Trac2 the church bells sound 100% the same as if i stand in the sreet and the church bells ring. A violin or a brass instrument sounds real. The size, decay of notes and the downward dynamic range is exeptional. Anybody is welcome to my home and listen to the Apogee's. Some speakers are tested by technical facts, and some are tested by reality.

-Flo

PS: Would E-Stat say his speakers are only a bit better in some areas? Or am I saying that the big Aps are only a bit better. No!The B&W 700 series is very good for the money and is definetly nice sounding than many speakers. But speakers like the big Soundlabs or Apogee or Dunlavys just play in a different leauge. And not just a little better in some areas, no they are in a different leauge. Yes, they cost more...but they also deliver more.

[E-Stat]

I think the old law of diminishing returns starts kicking in pretty hard when you get past $2000/pr for loudspeakers.

The same could be said for $20 ear bud headphones as well.

You'll never find the "magic" with $2k speakers.

rw

[PAT.P]

The same could be said for $20 ear bud headphones as well.

You'll never find the "magic" with $2k speakers.

rw

I'm curious but why dont you list your equipment ?Is there a reason ?And yes if money was not an issue I could find the magic with $2k ++++ speakers.Pat.P

[E-Stat]

I'm curious but why dont you list your equipment ?Is there a reason ?And yes if money was not an issue I could find the magic with $2k ++++ speakers.Pat.P

I really should list my equipment as I find it does give others a point of reference for my comments. Call my lazy. Until I do, here is a link that provides that answer:

http://cgi.audioasylum.com/systems/966.html

rw

[Florian]

I really should list my equipment as I find it does give others a point of reference for my comments.

This is a very good comment because i feel the same way. I list all my equipment and names like Apogee, Krell, VMPS or Pathos mean money. I do agree that you will not find the magic with 2K. Not saying there are no good speakers for 2K, but you wont find Audio Nirvana with those.

-Flo

[dean_martin]

This is a very good comment because i feel the same way. I list all my equipment and names like Apogee, Krell, VMPS or Pathos mean money. I do agree that you will not find the magic with 2K. Not saying there are no good speakers for 2K, but you wont find Audio Nirvana with those.

-Flo

Flo - when are you going to get rid of that cheap-assed Rega P2 and Rega phono amp analog rig? You don't even list your cartridge! It's time you moved up to a real analog rig. Your present one is severely lacking.

Therefore, you are prohibited from offering any comments or advice on turntables, tonearms, cartridges and phono preamps until you offer proof of owning a genuine "high end" rig!

[Geoffcin]

This is a very good comment because i feel the same way. I list all my equipment and names like Apogee, Krell, VMPS or Pathos mean money. I do agree that you will not find the magic with 2K. Not saying there are no good speakers for 2K, but you wont find Audio Nirvana with those.

-Flo

Nirvana, if you take it at it's literal meaning, is a PERSONAL state of being. No one can tell anyone else what nirvana is. Certainly those in search of it can expound all sorts of philosophies about how to attain it, but in the end it is a personal experience.